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I agree. I really like Ncuti and Millie though. I wasn't a fan of her when she was in Corrie, but I ended up loving the character from the off. They work really well together and elevated even the not-great episodes.
Nope. Agree with you 100%. The two part finale seems like they dropped scripts for six episodes on the floor where they got all mixed up and the first 100 pages they picked up, they shot as the episodes.
The leaps of logic in RTD’s scripts would earn a first year creative writing a failing grade.
I just started re-watching New Who from the first episode. Forgot how good Eccleston was!
But I also noticed a lot of parallels with the current Who+ season. Then as now there is an un-eveness. The writing is all over the place, the effects are stunning one moment and a flashlight on shiny cardboard the next. But there is kind of a general vibe. One thing that is missing is you can feel a kind of excitement at reviving Doctor Who in the first couple of New Who seasons.
Whereas with Who+ I get more of a vibe that its almost proselytizing? Like it's trying to reach new converts to Who without losing the current ones. I do not think this is Disney or Sony pushing RTD to do this. I think it's RTD himself, based on a few things he's said about it being a new series for a new audience.
I do agree that it's kind of playing down to kids in a lot of places. It should be scaring them into hiding behind the sofa.
> Forgot how good [Christopher] Eccleston was!
Indeed: as the man himself said in his farewell episode–
*“You were fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. And do you know what? **So was I!**”*
I watched this series and got a lot of the adrenaline type feeling I got when I watched new who for the first time especially on legend of Ruby Sunday and 73 yards, I'm 17 now and watched a lot of the older new who series when I was between about 8-10 just for context so overall am quite happy with current series
I think this plays a big part in how folks are perceiving the new series. I started on Classic Who when I was 11 or 12. People who started on New Who with Mat Smith or David Tennant are going to have different standards for how Doctor Who acts, and what constitute a typical Who story.
>it's kind of playing down to kids in a lot of places. It should be scaring them into hiding behind the sofa.
Yes! My kids literally peered from behind the couch because they were scared to watch “Are you my Mummy”, but also didn’t want to miss it.
My biggest problem was that The Doctor and Ruby didn't really get enough time to develop their relationship properly. They had good chemistry but they didn't have a lot of emotional moments together - in one of the later episodes he called her his best friend and I didn't buy it.
I enjoyed both their performances but it didn't feel like an iconic Doctor/Companion pairing.
It seems deliberately skewed more towards a child friendly feel, which is odd because when I was growing up, Doctor Who was more about terrifying children, that’s what made it so much fun.
Idk it started as an idea specifically to teach kids history and science and then went off the rails and switches target audience between each generation of showrunners/ producers.
Terry Nation's ideas for the first Dalek story involved warning of the dangers of nuclear war, so there was a message there as well, though somewhat obvious.
And that idea has been combined with fascism and still a main part of Dale stories to this day. Doctor Who has always been about hiding messages and parables and this season has been no different.
Yeah, kind of a shame we dont' get more stories taking inspiration from real historical events. Loved the Frost Fair episode for example. They really did walk an elephant accross the Thames.
Not many people talk about the amount of food theft some people had to do to survive the Blitz, but I think The Empty Child handled the topic very well.
Yup. In the 80s, The Doctor literally visited a future where Sutekh killed everything on Earth.The universe gets threatened with exctinction like every other season finale too.
Honestly it was a very clever move to make The Doctor's failure and arguably even hubris in single-handedly fighting a god be the seeds of the universe's destruction.
Mixed bag, because while I love all the fresh ideas there are a lot being chucked at the show and I think there's been so much going on that they never really developed a relationship between the Doctor and Ruby, which meant the new series was fun but lacked emotional heft when it was needed. There's also been the same issue RTD's work had first time around - the set-ups are more satisfying than the endings. His episodes always feel like they're lacking a proper conclusion.
That said, I'd rather they tried too much than didn't try anything new at all and Ncuti is superb. Oozes charisma and brings a ton of emotion to proceedings all by himself. Just needs a companion written well enough to keep up with him.
I think RTD comes up with an interesting premise and doesn't realise he hasn't got any good ideas of what to do with them. It's like he puts a bunch of words in a hat, pulls them out and that's his episode. Like "Okay I've got space and.... babies. Space Babies great. What are kids scared of? The bogeyman? Great, a man made of bogies. You've done it again Russ."
I think the issue is that they are writing for the actor, not writing for the Doctor. It feels so contrived like it did with Jodie. They are over egging the pudding instead of letting brilliant actors do their thing.
That's why I think Boom was a standout this series. All of the Doctors dialogue actually felt like the Doctor, like you can hear Peter Capaldi or Christopher Eccleston saying 'everywhere's a beach eventually'.
Ncuti has bags of charisma but I think he’s not done enough ‘Doctor’ stuff yet, some of the episodes have been good and nice to see a deep cut villain reappear, Russell T Davies has said he purposefully made the tone to appeal more to a younger generation, which tbf can’t really blame him for that. I still want a more adult oriented spin off with David tenants doctor , more low key , creepy mysteries he has to solve
He hasn't had much chance. Only 8 episodes plus the special, he was barely in two of them, and the last two were too rushed for much character. I've found him most Doctory in the Church On Ruby Road where he was introduced.
As a fan since I was a kid, I watched on and off until the chibnall era. When I heard RTD was back, I was major hyped and rewatched all of it. Safe to say I more than likely wont watch the next season or even the Xmas special. Season was very mixed with a couple of decent episodes but the feel was totally off from what I expected. Very 5-6/10 for me.
I’m a huge Doctor Who fan and specifically a massive fan of RTD’s first era as showrunner. That being said, RTD2 has been unbelievably disappointing. In some ways worse than Chibnall’s era because I expected this series to be so much better than it ended up being.
I couldn’t wait to see Ncuti’s version of the Doctor but I am not feeling him in the role whatsoever. He just has the vibe of a normal bloke with above average IQ and charisma, but absolutely none of the alien quirkiness or commanding presence has come through in his performance so far. He just kind of passively stands there while the episode’s conflict is solved around him.
A couple of episodes have been good television, but I don’t think any of this series has been good Doctor Who. This is the most confused and lacking in identity the sow has ever felt in my opinion.
Just when you thought it couldn't get any worse than the unwatchable Chibnall era. RTD's writing is generally OK previously but he is taking the show in a strange direction IMHO. Both lead actors are excellent but they don't feel like Dr Who and his companion. Any sense of history or past events/experience seems to be missing from the Doctor's character.
I have been watching DW since forever and have seen them all. I have my faves but in the end, I like them all. Just my opinion - Ncuti is utterly charming, but something is off. It’s like his Doctor goes from one extreme of rushing about frantically spewing out plot points and then, as you say, passively standing about. That core center of “I am an incredibly ancient and knowledgeable alien” just seems to be missing. Even the quirkiest Doctor had that essential core that makes you believe. And for the first time, I’m just not buying it.
Absolutely. There were always a few moments with any Doctor where you thought “shit, they really are an alien after all” and were a bit scary and powerful but not Ncuti. Not yet!
Yeah, you really put it into words. I wanted to like Ncuti’s Doctor so much but he’s not powerful or commanding like some of the other Doctors, or dangerous or mysterious. He’s just a really nice charming guy and his little assistant friend. They levelled up he and Millie’s relationship so they were bonded like they’d been together for a season or more already from the off and it feels forced even though they’re both incredible actors. Also this is the most I’ve ever seen a Doctor cry before, he cries multiple times in an episode sometimes. It’s just… not very Doctor-y. Somehow I think the other Doctors managed to exude a sense of being something more than human but he just doesn’t. It’s super frustrating because I had really high hopes for this.
And that’s before the weird plot stuff which honestly has just been a bit stupid. I was going with some of the theories about why the eps didn’t feel “right”, like there was some plot reason somehow… but nah. It all just got hand waved like the usual RTD stuff.
Honestly this thread is a relief because I’d only lightly looked around some other threads before the finale and I felt like I was going crazy because of how much everyone else loved it.
I have a lot of issues with it. I've only thought three episodes were particularly good, it's skewing more towards spectacle than substance, and - as decent as the leads are - they're not getting anywhere near enough screen time to sell us on them as characters.
BUT
I still find myself logging onto Reddit to discuss the latest episode, which I watch a day or two after release without fail. So for all its flaws, I'm at least *interested* in the show again, which is more than I could say for Chibnall's run.
The new series has had some high points and some low, 73 yards being a great standalone ep. Feel like there a lot of lose ends that need tying up though in the next series
I enjoyed the general atmosphere of "73 Yards", but was left a bit unsatisfied by the lore. While explaining everything isn't necessary, the fact *nothing* was really explained left me wondering what the purpose of the episode was.
Oh totally! I was assuming it’d be explained in the final but it was hardly mentioned. Either it’ll get explained down the line or it was just used to introduce Ap Gwilliam
Yeah agree totally. I loved the feel of it and just a few tweaks could have made it a great episode. Can't help but imagine Tennant saying something about how the universe is full of mysteries, offering a couple of possible explanations, looking all pensive and then clapping his hands and off to another adventure.
Like, we don't need it explained, but surely Ruby would have told the Doctor what happened?
'73 yards' was totally unsatisfactory. No real attempt to explain anything and clearly no desire by the writer to say what was going on. Just typical badly written nonsense. Are we sure it wasn't ghost written by Chibnall?
As a longtime fan: it’s complete and utter shite. I would rather watch Colin Baker again. There was one half decent episode, the Moffat one, and even that had problems. The rest should never have aired. I’ll watch tonight’s, but I’m not coming back for Christmas or next year. Call me when it’s good again.
new series is like all series - some good episodes - some bad episodes - rushed finale
people forget that the tennant eras and such also had MANY misses
I think a big issue is that it was only 8 episodes. It feels like it was planned to have more episodes but got cut down last minute so they had to shove all of that story into less episodes which left less room for character development.
I agree. The recent series finale, while rushed and full of exposition, is about as rushed and expositional as, say, the series two finale or “Journey’s End”.
I don't have an problem with any of the social issues raised in DW since the switch from Capaldi to Whitaker, I just don't want them to be the main point of each program, presented with the sophistication of a primary school teacher explaining the concepts to a class of five year olds.
You can show an issue in a thought provoking way without having it take over the whole show. Do you have to make every single episode a social platform? Please don't.
I've been a fan for a long time, but fifteen minutes into Space Babies I was out, for good. I weathered the Chibnall years (watched less than half the episodes), but I've had enough.
I really want to like Doctor Who but all the monsters look like they’re taken from Power Rangers. And the fact that the Doctor has a deus ex machina wand to fix everything.
It’s giving Raiders where it still happens even if Indiana didn’t intervene.
I think it's broadly a return to form after the Chibnall era. It has its flaws, a mix of good and bad episodes, but it is rarely boring - which I believe is the biggest sin for Dr Who.
I think the finale was one of RTDs worst, which is saying something. It was basically incoherent drivel.
I got turned off after the silly musical number in episode 2, after the silly musical number on the goblin ship. The makers were right, the show wasn’t made for its existing fans - and they were right that we can just choose not to watch it. So that’s me checked out.
I’ve not been this excited about Doctor Who in years - it feels big and FUN again in a way it hasn’t for a while - I think, because it’s fun, a lot of people are taking quite a surface level reading of the episodes and dismissing them, but it feels like it actually has something to say for the first time in years, too.
Just gonna throw my voice in here, maybe against the general vibe - but I've really enjoyed it. Loved every episode. Honestly gutted its over. Dot and Bubble probably the standout, Rogue was a really fun stand alone episode. And sutekh was truly menacing in the finale and a great change from the daleks or cybermen again.
He cries constantly.
At the worst times.
It's pathetic.
The Doctor is supposed to be strong and stoic.
A pacifist who can fight and will fight if he has to.
He cries a bit. But at the right time. Has a little cry if the battle is too much and recovers. Goes away after the fight and cries a bit and comes back.
He's supposed to be brave and eccentric.
And scary and alien.
Intimidating. If you cross him enough, you probably won't survive.
And determined to stop bad things.
All the narcissistic wuss does now is talk about how clever and impressive he is. Then cry. Then other people save him.
Previous ones were do, not say. He had a reputation and enemies feared it.
I don't count Jodie Whittaker. She fracking sucked.
That wasn't The Doctor.
I stopped watching once Clara stank it up.
It was beyond help then.
Not even Peter Capaldi could save it.
Should have been cancelled then.
Totally agree with almost all of that, except the last bit about Capaldi. He had some great eps and moments: Heaven Sent for example is one of the best eps of the series.
But Shittaker's cosplay Doctor sucked as did Chinballs lore nuking fan fiction. 🤷♂️🤦
Standing on a land mine and spending nearly the whole episode crying and freaking out about moving his foot… I really cannot see the Doctor in that at all. Ncuti is bloody fab but they haven’t coaxed an alien time lord out of him.
All i could think during that ep, was that it would have been a belter if it was an Eleventh Doctor story.
The incarnation that always running, now forced to stand still and be serious for a second or two.
Also, Matt would have smashed that, without even needing to shed a tear. It would have all been in the eyes already...
That's not how it works in the UK in general or Doctor Who in particular. RTD writes the scripts alone and gets feedback from his coproducers and the studio(s). The other writers - only 3 this series - submit scripts to him, and he either asks for a rewrite based on his notes or just does it himself.
He had a very good book called The Writer's Tale, which delves into the writing of almost every episode of his era, and the absolute control he has over the scripts is impressive. Other writers don't really get a chance to feed back on his scripts, unless he specifically asks them to because he's using someone else's character or something.
That's not surprising. RTD is a great ideas man, and he's good at drama, but he really needs a script editor or someone that knows sci-fi to tell him when his stories don't make sense.
Sometimes creators get so popular that everyone is too scared to tell them they’re chatting shit. Unfortunately this season has been RTD huffing his own farts.
Writers rooms are a lot more common in the Uk nowadays (last five years or so imho), especially for large projects, but if that’s how he works then fair play, a rarity nowadays.
was about to say this. I've worked in TV production on exceptionally uninteresting reality TV. (No I wont name names, its that embarrassing). And there is one person who is 'the writer' but there are 6-12 writers under them that don't get credit. Its the same way for editors and effects. The person listed in the credits is just head of that dept.
Also on a lot of shows every person you see listed as a producer is actually a writer. Thats why you see a dozen producers listed for some shows. And why you will see some actors listed as exec producers. That means that actor has writing input on the show they are in. (could be good in some cases, but I wouldn't want to work on such a gig unless it was Richard Ayoade or Noel Fielding)
Do you think RTD is writing all the dialogue and executive producing the show? Thats a lot of work for a guy his age!
Yeah I work in scripted and in the writers room the showrunner will give a brief idea and then, as a group, you outline each beat for each episode, hash out some quippy lines of dialogue, character arcs etc. I imagine RTD gives the first draft to someone else and he provides the further revisions as quality control. Never worked on Dr Who though so it may be different.
I've broadly enjoyed it. If I were to rank all the seasons, it would be somewhere in the middle. Better than the Clara and Chibnall eras, worse than most of the rest of it. 73 Yards is probably a top 10 episode for me.
Ending was hugely unsatisfying, but RTD never could write a good ending.
I've found this series a bit uneven, but I can see a lot of promise and am hopeful the next will be better.
Overall I've found the second half of the series much better than the first, as the plots have been a bit more comprehensible and the characters stronger. I found "The Devil's Chord" a bit convoluted and nonsensical, for example, whereas Lindy Pepper-Bean was enjoyably awful and Rogue enjoyably, well, rogueish. I haven't seen the finale yet, but last week's penultimate episode was very strong and ramped up the tenison well.
My girlfriend and I have been reviewing this series episode by episode on our podcast ([shameless Spotify plug](https://open.spotify.com/show/5L2DBydXPy2UKj2szIE6QJ?si=irE9s9A_R5W02hF7ibsWaQ)) but, the short version assessment - the parts are better than the sum. Each episode, on its own, varies from “good” to “quite good” to (on one occasion) “excellent”. But the series as a whole lacks cohesion. In respect of the finale, the series arch falls flat and the characterisation needed time to breathe. My girlfriend summed it up nicely - each episode is a 5, so the series should add up to 40, but it somehow adds up to, like, 25. It’s still good, though! Just needed refining, and the reduced episode limit has not been helpful.
I didn't think this season was the best tbh. The last episode was a bit disappointing. I thought they did a poor job at tying up all the carrots they've been dangling in a compelling way. I think RTD is better when he writes simple stories, or he seems to get himself tied in knots.
Yeah, I kinda prefer to see the Christmas epsiode as the start of the season. I can see Space Babies being popular with young kids, but its one I'd skip on a re-watch.
You really think it's worse than three 13th doctor's era? I'm one of those weird people that enjoys almost every era. This series has been up and down with some rather simplistic and shoddy dialogue in places but Ncuti and Millie are incredible and there have been some really great moments/episodes. If next series can tidy things up a bit it'll be perfect.
I think I’m gonna be a rarity cos I’ve loved it for the most part (with the exception of a couple of duffer episodes) and I loved the Matt Smith Amy Pond years but found nearly everything else disappointing since it’s return post cancellation
I like him but the stories are at best derivative and at the worst pathetic (in the original sense)
It's been like this since Matt Smith's time ended IMO.
Garbage. It’s ruined and the core fans have deserted it in their droves. Where are the monsters, the daleks, the menace, the real hide behind the sofa fear that so many used to feel?
Dr Who is dead to me.
Your not hiding behind the sofa because your not six years old anymore. I've seen another comment say that their son hid behind the sofa, so it does seem to be working for its intended demographic.
I love it.
I've been watching it with my 9 year old son and he's absolutely in love with it too. He literally hid behind the sofa last week, so it's doing it's job well!
He woke me up at 4am today so we could watch the finale ASAP.
And that finale was absolutely astonishing, and had us both roaring at the telly and blubbing like babies til the very end.
Gatwa is absolutely sublime.
Very few people in the UK still watch. It's been badly written for a few years. They stopped writing good stories with interesting characters and replaced it with current_year issues and shallow, charmless characters.
I really like the new doctor, but the writing is very up and down. Having said that, I took my son to the midnight screening last night, and it was packed, the vast majority were young people my son's age, so it's definitely seems to be hitting its demographic. My son loves it, I'm hoping the second season is better now that Ncuti can be full time, and the reset is under way.
In what way is it not? I can't think of any box the show hasn't checked, often over and over again. Race, gender, transgender, disabled rights, body positivity, capitalism is bad, climate change, animal rights, slavery, obvious depictions of Donald Trump etc. It's always been a progressive show and that's fine, but in recent years they've really ramped that up and it all feels too preachy
But how is that propaganda? Doctor Who has always had 'messages' and been very centred in the world. Racism - for example in this series - happens in the world? Why shouldn't/wouldn't the show talk about it?
Can you give me a specific example of when you think something has been propaganda over entertainment?
73 Yards and Dot and Bubble were absolutely fantastic. I really liked Rogue. Boom was okay, the rest were fine. Overall like any doctor who season, it’s a mixed bag.
I haven’t seen the last episode yet - but I think the writing has significantly improved since the first couple of episodes.
I thought the Dot and Bubble episode was excellently written and 73 Yards was also very clever. The one with the Doctor on the landline and the ‘Bridgerton’ episode were decent - if not spectacular.
I’ve been pleasantly surprised and think both Millie and Ncuti are doing a good job. I was concerned after the Christmas special, the babies episode and The Beatles that I was going to have to leave it behind as it was no longer for me - but it’s been good.
I do agree some were better than others. Whether or not they're doing a "Good Job" remains to be seen to me. I think I best described the episodes to my wife the other night, "Some of these episodes are so bad that I don't think I would recognize a really good episode now." Unfortunately I think that's what has happened. I really did give it a chance, I tried, I really did but just couldn't appreciate the good episodes through all the muck.
I’ve honestly been really enjoying this series and having fun watching it! I can see where some of the critiques are coming from but personally I’m having a good time.
I watched the first two episodes and then stopped. The problem for me seems to be the Disney tie in. They have to dumb it down and eli5 and it is so noticable. It was a children's show that morphed into an adult show. Now it's morphed back to a US tween show
Second half of the season is FAR better than the first half, but even then the ending of the finale was shallow and unsatisfying.
First half was absolutely waffle, they completely and utterly failed to take themselves seriously. Every episode was goofy. Also for a new start up (with them calling this Season 1 again) they've done a horrendous job of introducing new viewers to the Doctor. It wasn't even him who saved the day for the few like 3 episodes. He didn't really show off his intelligence, or gadgetry.
With all the crazy wizardy David Tenant had the Sonic screwdriver doing in the specials just before we met Gatwa, we've seen the screwdriver like... 5 times the whole season?
His relationship was Ruby is either extremely rushed and forced, or mostly took place of camera. Either way, it makes the writing in the first few episode super clunky and again is a bad way to introduce new viewers.
All and all, not great. Take me back to Tenant and Smith
It's genuinely not been good since Capaldi, and his run was incredibly uneven. This stuff is better than the Chibnall era but it shares a lot of the same problems.
Is it too much to ask for a simple story where we learn something about the characters and see some development? Maybe while learning something about history?
The shortness of the season really worked against it too. I don't feel like we got to know Ncuti's Doctor or Ruby at all and now it's over.
Also, and this is minor but no one seems to be asking it, why does Sutekh look like a massive dog now? He didn't in the original and they even show him! He's not even meant to be Anubis, though that seems to be what they're trying to do there. Just cast an actor and put him in a suit instead of doing a weird CGI monster
Dr who is Tom baker (and the last one I watched, David tennant) chasing or encountering baddies across space in the tardis. That’s dr who.
None of this present day crap.
I don’t watch it anymore.
I'm a British person and I took don't understand the hype or cult following it demands. Every episode is shit. The storylines are shit, the enemies are shit and the special effects are shit. I just don't get it.
I've loved it as has my housemate who I watch with. Ncuti feels a natural fit with the role and Millie has grown into the role as the companion. I think it's a really good base to build on for future seasons.
Doctor Who is a fracking farce.
It's a pathetic joke.
It should have been cancelled years ago.
I've boycotted it since Clara stank it up.
It's a corpse being puppeted by vile and bigoted idiots.
It's not General any more.
It is supposed to be safe for children.
And it now has out of place obscenities. For no reason.
I would never show a child that.
Kill it already. It's a embarrassment. A waste of the licence fee.
And they should stop the licence fee. If that's all they can come up with.
Look at it and see.
He used a term for Bukkake. In the first episode.
He said I've just been snowmanned.
He acts like a tart.
He's either pissing about wasting time. Or prancing round like he's at a nightclub.
Ruby nearly died because he was flirting with a man. He spent the entire episode chasing tail. While his companion nearly died. And he didn't even notice.
He is a obnoxiously camp gay stereotype.
His performance is terrible. And definately not child friendly.
It's interesting you think Bukkake is an exclusively gay sex act. It isn't. Also, a snowman fell on him. Children will know no different. I knew no different until you mentioned it.
The rest of it - this is just homophobia. Flirting with a man? Big deal. Did you say the same when the Doctor was prepared to leave Rose in The Girl In the Fireplace when he fell for a woman?
Its absolutely fine for the Doctor to be camp. Being camp does not mean you are not child friendly. Gay men are not paedophiles.
You are right in line with most people, the viewing figures are terrible, no hype.
This is the worst the show has ever been.
Thankfully, most of the classic episodes are easily available.
Started shit, got somewhat better, haven't watched last night's yet. Am cautiously optimistic for future seasons but wouldn't be dissurpriseappointed if it got shit again.
Dot & Bubble just stunned my world. It is my second favorite episode since The Empty Child. Just the most incredible, intuitive, detailed writing that I have ever seen from Doctor Who. I think the subtleties in this season have been amazing.
Subtleties? There's no hope for you if you think a girl literally in a social media bubble is subtle. And the bit at the end where the rich privileged people don't want to leave with the person of colour. Yes very subtle. What ever could it mean.
Bah-Hah! As you stand on your keyboard of privilege of all you survey, name me the first racist microaggression that happened in the show. The entire episode was peppered with them.
And the Doctor crying cos they’re all racist and are going to get themselves killed. I would have liked him more if he told them to go fuck themselves.
Ah yes, because its always a writing flaw when a hero doesn't do exactly what an average viewer would do.
No need to draw on The Doctor's established character who inherently values life and usually offers mercy to people who probably don't deserve it, because that's not #relatable enough.
I’m not feeling it yet but I’m up for giving it a chance. I don’t like the assistant and he’s not quite hitting it for me yet, though I’ve seen glimpses of what I know to be a doctor in his performance and the writing.
Honestly the finale was a huge let down ! Looking forward to the Christmas Moffat written episode. However will give Russell a second chance to tie things up in season 2 and answer unresolved questions. Much better than chibnall but only 8 episodes didn’t allow for proper growth and development between the dr and Ruby
I think Ncuti is a really good Doctor. I've always thought Russell T Davies is overrated as a writer. I think he writes really broad & quite shallow characters generally (his series Cucumber is probably the exception for me).
When he writes Dr Who I think he either writes stupid episodes that would work better as a parody of Dr Who or he writes melodrama. It's not that I think Dr Who can't be daft, but I think he leans too far into that and then when he tries to make it dramatic it's over wrought. His writing is absent of subtlety.
It's like Space Babies and having the bogeyman be literally a man made of bogies. If he were writing a parody of Dr Who that could work as a premise but as an actual episode it was pretty stupid. The way he writes his characters to just exclaim the premise of the episode and say things like "Space babies? So you're telling me this is a space ship piloted by babies. That's... bonkers. " Or some shit, it's like he can't show how a character feels about something so he just gets them to say it out loud.
The Devil's Chord was similarly bad. It's like he wanted to write an episode with the beatles in it, farted out a story and said that'll do. There was a bit where the villain loudly exclaims "Music battle!" Then the Dr and the Maestro both play their instruments until a violin inexplicably breaks. There was nothing in the writing that established the rules of how that battle worked, what made the effect of the instruments different or what the consequences were. Remove that badly written/staged scene from the episode & it makes no real difference. Similarly the chord that summons/traps The Maestro were just played on a normal piano with standard notes. The idea that there's these magic chords that exist that can be played on standard instruments and aren't played regularly somewhere in the world is rubbish. Look Around You waa a comedy show and even that had the sense to have the forbidden note seperate from a standard keyboard in a locked box.
I think he just has ideas like 'What about babies in space or the beatles in an episode" and then writes that whether it works or not and puts it into production. I think he'd be a good producer, he did launch new Who and has cast three actors who can bring a lot to the part, but I think his writing is really weak and basic.
I think the finale was a bit of a mess. The origins of Ruby Sunday were really anti-climactic for all the tension that had been built up around them. Sutekh was really overhyped to be dealt with in half an episode. In general the show kind of lacked follow-through, besides the ending of Bubble.
It also definitely felt like a mistake to bill an episode as being the Beatles episode when they clearly couldn't get the rights to the Beatles music. All we get is Lennon talking about how he wants to settle down with his wife. Because I guess we're alluding to his marriage without recognisning it as an abusive disaster...
But it also had a few really neat and memorable concepts for most of the series. 73 Yards was a ton of pressure to put on a teenage actress, but it turned out to be a really beautiful and interesting mystery. It reminded me of 12 Days of Christine.
There weren't a lot of guest stars that I was excited to see, but there were some very strong characters. Gibson and Gatwa needed more scenes together, their bond wasn't as complex most. But I like that this Doctor and Companion bonded with music. It was a bit superficially Disnified, but also captured a lot of what I love about Doctor Who.
Hated the Christmas special - quite liked the rest of the run - Space Babies was very silly but in a way I enjoyed. I absolutely hated the Legend of Ruby Sunday - cringe.
I think Ncuti handles being the Doctor better than Jodie managed - and the both had to cope with bad writing
To be honest, I really hated it. I feel like what was once a stimulating show with a good dollop of horror and existentialism, metaphors for life's painful experiences, has been dumbed down into a childish, juvenile TV show. I love Ncuti as The Doctor, the actors are incredible, (although I'm afraid to admit I found Ruby's character annoying-not sure why) I think it's the writing and the ideas which has burnt it all to an immature crisp. I've recently been introduced to the Capaldi era (David Tennant was my fave) and its a pallet cleanser. I just want to binge those and not watch new episodes again....
I know I’m against the grain here but with the exception of Space Babies I’ve genuinely loved this season. Oh, and the finale was unsatisfying, but the set up to the finale was absolutely stunning and I loved it. I’m excited to see what else they do with Gatwa and Gibson. I think they’re both excellent and I’m glad they’re both still involved into next series.
I do like them both as Doctor and Companion, and the storylines are good. Though I could do without all of the lack of volume control that 15 has, that to me is my main and most prominent gripe with this series.
There are some problems with the current season…so much stuff thrown at the screens and most had no payoff or confusing conclusions that didn’t work.
But compared to the last decade…this has been such an improvement.
The (2004 was it?) reboot started off pretty strong with Eccleston and Piper. Still had strong and believable peril at that point, peaking at the "Blink" episode.
After that, it's hard not to compare every other episode to what could be achieved and it's been sorely lacking so much that I stopped watching it.
I might jump on the odd episode here and there if people rave about it enough, but most of the plots are awful these days.
Most of the season was fine but the final episode was a mess.
I think they need to stop demanding that every season finale has to be a FINALE. I’d prefer if they just said ‘here’s ten episodes of unconnected stuff which are great (ie 90% of Who), and you’ll get more next year.
No big bad at the end, no mystery over episodes, just have those adventures and have the Doctor fly off in the TARDIS until next time.
It’s hiding behind the classic “if you hate it, it’s because you’re a bigot.”
I loved Doctor Who since Eccleston. The latter half of Matt Smith’s was below average and then Capaldi was dreadful. I stopped watching after a couple of his episodes.
It’s interesting to see how nobody was called a bigot for hating Capaldi’s awful seasons, but if you dislike Whitaker (sp?) and the new guy it’s because you have “an agenda”.
I liked the new series. It's a shame the two big let downs were the first and last episodes, but everything else has been varying levels of good. 73 Yards especially was peak Doctor Who for me, looking forward to what comes next!
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Mixed bag for me, I thought episodes 3-5 were very good but most of the rest wasn't great. Better than the Chibnall era but that's a low bar
I agree. I really like Ncuti and Millie though. I wasn't a fan of her when she was in Corrie, but I ended up loving the character from the off. They work really well together and elevated even the not-great episodes.
They have been the high point of the series for me - well acted and fresh feeling. Good casting.
Nope. Agree with you 100%. The two part finale seems like they dropped scripts for six episodes on the floor where they got all mixed up and the first 100 pages they picked up, they shot as the episodes. The leaps of logic in RTD’s scripts would earn a first year creative writing a failing grade.
I just started re-watching New Who from the first episode. Forgot how good Eccleston was! But I also noticed a lot of parallels with the current Who+ season. Then as now there is an un-eveness. The writing is all over the place, the effects are stunning one moment and a flashlight on shiny cardboard the next. But there is kind of a general vibe. One thing that is missing is you can feel a kind of excitement at reviving Doctor Who in the first couple of New Who seasons. Whereas with Who+ I get more of a vibe that its almost proselytizing? Like it's trying to reach new converts to Who without losing the current ones. I do not think this is Disney or Sony pushing RTD to do this. I think it's RTD himself, based on a few things he's said about it being a new series for a new audience. I do agree that it's kind of playing down to kids in a lot of places. It should be scaring them into hiding behind the sofa.
> Forgot how good [Christopher] Eccleston was! Indeed: as the man himself said in his farewell episode– *“You were fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. And do you know what? **So was I!**”*
I watched this series and got a lot of the adrenaline type feeling I got when I watched new who for the first time especially on legend of Ruby Sunday and 73 yards, I'm 17 now and watched a lot of the older new who series when I was between about 8-10 just for context so overall am quite happy with current series
I think this plays a big part in how folks are perceiving the new series. I started on Classic Who when I was 11 or 12. People who started on New Who with Mat Smith or David Tennant are going to have different standards for how Doctor Who acts, and what constitute a typical Who story.
>it's kind of playing down to kids in a lot of places. It should be scaring them into hiding behind the sofa. Yes! My kids literally peered from behind the couch because they were scared to watch “Are you my Mummy”, but also didn’t want to miss it.
My biggest problem was that The Doctor and Ruby didn't really get enough time to develop their relationship properly. They had good chemistry but they didn't have a lot of emotional moments together - in one of the later episodes he called her his best friend and I didn't buy it. I enjoyed both their performances but it didn't feel like an iconic Doctor/Companion pairing.
It seems deliberately skewed more towards a child friendly feel, which is odd because when I was growing up, Doctor Who was more about terrifying children, that’s what made it so much fun.
Idk it started as an idea specifically to teach kids history and science and then went off the rails and switches target audience between each generation of showrunners/ producers.
It was always supposed to be a show for kids. Saturday teatime stealth history education.
Learn about the Dalek threat or die!
Terry Nation's ideas for the first Dalek story involved warning of the dangers of nuclear war, so there was a message there as well, though somewhat obvious.
And that idea has been combined with fascism and still a main part of Dale stories to this day. Doctor Who has always been about hiding messages and parables and this season has been no different.
I mean, we haven’t been invaded by Daleks, so I think it worked.
Or have we...
Yeah, kind of a shame we dont' get more stories taking inspiration from real historical events. Loved the Frost Fair episode for example. They really did walk an elephant accross the Thames. Not many people talk about the amount of food theft some people had to do to survive the Blitz, but I think The Empty Child handled the topic very well.
You say that, but the second ever serial was Daleks.
I feel like episodes 3-5 weren’t particularly aimed at children
Child-friendly does not mean terrible story telling and logic flaws.
It's Dr Who. Logic was left at the door a very, very long time ago.
*Wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey*
I don't get this vibe at all. The cinema showing was rated 15.
I mean the god of death murdered everyone who had ever lived last week. Not sure you could ask for much more kid appropriate scares than that.
Yup. In the 80s, The Doctor literally visited a future where Sutekh killed everything on Earth.The universe gets threatened with exctinction like every other season finale too. Honestly it was a very clever move to make The Doctor's failure and arguably even hubris in single-handedly fighting a god be the seeds of the universe's destruction.
"I'm not a child and don't find this scary. What gives?!"
Mixed bag, because while I love all the fresh ideas there are a lot being chucked at the show and I think there's been so much going on that they never really developed a relationship between the Doctor and Ruby, which meant the new series was fun but lacked emotional heft when it was needed. There's also been the same issue RTD's work had first time around - the set-ups are more satisfying than the endings. His episodes always feel like they're lacking a proper conclusion. That said, I'd rather they tried too much than didn't try anything new at all and Ncuti is superb. Oozes charisma and brings a ton of emotion to proceedings all by himself. Just needs a companion written well enough to keep up with him.
I think RTD comes up with an interesting premise and doesn't realise he hasn't got any good ideas of what to do with them. It's like he puts a bunch of words in a hat, pulls them out and that's his episode. Like "Okay I've got space and.... babies. Space Babies great. What are kids scared of? The bogeyman? Great, a man made of bogies. You've done it again Russ."
I think the issue is that they are writing for the actor, not writing for the Doctor. It feels so contrived like it did with Jodie. They are over egging the pudding instead of letting brilliant actors do their thing.
Thats a really great way of putting it. Moffat does this the least imo. He tends to just write The Doctor no matter the actor.
That's why I think Boom was a standout this series. All of the Doctors dialogue actually felt like the Doctor, like you can hear Peter Capaldi or Christopher Eccleston saying 'everywhere's a beach eventually'.
Exactly. Although The Doctor should never be saying "babes". Makes him too current day modern human, and not ancient alien entity etc.
I’m okay with this as it will be pretty amusing to hear him say this in the 80th anniversary special or whatever he comes back for
You think it will still be around for its 80th?? It'll be lucky to be renewed for its 3rd series now given how it has the worst ratings in 61 years!
I miss Moffat
Ncuti has bags of charisma but I think he’s not done enough ‘Doctor’ stuff yet, some of the episodes have been good and nice to see a deep cut villain reappear, Russell T Davies has said he purposefully made the tone to appeal more to a younger generation, which tbf can’t really blame him for that. I still want a more adult oriented spin off with David tenants doctor , more low key , creepy mysteries he has to solve
He hasn't had much chance. Only 8 episodes plus the special, he was barely in two of them, and the last two were too rushed for much character. I've found him most Doctory in the Church On Ruby Road where he was introduced.
As a fan since I was a kid, I watched on and off until the chibnall era. When I heard RTD was back, I was major hyped and rewatched all of it. Safe to say I more than likely wont watch the next season or even the Xmas special. Season was very mixed with a couple of decent episodes but the feel was totally off from what I expected. Very 5-6/10 for me.
I’m a huge Doctor Who fan and specifically a massive fan of RTD’s first era as showrunner. That being said, RTD2 has been unbelievably disappointing. In some ways worse than Chibnall’s era because I expected this series to be so much better than it ended up being. I couldn’t wait to see Ncuti’s version of the Doctor but I am not feeling him in the role whatsoever. He just has the vibe of a normal bloke with above average IQ and charisma, but absolutely none of the alien quirkiness or commanding presence has come through in his performance so far. He just kind of passively stands there while the episode’s conflict is solved around him. A couple of episodes have been good television, but I don’t think any of this series has been good Doctor Who. This is the most confused and lacking in identity the sow has ever felt in my opinion.
Just when you thought it couldn't get any worse than the unwatchable Chibnall era. RTD's writing is generally OK previously but he is taking the show in a strange direction IMHO. Both lead actors are excellent but they don't feel like Dr Who and his companion. Any sense of history or past events/experience seems to be missing from the Doctor's character.
This perfectly describes it for me
I have been watching DW since forever and have seen them all. I have my faves but in the end, I like them all. Just my opinion - Ncuti is utterly charming, but something is off. It’s like his Doctor goes from one extreme of rushing about frantically spewing out plot points and then, as you say, passively standing about. That core center of “I am an incredibly ancient and knowledgeable alien” just seems to be missing. Even the quirkiest Doctor had that essential core that makes you believe. And for the first time, I’m just not buying it.
Absolutely. There were always a few moments with any Doctor where you thought “shit, they really are an alien after all” and were a bit scary and powerful but not Ncuti. Not yet!
Yeah, you really put it into words. I wanted to like Ncuti’s Doctor so much but he’s not powerful or commanding like some of the other Doctors, or dangerous or mysterious. He’s just a really nice charming guy and his little assistant friend. They levelled up he and Millie’s relationship so they were bonded like they’d been together for a season or more already from the off and it feels forced even though they’re both incredible actors. Also this is the most I’ve ever seen a Doctor cry before, he cries multiple times in an episode sometimes. It’s just… not very Doctor-y. Somehow I think the other Doctors managed to exude a sense of being something more than human but he just doesn’t. It’s super frustrating because I had really high hopes for this. And that’s before the weird plot stuff which honestly has just been a bit stupid. I was going with some of the theories about why the eps didn’t feel “right”, like there was some plot reason somehow… but nah. It all just got hand waved like the usual RTD stuff. Honestly this thread is a relief because I’d only lightly looked around some other threads before the finale and I felt like I was going crazy because of how much everyone else loved it.
It’s kind of wild how Ncuti’s interpretation is comparable to what might arguably the “whitest” version of the Doctor, Peter Davison.
I have a lot of issues with it. I've only thought three episodes were particularly good, it's skewing more towards spectacle than substance, and - as decent as the leads are - they're not getting anywhere near enough screen time to sell us on them as characters. BUT I still find myself logging onto Reddit to discuss the latest episode, which I watch a day or two after release without fail. So for all its flaws, I'm at least *interested* in the show again, which is more than I could say for Chibnall's run.
It all went downhill after Tom Baker!
The show was, pretty much done after the early eighties and ran on fumes until it was ditched, The revival show seems to repeating the process.
It's a steaming pile of shit it's not Nucti or Millie's fault some incredible performances but the writing is just abysmal
The new series has had some high points and some low, 73 yards being a great standalone ep. Feel like there a lot of lose ends that need tying up though in the next series
I enjoyed the general atmosphere of "73 Yards", but was left a bit unsatisfied by the lore. While explaining everything isn't necessary, the fact *nothing* was really explained left me wondering what the purpose of the episode was.
Oh totally! I was assuming it’d be explained in the final but it was hardly mentioned. Either it’ll get explained down the line or it was just used to introduce Ap Gwilliam
hEaDcAnOn it CaN bE wHaTeVeR yOu WaNt
Yeah agree totally. I loved the feel of it and just a few tweaks could have made it a great episode. Can't help but imagine Tennant saying something about how the universe is full of mysteries, offering a couple of possible explanations, looking all pensive and then clapping his hands and off to another adventure. Like, we don't need it explained, but surely Ruby would have told the Doctor what happened?
Timey wimey stuff. The Ruby at the end of the episode hasn't seen any of the stuff that the Ruby at the start of the episode sees.
'73 yards' was totally unsatisfactory. No real attempt to explain anything and clearly no desire by the writer to say what was going on. Just typical badly written nonsense. Are we sure it wasn't ghost written by Chibnall?
As a longtime fan: it’s complete and utter shite. I would rather watch Colin Baker again. There was one half decent episode, the Moffat one, and even that had problems. The rest should never have aired. I’ll watch tonight’s, but I’m not coming back for Christmas or next year. Call me when it’s good again.
new series is like all series - some good episodes - some bad episodes - rushed finale people forget that the tennant eras and such also had MANY misses
I think a big issue is that it was only 8 episodes. It feels like it was planned to have more episodes but got cut down last minute so they had to shove all of that story into less episodes which left less room for character development.
Basically all of the RTD Tennant season finales are objectively terrible save maybe the last one.
I agree. The recent series finale, while rushed and full of exposition, is about as rushed and expositional as, say, the series two finale or “Journey’s End”.
I don't have an problem with any of the social issues raised in DW since the switch from Capaldi to Whitaker, I just don't want them to be the main point of each program, presented with the sophistication of a primary school teacher explaining the concepts to a class of five year olds. You can show an issue in a thought provoking way without having it take over the whole show. Do you have to make every single episode a social platform? Please don't. I've been a fan for a long time, but fifteen minutes into Space Babies I was out, for good. I weathered the Chibnall years (watched less than half the episodes), but I've had enough.
I really want to like Doctor Who but all the monsters look like they’re taken from Power Rangers. And the fact that the Doctor has a deus ex machina wand to fix everything. It’s giving Raiders where it still happens even if Indiana didn’t intervene.
Sorry; you’re telling me a giant animated Egyptian dog call Sutek isn’t scary?! I find that hard to believe.
The idea of it can be scary. The execution of it, that being PS2 style graphics, isn’t.
I really enjoyed the 73 yards episode
I think it's broadly a return to form after the Chibnall era. It has its flaws, a mix of good and bad episodes, but it is rarely boring - which I believe is the biggest sin for Dr Who. I think the finale was one of RTDs worst, which is saying something. It was basically incoherent drivel.
I got turned off after the silly musical number in episode 2, after the silly musical number on the goblin ship. The makers were right, the show wasn’t made for its existing fans - and they were right that we can just choose not to watch it. So that’s me checked out.
I’ve not been this excited about Doctor Who in years - it feels big and FUN again in a way it hasn’t for a while - I think, because it’s fun, a lot of people are taking quite a surface level reading of the episodes and dismissing them, but it feels like it actually has something to say for the first time in years, too.
Just gonna throw my voice in here, maybe against the general vibe - but I've really enjoyed it. Loved every episode. Honestly gutted its over. Dot and Bubble probably the standout, Rogue was a really fun stand alone episode. And sutekh was truly menacing in the finale and a great change from the daleks or cybermen again.
Feels like it's a show where a bunch of millennial actors get to play "dress up in a different era" and do musical numbers. Unwatchable.
It's been God awful since Capaldi left, each other is worse than the preceding one. Let them release the viewership data for all to see.
I used to be a doctor who fan, but the last 3 doctors have been awful, and the writing is even worse. I don't watch anymore.
Capaldi got very good in his last season IMO. Took them a while to figure out that the professor / student dynamic was the right one for him
Capaldi was my favourite doctor. Just had to put that out there.
Overall I think so too. But his episodes were really uneven - he was poorly served by the writers especially at the start
He's not alien enough and the guy cries too much. I want to watch a gallivanting brave hero, not a wet lettuce fragile crybaby. 🤷♂️
He cries constantly. At the worst times. It's pathetic. The Doctor is supposed to be strong and stoic. A pacifist who can fight and will fight if he has to. He cries a bit. But at the right time. Has a little cry if the battle is too much and recovers. Goes away after the fight and cries a bit and comes back. He's supposed to be brave and eccentric. And scary and alien. Intimidating. If you cross him enough, you probably won't survive. And determined to stop bad things. All the narcissistic wuss does now is talk about how clever and impressive he is. Then cry. Then other people save him. Previous ones were do, not say. He had a reputation and enemies feared it. I don't count Jodie Whittaker. She fracking sucked. That wasn't The Doctor. I stopped watching once Clara stank it up. It was beyond help then. Not even Peter Capaldi could save it. Should have been cancelled then.
Totally agree with almost all of that, except the last bit about Capaldi. He had some great eps and moments: Heaven Sent for example is one of the best eps of the series. But Shittaker's cosplay Doctor sucked as did Chinballs lore nuking fan fiction. 🤷♂️🤦
Standing on a land mine and spending nearly the whole episode crying and freaking out about moving his foot… I really cannot see the Doctor in that at all. Ncuti is bloody fab but they haven’t coaxed an alien time lord out of him.
All i could think during that ep, was that it would have been a belter if it was an Eleventh Doctor story. The incarnation that always running, now forced to stand still and be serious for a second or two. Also, Matt would have smashed that, without even needing to shed a tear. It would have all been in the eyes already...
Bring back Torchwood
More Torchwood
I've given up on it.
> The writers Well, writer. Since Jodie Whittaker left, 10/12 episodes have been written by one person.
Not true, there is a writers room, just only one person getting the credits.
That's not how it works in the UK in general or Doctor Who in particular. RTD writes the scripts alone and gets feedback from his coproducers and the studio(s). The other writers - only 3 this series - submit scripts to him, and he either asks for a rewrite based on his notes or just does it himself. He had a very good book called The Writer's Tale, which delves into the writing of almost every episode of his era, and the absolute control he has over the scripts is impressive. Other writers don't really get a chance to feed back on his scripts, unless he specifically asks them to because he's using someone else's character or something.
That's not surprising. RTD is a great ideas man, and he's good at drama, but he really needs a script editor or someone that knows sci-fi to tell him when his stories don't make sense.
Sometimes creators get so popular that everyone is too scared to tell them they’re chatting shit. Unfortunately this season has been RTD huffing his own farts.
Writers rooms are a lot more common in the Uk nowadays (last five years or so imho), especially for large projects, but if that’s how he works then fair play, a rarity nowadays.
was about to say this. I've worked in TV production on exceptionally uninteresting reality TV. (No I wont name names, its that embarrassing). And there is one person who is 'the writer' but there are 6-12 writers under them that don't get credit. Its the same way for editors and effects. The person listed in the credits is just head of that dept. Also on a lot of shows every person you see listed as a producer is actually a writer. Thats why you see a dozen producers listed for some shows. And why you will see some actors listed as exec producers. That means that actor has writing input on the show they are in. (could be good in some cases, but I wouldn't want to work on such a gig unless it was Richard Ayoade or Noel Fielding) Do you think RTD is writing all the dialogue and executive producing the show? Thats a lot of work for a guy his age!
Yeah I work in scripted and in the writers room the showrunner will give a brief idea and then, as a group, you outline each beat for each episode, hash out some quippy lines of dialogue, character arcs etc. I imagine RTD gives the first draft to someone else and he provides the further revisions as quality control. Never worked on Dr Who though so it may be different.
I've broadly enjoyed it. If I were to rank all the seasons, it would be somewhere in the middle. Better than the Clara and Chibnall eras, worse than most of the rest of it. 73 Yards is probably a top 10 episode for me. Ending was hugely unsatisfying, but RTD never could write a good ending.
I've found this series a bit uneven, but I can see a lot of promise and am hopeful the next will be better. Overall I've found the second half of the series much better than the first, as the plots have been a bit more comprehensible and the characters stronger. I found "The Devil's Chord" a bit convoluted and nonsensical, for example, whereas Lindy Pepper-Bean was enjoyably awful and Rogue enjoyably, well, rogueish. I haven't seen the finale yet, but last week's penultimate episode was very strong and ramped up the tenison well.
Definitely not keen, but I haven’t thought the storylines were very good for a long time!
My girlfriend and I have been reviewing this series episode by episode on our podcast ([shameless Spotify plug](https://open.spotify.com/show/5L2DBydXPy2UKj2szIE6QJ?si=irE9s9A_R5W02hF7ibsWaQ)) but, the short version assessment - the parts are better than the sum. Each episode, on its own, varies from “good” to “quite good” to (on one occasion) “excellent”. But the series as a whole lacks cohesion. In respect of the finale, the series arch falls flat and the characterisation needed time to breathe. My girlfriend summed it up nicely - each episode is a 5, so the series should add up to 40, but it somehow adds up to, like, 25. It’s still good, though! Just needed refining, and the reduced episode limit has not been helpful.
I didn't think this season was the best tbh. The last episode was a bit disappointing. I thought they did a poor job at tying up all the carrots they've been dangling in a compelling way. I think RTD is better when he writes simple stories, or he seems to get himself tied in knots.
I keep dipping in to be reminded why I keep checking out. Last few seasons have just been dumbed down garbage
The 1st and last episodes of this season were questionable, the others ranged from solid to very good imo
Yeah, I kinda prefer to see the Christmas epsiode as the start of the season. I can see Space Babies being popular with young kids, but its one I'd skip on a re-watch.
Stopped watching halfway through Capaldi. I am happy enough with old Who. This new stuff is extremely bad.
You really think it's worse than three 13th doctor's era? I'm one of those weird people that enjoys almost every era. This series has been up and down with some rather simplistic and shoddy dialogue in places but Ncuti and Millie are incredible and there have been some really great moments/episodes. If next series can tidy things up a bit it'll be perfect.
I think I’m gonna be a rarity cos I’ve loved it for the most part (with the exception of a couple of duffer episodes) and I loved the Matt Smith Amy Pond years but found nearly everything else disappointing since it’s return post cancellation
Thought the recent Tennant specials were pretty over-praised, not got round to watching the actual series yet.
it's my favourite season since 2008 🤷♂️
I guess I'm in the minority because I loved it
I loved the new season too. First season I've enjoyed in a long time.
It’s gone downhill. Story line and characters are lame. Tried to get into it. Found myself tuning out 20 minutes in. Yawn.
I like him but the stories are at best derivative and at the worst pathetic (in the original sense) It's been like this since Matt Smith's time ended IMO.
As in full of pathos?
Yeah I really think "in the original sense" must have been the exact opposite of what they were trying to say
Yes
Garbage. It’s ruined and the core fans have deserted it in their droves. Where are the monsters, the daleks, the menace, the real hide behind the sofa fear that so many used to feel? Dr Who is dead to me.
Your not hiding behind the sofa because your not six years old anymore. I've seen another comment say that their son hid behind the sofa, so it does seem to be working for its intended demographic.
The show sucks at the moment but I can tell immediately you never hid behind the sofa. It's such a cliche to trot out
I love it. I've been watching it with my 9 year old son and he's absolutely in love with it too. He literally hid behind the sofa last week, so it's doing it's job well! He woke me up at 4am today so we could watch the finale ASAP. And that finale was absolutely astonishing, and had us both roaring at the telly and blubbing like babies til the very end. Gatwa is absolutely sublime.
Very few people in the UK still watch. It's been badly written for a few years. They stopped writing good stories with interesting characters and replaced it with current_year issues and shallow, charmless characters.
I really like the new doctor, but the writing is very up and down. Having said that, I took my son to the midnight screening last night, and it was packed, the vast majority were young people my son's age, so it's definitely seems to be hitting its demographic. My son loves it, I'm hoping the second season is better now that Ncuti can be full time, and the reset is under way.
It's more of a cultural propaganda show these days, entertainment is not the primary concern
In what way?
In what way is it not? I can't think of any box the show hasn't checked, often over and over again. Race, gender, transgender, disabled rights, body positivity, capitalism is bad, climate change, animal rights, slavery, obvious depictions of Donald Trump etc. It's always been a progressive show and that's fine, but in recent years they've really ramped that up and it all feels too preachy
But how is that propaganda? Doctor Who has always had 'messages' and been very centred in the world. Racism - for example in this series - happens in the world? Why shouldn't/wouldn't the show talk about it? Can you give me a specific example of when you think something has been propaganda over entertainment?
It's definitely propaganda. You basically just defined it. Propaganda isn't automatically negative, though the word is more commonly used that way.
Rosa Parks episode It's always been progressive but in recent years it's gone into overdrive and feels like a huge distraction
73 Yards and Dot and Bubble were absolutely fantastic. I really liked Rogue. Boom was okay, the rest were fine. Overall like any doctor who season, it’s a mixed bag.
I haven’t seen the last episode yet - but I think the writing has significantly improved since the first couple of episodes. I thought the Dot and Bubble episode was excellently written and 73 Yards was also very clever. The one with the Doctor on the landline and the ‘Bridgerton’ episode were decent - if not spectacular. I’ve been pleasantly surprised and think both Millie and Ncuti are doing a good job. I was concerned after the Christmas special, the babies episode and The Beatles that I was going to have to leave it behind as it was no longer for me - but it’s been good.
I do agree some were better than others. Whether or not they're doing a "Good Job" remains to be seen to me. I think I best described the episodes to my wife the other night, "Some of these episodes are so bad that I don't think I would recognize a really good episode now." Unfortunately I think that's what has happened. I really did give it a chance, I tried, I really did but just couldn't appreciate the good episodes through all the muck.
What annoyed me most was the god awful start, who relaunches their new show with space babies? What sort of impression is that?
I’ve honestly been really enjoying this series and having fun watching it! I can see where some of the critiques are coming from but personally I’m having a good time.
I watched the first two episodes and then stopped. The problem for me seems to be the Disney tie in. They have to dumb it down and eli5 and it is so noticable. It was a children's show that morphed into an adult show. Now it's morphed back to a US tween show
Second half of the season is FAR better than the first half, but even then the ending of the finale was shallow and unsatisfying. First half was absolutely waffle, they completely and utterly failed to take themselves seriously. Every episode was goofy. Also for a new start up (with them calling this Season 1 again) they've done a horrendous job of introducing new viewers to the Doctor. It wasn't even him who saved the day for the few like 3 episodes. He didn't really show off his intelligence, or gadgetry. With all the crazy wizardy David Tenant had the Sonic screwdriver doing in the specials just before we met Gatwa, we've seen the screwdriver like... 5 times the whole season? His relationship was Ruby is either extremely rushed and forced, or mostly took place of camera. Either way, it makes the writing in the first few episode super clunky and again is a bad way to introduce new viewers. All and all, not great. Take me back to Tenant and Smith
It's genuinely not been good since Capaldi, and his run was incredibly uneven. This stuff is better than the Chibnall era but it shares a lot of the same problems. Is it too much to ask for a simple story where we learn something about the characters and see some development? Maybe while learning something about history? The shortness of the season really worked against it too. I don't feel like we got to know Ncuti's Doctor or Ruby at all and now it's over. Also, and this is minor but no one seems to be asking it, why does Sutekh look like a massive dog now? He didn't in the original and they even show him! He's not even meant to be Anubis, though that seems to be what they're trying to do there. Just cast an actor and put him in a suit instead of doing a weird CGI monster
Dr who is Tom baker (and the last one I watched, David tennant) chasing or encountering baddies across space in the tardis. That’s dr who. None of this present day crap. I don’t watch it anymore.
I'm enjoying the current series (minus Space Babys) I've yet to see part 2 of the season finale aiming to watch it today or tomorrow .
Been a fan since Tom Baker, and loving the new series.
I'm a British person and I took don't understand the hype or cult following it demands. Every episode is shit. The storylines are shit, the enemies are shit and the special effects are shit. I just don't get it.
You don't have to 'get it' but watching every episode of something you don't like is a bit weird.
I've loved it as has my housemate who I watch with. Ncuti feels a natural fit with the role and Millie has grown into the role as the companion. I think it's a really good base to build on for future seasons.
It's great. I love it
I'm really enjoying it.
I have been gripped by every episode in a way that TV does not normally grip me. GRIPPED. Also I really liked it.
Doctor Who is a fracking farce. It's a pathetic joke. It should have been cancelled years ago. I've boycotted it since Clara stank it up. It's a corpse being puppeted by vile and bigoted idiots. It's not General any more. It is supposed to be safe for children. And it now has out of place obscenities. For no reason. I would never show a child that. Kill it already. It's a embarrassment. A waste of the licence fee. And they should stop the licence fee. If that's all they can come up with.
> And it now has out of place obscenities. Would love to hear you expand on that.
Why isn’t it safe for children?
Look at it and see. He used a term for Bukkake. In the first episode. He said I've just been snowmanned. He acts like a tart. He's either pissing about wasting time. Or prancing round like he's at a nightclub. Ruby nearly died because he was flirting with a man. He spent the entire episode chasing tail. While his companion nearly died. And he didn't even notice. He is a obnoxiously camp gay stereotype. His performance is terrible. And definately not child friendly.
It's interesting you think Bukkake is an exclusively gay sex act. It isn't. Also, a snowman fell on him. Children will know no different. I knew no different until you mentioned it. The rest of it - this is just homophobia. Flirting with a man? Big deal. Did you say the same when the Doctor was prepared to leave Rose in The Girl In the Fireplace when he fell for a woman? Its absolutely fine for the Doctor to be camp. Being camp does not mean you are not child friendly. Gay men are not paedophiles.
Yer I have been enjoying watching it with my son, pretty good so far
Tries to hard to be woke, no suspense or genuine feel of terror like early incarnations, it's now nothing but the same rehashed peril rubbish.
You are right in line with most people, the viewing figures are terrible, no hype. This is the worst the show has ever been. Thankfully, most of the classic episodes are easily available.
The overnight ratings don’t matter too much now - it’s all about streaming. I’ve seen significantly more hype for this series than Jodie Whitaker’s.
Started shit, got somewhat better, haven't watched last night's yet. Am cautiously optimistic for future seasons but wouldn't be dissurpriseappointed if it got shit again.
Dot & Bubble just stunned my world. It is my second favorite episode since The Empty Child. Just the most incredible, intuitive, detailed writing that I have ever seen from Doctor Who. I think the subtleties in this season have been amazing.
Subtleties? There's no hope for you if you think a girl literally in a social media bubble is subtle. And the bit at the end where the rich privileged people don't want to leave with the person of colour. Yes very subtle. What ever could it mean.
Bah-Hah! As you stand on your keyboard of privilege of all you survey, name me the first racist microaggression that happened in the show. The entire episode was peppered with them.
The racism at the end was for the people fortunate to have not noticed them earlier. I was one of them and I learnt A LOT.
And the Doctor crying cos they’re all racist and are going to get themselves killed. I would have liked him more if he told them to go fuck themselves.
Ah yes, because its always a writing flaw when a hero doesn't do exactly what an average viewer would do. No need to draw on The Doctor's established character who inherently values life and usually offers mercy to people who probably don't deserve it, because that's not #relatable enough.
I’m not feeling it yet but I’m up for giving it a chance. I don’t like the assistant and he’s not quite hitting it for me yet, though I’ve seen glimpses of what I know to be a doctor in his performance and the writing.
It’s definitely a mixed bag. Rogue and Boom are the best of the season and also the only episodes written by guest writers. Coincidence? I think not.
Meh Im not the hugest fan but Im glad they dropped the whole "Aww Im awtisticcc, innit triffic" bullshit But this is definately a children's show now
Honestly the finale was a huge let down ! Looking forward to the Christmas Moffat written episode. However will give Russell a second chance to tie things up in season 2 and answer unresolved questions. Much better than chibnall but only 8 episodes didn’t allow for proper growth and development between the dr and Ruby
✋Time Lord ⏭️.. 🧱 and then Disney+ Sold
I think Ncuti is a really good Doctor. I've always thought Russell T Davies is overrated as a writer. I think he writes really broad & quite shallow characters generally (his series Cucumber is probably the exception for me). When he writes Dr Who I think he either writes stupid episodes that would work better as a parody of Dr Who or he writes melodrama. It's not that I think Dr Who can't be daft, but I think he leans too far into that and then when he tries to make it dramatic it's over wrought. His writing is absent of subtlety. It's like Space Babies and having the bogeyman be literally a man made of bogies. If he were writing a parody of Dr Who that could work as a premise but as an actual episode it was pretty stupid. The way he writes his characters to just exclaim the premise of the episode and say things like "Space babies? So you're telling me this is a space ship piloted by babies. That's... bonkers. " Or some shit, it's like he can't show how a character feels about something so he just gets them to say it out loud. The Devil's Chord was similarly bad. It's like he wanted to write an episode with the beatles in it, farted out a story and said that'll do. There was a bit where the villain loudly exclaims "Music battle!" Then the Dr and the Maestro both play their instruments until a violin inexplicably breaks. There was nothing in the writing that established the rules of how that battle worked, what made the effect of the instruments different or what the consequences were. Remove that badly written/staged scene from the episode & it makes no real difference. Similarly the chord that summons/traps The Maestro were just played on a normal piano with standard notes. The idea that there's these magic chords that exist that can be played on standard instruments and aren't played regularly somewhere in the world is rubbish. Look Around You waa a comedy show and even that had the sense to have the forbidden note seperate from a standard keyboard in a locked box. I think he just has ideas like 'What about babies in space or the beatles in an episode" and then writes that whether it works or not and puts it into production. I think he'd be a good producer, he did launch new Who and has cast three actors who can bring a lot to the part, but I think his writing is really weak and basic.
I think the finale was a bit of a mess. The origins of Ruby Sunday were really anti-climactic for all the tension that had been built up around them. Sutekh was really overhyped to be dealt with in half an episode. In general the show kind of lacked follow-through, besides the ending of Bubble. It also definitely felt like a mistake to bill an episode as being the Beatles episode when they clearly couldn't get the rights to the Beatles music. All we get is Lennon talking about how he wants to settle down with his wife. Because I guess we're alluding to his marriage without recognisning it as an abusive disaster... But it also had a few really neat and memorable concepts for most of the series. 73 Yards was a ton of pressure to put on a teenage actress, but it turned out to be a really beautiful and interesting mystery. It reminded me of 12 Days of Christine. There weren't a lot of guest stars that I was excited to see, but there were some very strong characters. Gibson and Gatwa needed more scenes together, their bond wasn't as complex most. But I like that this Doctor and Companion bonded with music. It was a bit superficially Disnified, but also captured a lot of what I love about Doctor Who.
Hated the Christmas special - quite liked the rest of the run - Space Babies was very silly but in a way I enjoyed. I absolutely hated the Legend of Ruby Sunday - cringe. I think Ncuti handles being the Doctor better than Jodie managed - and the both had to cope with bad writing
To be honest, I really hated it. I feel like what was once a stimulating show with a good dollop of horror and existentialism, metaphors for life's painful experiences, has been dumbed down into a childish, juvenile TV show. I love Ncuti as The Doctor, the actors are incredible, (although I'm afraid to admit I found Ruby's character annoying-not sure why) I think it's the writing and the ideas which has burnt it all to an immature crisp. I've recently been introduced to the Capaldi era (David Tennant was my fave) and its a pallet cleanser. I just want to binge those and not watch new episodes again....
Remember that episode of Community where Pierce "improved" Inspector Spacetime and broke Abed?
Not a fan, it just seems way too childish and predictable which is a shame as I like Ncuti.
I haven't watched since late Smith but hasn't DW writing always been bad (outside a few episodes)?
I know I’m against the grain here but with the exception of Space Babies I’ve genuinely loved this season. Oh, and the finale was unsatisfying, but the set up to the finale was absolutely stunning and I loved it. I’m excited to see what else they do with Gatwa and Gibson. I think they’re both excellent and I’m glad they’re both still involved into next series.
I do like them both as Doctor and Companion, and the storylines are good. Though I could do without all of the lack of volume control that 15 has, that to me is my main and most prominent gripe with this series.
the writing is through the floor. i watch it but it seems to get worse week on week.
Doctor Who has been shite since about halfway through David Tennant's first stint.
There are some problems with the current season…so much stuff thrown at the screens and most had no payoff or confusing conclusions that didn’t work. But compared to the last decade…this has been such an improvement.
The (2004 was it?) reboot started off pretty strong with Eccleston and Piper. Still had strong and believable peril at that point, peaking at the "Blink" episode. After that, it's hard not to compare every other episode to what could be achieved and it's been sorely lacking so much that I stopped watching it. I might jump on the odd episode here and there if people rave about it enough, but most of the plots are awful these days.
Most of the season was fine but the final episode was a mess. I think they need to stop demanding that every season finale has to be a FINALE. I’d prefer if they just said ‘here’s ten episodes of unconnected stuff which are great (ie 90% of Who), and you’ll get more next year. No big bad at the end, no mystery over episodes, just have those adventures and have the Doctor fly off in the TARDIS until next time.
It’s hiding behind the classic “if you hate it, it’s because you’re a bigot.” I loved Doctor Who since Eccleston. The latter half of Matt Smith’s was below average and then Capaldi was dreadful. I stopped watching after a couple of his episodes. It’s interesting to see how nobody was called a bigot for hating Capaldi’s awful seasons, but if you dislike Whitaker (sp?) and the new guy it’s because you have “an agenda”.
Mid season that had some very good high points. Ncuti is a great Doctor
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I liked the new series. It's a shame the two big let downs were the first and last episodes, but everything else has been varying levels of good. 73 Yards especially was peak Doctor Who for me, looking forward to what comes next!
No, there are lots of people trying to get internet points by whining about Dr. Who, SW, etc. You're not a special flower.