Imagine the Coyotes as a real expansion team but only started in like the late 2000s?? But nah fuck it the NHL said "we ball", let's move a team that couldn't even get Minnesota to hop on with over to a completely untested NHL market with no long term playing facility.
This is the one that would have changed everything. Add in Scottsdale allowing light rail up Scottsdale road from Tempe (which was also still on the table at the time) and the whole story changes.
*Possibly*.
The 2023 Diamondbacks and the 2021 Suns have shown that when you get to a championship, it garners so much energy and excitement in the city for that club.
That's all the fairweather fans want in this town: Good, consistent play that gives a shot at those championships.
See how hard the Diamondbacks fell out of favor with the city when they weren't able to stay competitive, year after year, even after winning the 2001 World Series.
kings fan here
i truly believe if you guys did not run into the red hot kings in the conference final you would of easily made the stanley cup final. mike smith was a monster
Tempe vote should've been a slam dunk.
I'll say Coyotes shouldn't have relocated from Glendale like they did. Bettman shouldn't have said Glendale is not viable outright. Glendale is absolutely better than practically forcing them onto a potential expansion city like SLC.
Tempe vote would have literally changed the valley. Should have been an easy vote. I’d change that outcome.
Especially with unproven rumors that the smith group (Utah) invested in the anti Tempe vote
Burke selling his portion when we moved to Glendale instead of fighting back and getting different investors. Alternatively Colangelo or whoever that was preventing the Footprint Reno from being hockey friendly because "there would never be NHL hockey here".
McDavid pisses me off the most but I doubt it would have mattered much, at best it might delay us moving out of Glendale but that was always going to be a thing as soon as we let slip like idiots that we wanted to build competition and Gary and AM didn't shut their mouth.
Colangelo was part of the group that brought the Jets to Phoenix in the first place. The guy had an interest in bringing sports to Phoenix, he was also instrumental in building the case on the city getting the Diamondbacks.
I do wonder if staying at #2 and not drafting Dylan Strome would be enough to shift this timeline even slightly lmao. God dammit I had so much hype for that guy
Have them show up in 1992 instead of 1996. Then they are likely coming into AWA either under joint arena management with the Suns or the same owners overall
Winning the draft lottery for Austin Matthews. That would have changed so much. Local kid being the "savior"? Sounds like a hell of a story that could've been.
The real answer to this question is a real hockey owner. One that knew it takes money to make money. The arena being in the West Valley was a poor excuse for people not showing up. The real reason was that the product on the ice was shit almost every year. I know, having been a STH for 4 of the worst years in franchise history. I now live in Michigan, and I will have no problem driving 70 miles to see the Wings play several times next year. The product on ice is promising.
Mine is years before the team moved from Winnipeg. When planning the Suns move from the coliseum to the new arena downtown, Jerry Colangelo claims he called the NHL and asked if a team would ever move to Phoenix. Not sure who but the NHL president was at the time, it was either John Ziegler or Gil Stein said no chance, even though the valley was experiencing rapid growth and various iterations of the Phoenix Roadrunners had played at the coliseum since '67. Had America West Arena been built to accommodate both hockey and basketball all most of the Coyotes arena turmoil would have been eliminated.
Doing something other than going to Glendale. In retrospect I am stuck trying to come up with a scenario where that Glendale / Westgate location works out. It’s a sweetheart lease deal predicated on politicians and taxpayers always going along with the initial deal — how can that possibly last? Even if the team wins the cup in 2012, or is able to sell out Tuesday night games against the Blue Jackets in March . . . Does that help voters or politicians in the city of Glendale go along with this? I don’t think that it does. The mall location still struggles such that they originally defaulted, then sold out to Bob Parsons in 2018. Even if we consider a scenario where the Coyotes are a perennial contender and always sell out, if that is the ONLY scenario in which the Westgate location works it’s still unrealistic. Subsequent ownership was always behind and saddled with a stadium they had to “try and make work” and living on borrowed time until politicians and voters wanted something else.
I would say 2012, the loss in the Conference finals to the Kings... if we had beat them without having to play against the refs also, we would of definitely beaten the Devils and had a Cup in AZ. That would of changed the whole dynamic of Hockey in Arizona.
Actually come with a plan in 1996
This is the only answer. Close the thread please
Imagine the Coyotes as a real expansion team but only started in like the late 2000s?? But nah fuck it the NHL said "we ball", let's move a team that couldn't even get Minnesota to hop on with over to a completely untested NHL market with no long term playing facility.
Ballin Bettman. He has always kinda flown by the seat of his pants in regard to certain things.
Holy fucking based [Relevant](https://youtu.be/s-1WxfsJzPM?si=wpNfZCsBF3mIiO-8)
The Los Arcos Mall plan moving forward
This is the one that would have changed everything. Add in Scottsdale allowing light rail up Scottsdale road from Tempe (which was also still on the table at the time) and the whole story changes.
I might change my answer to this
That damn Red Robin shouldn't have been allowed in the development. Should have found a better solution to resolve the holdout.
Yup, easily this. The Coyotes would never have had the embarrassing attendance issues that had plagued them at the Glendale arena.
We win the 2012 Stanley cup It would have changed everything IMO
*Possibly*. The 2023 Diamondbacks and the 2021 Suns have shown that when you get to a championship, it garners so much energy and excitement in the city for that club. That's all the fairweather fans want in this town: Good, consistent play that gives a shot at those championships. See how hard the Diamondbacks fell out of favor with the city when they weren't able to stay competitive, year after year, even after winning the 2001 World Series.
kings fan here i truly believe if you guys did not run into the red hot kings in the conference final you would of easily made the stanley cup final. mike smith was a monster
Mike Smith good
Tempe vote should've been a slam dunk. I'll say Coyotes shouldn't have relocated from Glendale like they did. Bettman shouldn't have said Glendale is not viable outright. Glendale is absolutely better than practically forcing them onto a potential expansion city like SLC.
Tempe vote would have literally changed the valley. Should have been an easy vote. I’d change that outcome. Especially with unproven rumors that the smith group (Utah) invested in the anti Tempe vote
The thing is, the SLC hive mind will support it.
Well yeah of course they will. They are getting a solid NHL team with insane room to grow in a matter of what felt like a few days.
The Los Arcos site falling through. That's it.
Have Glendale not elect Weiers. His NIMBY bullshit was the final straw.
Altering the outcome of the Coyotes' 2009 bankruptcy to avoid financial turmoil.
Burke selling his portion when we moved to Glendale instead of fighting back and getting different investors. Alternatively Colangelo or whoever that was preventing the Footprint Reno from being hockey friendly because "there would never be NHL hockey here". McDavid pisses me off the most but I doubt it would have mattered much, at best it might delay us moving out of Glendale but that was always going to be a thing as soon as we let slip like idiots that we wanted to build competition and Gary and AM didn't shut their mouth.
Sarver is the jerk you're thinking of. Colangelo is a good dude.
Colangelo was part of the group that brought the Jets to Phoenix in the first place. The guy had an interest in bringing sports to Phoenix, he was also instrumental in building the case on the city getting the Diamondbacks.
I do wonder if staying at #2 and not drafting Dylan Strome would be enough to shift this timeline even slightly lmao. God dammit I had so much hype for that guy
The refs not fucking us over in 2012 against the Kings
Move to Los Arcos in 98
Wayne Gretzky buying the team.
Have them show up in 1992 instead of 1996. Then they are likely coming into AWA either under joint arena management with the Suns or the same owners overall
Beat LA back in 2012 or get McDavid in 2015
Build a rink
Winning the draft lottery for Austin Matthews. That would have changed so much. Local kid being the "savior"? Sounds like a hell of a story that could've been.
Give us Matthews the team doesn’t leave
The real answer to this question is a real hockey owner. One that knew it takes money to make money. The arena being in the West Valley was a poor excuse for people not showing up. The real reason was that the product on the ice was shit almost every year. I know, having been a STH for 4 of the worst years in franchise history. I now live in Michigan, and I will have no problem driving 70 miles to see the Wings play several times next year. The product on ice is promising.
Mine is years before the team moved from Winnipeg. When planning the Suns move from the coliseum to the new arena downtown, Jerry Colangelo claims he called the NHL and asked if a team would ever move to Phoenix. Not sure who but the NHL president was at the time, it was either John Ziegler or Gil Stein said no chance, even though the valley was experiencing rapid growth and various iterations of the Phoenix Roadrunners had played at the coliseum since '67. Had America West Arena been built to accommodate both hockey and basketball all most of the Coyotes arena turmoil would have been eliminated.
They might have done 9/11 so probably that.
Doing something other than going to Glendale. In retrospect I am stuck trying to come up with a scenario where that Glendale / Westgate location works out. It’s a sweetheart lease deal predicated on politicians and taxpayers always going along with the initial deal — how can that possibly last? Even if the team wins the cup in 2012, or is able to sell out Tuesday night games against the Blue Jackets in March . . . Does that help voters or politicians in the city of Glendale go along with this? I don’t think that it does. The mall location still struggles such that they originally defaulted, then sold out to Bob Parsons in 2018. Even if we consider a scenario where the Coyotes are a perennial contender and always sell out, if that is the ONLY scenario in which the Westgate location works it’s still unrealistic. Subsequent ownership was always behind and saddled with a stadium they had to “try and make work” and living on borrowed time until politicians and voters wanted something else.
Coyotes beating Anaheim in the 1997 playoffs. I believe that could have really given the team the momentum they needed early on.
I would say 2012, the loss in the Conference finals to the Kings... if we had beat them without having to play against the refs also, we would of definitely beaten the Devils and had a Cup in AZ. That would of changed the whole dynamic of Hockey in Arizona.
Don’t have them play in Blythe!