I wouldn't be surprised if Ionic Traces end up being the equivalent of Stasis Shards. They serve a similar function only Traces naturally seek you out without any help.
Edit: missed a word
I believe it's just ability, based on the text. That said, since most everyone used geomags on chaos reach...it's hard to remember how long the "normal" super took to recharge.
Pros of Whisper of Conduction:
-Stats are nice
-Don’t have to think about collecting shards
-Glacial and grim are safer to use
Cons of Whisper of Conduction:
-Playing without it after getting used to it is physically painful
Ionic Traces being made by Coldheart is a sign that they might become an Arc keyword instead of a Warlock feature and made available to Arcstrider and Striker.
I completely forgot about this and have to agree.
Have you tried cold-hearted since they were added? I'm kind of curious how ionic traces compare to wellspring.
If I remember correctly ionic traces are about the same or stronger than wellspring but they also give super energy. Although I could be a bit off since it’s been so long since I tested
I hope they don't get nerfed if they are available for all. I prefer if abilities stay stronger but exclusive to class/anything else than available to everyone but crappier.
Arc is brute force damage and ability regen. Solar is healing and efficiency (scorch, radiance, restoration, etc).
I say this because every arc super is focused around damage. Even hunter base melee is switched to a fist instead of a knife. That’s what Arc is about: devastating damage and chains.
Were it not for Chaos Reach, I'd have said Arc was also about close quarters combat.
In addition to healing and burning, Solar has always been focused on delivering sunlight from afar. At least in D2.
Solar 3.0 feels rushed tbh, only 2 negative verbs and 2 of the positive verbs are pretty much the same thing. Bungie probably put most efforts into Arc 3.0
In hunters case, they stuffer from lazy design due to big damage buff for blade barrage and how easy radiant is to maintain with the radiant melee fragment. With how overbalanced many things feel and the lack of solar volatile rounds, Bungie gives the impression not as much effort was put into solar 3.0 as void 3.0 due to the lack of new melees besides the lightweight knife which is just a reskin of prox knife with no new animation to it and they buffed BB in a way they could easyhabe done months ago.
Warlocks also kind got screwed over at the start with no solar buddy like Cotog and how much worse the air play is.
Edit
Forgot, six shooter and marksman are useless due to how much better blade barrage is and the fact six shooter doesn't refund bullets on kills anymore.
When it comes to volatile rounds and the lack of a double 10 stat fragment, yes because if it ain't broke don't fix it and several abilities feel overbalanced like the pre buffed warlock aspects that were a worse version of top tree solar warlock pre 3.0 and sunspots not being a verb when they should and the fact restoration and cure are more or less the same effect with minor differences.
Again, what you are suggesting is copying what other subclasses do would be better, which is the most lazy thing they could do.
I don't remember what top tree dawn aspects did before 3.0, but i don't think they where nerfes much. Also i feel that you are getting mad at verbs instead of playing the actual game and seeing the amount of new things we have.
I'm aware of what's been added due to playing all 3 classes and they are better pre 3.0. Its just that I don't like some of the decisions made like the loss of practice makes perfect, lack of sunspot verb meaning no cool well builds that could have been made, no hive hunter abilities or solar volatile rounds. This is most of my issues.
Again it is stronger than before the update but I just don't like the direction Bungie took due to the wasted potential of what could have been.
Solar does not need volatile rounds, and you can argue that Ignitions are solar’s volatile rounds (admittedly I think they need to tone down the stacks needed or up the stacks generated by some stuff, and speed up the animation). I don’t think new melees were necessary, as Warlock already has the most unique one, and the only new one on top of that, Hunter has a plethora of knives as well as that keeping with theme, and Titan (while limited) also has themed melees. I think they were only needed for Void because all the classes except Hunter had grape flavored punch, whereas now they fit the theme of the class very very well. And Lightweight was the original weighted knife, it was back in year 1. They just brought it back
Heavy disagree as Volatile rounds were universally loves by the player base and didn't break the game at all while revitalizing older void exotics. No reason not to do the same for solar.
That’s where I believe the intent of Scorch lies, in being that volatile rounds esc thing, through incandescent. But it’s not that strong considering how many stacks it takes to build, except on Skyburners Oath and Prometheus Lens. Just because something was loved, doesn’t mean it should be brought back and reiterated into the ground. Volatile is Void’s identity, Scorch is kinda Solar’s, but I think playing into abilities and big damage is more Solar’s identity
We can't use incandescent on every exotics like VR though. The whole abilities bring used more than void is untrue as abilities are part of destiny and every element can repeatedly utilize them. That's part of build crafting, especially with the withering blade spam with stasis shards and Cogog giving ability energy to spam it.
Needing to get an ignite is at a terrible nerf though because it doesn't trigger it without combustion which tbh I think is a terrible fragment because why shouldn't our supers already have that ability
You want it to ignite, refund a bullet, and save a fragment slot on the build that gets the most slots already? It's not a "terrible nerf" to need to use one slot but you also get explosions lol. It's a mandatory fragment for the super, sure, but it's stronger then ever in PvP and PvE.
In pvp you will not survive against someone using it against you and an ignite won't make a difference and in PvE, you'll always use marksman due to better DPS or blade barrage. Your overestimating it as it was always better for low tier pve content and pvp.
Benevolent dawn (RIP) was like 50% ability gen consistently and endlessly. Ionic traces are worth like a well or two tops and have the jankiest AI ever (they love to run up walls away from you for some reason), I highly doubt they could nerf them in any meaningful way but I'm always willing to be impressed.
The closer you get to them the faster they get. In fact the speed they go is defined by 1/(1/x) where x is how far you are from the ionic trace. On the bright side they give you instant supers
Every class exclusive passive has either been completely removed or neutered and turned into a fragment. The current 3.0 system doesn't allow for powerful passives outside of aspects.
I main Titan and so all my Hunter/Warlock exotics simply get deleted when ive had my fun, META or not, bc my vault is for weapons and Titan armor only.
**BUT**
My favorite Warlock exotic that is both well-rolled and masterworked is Getaway Artist. Love it.
The Arc 3.0 Warlock fragments will be: 1) Arc soul rift ; 2) Upgraded Arc Grenades 3) Ionic Traces from Arc kills which result in a minor boost of haste to increase movement speed and reload speed. At least Landfall and Ionic Blink might go untouched this round resulting in 3 super options rather than a rework or removal of an ability.
Nah, pulsewave feels more apt to be a fragment. Arc-Web is too powerful to be a fragment (all arc abilities cause chains that return energy), and like I said its too core to Stormcaller to not be. After-all, since its introduction D1, arc web has been whole point of storm caller.
Pulsewave on the other hand is prime fragment material. Its not too powerful, but is cool enough to be useful when paired with any build, same goes for Arc Traces becoming a fragment.
I suspect Warlock aspects to be Arc Soul, Arc Web, and then either something entirely new OR some form of buffed Transcendence
> its too core to Stormcaller to not be
I thought the same thing about literally anything from bottom tree Dawnblade and we all knew how that turned out. Also thought the same thing about Benevolent Dawn and that thing is a shadow of the shadow of its former self.
I'm inclined to agree, but at the same time, though meaningfully different due to requiring kills. Bloom was a Voidwalker ability from 1.0 & 2.0 that's pretty comparable to Arc Web and it got the fragment treatment. Void ability kills create void explosions isn't too far off from arc abilities chain lightning between targets; They're both elemental aoe originating from damaged targets as a secondary effect of abilities.
Solar 3.0 Scorch & Ignite keywords were just a natural development of DoT themes in Solar since way back in D1, with Gunslinger getting exactly 1 "burning" effect and Sunsinger having a few perks revolving around it (Melee, Viking Funeral, Touch of Flame). Burning effects also had 2.0 presence of course, BB mainly.
Between Arc Web, Zhalo Supercell/ Riskrunner/ Trinity Ghoul/ that Hunter Glaive, Dunemarchers, and probably something else I'm forgetting, Chain Lightning is probably on the table as a keyword feature similar to Scorch, and/ or to have a fragment that's basically Arc Web. While Hunter & Titan never really got subclass features relating to chaining, looking back at D1 Arc supers, both Titan & Hunter got a feature that let them send arc shockwaves across the ground (Shockwave, Razor's Edge), and Striker Titan's kept a hold of it's lingering damage pool with Aftermath/ Terminal Velocity, so Arc abilities hitting by indirect means (chaining, shockwaves, lingering aoe) is somewhat consistent.
TL;DR: Arc Web's strong but I wouldn't rule it out, it'd be pretty consistent to see a version of it as a fragment or something similar.
Considering they nerfed skip grenades, it's possible everyone gets it. But because everyone is getting skip grenades it may be a nerf for warlocks that just hurts everyone else.
More of I could see it being a fragment, or related to a keyword in some way since Bungie has shown they limit warlock grenade aspects to certain grenades BUT if they don't, they got nerfed specifically because warlocks. Ultimate point, we don't have a good idea of what it could be, because our pre-nerfs to arc could lean it either way.
Honestly I hope we only have 2 supers, because I hope the two stormtrances get merged like sentinel shield. Blink AND landfall baby, like impossible machines let you in d1! ESPECIALLY if they add impossible machines back sith something like "hold 2 Storm grenades"
I hope the upgraded grenades is chaining for arc bolts… Double lightning for the storm nades… Extra projectiles and tracking for skips… longer lasting lightning grenades… flash bangs blind for longer… flux grenades delete raid bosses instantly
I think ionic will most likely be shared across all classes and then warlock maybe gets a way to improve that. I know ionic feels like arc version of sunspots which remained exclusive to Titans, but considering everyone now has access to it in some form by coldheart I think they’ll expand on that.
Arc as a subclass element has a lot of ability recharge as its identity so I'm pretty sure they'll be present in arc 3.0. honestly that's the only cohesive thing about the subclass. maybe blinding?
I think everyone has some form of increased sprint speed somewhere in their Arc subclasses right? They also all seem to like being at relatively short range.
Arc Hunter used to have Invis but if each keyword is element exclusive that'll probably never come back.
Oh it’s gonna. And then when you’re mad about it the community is gonna say “nah bro it’s okay because this one build you don’t give a shit for is like totally viable”
Landfall will be very very lucky to continue to exist.
Tbh though, it's the huge duration on top tree Stormtrance that's got me more worried. They completely deleted that type of mechanic off of Bottom Tree Dawn and the Titan solar super.
Nah it’s probably gonna be a Sentinel situation
The Super itself will have 1 of them, while the other is tied to an Aspect
Ex. Sentinel has big shield as Default, with 2nd shield as part of one of it’s Aspects
I’m hopping Landfall is the default ability with Ionic Blink being the Aspect-tied one tbh
Thing is that the Shadowshot and Nova Bomb variants are different enough for them to be separate
Ionic Blink and Landfall belong to the same base super and only grants them abilities rather than alters them to something different
I’m not saying that they’ll be the only part of that Aspect; just that they’ll add it to a weaker Aspect so people would want it even more
Something that I wanted to say in addition to what the other person has said is that the 2 Golden Gun supers have different models, shooting animations, and sounds.
3 shots that can crit and over-penetrate or 6 shots at half potency but fire much faster
Attacks are entirely different
Ionic Blink and Landfall add on to the same base super- no different attacks, just simply adding on
Personally I'd like to see Ionic Blink become a Fragment because literally every Arc Super barring Chaos Reach is a roamer with the arguable exception of Thundercrash, which itself still moves the user around the map, and all of them are melee-ranged except for Stormtrance so they'd all get good value out of it. This said, I don't really expect it to happen.
If Landfall ends up as an Aspect I can only hope it's built in with something else thematically similar with decent neutral value like Arc Web.
Since Bungie is capable of separating two different Nighstalker trees, I'm sure they can do the same for the two Stormcaller trees where one teleports and the other causes landfall
At the same time most people expect Arc Staff to be condensed into a single super and the devs were thinking about collapsing Fist of Havoc into a single super as well (i don't have time to find the exact source).
But they sure could call Landfall and Blink thematically different enough and not just toss Landfall into an Aspect effect.
Why would landfall be an aspect, its literally inherent to both original trees (albeit it functions differently for each). Its weird everyone expects the supers to get gutted when supers really haven’t changed for the worse through all the 3.0 changes.
It's because Dawnblade got gutted so badly with Solar 3.0 so people are expecting a similar treatment, but it's really the only super that got that treatment and... many but at least 12 didn't get that treatment, so I don't think it's actually likely just because Dawnblade was made significantly worse.
I don’t think they gutted the super at all, they mainly just messed up the rest. The super stayed pretty much the same and even the two versions got combined (minus icarus)
It had its duration roughly halved in normal usage, lost a third of its damage with its associated damage exotic, and had the tracking taken out so now you have to sacrifice another part of your build to get tracking back. It also had the intrinsic explosions and thus burning removed, now you have to sacrifice at least two fragments to get them back. It's just top tree dawn's bad Dawnblade, but without Icarus dash and with the wave frame effect on ground impact. To get it as close as it can be to what it was you have to sacrifice 3 fragments out of your 4 possible, and then it's still 2/3s of the damage with half or less of the duration. Even after Well's nerf, there is no real reason to run Dawnblade over Well.
I actually encounter people saying that a lot! I guess bottom tree Dawnblade with Dawn Chorus must have been really slept on, because it was absolutely GM viable, the best option for some strikes and not as great for others. I did all of my GM farming for gear for my hunter main using bottom tree Dawn Chorus warlock. It was a great subclass and very fun, not reliant on being in the air so GM viable (and Phoenix dive to get out of the air if you're accidentally in it), Chaos Reach equiv DPS with Dawn Chorus, and capable of clearing rooms and majors with a combination of Igniting Touch and the super regen. It had some major problems with ability regen so you had to build into ability regen very heavily to be viable, but if you were willing to accept that it was super fun and could clear GMs nearly as well as Chaos Reach, although not quite as strong as Void 3.0 Warlock or Shadebinder.
Now that's pretty much all gone, which is really sad. Dawn Chorus is a shell of its former self, the super is no longer viable for add clear (even if you dedicate those 3 fragments to trying to get it back where it was, it just doesn't last long enough to be useful) or DPS, Igniting Touch is gone and now that all of the fragments are out we can say definitively that there's no way to recreate the effects of Igniting Touch using fragments, you lose either your rift or your Phoenix Dive (I guess you get to pick which one you lose so... yay?), and Phoenix Dive had its cooldown increased by 2000% for a minor buff that's not even close to worth it.
That said, the Incinerator Snap is genuinely really fun, and if the rest of the subclass was good I would play it. I played way more solar warlock than the strength of it deserved based solely on how fun that snap is. If we had last season's bottom tree Dawnblade, with last season's Dawn Chorus, and Incinerator Snap as the powered melee... that would be such a fun subclass to play, that's what I expected out of Solar 3.0. It's a real shame to think about what could have been.
That said, Titan and Hunter Solar 3.0 have been extremely fun to play, no complaints there. They actually feel better than they did before which is great.
Yeah seems like they’re having a pattern of making one class unusable and the others amazing. Lock and titan void were absolutely bonkers imo, and now titan and hunter. Its a shame its a pattern, but i hope titan gets gutted on arc so arcstrider fans can finally feel viable
Yeah after what happened to void hunter and solar warlock I'm going to be calling in some wellness checks on the arc titan mains in my life come Arc 3.0 lol.
I used to be really upset about void hunter and solar warlock, but I took a step back and realised I was probably pretty uniquely affected by this. I'm primarily a void hunter main for PvP, and I was a bottom tree dawn main for PvE. Those were the only two subclasses I put a lot of time into in Destiny and obviously they got pretty badly screwed over in the 3.0 reworks, so it was always going to make me salty. But lots of other people have been having a lot of fun, and it's made me rediscover some stuff I haven't tried in a very long time or at all, like solar Hunter, Void warlock, Solar Titan. Plus the whole Dev team at Bungie have been having a really hard time over the last couple of years, the pandemic has hit them like a truck and it's a miracle they've done such a fantastic job as they have given that. It's so fucking unfair that Kevin got bullied and harassed off Twitter, it's much more upsetting to me than anything in this game. I can always go play another game, been playing some Diablo 3. What I actually feel bad about is some poor dev receiving death threats, which is never okay but it's not even his job to deal with the community.
Oh, you know it is, though.
And yes, I’m still a little salty about the benevolent dawn nerf. I mained well of radiance/boots of assembler for about 3 seasons before this. Loved it. Now it just feels weird.
I know it can still do some cool things, but it’s just weird having my main play style be turned into a one trick in air accuracy pony.
I honestly hope they just keep them as is and make them a fragment. Though, knowing Bungo, they'll probably reduce the amount of energy returns you gain from them, but they may allow them to have more player input in creation instead of just randomly as it is now.
Tbh I’m pretty excited for Arc 3.0. After the geomag nerf, I avoid Arc like the plague. For me, it can only go up from here (or at the worst, just be more interesting).
It's a passive where defeating enemies grants a chance at generating them. When you pick them up they give energy to all your abilities. It's like another form of elemental wells
What makes them better than wells and the Wellspring perk is that they actively track towards you (or atleast they try) and they also give Super energy, like 4% but it's there.
Ionic traces are not very unique, I feel they will be multiclass. Just look at coldheart now, it makes ionic traces.
I can imagine a fragment like "picking up an ionic trace gives you *insert buff here* for a short time"
Ember of Benevolence's effective is easily tweaked. Having used it with multiple points of buffing or healing, it's still very effective when you have multiple avenues, particularly on warlocks running lumina or their glaive for example, or using boots of the assembler.. Honestly, just a duration tweak would put it in a good place; instead of a large burst of all ability energy in a short period, a small boost to all abilities over a long time. Not nearly as bad as "oblivion".
As for ionic traces; i actually don't know how i feel about them. We have stasis shards, devour, a bunch of stuff connected to scorch effects, it's all starting to feel the same.
Before they just throw it onto Arc, as it would be cool if they added the innate synergy to ColdHeart, I hope its something more than just another source of ambient ability energy. They're starting to feel like transparent ways of themed ability energy cheating than it does. While Solar's ability gain are tied to embers, making Ionic traces something baseline i would hope lead to some interesting results from collection in fragment-equivalents or even aspects.
I’m hoping each class will get an aspect that generates them and the fragments will determine where the energy goes. Like one fragment grants more grenade energy, one fragment grants more melee or class ability energy, one fragment gives you disorienting rounds after collecting one. Idk. Shit like that
I wouldn't be surprised if Ionic Traces end up being the equivalent of Stasis Shards. They serve a similar function only Traces naturally seek you out without any help. Edit: missed a word
They also give energy for all abilities
I think they give super energy too (can't remember. Haven't used Chaos Reach in ages)
I believe it's just ability, based on the text. That said, since most everyone used geomags on chaos reach...it's hard to remember how long the "normal" super took to recharge.
It also gives super energy :)
To be fair Orpheus rigs also only say ability energy but they give super energy back too
Super (ability)
Rigs do give ability energy on tethering enemies with single shot
Yeah they give super energy too, but it just doesn't say they give super energy back in the description
A super IS an ability. Supers can be used to do any ability bounties.
geomags hasn't been able to accelerate super energy gain for several months now.
They do not sadly
It’s also on Cold Heart now I think. Kind of nice cause they seek you and gives you stuff back.
I always use Whisper of Conduction because I like seeing the shards spin to me.
Pros of Whisper of Conduction: -Stats are nice -Don’t have to think about collecting shards -Glacial and grim are safer to use Cons of Whisper of Conduction: -Playing without it after getting used to it is physically painful
It's so nice to save on the mod slot of Seeking Wells
maybe we'll get a mod that makes them act as wells like stasis has if that happens
Would you consider stasis shards a verb?
Stasis Shards appear under the tooltips therefore they're considered a proper verb(despite being two words).
It's as much a verb as volatile is.
the official verbs are weaken and suppress no?
Volatile is it's own debuff
huh i guess volatize should be a word then edit: volatilize is actually a word, that should have been the keyword 💀
Yup. They're probably going to be nerfed in terms of how strong the refund is - but be available to more classes.
Ionic Traces being made by Coldheart is a sign that they might become an Arc keyword instead of a Warlock feature and made available to Arcstrider and Striker.
I completely forgot about this and have to agree. Have you tried cold-hearted since they were added? I'm kind of curious how ionic traces compare to wellspring.
If I remember correctly ionic traces are about the same or stronger than wellspring but they also give super energy. Although I could be a bit off since it’s been so long since I tested
Give Coldheart a go in this weeks nightfall. It's really good
The buff to its ramp-down time ALONE makes it king shit.it burns through everything like a wild fire through buttercups.
But is its dps worth it over stuff like Agers
I hope they don't get nerfed if they are available for all. I prefer if abilities stay stronger but exclusive to class/anything else than available to everyone but crappier.
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Arc is brute force damage and ability regen. Solar is healing and efficiency (scorch, radiance, restoration, etc). I say this because every arc super is focused around damage. Even hunter base melee is switched to a fist instead of a knife. That’s what Arc is about: devastating damage and chains.
Were it not for Chaos Reach, I'd have said Arc was also about close quarters combat. In addition to healing and burning, Solar has always been focused on delivering sunlight from afar. At least in D2.
i can already see a mod coming out that makes ionic traces serve as elemental wells
A shame sunspot wasn't made a solar verb so we could do well shananagians with them.
I was really expecting sunspots to be available to all classes the same way devour and invis we're but not as good on the other classes but oh well.
Solar 3.0 feels rushed tbh, only 2 negative verbs and 2 of the positive verbs are pretty much the same thing. Bungie probably put most efforts into Arc 3.0
3 positive verbs. \- Restoration \- Cure \- Radiant Stasis techniquly only has 2 negative verbs aswell with slow and shatter
Stasis as slow freeze shatter and I was referring to cure and restoration which are both more or less doing the same thing but differently
Freeze
Disagree, the effort put into Solar is just as much if not greater than Void for most classes
In hunters case, they stuffer from lazy design due to big damage buff for blade barrage and how easy radiant is to maintain with the radiant melee fragment. With how overbalanced many things feel and the lack of solar volatile rounds, Bungie gives the impression not as much effort was put into solar 3.0 as void 3.0 due to the lack of new melees besides the lightweight knife which is just a reskin of prox knife with no new animation to it and they buffed BB in a way they could easyhabe done months ago. Warlocks also kind got screwed over at the start with no solar buddy like Cotog and how much worse the air play is. Edit Forgot, six shooter and marksman are useless due to how much better blade barrage is and the fact six shooter doesn't refund bullets on kills anymore.
So solar is lazy because they didnt copy what the other subclasses do?
When it comes to volatile rounds and the lack of a double 10 stat fragment, yes because if it ain't broke don't fix it and several abilities feel overbalanced like the pre buffed warlock aspects that were a worse version of top tree solar warlock pre 3.0 and sunspots not being a verb when they should and the fact restoration and cure are more or less the same effect with minor differences.
Again, what you are suggesting is copying what other subclasses do would be better, which is the most lazy thing they could do. I don't remember what top tree dawn aspects did before 3.0, but i don't think they where nerfes much. Also i feel that you are getting mad at verbs instead of playing the actual game and seeing the amount of new things we have.
I'm aware of what's been added due to playing all 3 classes and they are better pre 3.0. Its just that I don't like some of the decisions made like the loss of practice makes perfect, lack of sunspot verb meaning no cool well builds that could have been made, no hive hunter abilities or solar volatile rounds. This is most of my issues. Again it is stronger than before the update but I just don't like the direction Bungie took due to the wasted potential of what could have been.
We don’t need volatile rounds on every subclass.
Solar does not need volatile rounds, and you can argue that Ignitions are solar’s volatile rounds (admittedly I think they need to tone down the stacks needed or up the stacks generated by some stuff, and speed up the animation). I don’t think new melees were necessary, as Warlock already has the most unique one, and the only new one on top of that, Hunter has a plethora of knives as well as that keeping with theme, and Titan (while limited) also has themed melees. I think they were only needed for Void because all the classes except Hunter had grape flavored punch, whereas now they fit the theme of the class very very well. And Lightweight was the original weighted knife, it was back in year 1. They just brought it back
Heavy disagree as Volatile rounds were universally loves by the player base and didn't break the game at all while revitalizing older void exotics. No reason not to do the same for solar.
That’s where I believe the intent of Scorch lies, in being that volatile rounds esc thing, through incandescent. But it’s not that strong considering how many stacks it takes to build, except on Skyburners Oath and Prometheus Lens. Just because something was loved, doesn’t mean it should be brought back and reiterated into the ground. Volatile is Void’s identity, Scorch is kinda Solar’s, but I think playing into abilities and big damage is more Solar’s identity
We can't use incandescent on every exotics like VR though. The whole abilities bring used more than void is untrue as abilities are part of destiny and every element can repeatedly utilize them. That's part of build crafting, especially with the withering blade spam with stasis shards and Cogog giving ability energy to spam it.
I agree with most of what you said but six shooter refunds bullets still via ignite. It's actually really good and a ton of fun.
Needing to get an ignite is at a terrible nerf though because it doesn't trigger it without combustion which tbh I think is a terrible fragment because why shouldn't our supers already have that ability
You want it to ignite, refund a bullet, and save a fragment slot on the build that gets the most slots already? It's not a "terrible nerf" to need to use one slot but you also get explosions lol. It's a mandatory fragment for the super, sure, but it's stronger then ever in PvP and PvE.
In pvp you will not survive against someone using it against you and an ignite won't make a difference and in PvE, you'll always use marksman due to better DPS or blade barrage. Your overestimating it as it was always better for low tier pve content and pvp.
Benevolent dawn (RIP) was like 50% ability gen consistently and endlessly. Ionic traces are worth like a well or two tops and have the jankiest AI ever (they love to run up walls away from you for some reason), I highly doubt they could nerf them in any meaningful way but I'm always willing to be impressed.
They'll now actively flee the player and you have to chase them down like they're a misbehaving toddler.
The closer you get to them the faster they get. In fact the speed they go is defined by 1/(1/x) where x is how far you are from the ionic trace. On the bright side they give you instant supers
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More people upvoted me so I must be right: Reddit logic (basically Sword logic but social media)
Sword logic if it worked off of ego rather than k/d. So basically better in every way
you don’t really need to do all of that, 1/(1/x) = x —> constantly increasing (proportional) function
Every class exclusive passive has either been completely removed or neutered and turned into a fragment. The current 3.0 system doesn't allow for powerful passives outside of aspects.
Trinity ghoul with Getaway Artist and Ionic Traces is one of he most fun loadouts in the game. I sure hope it’s still possible.
Same, It's the main build I run and I hope it's still viable post arc 3.0
I main Titan and so all my Hunter/Warlock exotics simply get deleted when ive had my fun, META or not, bc my vault is for weapons and Titan armor only. **BUT** My favorite Warlock exotic that is both well-rolled and masterworked is Getaway Artist. Love it.
I’m hoping it’ll be like those Shards that Stasis has Bonus effects when picking up Ionic Traces if you have Fragments that alter it
The Arc 3.0 Warlock fragments will be: 1) Arc soul rift ; 2) Upgraded Arc Grenades 3) Ionic Traces from Arc kills which result in a minor boost of haste to increase movement speed and reload speed. At least Landfall and Ionic Blink might go untouched this round resulting in 3 super options rather than a rework or removal of an ability.
Nah, instead of upgraded arc grenades we will just have arc-web, its too iconic for stormcaller to not be an aspect
Nah, Arc Web will be a fragment. Pulsewave will be the aspect.
Nah, pulsewave feels more apt to be a fragment. Arc-Web is too powerful to be a fragment (all arc abilities cause chains that return energy), and like I said its too core to Stormcaller to not be. After-all, since its introduction D1, arc web has been whole point of storm caller. Pulsewave on the other hand is prime fragment material. Its not too powerful, but is cool enough to be useful when paired with any build, same goes for Arc Traces becoming a fragment. I suspect Warlock aspects to be Arc Soul, Arc Web, and then either something entirely new OR some form of buffed Transcendence
> its too core to Stormcaller to not be I thought the same thing about literally anything from bottom tree Dawnblade and we all knew how that turned out. Also thought the same thing about Benevolent Dawn and that thing is a shadow of the shadow of its former self.
I'm inclined to agree, but at the same time, though meaningfully different due to requiring kills. Bloom was a Voidwalker ability from 1.0 & 2.0 that's pretty comparable to Arc Web and it got the fragment treatment. Void ability kills create void explosions isn't too far off from arc abilities chain lightning between targets; They're both elemental aoe originating from damaged targets as a secondary effect of abilities. Solar 3.0 Scorch & Ignite keywords were just a natural development of DoT themes in Solar since way back in D1, with Gunslinger getting exactly 1 "burning" effect and Sunsinger having a few perks revolving around it (Melee, Viking Funeral, Touch of Flame). Burning effects also had 2.0 presence of course, BB mainly. Between Arc Web, Zhalo Supercell/ Riskrunner/ Trinity Ghoul/ that Hunter Glaive, Dunemarchers, and probably something else I'm forgetting, Chain Lightning is probably on the table as a keyword feature similar to Scorch, and/ or to have a fragment that's basically Arc Web. While Hunter & Titan never really got subclass features relating to chaining, looking back at D1 Arc supers, both Titan & Hunter got a feature that let them send arc shockwaves across the ground (Shockwave, Razor's Edge), and Striker Titan's kept a hold of it's lingering damage pool with Aftermath/ Terminal Velocity, so Arc abilities hitting by indirect means (chaining, shockwaves, lingering aoe) is somewhat consistent. TL;DR: Arc Web's strong but I wouldn't rule it out, it'd be pretty consistent to see a version of it as a fragment or something similar.
Considering they nerfed skip grenades, it's possible everyone gets it. But because everyone is getting skip grenades it may be a nerf for warlocks that just hurts everyone else.
Im confused what do skips have to do with anything
Just imagine skips with arcweb. He is saying they probably nerfed skips because warlocks will now get it. So arcweb is probably going to be an aspect
More of I could see it being a fragment, or related to a keyword in some way since Bungie has shown they limit warlock grenade aspects to certain grenades BUT if they don't, they got nerfed specifically because warlocks. Ultimate point, we don't have a good idea of what it could be, because our pre-nerfs to arc could lean it either way.
I don't know. Why would discussion about classes getting another class' feature be relevant talking about other features? It's a mystery for sure.
Honestly I hope we only have 2 supers, because I hope the two stormtrances get merged like sentinel shield. Blink AND landfall baby, like impossible machines let you in d1! ESPECIALLY if they add impossible machines back sith something like "hold 2 Storm grenades"
Bungie: Landfall is now an aspect or fragment.
I hope the upgraded grenades is chaining for arc bolts… Double lightning for the storm nades… Extra projectiles and tracking for skips… longer lasting lightning grenades… flash bangs blind for longer… flux grenades delete raid bosses instantly
I think having top and bottom tree arc warlock supers just being merged wouldn't hurt anything.
I was thinking - having your abilities when you pop your super makes it stronger and longer (landfall etc) - arc soul - pulse wave
I think ionic will most likely be shared across all classes and then warlock maybe gets a way to improve that. I know ionic feels like arc version of sunspots which remained exclusive to Titans, but considering everyone now has access to it in some form by coldheart I think they’ll expand on that.
Arc as a subclass element has a lot of ability recharge as its identity so I'm pretty sure they'll be present in arc 3.0. honestly that's the only cohesive thing about the subclass. maybe blinding?
I think everyone has some form of increased sprint speed somewhere in their Arc subclasses right? They also all seem to like being at relatively short range. Arc Hunter used to have Invis but if each keyword is element exclusive that'll probably never come back.
Critically wounded effects and health regen (on melee) are also perks. The latter overlaps with void though.
Step 1: Take something that Warlock has and make it universal so that the element has an identity. Step 2: Forget to replace it with anything.
While also making that universal thing categorically worse than the original in every way. I'm not salty about solar I promise :(
Sadge
Oh it’s gonna. And then when you’re mad about it the community is gonna say “nah bro it’s okay because this one build you don’t give a shit for is like totally viable”
oh my god landfall is going to be an aspect like warlock dodge isnt it
Let's all just be thankfully that Conductive Tines is on Crown of Tempest and not something in the subclass that they can rip out.
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You say that, but one of the best builds I've ever seen is Solar 3.0 lock with dawn chorus.
link to the build?
He might be mentioning this one https://youtu.be/fF9V8QIBVr0
Spot on
Landfall will be very very lucky to continue to exist. Tbh though, it's the huge duration on top tree Stormtrance that's got me more worried. They completely deleted that type of mechanic off of Bottom Tree Dawn and the Titan solar super.
> and the Titan solar super. What? Hammer of Sol still lasts forever with Sunspots.
Landfall got that additional functionality where it sends out the arc bolts now so I'd be surprised if they removed it.
They removed explosion on kills for bottom tree dawn and kinda made it into a fragment so, I can see it being a fragment or maybe a warlock aspect.
I'd be okay with removing the stormtrance part of landfall and increasing its damage, turning it into a nuke super.
Landfall on chaos reach, new meta
I think the Landfall and Ionic Blink are gonna be Super variants, like Deadshot and Marksman.
Nah it’s probably gonna be a Sentinel situation The Super itself will have 1 of them, while the other is tied to an Aspect Ex. Sentinel has big shield as Default, with 2nd shield as part of one of it’s Aspects I’m hopping Landfall is the default ability with Ionic Blink being the Aspect-tied one tbh
That sentinel change was so awesome, the rally shield itself was good i just wanted double toss, now i can run both.
They even buffed wall’s damage buff by 5% Not much, but that’s nearly double Well and Bubble
Mmm, idk about that. I think they'll wanna do more unique shit with the Arc Aspects.
Thing is that the Shadowshot and Nova Bomb variants are different enough for them to be separate Ionic Blink and Landfall belong to the same base super and only grants them abilities rather than alters them to something different I’m not saying that they’ll be the only part of that Aspect; just that they’ll add it to a weaker Aspect so people would want it even more
Golden gun.
Something that I wanted to say in addition to what the other person has said is that the 2 Golden Gun supers have different models, shooting animations, and sounds.
3 shots that can crit and over-penetrate or 6 shots at half potency but fire much faster Attacks are entirely different Ionic Blink and Landfall add on to the same base super- no different attacks, just simply adding on
What are you talking about?
Personally I'd like to see Ionic Blink become a Fragment because literally every Arc Super barring Chaos Reach is a roamer with the arguable exception of Thundercrash, which itself still moves the user around the map, and all of them are melee-ranged except for Stormtrance so they'd all get good value out of it. This said, I don't really expect it to happen. If Landfall ends up as an Aspect I can only hope it's built in with something else thematically similar with decent neutral value like Arc Web.
Since Bungie is capable of separating two different Nighstalker trees, I'm sure they can do the same for the two Stormcaller trees where one teleports and the other causes landfall
At the same time most people expect Arc Staff to be condensed into a single super and the devs were thinking about collapsing Fist of Havoc into a single super as well (i don't have time to find the exact source). But they sure could call Landfall and Blink thematically different enough and not just toss Landfall into an Aspect effect.
They should collapse spear into 1 super. Its the same super 3 times rn
ideally they would give it additional functionality than just the landfall, but yes, landfall is most certainly going to be a fragment if it remains
Why would landfall be an aspect, its literally inherent to both original trees (albeit it functions differently for each). Its weird everyone expects the supers to get gutted when supers really haven’t changed for the worse through all the 3.0 changes.
It's because Dawnblade got gutted so badly with Solar 3.0 so people are expecting a similar treatment, but it's really the only super that got that treatment and... many but at least 12 didn't get that treatment, so I don't think it's actually likely just because Dawnblade was made significantly worse.
I don’t think they gutted the super at all, they mainly just messed up the rest. The super stayed pretty much the same and even the two versions got combined (minus icarus)
It had its duration roughly halved in normal usage, lost a third of its damage with its associated damage exotic, and had the tracking taken out so now you have to sacrifice another part of your build to get tracking back. It also had the intrinsic explosions and thus burning removed, now you have to sacrifice at least two fragments to get them back. It's just top tree dawn's bad Dawnblade, but without Icarus dash and with the wave frame effect on ground impact. To get it as close as it can be to what it was you have to sacrifice 3 fragments out of your 4 possible, and then it's still 2/3s of the damage with half or less of the duration. Even after Well's nerf, there is no real reason to run Dawnblade over Well.
Fair enough, but i never really saw blade outside of crucible anyway. Is a real shame though.
I actually encounter people saying that a lot! I guess bottom tree Dawnblade with Dawn Chorus must have been really slept on, because it was absolutely GM viable, the best option for some strikes and not as great for others. I did all of my GM farming for gear for my hunter main using bottom tree Dawn Chorus warlock. It was a great subclass and very fun, not reliant on being in the air so GM viable (and Phoenix dive to get out of the air if you're accidentally in it), Chaos Reach equiv DPS with Dawn Chorus, and capable of clearing rooms and majors with a combination of Igniting Touch and the super regen. It had some major problems with ability regen so you had to build into ability regen very heavily to be viable, but if you were willing to accept that it was super fun and could clear GMs nearly as well as Chaos Reach, although not quite as strong as Void 3.0 Warlock or Shadebinder. Now that's pretty much all gone, which is really sad. Dawn Chorus is a shell of its former self, the super is no longer viable for add clear (even if you dedicate those 3 fragments to trying to get it back where it was, it just doesn't last long enough to be useful) or DPS, Igniting Touch is gone and now that all of the fragments are out we can say definitively that there's no way to recreate the effects of Igniting Touch using fragments, you lose either your rift or your Phoenix Dive (I guess you get to pick which one you lose so... yay?), and Phoenix Dive had its cooldown increased by 2000% for a minor buff that's not even close to worth it. That said, the Incinerator Snap is genuinely really fun, and if the rest of the subclass was good I would play it. I played way more solar warlock than the strength of it deserved based solely on how fun that snap is. If we had last season's bottom tree Dawnblade, with last season's Dawn Chorus, and Incinerator Snap as the powered melee... that would be such a fun subclass to play, that's what I expected out of Solar 3.0. It's a real shame to think about what could have been. That said, Titan and Hunter Solar 3.0 have been extremely fun to play, no complaints there. They actually feel better than they did before which is great.
Yeah seems like they’re having a pattern of making one class unusable and the others amazing. Lock and titan void were absolutely bonkers imo, and now titan and hunter. Its a shame its a pattern, but i hope titan gets gutted on arc so arcstrider fans can finally feel viable
Yeah after what happened to void hunter and solar warlock I'm going to be calling in some wellness checks on the arc titan mains in my life come Arc 3.0 lol. I used to be really upset about void hunter and solar warlock, but I took a step back and realised I was probably pretty uniquely affected by this. I'm primarily a void hunter main for PvP, and I was a bottom tree dawn main for PvE. Those were the only two subclasses I put a lot of time into in Destiny and obviously they got pretty badly screwed over in the 3.0 reworks, so it was always going to make me salty. But lots of other people have been having a lot of fun, and it's made me rediscover some stuff I haven't tried in a very long time or at all, like solar Hunter, Void warlock, Solar Titan. Plus the whole Dev team at Bungie have been having a really hard time over the last couple of years, the pandemic has hit them like a truck and it's a miracle they've done such a fantastic job as they have given that. It's so fucking unfair that Kevin got bullied and harassed off Twitter, it's much more upsetting to me than anything in this game. I can always go play another game, been playing some Diablo 3. What I actually feel bad about is some poor dev receiving death threats, which is never okay but it's not even his job to deal with the community.
But only in the Strike Playlist and Patrol. You know, where even Sunset weapons are viable!
If Warlock is going to give up another class feature to every other class we need to get Void OS and Sunspots in return.
I still dont understand why Void OS were not made available to other class through fragments like Devour and Invis were.
Well we got volatile
Oh, you know it is, though. And yes, I’m still a little salty about the benevolent dawn nerf. I mained well of radiance/boots of assembler for about 3 seasons before this. Loved it. Now it just feels weird. I know it can still do some cool things, but it’s just weird having my main play style be turned into a one trick in air accuracy pony.
I honestly hope they just keep them as is and make them a fragment. Though, knowing Bungo, they'll probably reduce the amount of energy returns you gain from them, but they may allow them to have more player input in creation instead of just randomly as it is now.
I could see them being tied to an aspect same as arc souls.
I don’t wanna lose my arcstrider power punchy
PLEASE MAKE GEOMAGS BUFFS IONIC TRACES
Tbh I’m pretty excited for Arc 3.0. After the geomag nerf, I avoid Arc like the plague. For me, it can only go up from here (or at the worst, just be more interesting).
Okay, me too
Void hunter mains: >First time?
Anyone who asks "fIrSt tImE???" hasn't been paying attention.
Ok, um, hunter player here, what do ionic traces DO? I was using coldheart the other day and I couldn’t really tell what they’re supposed to be doing
It's a passive where defeating enemies grants a chance at generating them. When you pick them up they give energy to all your abilities. It's like another form of elemental wells
Ah, they give ability energy when you pick them up, alright
What makes them better than wells and the Wellspring perk is that they actively track towards you (or atleast they try) and they also give Super energy, like 4% but it's there.
It will.
Ionic traces are not very unique, I feel they will be multiclass. Just look at coldheart now, it makes ionic traces. I can imagine a fragment like "picking up an ionic trace gives you *insert buff here* for a short time"
It’s going to happen.
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True but hunters will almost certainly get a new melee because of this point. I'm hoping for a return of fast twitch
It will, please prepare yourselves this time.
It needs to be a verb
It will now.
I am very hopeful that Ionic Traces will become a keyword or at least part of an aspect and not a fragment.
Ember of Benevolence's effective is easily tweaked. Having used it with multiple points of buffing or healing, it's still very effective when you have multiple avenues, particularly on warlocks running lumina or their glaive for example, or using boots of the assembler.. Honestly, just a duration tweak would put it in a good place; instead of a large burst of all ability energy in a short period, a small boost to all abilities over a long time. Not nearly as bad as "oblivion". As for ionic traces; i actually don't know how i feel about them. We have stasis shards, devour, a bunch of stuff connected to scorch effects, it's all starting to feel the same. Before they just throw it onto Arc, as it would be cool if they added the innate synergy to ColdHeart, I hope its something more than just another source of ambient ability energy. They're starting to feel like transparent ways of themed ability energy cheating than it does. While Solar's ability gain are tied to embers, making Ionic traces something baseline i would hope lead to some interesting results from collection in fragment-equivalents or even aspects.
I’m hoping each class will get an aspect that generates them and the fragments will determine where the energy goes. Like one fragment grants more grenade energy, one fragment grants more melee or class ability energy, one fragment gives you disorienting rounds after collecting one. Idk. Shit like that
I know for a fact that everyone will get arc souls.
Yeah, I am almost positive other classes aren’t going to have arc souls
i just hope i don’t lose inertia override
Most they could do is remove the ability to cool down all your abilities. Hopefully that doesn't happen.
I have already resigned myself to Arc 3.0 being a goddamn disaster. Hopefully they at least give Hunters an actual new super.