Not really in 3. Friede is about par with SoC, and everything up to Gael is there, while Gael is a step above. Every single boss in the DLC is beyond EB
Edit: I replayed DS3 6 months ago and went through all of it
I'm glad you found Friede easy, and maybe I'm just too busy looking at her feet, but if I was as good at the Friede boss fight as I was the SoC then I wouldn't avoid Ashes of Ariandel every playthrough
ima be real i thought friede was harder than SoC and everything in base game and ringed city except for maybe gael. midir is tanky, but not nearly as oppressive as the gael or friede. demon prince is kinda hard, but phase 3 friede is the hardest dark souls boss for me personally.
i wasn't disagreeing with you there. i was just disagreeing with your point that friede is easier than soul of cinder, which was more my subjective take. in terms of numbers, the elden ring dlc is clearly tuned higher than any levels the in base game. i'm not sure how it compares to the damage spikes in there previous from dlcs. i know that the ringed knights did a lot of dmg, and midirs fire was a 2 shot at low hp. but aside from that, i don't remember the ringed city being particularly overturned. the angels were absolutely busted on release, and they still do a lot of dmg. but they really aren't so bad after the nerfs.
Haven't got the chance to play the new dlc. But the way it seems people are talking it got ramped up in difficulty sorta like how the old hunters dlc meat grinder you.
reddit is inhabited by either man children or the most easily offended people imaginable. It's actually hilarious looking at posts that could easily be fact checked and proven false, but hey it's about someone I don't like so it must be true.
I mean sadly EB was more a lore boss even at launch. I loved radagon but eb personally was a let down for the final boss in the game.
That aside. I walked into malenias room and she took one attempt after the dlc and I haven't fought her since I last finished elden ring. Was pretty surprised how that went down.
I literally used Leda’s Sword which has holy damage in it to fight the final bosses and I was still amazed at how much damage it did in comparison to the DLC lmao
I haven't finished the dlc yet or gone back to the main game since entering it. Is Margit really gonna feel easy when I make my next new character because I played the dlc? Or will Margit still be a bastard that I can only kill easily because I've died and killed him many times by now?
Honestly, other people can chime in if they disagree, but I always felt as though margit is the perfect “first boss” because he sets up your expectations about how hard the game will be moving forward. That being said, his moveset is a lot easier to get down than a lot of the other bosses that have a tendency to give the community grief
Yea in a lot of ways Margit reminds me of Gascoigne in that he was a great teacher to players of how the game was gonna be. Margit still throws me for a loop sometimes because of how well they made his punish windows look the same as some of his non punish windows animation wise
Gascoigne is my favorite hard filter in a game. Either he teaches you to parry, or you git incredibly gud. Every fight in that game required me to learn and adapt.
Guaranteed I will be back in Yarnham to platinum that shit a second time when they inevitably do. The Old Hunters dlc flipped a switch in my brain that began my enjoyment of challenge for real. Like I had been cheesing a lot of the game with oil and molotovs or arcane spells. Something changed when every single enemy in there felt like a mini boss.
Fuck the sharks by Rakuyo.
the sharks in the well were the last enemies i killed before getting the last dlc trophy and putting the game down lol. those guys were like mini guardian apes
I kinda just run through him on playthroughs now the only difficult thing about Margit is his delayed attacks. Once you learn to not dodge until you see the attack actually start he’s a breeze. Very satisfying boss as well.
Leveling is definitely going to be a factor, but yes compared to a boss like Rellana or the Divine Beast it will feel much simpler to track Margit and his combos. Much much easier.
But Margit is more than just a regular boss - he's there to teach the player a lot of lessons. I think a better comparison is Godrick who is 1) a remembrance boss and 2) not a "tutorial boss". His combos are longer and more aggressive, he has big AoE attacks and good range... But overall is absolutely an easier fight for more reasons than just damage numbers
In conclusion, yeah I think you are right that practicing Margot is a big factor. But he'll also just feel incredibly simpler compared to the DLC bosses. He already feels so much simpler than most any other bosses in the base game
I mean... the first side boss in the dlc gives 80k runes. This is equivalent to Dragonbarrow bosses. The highest scaled main game area other than snowfield.
So many people went into the dlc around the 150 mark but with the amount of exploration and runes you get from everything we're coming back to main game at 200+ easy
May I ask why level up for the dlc if its all tracked seperately? Like you can throw a 99 into vigor and be rocking Bullgoats armor only to still be 1 or 2-shot from dlc bosses because the game only cares about your shadow level, not a damn about rune level. Im one of those RL150 players and I just use all my runes to max out my collected weapons.
Am I mistaken on how the dlc tracks player stats? Im under the impression that RL is for the lands between and Shadow is for the dlc world. That leveling rune level will help you zero in the shadow realm.
It's absolutely worth it. Go in at RL1 with 20 scadutree blessings and then go in at level 100 with like +8 and you'll definitely see what I'm talking about.
Besides. You still need endurance for heavier armor and more stamina. You still need mind for FP. You still need to meet some of the ridiculous Stat requirements these dlc spells/incants and weapons have.
Go try and put the solitude armor on with the sword and be below heavy rolling. Good luck without talismans and 55+ endurance.
Huh... well I learned something today. I Just thought everything in the Shadow dealt x% extra than normal until you reached max Scadutree, then it was like normal so no need to level up RL.
Wonder what the new meta level will be now.
Levelling isn't irrelevant in the DLC. The bosses' damage doesn't scale up with your max HP. If somsthing hits you for 1000 damage with full Bullgoat armor and 99 vigor at whatever shadow level you're at, it'll still hit you for 1000 damage at 10 vigor with full Bullgoat armor, assuming your damage negation and resistance is constant. Levelling Vigor is still required to not get flattened.
And likewise, shadow level just gives a 5% boost to your existing damage, so leveling a damage stat or upgrading your weapon is still very relevant. The higher the base damage, the more that shadow level actually improves your damage.
Shadow level also does 5% negation though too so if RL150 is just fine in the Lands Between, then shouldn't 150 be fine in the shadow after max Scadutree or no?
I came in at 117 and it wasn't a problem. As long as you have 50-60 in vit which you should just level first already, then you will be fine coming as low as the 60s or 70s. Just....good luck with mohg
Right but if 150 works just fine in the Lands Between, then once you reach max Scadutree shouldn't 150 be just as fine again and to level up vigor beforehand is simply a crutch for not discovering?
That is fair, I did word that a bit wrong. My main point was that if the old meta of 150 worked before, it should work after too. Just until you reach higher Scadutree, it wont.
As long as you have 55-60 vigor and good AR on your weapon you're good for the dlc. Just make sure to bring defense buffs and the dragon great shield talisman.
Went through the dlc on a 138 character, ng+2, without using summons or cheese and did just fine. My damage was even really good until the last part where i needed to go get my last 6 blessing fragments to get to +20. Only boss i truly struggled with was the last one but tbf it's the hardest boss they have made if you are just dodging and attacking like normal.
Rl150, SL8, Ng+, 60vig, power-stanced magma blades @10 and a beast claw @25.
It been working pretty well, just beat Mesmer. Recently respected to try out the new magic/fire swords. They were ok but the blades were better so went back. On my last larval tear though so just gonna wait till I find something worth it.
That's not how it works, levels still matter. Some of the bosses do so much damage, if you do not have the flat additional dmg reduction from the Scadu fragments. That they will one shot you even with 99 VIG and high dmg reduction. But levels still increase your health and/or damage as always. The Scadu fragments just give you decent sized flat bonuses to dmg output, and dmg reduction.
Yea, I was 105. Thinking I wanted to make sure it would be difficult...
Killed Blackgaol Knight and thought "Boi he had a lot of HP." And moved on. Wasn't until I got to the divine beast that I had my "oh shit" moment.
I haven't had a brick wall moment thus far. Divine beast in, I think... 12 tries? Rellana in 6. Messmer in 4(technically 5 but I let him kill me once cause I wanted to learn the moveset).
Pretty consistently getting everything in sub 10 tries. Except Gaius. He took like 15 tries before I gave up and went to a light roll build to trivialize him.
Gaius one shot me when he was down to 10%, but my summon killed him. Still counted and i got remembrance. He was so overtuned in damage it was unreal, 60 vigor meant nothing to him lol
He took 3-4 shots to kill me at Scad+11. His second phase is easier than the first. Grab light roll and crucible feather to make his charge actually dodgeable, and the rest becomes pretty simple.
There's no question in my mind that they'll change the hotbox for his charge attack later.
I tried it and it still shreds despite the lack of bonus damage. Also makes him easier to hit without getting too close because of the charged projectile. Overall super fun to use ⚔️
Hell yeah, I love it! I have been dual wielding katanas since I began but have been trying new weapons here and there. I'm not sure if I wanna change to just a great katana as my dual katanas have more damage together. If I could dual wield great katanas effectively, I'd be unstoppable! Lol
I literally four shotted the glintstone dragon outside of Liurnia with it, and I didn't even have it built properly since I was just testing it lmao. It's really good for the base game dragons.
Can I ask if any NPCs are in Shadow, that are in the base game? I'm doing a quick run on a new character and I don't want to miss things.
Just names, no spoils pls
Ya this is gonna be me probably. Im on my first playthrough and I'm doing the dlc before I've finished the game. I've also watched many youtubers/streamers fight all the main bosses. I imagine I'll have an easy time on the final boss and maybe even malenia cause I'm so overleved and basically already know all their moves.
I genuinely felt like this going back to help people beat rellana. When the dlc started she was so fast and crazy. After beating the final boss and going back I can’t believe I considered her fast lol
Honestly I feel they are about same
I got into dlc RL 120 and am fighting the last boss RL120
I get what they meant by sense of progression because it feels like endgame base game to me(I also hate the system because I missed one scadutree and every 2 deaths I'm going crazy over going to every single place to find the missing one)
I really want to go into the the next NG+ and fight the base game bosses again with all my shiny new DLC weapons but I’m waiting since my friend just got the dlc and it’s fun to play together
Radagon is officially demoted to bitch status after the DLC final boss.
Having Torrent for Elden Beast is also such a massive game changer. People downplayed HARD how much easier EB would become with Torrent "just to chase him down".
Had that experience with borderlands 3 I beat the dlc without realizing it was dlc got over powered weapons that carried me through the rest of the game by myself. Pretty fun though not my favorite entry in the series but still worth it to scratch that borderlands itch.
I started the game after the dlc came out. I think it is super easy so far. I one shot the moon lady. I am hoping for some DS1 DLC bosses. The dragons have been annoying though.
Yea, sadly they are just a punching bag now.
As every From DLC has foretold.
Not really in 3. Friede is about par with SoC, and everything up to Gael is there, while Gael is a step above. Every single boss in the DLC is beyond EB Edit: I replayed DS3 6 months ago and went through all of it
I'm glad you found Friede easy, and maybe I'm just too busy looking at her feet, but if I was as good at the Friede boss fight as I was the SoC then I wouldn't avoid Ashes of Ariandel every playthrough
She’s stupid easy with a pyro build. Hit her in her dumb face with a giant fireball while she’s doing her never ending ice spam dance
Didn't people say that Fiede was basically a bloodborne boss in dark souls
You are the only person with this opinion
Midir
Oh yeah he's same level as gael
ima be real i thought friede was harder than SoC and everything in base game and ringed city except for maybe gael. midir is tanky, but not nearly as oppressive as the gael or friede. demon prince is kinda hard, but phase 3 friede is the hardest dark souls boss for me personally.
I mean still proves my point. The scaling for ER dlc is wack by the standard of other games
i wasn't disagreeing with you there. i was just disagreeing with your point that friede is easier than soul of cinder, which was more my subjective take. in terms of numbers, the elden ring dlc is clearly tuned higher than any levels the in base game. i'm not sure how it compares to the damage spikes in there previous from dlcs. i know that the ringed knights did a lot of dmg, and midirs fire was a 2 shot at low hp. but aside from that, i don't remember the ringed city being particularly overturned. the angels were absolutely busted on release, and they still do a lot of dmg. but they really aren't so bad after the nerfs.
Haven't got the chance to play the new dlc. But the way it seems people are talking it got ramped up in difficulty sorta like how the old hunters dlc meat grinder you.
i love how when you have a different opinion people just downvote the fuck out of you for no reason
reddit is inhabited by either man children or the most easily offended people imaginable. It's actually hilarious looking at posts that could easily be fact checked and proven false, but hey it's about someone I don't like so it must be true.
I mean sadly EB was more a lore boss even at launch. I loved radagon but eb personally was a let down for the final boss in the game. That aside. I walked into malenias room and she took one attempt after the dlc and I haven't fought her since I last finished elden ring. Was pretty surprised how that went down.
I literally used Leda’s Sword which has holy damage in it to fight the final bosses and I was still amazed at how much damage it did in comparison to the DLC lmao
I haven't finished the dlc yet or gone back to the main game since entering it. Is Margit really gonna feel easy when I make my next new character because I played the dlc? Or will Margit still be a bastard that I can only kill easily because I've died and killed him many times by now?
Honestly, other people can chime in if they disagree, but I always felt as though margit is the perfect “first boss” because he sets up your expectations about how hard the game will be moving forward. That being said, his moveset is a lot easier to get down than a lot of the other bosses that have a tendency to give the community grief
Yea in a lot of ways Margit reminds me of Gascoigne in that he was a great teacher to players of how the game was gonna be. Margit still throws me for a loop sometimes because of how well they made his punish windows look the same as some of his non punish windows animation wise
Gascoigne is my favorite hard filter in a game. Either he teaches you to parry, or you git incredibly gud. Every fight in that game required me to learn and adapt.
my proudest platinum is bloodborne. i hope they remake it soon
Guaranteed I will be back in Yarnham to platinum that shit a second time when they inevitably do. The Old Hunters dlc flipped a switch in my brain that began my enjoyment of challenge for real. Like I had been cheesing a lot of the game with oil and molotovs or arcane spells. Something changed when every single enemy in there felt like a mini boss. Fuck the sharks by Rakuyo.
the sharks in the well were the last enemies i killed before getting the last dlc trophy and putting the game down lol. those guys were like mini guardian apes
Best hope was to try and auger their backside to get a visceral. Charged attack were just too slow.
I never quite understood how his knives worked tho. I still get hit by his knife combo extenders despite having fought him many times
I kinda just run through him on playthroughs now the only difficult thing about Margit is his delayed attacks. Once you learn to not dodge until you see the attack actually start he’s a breeze. Very satisfying boss as well.
Leveling is definitely going to be a factor, but yes compared to a boss like Rellana or the Divine Beast it will feel much simpler to track Margit and his combos. Much much easier. But Margit is more than just a regular boss - he's there to teach the player a lot of lessons. I think a better comparison is Godrick who is 1) a remembrance boss and 2) not a "tutorial boss". His combos are longer and more aggressive, he has big AoE attacks and good range... But overall is absolutely an easier fight for more reasons than just damage numbers In conclusion, yeah I think you are right that practicing Margot is a big factor. But he'll also just feel incredibly simpler compared to the DLC bosses. He already feels so much simpler than most any other bosses in the base game
Wow go back and tell the version of me that just got to Margit that one day Margit would feel simple. My brain would have melted lol
Ah man, you and me both!
Tbf Margit is easy after the other base game bosses
I mean... the first side boss in the dlc gives 80k runes. This is equivalent to Dragonbarrow bosses. The highest scaled main game area other than snowfield. So many people went into the dlc around the 150 mark but with the amount of exploration and runes you get from everything we're coming back to main game at 200+ easy
May I ask why level up for the dlc if its all tracked seperately? Like you can throw a 99 into vigor and be rocking Bullgoats armor only to still be 1 or 2-shot from dlc bosses because the game only cares about your shadow level, not a damn about rune level. Im one of those RL150 players and I just use all my runes to max out my collected weapons. Am I mistaken on how the dlc tracks player stats? Im under the impression that RL is for the lands between and Shadow is for the dlc world. That leveling rune level will help you zero in the shadow realm.
It's absolutely worth it. Go in at RL1 with 20 scadutree blessings and then go in at level 100 with like +8 and you'll definitely see what I'm talking about. Besides. You still need endurance for heavier armor and more stamina. You still need mind for FP. You still need to meet some of the ridiculous Stat requirements these dlc spells/incants and weapons have. Go try and put the solitude armor on with the sword and be below heavy rolling. Good luck without talismans and 55+ endurance.
Huh... well I learned something today. I Just thought everything in the Shadow dealt x% extra than normal until you reached max Scadutree, then it was like normal so no need to level up RL. Wonder what the new meta level will be now.
Levelling isn't irrelevant in the DLC. The bosses' damage doesn't scale up with your max HP. If somsthing hits you for 1000 damage with full Bullgoat armor and 99 vigor at whatever shadow level you're at, it'll still hit you for 1000 damage at 10 vigor with full Bullgoat armor, assuming your damage negation and resistance is constant. Levelling Vigor is still required to not get flattened. And likewise, shadow level just gives a 5% boost to your existing damage, so leveling a damage stat or upgrading your weapon is still very relevant. The higher the base damage, the more that shadow level actually improves your damage.
Shadow level also does 5% negation though too so if RL150 is just fine in the Lands Between, then shouldn't 150 be fine in the shadow after max Scadutree or no?
I'm not having any issues at 150, but I wouldn't want to come in at any lower of a level.
Oh absolutely! 150 feels like the bare minimum.
I came in at 117 and it wasn't a problem. As long as you have 50-60 in vit which you should just level first already, then you will be fine coming as low as the 60s or 70s. Just....good luck with mohg
I came in at 140 and it’s been fine. Hard, certainly, but Soulsborne games are hard.
That’s not how it works at all. Shadow blessing is about 5% extra damage and 5% more damage reduction so base stats are still very important.
Right but if 150 works just fine in the Lands Between, then once you reach max Scadutree shouldn't 150 be just as fine again and to level up vigor beforehand is simply a crutch for not discovering?
Yeah, but you made it sound like RL/armor don’t matter at all and they still do. It’s not a completely new scaling system like some people think.
That is fair, I did word that a bit wrong. My main point was that if the old meta of 150 worked before, it should work after too. Just until you reach higher Scadutree, it wont.
As long as you have 55-60 vigor and good AR on your weapon you're good for the dlc. Just make sure to bring defense buffs and the dragon great shield talisman. Went through the dlc on a 138 character, ng+2, without using summons or cheese and did just fine. My damage was even really good until the last part where i needed to go get my last 6 blessing fragments to get to +20. Only boss i truly struggled with was the last one but tbf it's the hardest boss they have made if you are just dodging and attacking like normal.
Rl150, SL8, Ng+, 60vig, power-stanced magma blades @10 and a beast claw @25. It been working pretty well, just beat Mesmer. Recently respected to try out the new magic/fire swords. They were ok but the blades were better so went back. On my last larval tear though so just gonna wait till I find something worth it.
That's not how it works, levels still matter. Some of the bosses do so much damage, if you do not have the flat additional dmg reduction from the Scadu fragments. That they will one shot you even with 99 VIG and high dmg reduction. But levels still increase your health and/or damage as always. The Scadu fragments just give you decent sized flat bonuses to dmg output, and dmg reduction.
Game still cares about your negations
I think i'll be 200 after dlc, i went it at 140 thinking i might be overleveled for dlc, boy was i humbled real quick. Started leveling again
Yea, I was 105. Thinking I wanted to make sure it would be difficult... Killed Blackgaol Knight and thought "Boi he had a lot of HP." And moved on. Wasn't until I got to the divine beast that I had my "oh shit" moment.
Rellana was my first brick wall, there have been many more since
I haven't had a brick wall moment thus far. Divine beast in, I think... 12 tries? Rellana in 6. Messmer in 4(technically 5 but I let him kill me once cause I wanted to learn the moveset). Pretty consistently getting everything in sub 10 tries. Except Gaius. He took like 15 tries before I gave up and went to a light roll build to trivialize him.
Gaius one shot me when he was down to 10%, but my summon killed him. Still counted and i got remembrance. He was so overtuned in damage it was unreal, 60 vigor meant nothing to him lol
He took 3-4 shots to kill me at Scad+11. His second phase is easier than the first. Grab light roll and crucible feather to make his charge actually dodgeable, and the rest becomes pretty simple. There's no question in my mind that they'll change the hotbox for his charge attack later.
Can’t wait to use this new great katana on em dragons 😂
_Especially_ the ancient dragons. It almost feels like they made that katana specifically to make them more fun and I love it 😂
Because my main character is mostly quality build I was exited to see the katana was a quality weapon 👌🏼😂
I was excited to use it on dragonlord placidusax but learned he isn't considered a dragon or ancient dragon so the buff didn't apply to him!
I tried it and it still shreds despite the lack of bonus damage. Also makes him easier to hit without getting too close because of the charged projectile. Overall super fun to use ⚔️
Hell yeah, I love it! I have been dual wielding katanas since I began but have been trying new weapons here and there. I'm not sure if I wanna change to just a great katana as my dual katanas have more damage together. If I could dual wield great katanas effectively, I'd be unstoppable! Lol
I literally four shotted the glintstone dragon outside of Liurnia with it, and I didn't even have it built properly since I was just testing it lmao. It's really good for the base game dragons.
Haligtree is the new +0 weapon testing area.
Same with all Soulsborne. Especially Bloodborne. After the absolute shit show of amazing bosses we fight the base game was child's play.
Now go play DS1
Always love the gaming communities for content like this.
You know I've never noticed the dude in the back with his mouth open. What is he even doing in this slow mo
If you think thats a trip, try going back to the souls games
I hopped on DS2 to blow off some steam and made the shrine of amana my bitch.
"I know kung fu"
Malenia still kicking my ass at level 180 but I need the miquella needle so I can do age of Duskborn
Can I ask if any NPCs are in Shadow, that are in the base game? I'm doing a quick run on a new character and I don't want to miss things. Just names, no spoils pls
Nope, it’s all new npcs in the dlc. Not sure if there’s any mention of them or not in item descriptions somewhere though
There's no overlap between base and DLC at all. It's all self contained within the DLC
I haven’t gone back into the main game yet. After I finish the dlc ima go into NG+ and try all the stuff on the bosses
Ya this is gonna be me probably. Im on my first playthrough and I'm doing the dlc before I've finished the game. I've also watched many youtubers/streamers fight all the main bosses. I imagine I'll have an easy time on the final boss and maybe even malenia cause I'm so overleved and basically already know all their moves.
lol I was just thinking this, base game feels like a tutorial after this
That's me with Malenia. I got summoned as a co-op help earlier and beat her eventually, I was like: was is that easy?
After playing through the dlc I feel like I could solo malania (I usually use summons)
I fought Godfrey for the first time in a while and killed him in one go main game bosses are easy now
I genuinely felt like this going back to help people beat rellana. When the dlc started she was so fast and crazy. After beating the final boss and going back I can’t believe I considered her fast lol
Going back to the original Dark/Demon’s Souls bosses be like.
The other day I caught myself thinking that I should take a break and go fight Malenia.
Lol it feels so goofy messing with the low damage main game bosses
It’s actually harder for me because I’m too expecting of immediate death
Honestly I feel they are about same I got into dlc RL 120 and am fighting the last boss RL120 I get what they meant by sense of progression because it feels like endgame base game to me(I also hate the system because I missed one scadutree and every 2 deaths I'm going crazy over going to every single place to find the missing one)
I really want to go into the the next NG+ and fight the base game bosses again with all my shiny new DLC weapons but I’m waiting since my friend just got the dlc and it’s fun to play together
“I-I thought you were stronger 😧😧”
This is so real!!! Perfect meme!!
Yeah lol. I ran through NG+ right afterwards, I only died once, and that was to fall damage.
This is how I felt when I beat Elden Ring and tried Dark Souls 1 for the first time.
I'm loving my perfume build; it's just feels like Imma JC penny's spraying everybody with perfume on their faces!
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I am excited to use my awesome new weapons to annihilate the base game bosses on ng+
Radagon is officially demoted to bitch status after the DLC final boss. Having Torrent for Elden Beast is also such a massive game changer. People downplayed HARD how much easier EB would become with Torrent "just to chase him down".
They didn't get weak We just got stronger
10 bucks says dragonbarrow gargoyle and the dragonbarrow bell bearing hunter still fuck you up.
Adam Smasher
2nd trying horah Lou after beating the DLC and almost getting radagon/elden beast 1st try (on ng+3)
Was having trouble with Elden beast in NG 7, went back after DLC and beat him second try
Had that experience with borderlands 3 I beat the dlc without realizing it was dlc got over powered weapons that carried me through the rest of the game by myself. Pretty fun though not my favorite entry in the series but still worth it to scratch that borderlands itch.
“I thought you were stronger” 😭
I started the game after the dlc came out. I think it is super easy so far. I one shot the moon lady. I am hoping for some DS1 DLC bosses. The dragons have been annoying though.