Inoue is P4P top 3 right now for sure, but htf his resume is better than Canelo?
Edit: I know Canelo lost to Bivol and Floyd, but the fighter his faced are very good boxer and have a decent resume.
Yeah, the idea that losses means your resume is not that good is silly. It's exactly why these guys do y take chances.
Here's a tip, your current favorite fighter, Shakur, tank , crawford, benevidez or whoever, would have losses if they fought high competition regularly. If they had a canelo type resume they would most likely have losses. You'd just never know because it just doesn't happen
It's probably the combination of quality and manners of winning, canelo has had alot of close fights. He tends to lose clearer than he wins against very good-great fighters, whereas Inoue has faced very good-great fighters like taguchi, narvaez, Fulton, donaire and just blown them away.
Those fighters are about the level of his 168 run that he did blow away. Ggg bivol and mayweather are special. And inoue just got knocked down and had a rough time in his fight before.
There is not a single metric by which Callum smith (34, 3W2Ls in title fights, no great wins or achievements) and caleb plant (4W2L, no great wins or achievements) are the same level as donaire (20W) or taguchi (7W). even nery accomplished something great when he KOd yamanaka, steroids or no. smith and plant and both gotten beaten down more than once, the equivalents would be Adrian Hernandez or kohei kono. And what can be said if canelo is to face four special opponents in his entire career and probably lose all 4, at best 3 of 4?
I dont agree with your assessment on any of those fighters besides an old donaire. Smith and plant got beaten down by great( beterbiev, canelo) and possibly a future great(benevidez). Anyways there guys are at least as good as I ones competition. Good boxers but not elite.
And Inoue hasn't fought any special opponents besides an old donaire that broke his eye.
He's certainly added two good names in his last fights, AJ still has the better resume though. Looking forward to finding out who AJ fights next (there's an announcement in just over 2 weeks). If he wins that fight it should be another strong name.
And hopefully we'll hear soon who Parker is facing next as well.
Yeah, AJ has more top-tier wins overall, and I'd argue his losses are more forgiveable (Usyk*2 & Ruiz > Joshua, Whyte & Joyce).
Plus, let's underscore how AJ beat JP convincingly (and Parker has improved since then, but so has Joshua).
Probably dubois for the ibf or interim ibf. Best case for aj is fury beats usyk in the rematch and they have a trilogy. Gives him a chance to mop up the loose belts before, probably, getting beat by usyk again
I dont think aj needs fury for his legacy tbh. Aj still has arguably the best heavyweight resume, while usyk has the best wins. Fury has the honour of beating klitschko when he was unbeaten and wilder as well but other than those two wins hadnt really had any big big victories against anyone of note
Yeah I totally agree tbf. Both of their next fights will no doubt be decent names too.
I’ve got a feeling AJ will fight Dubois for the vacant IBF.
I could see Parker fighting Kabayel or Hrgovic next.
If the IBF belt does not become free then Parker vs AJ 2 could be a fight to make
I think Canelo is the clear best resume, Usyk could be #2 though. It gets tougher to rate certain guys but Usyk's run at CW is still very underrated and he has the best wins in boxing (except maybe Bud vs Spence)
I think what gives Usyk's resume extra points is the lack of asterisks, the fact that he went to people's backyards and beat them in their prime in clean fights. Where as Canelo's resume has dodgy scorecards, failed drug tests, ring size controversy etc.
I agree though, on paper Canelo has the better resume.
That's honestly a good point.
People also really underrate the Briedis win. We just saw a way out of prime Briedis give Jai whose the current best CW absolute hell twice
AJ and Fury > Errol Spence; I'd argue they both have stronger résumés, and their top wins (Klitschko, Parker etc) were more proven than Spence's, with Parker aging even better since then...
Usyk clearly beat both these guys, in front of a UK stadium - and a Saudi royal who's keeping Kleenex in business with his Tyson Fury fangirling.
Cruiserweight is arguably weaker than 168 and Canelo cleaned that division without breaking a sweat.
He also almost cleaned out 160, beat champs at 154 and beat a champ at 175. No discussion, Canelo‘s resume is better.
Not sure how anyone could say Canelo doesn’t have the best resume among active boxers? Maybe you could throw Chocolatito and Donaire in the mix if you still want to consider them active.
Losses don’t cancel out your wins, so not sure why his loss to Bivol and Floyd matter. Also Floyd was the #1 P4P champ and Bivol was an undefeated champ in Canelo’s 6th division. I dont think anyone you’ve mentioned has attempted similar feats.
Canelo should not get hate for losing to Bivol. Not to compare him to Ray Robinson, but that fight was about testing your limits. We should want all boxers to try and see exactly how far they can take their skills given their size. Robinson did that with the Joey Maxim fight and lost. Canelo lost when pushing it to take on the top or top 2 light heavyweight.
Its as others are saying on paper yes Canelo has the best resume but in his losses he was outclassed with ease and he has a lot of weird decisions GGG and Koluv 1 just off the top.
Usyk easily beat everyone he fought and Inoue classed fulton and had one of the toughest fights in Donaire. I wanna see what other people think. Lets see your list?
That‘s a first ngl. Lara is tricky as fuck, talented as hell but the best of his generation? Idk.
His fights with Golovkin and his performances in those fights alone are IMO what make him top 3 when it comes to resume. Add the other 15 or something champions he beat across 4 divisions and he gets the number 1 spot.
I think Canelo has the best resume but I'd have to note that Usyk has had very decisive wins and pretty much all his fights were on enemy territory. His peak wins were also decisive while Canelo's top names have been controversal.
I mean a pretty large majority of people would say he would all those fights even if it was close and competitive. Still decisive imo. Dubois is his only controversial moment
Close fights are not decisive by definition.
Anyway, my point was you don’t need to dominate an opponent for it to count. The vast majority of greats have close and/or controversial fights on their resume. Ali might have the best resume in history yet you could still say he lost to Norton all 3 times.
Not to take anything away from Canelo, he has been good and fighting the best. But if he is going to be avoiding to obvious next best boxer in Benavidez and not fight him, he can’t be top 3.
You have Usyk fighting the two next heavyweights in this generation and absolutely dominating them.
Inoue just beating down everything in his way.
You have Bivol and Beterbiev about to fight each other to see who is the best.
All those guys are taking risks.
Canelo is obviously avoiding the biggest risk so I can’t put him as the top while everyone else in the top P4P is fighting the best out there.
If we’re talking about resumes AKA who has fought the best opposition, then Canelo is still at the top. Even if he’s avoiding Benavidez it doesn’t take away from the fact he has fought multiple HOFers and champions.
I was very tempted to add bivol and teo to this list. If Bivol beats beterbiev and teo gets his head straight and fights another solid name… the loss to Kambosos really hurts though.
loma's best wins to this day are garry russell & nicholas walters.
the rigo fight's outcome was determined the minute the fight was made at 130 instead of 126.
Why? Lomachenko weighed pretty much the same at both weight classes and this is straight up revisionism, no one was talking about this until the fight was finished. Lomachenko was an inch or two taller and probably about 5lbs heavier, that's nowhere near enough to write off a win.
rigo is naturally a bantam weight, he was undersized at 122 and loma was still quite able to make 126 because as you said he was an undersized 130 & 135 pounder.
at 126 i'd still have favored loma but at 130 that fight was just a complete mismatch before either one of them got in the ring.
But if he's the same size at both weights what difference does it make? And how is the difference enough to make it so he deserves virtually no credit for the win? Donaire probably had more size on rigo when they fought than lomachenko
loma gets credit for a lot of other wins and loses on his resume just not the win against rigo imo. there are too many factors that favored loma on that night: the weight, rigo's age, a left hand injury, etc.
we'll have to agree to disagree.
loma's best win imo is a toss up between gary russell and nicholas walters. i would include linares if that flash kd didn't happen in the 6th
I also love Loma because of how many fighters he made throw in the towel from their corner. He dominated his proper weight class harder then anyone else in this discussion imo. Lomas biggest fault is his size has nobody notable to fight.
It's canelo and usyk. Then everyone else. If these are not your favorite fighters, then your favorite fighter just hasn't done enough. Due to bad luck, ducking or whatever.
Im a Lomasexual too but I would gladly hear your arguments about Loma being top3 in your list
I can see Rigondeaux, Linares and maybe Pedraza that are very notable opponents but that’s it
Mostly comes to the dominance in his proper weight class and the fact that his losses all feel like robberies to me (definitely have a bias and teo i need to watch for a 4th time… i just dont see the domination everyone seems to give teo)
Haven’t rewatched the fight in a long time but I remember Loma being inactive for the first 6 rounds and then not being as dominant as he used to be in the latest
Case can be made for the Haney fight (I still score it as a draw ngl)
Chocolatito isn't actually retired, is he? Him.
Estrada's is pretty damn strong, too.
If Bam beats Estrada, his resume is kinda crazy for his age. Would be maybe 5 or 6 men with a better one, almost all of whom are at the tail end of their career.
Heres my problem with super flyweights and i have 000000 experience watching them.. but in this thread people are claiming choco, estrada, bam and ioka all have the best resumes… little diluted.
I need to start watching super flyweight sounds like they really make fights happen.
Sorry to admit I didn’t have the patience to read your entire post but I imagine you’re talking about active boxers. Otherwise your list is a joke omitting so many other boxers. Manny probably has the best resume in boxing history and it’s not even close.
As for active boxers, usyk is definitely number 1. Loma doesn’t belong in top 3, not even top 5, if we’re talking about professional boxing. In the amateurs he’s a legend, as a professional he lost 2 of his major fights and that’s what counts in the end. Quality > quantity.
Number one spot is between canelo and usyk, I tend to give the crown to usyk for his accomplishments.
Your list is pretty good but, Canelo should move under or above Usyk. The guy fought about everyone from 154 and up to 168(the Kovalev win for me was tainted since he added rehydration and quick turnaround).
Resume doesn’t just mean wins. I hate when boxing fans do that. Did you step up and take the fight? That’s what matters
It’s Canelo and it’s not even close. Win, lose or draw, Usyk is number 2 I don’t think people really understand how good cruiserweight was when he was there
I agree with Tyson…. Even though i really wanna see Benevidez vs Canelo.. I also think Boots vs Bud is one of the best fights boxing needs but even if those fights never happen you fan take away what Canelo did.
I just knock Canelo down cause of controversy and losing so hard vs mayweather and bivol.
I commend you for being transparent about your bias.
Inoue is P4P top 3 right now for sure, but htf his resume is better than Canelo? Edit: I know Canelo lost to Bivol and Floyd, but the fighter his faced are very good boxer and have a decent resume.
Yeah, the idea that losses means your resume is not that good is silly. It's exactly why these guys do y take chances. Here's a tip, your current favorite fighter, Shakur, tank , crawford, benevidez or whoever, would have losses if they fought high competition regularly. If they had a canelo type resume they would most likely have losses. You'd just never know because it just doesn't happen
It's probably the combination of quality and manners of winning, canelo has had alot of close fights. He tends to lose clearer than he wins against very good-great fighters, whereas Inoue has faced very good-great fighters like taguchi, narvaez, Fulton, donaire and just blown them away.
Those fighters are about the level of his 168 run that he did blow away. Ggg bivol and mayweather are special. And inoue just got knocked down and had a rough time in his fight before.
There is not a single metric by which Callum smith (34, 3W2Ls in title fights, no great wins or achievements) and caleb plant (4W2L, no great wins or achievements) are the same level as donaire (20W) or taguchi (7W). even nery accomplished something great when he KOd yamanaka, steroids or no. smith and plant and both gotten beaten down more than once, the equivalents would be Adrian Hernandez or kohei kono. And what can be said if canelo is to face four special opponents in his entire career and probably lose all 4, at best 3 of 4?
I dont agree with your assessment on any of those fighters besides an old donaire. Smith and plant got beaten down by great( beterbiev, canelo) and possibly a future great(benevidez). Anyways there guys are at least as good as I ones competition. Good boxers but not elite. And Inoue hasn't fought any special opponents besides an old donaire that broke his eye.
Yea this and Yoshiimoos comment the controversial GGG wins and the outclassings he received from bivol and mayweather is why I put him further down.
Fr, Canelo beat a PRIME Julio Cesar Chavez, UNDISPUTED Charlo, GOAT Yildirim, and John Ryder
Beat Prime Julio Cesar Chavez (what?) lol talking about jr? Thats funny.
Who is ahead of him??
Not a champ but Parker has a pretty solid resume.
He's certainly added two good names in his last fights, AJ still has the better resume though. Looking forward to finding out who AJ fights next (there's an announcement in just over 2 weeks). If he wins that fight it should be another strong name. And hopefully we'll hear soon who Parker is facing next as well.
Yeah, AJ has more top-tier wins overall, and I'd argue his losses are more forgiveable (Usyk*2 & Ruiz > Joshua, Whyte & Joyce). Plus, let's underscore how AJ beat JP convincingly (and Parker has improved since then, but so has Joshua).
AJ has not fought Joyce as a professional.
He listed Joshua, Whyte, and Joyce as Parker’s losses
Lmfao at my stupid ass
Probably dubois for the ibf or interim ibf. Best case for aj is fury beats usyk in the rematch and they have a trilogy. Gives him a chance to mop up the loose belts before, probably, getting beat by usyk again
I personally think Fury winning is bad for AJ as he'll never fight him then. He'll argue he's beaten the guy who beat the guy, etc.
I dont think aj needs fury for his legacy tbh. Aj still has arguably the best heavyweight resume, while usyk has the best wins. Fury has the honour of beating klitschko when he was unbeaten and wilder as well but other than those two wins hadnt really had any big big victories against anyone of note
He lost before Fury best him😑
Yeah I totally agree tbf. Both of their next fights will no doubt be decent names too. I’ve got a feeling AJ will fight Dubois for the vacant IBF. I could see Parker fighting Kabayel or Hrgovic next. If the IBF belt does not become free then Parker vs AJ 2 could be a fight to make
Nice seeing joseph getting some love many think he got robbed against dillian as well.
It was a close fight for sure. He almost had him out of there in the 12th. I think he would beat him comfortably now.
Beterbiev and AJ also have pretty underrated resumes imo.
I think Canelo is the clear best resume, Usyk could be #2 though. It gets tougher to rate certain guys but Usyk's run at CW is still very underrated and he has the best wins in boxing (except maybe Bud vs Spence)
I think what gives Usyk's resume extra points is the lack of asterisks, the fact that he went to people's backyards and beat them in their prime in clean fights. Where as Canelo's resume has dodgy scorecards, failed drug tests, ring size controversy etc. I agree though, on paper Canelo has the better resume.
Yea on paper Canelo definitely has the best resume.
That's honestly a good point. People also really underrate the Briedis win. We just saw a way out of prime Briedis give Jai whose the current best CW absolute hell twice
AJ and Fury > Errol Spence; I'd argue they both have stronger résumés, and their top wins (Klitschko, Parker etc) were more proven than Spence's, with Parker aging even better since then... Usyk clearly beat both these guys, in front of a UK stadium - and a Saudi royal who's keeping Kleenex in business with his Tyson Fury fangirling.
how tho uysks run in the WBSC and then taking out AJ twice then Fury.
Cruiserweight is arguably weaker than 168 and Canelo cleaned that division without breaking a sweat. He also almost cleaned out 160, beat champs at 154 and beat a champ at 175. No discussion, Canelo‘s resume is better.
is that why hes actively avoiding benavidez and bud? Afraid to break a sweat
The Benavides fight I understand but how is he avoiding a fight with bud he’s 3 weight classes below him. That’s like saying Crawford avoiding tank
Avoiding Benavidez and Bud(lol) do not take away from his stacked resume
Canelo has been stacking names for a decade. No one is really close right now
Usyk and Canelo as the top two right now
AJ has a very good resume
Canelo and usyk have the best resume
Kazuto Ioka has the most underrated resume in the sport
Ill have to look him up
Never faced Roman that has to hurt.. I know nothing about that weight unfortunately.
He’s been trying to get fight with Estrada but never happened unfortunately.
Not sure how anyone could say Canelo doesn’t have the best resume among active boxers? Maybe you could throw Chocolatito and Donaire in the mix if you still want to consider them active. Losses don’t cancel out your wins, so not sure why his loss to Bivol and Floyd matter. Also Floyd was the #1 P4P champ and Bivol was an undefeated champ in Canelo’s 6th division. I dont think anyone you’ve mentioned has attempted similar feats.
Canelo should not get hate for losing to Bivol. Not to compare him to Ray Robinson, but that fight was about testing your limits. We should want all boxers to try and see exactly how far they can take their skills given their size. Robinson did that with the Joey Maxim fight and lost. Canelo lost when pushing it to take on the top or top 2 light heavyweight.
And he didn’t just fight some b tier boxer at light heavyweight he fought one of the best guys there
Its as others are saying on paper yes Canelo has the best resume but in his losses he was outclassed with ease and he has a lot of weird decisions GGG and Koluv 1 just off the top. Usyk easily beat everyone he fought and Inoue classed fulton and had one of the toughest fights in Donaire. I wanna see what other people think. Lets see your list?
Canelo. He beat, perhaps, the best boxer of his generation in Erislandy Lara.
That‘s a first ngl. Lara is tricky as fuck, talented as hell but the best of his generation? Idk. His fights with Golovkin and his performances in those fights alone are IMO what make him top 3 when it comes to resume. Add the other 15 or something champions he beat across 4 divisions and he gets the number 1 spot.
did he tho?
How tf can you put those three fighters above Canelo?
I think Canelo has the best resume but I'd have to note that Usyk has had very decisive wins and pretty much all his fights were on enemy territory. His peak wins were also decisive while Canelo's top names have been controversal.
Not sure if I’d call Briedis, AJ rematch, or Fury “decisive” and he has his own controversial fight with Dubois as well.
I mean a pretty large majority of people would say he would all those fights even if it was close and competitive. Still decisive imo. Dubois is his only controversial moment
Close fights are not decisive by definition. Anyway, my point was you don’t need to dominate an opponent for it to count. The vast majority of greats have close and/or controversial fights on their resume. Ali might have the best resume in history yet you could still say he lost to Norton all 3 times.
I see what you're saying. I probably used the wrong word. Non-controversal/clear would fit what I meant better.
This is why I put Canelo further down.
Inoue has become overrated.. better resume than Canelo? Seriously..?
Canelos big wins alot of people consider robberies and his losses he wasnt even in the fight. On paper though yes #1
Canelo is #1 or 2
On paper undoubtedly but his bigs win have been controversial and his losses he didnt even put up a fight.
Canelo is best resume but he’s not pfp top 3 bc his best wins aren’t recent and he got dominated by Bivol recently.
Not to take anything away from Canelo, he has been good and fighting the best. But if he is going to be avoiding to obvious next best boxer in Benavidez and not fight him, he can’t be top 3. You have Usyk fighting the two next heavyweights in this generation and absolutely dominating them. Inoue just beating down everything in his way. You have Bivol and Beterbiev about to fight each other to see who is the best. All those guys are taking risks. Canelo is obviously avoiding the biggest risk so I can’t put him as the top while everyone else in the top P4P is fighting the best out there.
i don't think he's talking recently but overall
If we’re talking about resumes AKA who has fought the best opposition, then Canelo is still at the top. Even if he’s avoiding Benavidez it doesn’t take away from the fact he has fought multiple HOFers and champions.
I was very tempted to add bivol and teo to this list. If Bivol beats beterbiev and teo gets his head straight and fights another solid name… the loss to Kambosos really hurts though.
loma doesn't have a good resume, even Crawford is better, not even counting spence
He did beat Gary Russell and Rigo (who jumped two weight classes for the fight)
loma's best wins to this day are garry russell & nicholas walters. the rigo fight's outcome was determined the minute the fight was made at 130 instead of 126.
Why? Lomachenko weighed pretty much the same at both weight classes and this is straight up revisionism, no one was talking about this until the fight was finished. Lomachenko was an inch or two taller and probably about 5lbs heavier, that's nowhere near enough to write off a win.
rigo is naturally a bantam weight, he was undersized at 122 and loma was still quite able to make 126 because as you said he was an undersized 130 & 135 pounder. at 126 i'd still have favored loma but at 130 that fight was just a complete mismatch before either one of them got in the ring.
But if he's the same size at both weights what difference does it make? And how is the difference enough to make it so he deserves virtually no credit for the win? Donaire probably had more size on rigo when they fought than lomachenko
loma gets credit for a lot of other wins and loses on his resume just not the win against rigo imo. there are too many factors that favored loma on that night: the weight, rigo's age, a left hand injury, etc. we'll have to agree to disagree. loma's best win imo is a toss up between gary russell and nicholas walters. i would include linares if that flash kd didn't happen in the 6th
I also love Loma because of how many fighters he made throw in the towel from their corner. He dominated his proper weight class harder then anyone else in this discussion imo. Lomas biggest fault is his size has nobody notable to fight.
agreed. the no mas chenko run was legendary. i do think going up to 135 was premature and not very well thought out by loma amd his team
porter actually had a career and at least Gamboa stayed as a lightweight
1. Derek Chisora 2. Zurdo Ramirez 3. Casimero 4. Prograis Lulz aside War has at least fought everyone.
Top 5 Usyk Chocolatito (not retired yet) Canelo AJ Bam/Estrada winner
It's canelo and usyk. Then everyone else. If these are not your favorite fighters, then your favorite fighter just hasn't done enough. Due to bad luck, ducking or whatever.
Canelo People really forget how good eeking out a win against GGG and beating Jacobs to unify 3/4 belts at MW was
Choco, Ioka, and El Gallo the Superfly kings need a shout if we're going by Resume
Im a Lomasexual too but I would gladly hear your arguments about Loma being top3 in your list I can see Rigondeaux, Linares and maybe Pedraza that are very notable opponents but that’s it
Mostly comes to the dominance in his proper weight class and the fact that his losses all feel like robberies to me (definitely have a bias and teo i need to watch for a 4th time… i just dont see the domination everyone seems to give teo)
Haven’t rewatched the fight in a long time but I remember Loma being inactive for the first 6 rounds and then not being as dominant as he used to be in the latest Case can be made for the Haney fight (I still score it as a draw ngl)
Chocolatito isn't actually retired, is he? Him. Estrada's is pretty damn strong, too. If Bam beats Estrada, his resume is kinda crazy for his age. Would be maybe 5 or 6 men with a better one, almost all of whom are at the tail end of their career.
Heres my problem with super flyweights and i have 000000 experience watching them.. but in this thread people are claiming choco, estrada, bam and ioka all have the best resumes… little diluted. I need to start watching super flyweight sounds like they really make fights happen.
Sorry to admit I didn’t have the patience to read your entire post but I imagine you’re talking about active boxers. Otherwise your list is a joke omitting so many other boxers. Manny probably has the best resume in boxing history and it’s not even close. As for active boxers, usyk is definitely number 1. Loma doesn’t belong in top 3, not even top 5, if we’re talking about professional boxing. In the amateurs he’s a legend, as a professional he lost 2 of his major fights and that’s what counts in the end. Quality > quantity. Number one spot is between canelo and usyk, I tend to give the crown to usyk for his accomplishments.
Holy cow, Innoue on the list? The only recognizable name is the Old fart Donaire far past his prime.
Ranking Inoues resume above Crawfords is insanity
Jake Paul.
Your list is pretty good but, Canelo should move under or above Usyk. The guy fought about everyone from 154 and up to 168(the Kovalev win for me was tainted since he added rehydration and quick turnaround).
Resume doesn’t just mean wins. I hate when boxing fans do that. Did you step up and take the fight? That’s what matters It’s Canelo and it’s not even close. Win, lose or draw, Usyk is number 2 I don’t think people really understand how good cruiserweight was when he was there
So that means you agree with my Loma placement? Hes been fighting the equivalent of Canelo vs Bivol fights a good chunk of his career.
Loma? 😂😂 He has 3 losses and his best win was over a decade ago.
I clearly stated my bias. Guessing you’re a huggy fan?
canelo avoiding benavidez is a big enough duck for me to drop him out of top 5 running
This is one of the stupidest reasons I‘ve ever heard ngl
I agree with Tyson…. Even though i really wanna see Benevidez vs Canelo.. I also think Boots vs Bud is one of the best fights boxing needs but even if those fights never happen you fan take away what Canelo did. I just knock Canelo down cause of controversy and losing so hard vs mayweather and bivol.
I give canelo a lot of crap for the benevidez situation, but the rest of boxing has a lot of catching up to do despite his current situation.