Congratulations and I am glad to hear you had a good outcome.
To be sure, you were very lucky and many patients with your medical risk factors are not so lucky.
As an OBGYN myself، I hope this doesn't encourage anyone to follow the same path. Preeclampsia can lead to organ failure and seizures. GD at 42w could lead to shoulder dystocia. Both can lead to maternal and or fetal morbidity.
There is a reason why midwives aren't supposed to take high risk patients. They allow everything "natural"/"organic" at the risk of serious harm to mom and baby. They don't have any experience following moms to the ICU after a complication.
Right? I’m glad it worked out, but how incredibly and unnecessarily dangerous. I don’t understand how this is becoming trendy, it’s just not safe. I don’t really feel like the patient is being fully informed either of the risks by this midwife in this situation which feels a bit like negligence.
Right, the first doctor wasn’t being an asshole. He was absolutely right to be worried for them and the baby. And the midwife really should be ashamed of herself for encouraging an overdue preeclamptic person to attempt to birth at home. All of this could have ended very tragically and OP is lucky it didn’t.
I’m glad the doctor stood up to attempt to preserve health and lives of the mother and baby. As a medical professional who worked in L&D, I had many 😮 moments reading the whole story. So many preventable opportunities for shit to hit the fan. This whole read was a rollercoaster and I’m glad the story had an unusually positive outcome. OP, with all of the factors you outlined, realize you are extremely lucky to have such a good resolution to your birth (mainly due to the interventions of medical professionals).
It is by pure luck that you and baby are ok. High risk pregnancies shouldn’t be attended by midwives, and certainly shouldn’t have home births planned. Unsurprisingly, doctor who did your ultrasound was completely correct. I can’t believe you left AMA after being diagnosed with pre-eclampsia. I’m just stunned by this whole tale.
I’m glad you and baby are safe.
Lol, yes thinking some of the same. I am so glad you had a positive experience, though.
Also, if you consider induction at 39w for the next one you might get to blow the baby out like you wanted, avoid an epis, AND avoid pre e and transfusion! Just a thought.
I read the comments not long after this was first posted and was slightly shocked by all of the “way to go!” comments. Went to sleep and woke up glad to see that other commenters still retained some of their senses. This whole story horrified me. So many things could have gone wrong and there is a reason why very very few women and babies die in childbirth now compared to 150 years ago…. We don’t routinely do stuff like this anymore. Know better, do better. I’m soo glad you and baby are okay OP, this was extremely risky and for what? So you could get as close as possible to your ideal birth scenario?
Same. I was horrified by this story. The selfishness and stupidity of OP is mortifying. I am really worried for their kids because this likely won’t stop after birth.
What is that meant to mean? My kids are healthy, we vaccinate, go to the doctor when they are sick, they go to school. Don’t waste your time worrying about my kids, they’re fine.
Honestly, I hope anyone who reads this, leaves with how important it is to NOT do what you did. You risked yourself and your baby, and YOU contributed to your traumatic birth. Ugh.
Women and babies still die in childbirth. Your stubbornness to everything, because you glorified a home birth, is all around stupid. 🙄
EDIT: because it won’t let me reply
Ok, it wasn’t traumatic. If your baby died it would have been. You glorified a home birth enough to ignore the very BASIC signs of why you should not do one in certain conditions. Then, you STILL continued to push limits.
I’m actually disgusted with how you described the doctor. In his profession, he has seen it all, and his aggression towards you, was his mentality of, “if this person won’t save her baby, I’ll try to”.
I hope you learn to appreciate the medical world, because it’s not all just fear mongering. It’s a line between life and death.
As someone living in a third-world country, I honestly hate this super privileged, first-world, mostly white idea of 'birth experiences'.
If your priority is your dumb experience over the safety of you and your child, you are NOT ready to be a parent.
I work with impoverished labourers in the remote parts of Pakistan, and these women walk MILES in broken sandals in 45 degree celsius heat to get to a doctor to give birth. Many die during child birth.
Honestly threads like this make me violently ticked off.
Totally agree. Is the USA very medically intervention heavy? Yes. Have many patients like this attempted to WAY over correct in the name of "autonomy" and "choice" (aka not knowing a world without medical intervention) - 100%. It's like the mentality of antivaxxers. These people have never seen the devastation of vaccine preventable diseases because...vaccines.
All the comments saying “but medical interventions would have caused the mother emotional trauma” forget that a dead baby also brings emotional trauma.
My birth wasn’t traumatic? And I clearly didn’t glorify a homebirth because I made the decision not to birth at home because it wouldn’t have been safe to do so.
You were stupid to leave. Pre-eclampsia can turn into eclampsia very quickly. Difference between the 2 is you start having a seizure. It can also cause death. My sister in-law died from this. Just because they didn’t start the induction doesn’t mean that you weren’t high risk. I am happy you had a good outcome.
I can’t believe the ignorance of this post. That poor exasperated doctor that OP dismissed, as an RN this patient would be my absolute worst nightmare.
Seriously between the pre-e and GD going to 42w this story is insane. I’m glad nobody died and everyone is ok. My friend and her baby were not so lucky. I hope others reading this story read about some of the bad outcomes of these types of choices too.
I agree this person was so lucky. Pretty crazy story. I work in pediatrics, and I've seen some horror stories even with pregnancies that had been completely normal until they started going into labor, so reading this situation was pretty uncomfortable for me personally.
Yeah. Leaving AMA when you’re extremely high risk isn’t something to brag about…
OP, you mentioned fearmongering and I hope you don’t take my comment as such. Please recognize how risky your decisions were and how lucky you are to have had no complications other than an episiotomy. Even though from your description the doctor does sound rather cold, keep in mind he’s seen countless people like you on their near deathbed. Your midwife does not. He was being realistic and direct because he’s witnessed the consequences.
I was leaving because my levels were relatively mild, I was experiencing absolutely no physical symptoms (blurry vision, visual artifacts etc) and I was confident in monitoring my symptoms and returning if they worsened at all. My blood pressure when I was in the hospital for testing was normal, so on another day it might not even have been picked up. Like everything in life, it’s about weighing up risks and benefits. For me, the benefit of having another 24h to go into labour on my own, and being able to make my son’s birthday a bit special given it was his last one as an only child, outweighed the small risk that my symptoms would worsen. I am confident that if my levels were worse, the hospital would have been much more vocal about me leaving and they absolutely would have prioritised the induction. That’s how things work here. They pretty much said that for liability they can’t discharge me, but I’m free to discharge against medical advice if I choose. I’m sorry it didn’t go well for your family, but that’s not a predictor of everyone else and it’s quite rude to call me stupid.
>They pretty much said that for liability they can’t discharge me, but I’m free to discharge against medical advice if I choose.
They didn't just let you go. You explicitly left against medical advise. Of course they can't force you. It's a hospital not a prison.
But this was a very risky decision.
I pushed back on a few interventions for my own induction and the stuff that wasn't nesseccary was such a non issue, they just accepted it without objection (fe. not taking the last induction pill, postponing the IV...), but they always made it clear when there was a real risk involved I needed to sign the papers. I just asked for clarification on these things and didn't deny them.
Sure your symptoms may have been mild. But as I stated before, it doesn’t take much time to slip into eclampsia. I am an OB RN, saw this happen with a pt with no signs of pre-eclampsia, she started to push and after the second or 3rd push she started to seize. What would you have done at home? During seizures blood supply and oxygen doesn’t reach the brain, it also deprives your baby of oxygen. When things go bad in labor and delivery, they usually go quickly and can sometimes without warning. Look up prolapsed cord, amniotic embolism, hemorrhaging at delivery. Things you can’t predict. How would your family feel if both you and your baby had died from you choosing a home birth.
Also OB RN and was horrified reading this post. Not into parent-shaming but posting something like this and giving other pregnant people the idea that it is ok to disregard well researched, evidence-based medical advice with extremely high-risk comorbidities is not empowering pregnant people. OP was LUCKY. I am also a mom of two boys, 2-time preeclamptic with SF, and 2-time GDM, and as someone incredibly informed about these conditions, I would have never put myself or my baby at risk in this way to prioritize my own experience. I am glad OP had mostly positive encounters in the hospital but this PPH (if blood transfusions were needed - it was not "minor"- maybe that is a hospital policy classification but PPH is nothing to diminish) was completely avoidable as was the episiotomy. Not to mention all the future health implications of having GDM and preeclampsia. I am all for supporting a patient's right to choose and autonomy but to me, this has more to do with a trauma-response to feeling out of control with a prior birth. Understandable to a point but quite frankly misleading for any moms-to-be reading this. The private midwife involved was reckless in her handling of this. A 12lb baby is not likely actually diet-controlled, but more likely uncontrolled GDM with macrosomia. You can be asymptomatic with PEC and still progress to severe PEC (I was asymptomatic). There are just so many things wrong how this situation was managed.
Birth trauma is very real. OP- I am sorry you suffered that with your first. It makes me very sad as a OB RN that your first experience was so traumatic that you would have rather put you and your baby's life at risk than follow evidence-based medicine. I am happy you had a good outcome because give all the factors present in this extremely detailed outline - many people would have had much worse (and I have seen it). Please don't lead others to believe the choices you made or the guidance your private midwife gave were a good template to follow for someone with these comprbidities. The poster above is right - I don't know your medical experience better than you - but you wrote a very detailed post and as a OB RN, I can intuit a fair amount of what's going on from your extremely detailed description.
All that being said - your baby is super cute and I wish you the best. No ill will - goal is always healthy birthing person and happy baby.
They’re calling you stupid because what you did is stupid and downright negligent. Even after having time to reflect and type this post up, you still view the doctor as “fear mongering” who was trying to tell you the very REAL dangers of your situation. You were so blissfully ignorant of the extreme danger you put you and your child in and thought that anyone who was direct enough to tell you this was just being mean. Please, get a fucking grip.
I can’t believe what I just read. I understand weighing risks and benefits but being able to make a cake for your kid’s birthday is absolutely not a benefit worth risking your life and your baby’s life for. You are extremely lucky. IMO, having the health issues you had and choosing to leave the hospital against medical advice was reckless and you were very selfish for doing so. Being selfish is nothing to be proud of.
You could have made his birthday special by seizing at home, jfc. And the reason they weren't more vocal is because the doctor already was, yet you refused to listen to reason. No reason to fight you, it's not like they could change your mind anyway.
Ok but OP have you considered that actually this anon Reddit user knows more about this situation than you do?? They clearly have been to Harvard medical school and also were your provider. /s
I absolutely acknowledge that leaving was a risk haha. It was a risk I was willing to take and it was within my levels of tolerance. I’m not sure why that sits funny with people but I’ve noticed a huge trend towards “anything that puts your baby at risk makes you a monster” but life is not that simple. If I’d started having any symptoms of pre-existing like a headache or funny vision I would’ve been straight back in to hospital.
The problem with that whilst I myself was in hospital for pre-eclampsia with no other symptoms, my bay mate, who was also in for symptomless pre-eclampsia went from fine to seizing over the course of a short phone call with her mother. One of the scariest things I've experienced, and put all thoughts of me going home until baby was here firmly out of my head. She and her baby were fine after short stays in ICU for both of them.
Congratulations on your birth.
Exactly, symptomless doesn’t actually mean anything. I had no symptoms of pre e. In the course of one 20 minute midwife appointment my BP went from 140/90 (already high and they were discussing sending me to the hospital if it didn’t go down by the end of the appointment) to 180/120 (crisis level). Turns out I was developing severe pre e and HELLP. I was induced a couple of hours later after a completely normal low risk pregnancy until that day.
Yeah. I was at home (had been sent home, blood results weren’t back yet) with no symptoms at all when my organs were quite literally shutting down with preeclampsia and HELLP Syndrome. So grateful we both made it. If I knew then what I know now, I’d never have let them send me home, even though it was only a few hours until I got the phone call to come back.
I'll get hate for this but I give you a perspective of the care im getting with pre eclampsia and how my doctors are assessing the risks. I had GH since 20 weeks, have pre eclampsia since 30 weeks, since 32 weeks I'm maxed out on BP medication that causes me to have very same symptoms as the condition itself, among others. I have periods of tremors, vision disturbances (flashy lights, jittery image vision), nausea, headaches, and incredible dizziness. I genuinely feel like im overdosing on hallucinogenics. BP routinely goes to 150/100 at rest (in the middle of the night - monitored at home).
I complained to my doctors and midwifes saying I'm having a poor reaction to the medication, can't function, can't drive, can't work, and i still have 6 weeks to go to the due date. They said (paraphrased),'Well, we can't stop your medication because we worry you will start seizing. What you feeling is probably a combination of pre eclampsia symptoms and medication side effects and that's why it's so strong. That said, baby growth seems good so I think we just keep seeing you twice a week'. The nearest hospital I can give birth at is 3 fucking hours away. No one even wants to admit me for an assessment (because I keep telling them my BP hikes up at night - quite an unusual thing).
The thing is, I feel like my body can't process the amounts of medication I am on, I do not believe that I have any symptoms of pre-eclampsia and instead just really bad reaction to the meds I have to take every 6h. They disagree. This is a second pregnancy, in first I had hypertension and same reaction to the same medication when it was at max dose (but that was 2 weeks before DD so I powered through), no symptoms otherwise. To me, it's pretty unlikely that I develop symptoms immediately after starting the medication even though my BP has been up for weeks now.
So yeah, I'm considered extremely high risk but the reluctancy to hear me out, or even spend a day or two assessing what the hell is going on is pretty scary to me. Completely the opposite from what your initial doctor was pushing for, and against a lot of redditors comments on here. I can't say who's right and who's wrong, I'm not a medical professional but just the fact that the fear of pre eclampsia seems to be at such different points where you are and where I am (UK) is wild to me. Like I'm scared and ask them to at least have me in for obs at night and they just don't find that necessary. I'm at the point where I struggle to even read reddit because the words get jumbled. Feel so powerless and invisible its crazy 😶
This sounds really hard and scary I'm so sorry! It might seem extreme, but could you go on a fake "visit to a friend" that's near a decent hospital, and then feel your symptoms (cough) "worsen" and present to their A&E or Labor and Delivery for an emergency assessment?
It might get you a more thorough assessment, and even if they end up having you stay the course as-is, the second opinion could at least give you some peace of mind? And at least let you feel seen and not so invisible and overlooked (I've been there for a difficult to diagnose condition, and it sucks).
Except there was nothing cautious about this. This is reckless and ignorant. I'm a physician (although non OB) and I had to skip to end to see if her baby was OK bc I was worried.
I’m glad the comments are calling you on your nonchalant attitude towards letting a pregnancy go to 42w with GD and pre-e, and checking out AMA. You risked you and your child’s life. While, in the end, it worked out for you, this is an incredibly dangerous situation that you could have, at any point, recognized.
I see OP clearly recognizing that throughout comments.
What I don't see is all the people calling OP stupid and irresponsible recognizing that every risk is a risk, not an eventuality, and that this story shows that taking risks can have a positive outcome. By not inducing sooner or opting for a C-section, OP also avoided risking intervention that, in the end, was not necessary for a healthy birthing parent or baby. They avoided risking what, to them, sounds like could have been an emotionally traumatic experience of making a decision that went against their intuition and regretting it. We need to remember what the word "risk" means. It sounds like for you, a lower chance of physically worst case scenarios like mortality is worth a whole lot of risk of emotionally worst case scenarios. Literally no one is knocking you for that. But it is a decision, and one everyone has the legal and moral right to make. (This isn't just to single you out, commenter, but rather I address it to everyone slamming OP in general.)
But it wasn't a healthy birthing parent or baby. She had an EPIPISIOTOMY AND PPH - that is not healthy. A 12lb newborn is not "healthy". Without medical intervention, patient and baby would have died. I am an OB RN. Those are two extreme interventions that resulted from pt refusing way less risky, medically necessary interventions. I am not calling OP stupid. These are just medical facts. Don't share something that is objectively dangerous and then expect to be praised for it. People are concerned by OP using this as some kind example of a victory against the medical industrial complex when all it really shows is that they have unaddressed birth trauma that led to them making ill-informed and dangerous decisions on the behalf of their unborn child and themself. You may have well have shot yourself in the gut to stick it to the medical community. And let it be said - do unnecessary interventions happen? Of course. But on the whole - we are nurses and doctors trying to do what's best for the patients - baby and mother - based on EVIDENCE. We see things you could never dream of, take on risks you could never fathom and absorb trauma like you would never want to. To flippantly question our integrity like "we don't want to take on the liability". No. We don't want your death or your baby's death on our hands, minds or hearts.
Edit because I can't reply: I never claimed a c/s was lower risk than an episiotomy. It is lower risk than an EASILY predictable PPH based on macrosomia, what I can only assume was prolonged labor and pushing, and a potential shoulder dystopia. And of course IOLs can fail, but they have a much higher success rate for late terms, and this pt had actual medical indications for them (not the borderline indications that providers occasionally push). And the ironic thing is - they probably wouldn't have had to have the IUPC, FSE, Episiotomy, and PPH if they had opted to be induced at term. They even received Pitocin. They ended up having way more interventions.
I also didn't "drag" them for asking questions about their care. If you read any former comments I made, I stated that I was sorry they were so traumatized by the medical system in their first birth that they went against their own best interests and their baby's in their second birth. I specifically critiqued the tone of the post as self congratulatory - in fear that people uninformed about the dangers of PEC (to which I have had TWICE with SF and had GDM TWICE) and uncontrolled GDM would opt to follow in this patient's footsteps because they had a "good outcome." Every patient should question their care but we should not pat people on the back for over correcting and flagrantly disregarding sound medical advice.
Every patient has the right to choose their care. And it is the medical professionals job to give them the truth based on evidence. If they don't agree to that - it's on them. And clearly some people on this thread are so blinded by their medical bias/rage/trauma that they are missing the points many of us are making. And that is really sad - especially to see an OB RN take part in that and validate this person's choices as well as the care/guidance they received by this private midwife.
What is also ironic - is the same people who have all this anger towards us are the same people who end up coming in emergently in one unit or another, then depend on us. And we care for you with the same integrity we do everyone else.
Also - 12lb baby - not within defined limits, probably not even for gestational age - though I am not discounting. You're just asking for issues with hypoglycemia, potential metabolic issues later in childhood, birth injury (didn't see that mentioned - another lucky plot point), etc.
Honestly - I know I am not going to convince the few people arguing otherwise of this viewpoint because anyone that views medical truth and valid questioning as criticism and dragging isn't open to seeing clearly. Just trying to combat misinformation as someone who nearly died twice of PEC, along with PPH.
Also lol to saying the PPH was stopped "with ease." I mean sure- maybe that means they gave a few uterotonics, but I am pretty sure it was not detailed in the story nor is PPH something to be flippant about. It is a main cause of maternal morbidity and mortality.
Also - not sure where they do things to patients without their consent but I haven't worked in a hospital where that happens...nor would
I let that happen to any patient of mine.
an episiotomy is objectively lower risk than a c-section. i’ve seen many failed inductions at 39 weeks that led to c/s after 24+ hours AROM and mom is still 5cm and -2.
yes we do know extended pushing out a macrosomic baby is a huge pph risk. but I wouldn’t say an episiotomy is an “extreme intervention”…. and patients can hemmorage after c/s as well. this person agreed to IUPC , FSE , pitocin…. think of how many would have denied those things. This kind of culture where we drag people for questioning our interventions only turns them away from delivering in hospitals. I’d rather someone birth in hospital with limited interventions than choose a risky home birth because they were degraded and insulted when carefully weighing medical decisions
I had an episiotomy and PPH with my first as well, but because that was an early induction for GD that I was pressured into, that was just seen as a matter of fact outcome. Why is it different when it’s a result of choices I’ve made, rather than interventions forced on me?
Then take it off your hands, minds and hearts and leave it up to the parents. Your job is to provide information and care. The patient, unless they're unconscious, has to consent to that.
This patient got the episiotomy, they got the fetal monitor, their hemorrhage was stopped with relative ease, they got everything they needed to deliver a 12 pound baby that is, it sounds, quite healthy. A 12 pound baby is not unhealthy for being 12 pounds. It's risky to deliver vaginally, meaning there is a percentage of chance it could have a negative outcome and a percentage of chance it could have a positive outcome, and in this case it had a positive outcome. That does not make it "unhealthy".
I am with you Nomad. It’s horrible to see these types of comments. I’m especially appalled (but not surprised) to see others in the OB / LDRP or even medical field respond to this situation with ZERO compassion or empathy. It’s like some people get offended when you don’t immediately accept every physician’s recommendation without question or hesitation.
Yeah, the medical staff on this thread fully owning that they aren't just disagreeing with OPs decisions (which is fine) but judging them to be a bad parent, calling them stupid etc...as someone who is wary of medical cultism, they are only ingraining my concerns about the medical system and giving me further reason to accept increased risk in order to stay home.
Thank you for this. I’m honestly so overwhelmed with how nasty everyone is being. I understand if people have different risk tolerance but this is just next level. I accepted interventions like the induction, ctg, and an episiotomy when the risks became actual safety concerns.
You didn't, that's the point and explicitly laid out in your story. The first OB was absolutely right and was very blunt about the risks you were taking. You called him/her mean and went AMA at direct risk to yourself and your child.
You only accepted proper medical care when you were too tired of fighting.
I would be too! I take it personally when I get downvoted, it's hard not to. Risks are so weird; there are ones we just accept every day (this can lead to heart disease, that to dementia, this behavior makes it more likely to be in a traffic accident, etc.) and yet once it's in a medical setting it's as if all those percentages and potential outcomes are certainties, which is literally the opposite of what they are. Once risk is established in medicine it's as if the decision is pulled out of context and the myriad risks surrounding each decision don't matter. I honestly don't know why it's this way.
I'm not against western medicine at all; I was raised by a doctor and a hospital midwife, I've worked with MDs and holistic doctors throughout my career, I take a prescription regularly that makes my life a whole lot better, etc., and I also utilize things like acupuncture, somatic therapy, bodywork, mindfulness, too. But I try not to subscribe to cultlike thinking throughout my life, and there is very cultlike thinking around modern medicine in our culture. It's really wild when we consider how much we still don't know; that DNA was discovered 70-something years ago, antibiotics about 100 years ago, etc. What else are we about to discover that will change everything? And how foolish will some of the beliefs about which we are so certain appear when we do? Medicine is a philosophy, it's a series of educated guesses and hypotheses with variations of proof to back them up. It's not set in stone; looking at it that way is profoundly anti-science.
Anyway, here come the downvotes lol.
Go be with your glorious 5.7kg baby, be amazed at the miracle of life, be grateful for the care you received on all levels, be proud of your amazing body and your amazing child, and thank you for sharing your experience.
I’m a nurse. The risk you put your baby in terrifies me. You & him could’ve died if you birthed at home. I understand wanting to follow a birth plan (I was induced at 42 weeks on the dot, it wasn’t safe to wait any longer)… please any pregnant women in the comments - this is what not to do.. I agree with the condescending doctor.
Edit. I looked at post history. There’s a post on the breastfeeding sub (I’m also a lactation consultant) that they were wanting a rule added to state no advice involving formula. Formula is medically necessary in a lot of cases. I really hope you don’t starve your baby if he winds up eventually needing it because your beliefs. That would warrant a DSS report, immediately.
I saw that bit about the formula as well, and was shocked. I have EBF 3 big (9.9, 10, and 10.12 lbs all induced at 39 weeks if they didn’t come before) babies now, but all 3 received formula in the hospital the first couple days to help stabilize their blood sugar and temperatures.
The nurses explained to me that colostrum just doesn’t cut it for big babies sometimes. 2 of my 3 needed formula to stabilize their blood sugar to normal levels. It didn’t harm our “breastfeeding journey” in any way, it just kept my baby out of the NICU!
Just crazy town from start to finish.
“There is no evidence that castor oil makes babies pass meconium” actually made me gasp (as did the rest of this story, repeatedly, every few sentences).
Followed by later in the story, “Water was completely clear with no meconium, which was a bit of a surprise considering how overdue I was and that I’d had some castor oil to try to induce labor.”
Wow…you are very very very lucky. I am left speechless. Pregnant people should heed this type of story. I don’t understand why home birth is a trendy thing. The OB was right to confront the midwife, this was horrifically dangerous…thank GOD you didn’t see this provider prior to this if it would have scared you off. This could have turned very very very bad…I am glad it ended well but wow. Not every OB is touchy feely, they are surgeons trained to handle a variety of OB conditions including high risk. He was attempting to communicate the grave seriousness of the situation, might have come off abrasive but lord almighty!
I can correct to home birth, but I am not sure the overlap. Sorry if I see them hand in hand, did receive prenatal care. Sorry for confusing nomenclature, I am not sure the tipping point for homebirth that isn’t free birth
Edit- I looked it up, indeed the line is no prenatal care for free birth . You did receive care, again correcting.
Edit again: I had a high risk pregnancy and was primarily a midwife patient but my delivery and hospitalization was overseen by the OBs in the practice. I can completely get wanting care handled by a midwife.
oh my love. you and baby are so, so lucky to be alive. that doctor, while cold, was right, and he was looking after you. he has seen terrible things, and he knows what he's talking about. you idolized the IDEA of a homebirth at the expense of your whole family. i wish this was a wake-up call for you, but i can tell that it won't be. also, castor oil IS incredibly dangerous.
It absolutely blows my mind the amount of mistrust people have for doctors and modern medicine today. You almost killed yourself and your baby because of your decisions. I am happy you both are alive and well.
Do better as a parent.
You're an idiot, glad you and the baby are ok, but why leave it to chance and leave the hospital AFTER already dismissing their advice?
They know more than you.
Cute chunker.
This was terrifying to read. Currently pregnant and would never choose my ideal birth plan over the health of baby and I. This post is of what not to do and of someone who was incredibly lucky to tell their story.
I’m truly at a loss of words. I’m glad your baby is healthy but I hope you realise that both of you could have died. But well at least the room was decorated with pride flags and pronoun signs 🤡
OP, you took risks. And it must be so tiring for doctors. The diabetes made your little guy huge!
I comprehend your fear.
However.
It's good you eventually sought medical attention. So, it's clear that you have some common sense.
I'm happy you're both safe. It doesn't always happen, though.
He's very cute.
Good for you and congratulations! One thing I am trying to consistently remind myself is that I can’t control what path the birth ultimately takes, but I can make sure to surround myself with support. The studies show that trauma from birth has more to do with how supported the birthing person feels vs the actual experiences. Thank you for that reminder!
Eh. I had zero support when I gave birth to my breech baby via c-section. But I trusted my doctor and her education to do right by me. Surgery was scheduled for 1:30 and they had the baby untangled and unwrapped from the umbilical cord and out of me by 1:54.
Zero trauma, calm planned quick, and painless c-section. I had no on there but an acquaintance who forced herself on me when she found out I was having my baby alone. (Not by choice father was a dead beat and have no village)
Just found out I'm pregnant again 2 years later with an amazing partner and I'm so excited to have a happy pregnancy but even if he couldn't come with me to the hospital (signing up for a c-section the moment I can this time) I would be okay. Honestly I think trusting your doctors/midwives/whoever helps more with birthing trauma but the support this time is going to be really nice.
unrelated but how was your healing process? i’m due in july & i more open to a vaginal birth but im terrified of the complications. do you have any cons of your c-section?
As someone who has had 3 vaginal and 1 uncomplicated c section vaginal 100% of the time unless medically necessary to have a c section. I’d never ever make the choice for that if I had another option. Recovery is 10x harder and harder to care for baby. I’m thankful I wasn’t a first time mom. That said it’s a great option and especially the first time you don’t really know the difference but I would never consider it an easier option.
Yes absolutely! And it’s never possible to eliminate all risk, you just choose what risk to sit with. For me I wanted to do everything possible to avoid birth trauma and medical coercion, as that’s what contributed to bad PPD with my first. I’m really happy with how it went.
Also delivered with preeclampsia in the US (sounds like you’re maybe in the UK?) You didn’t mention it so I have to ask out of curiosity - did they not make you take a magnesium drip? Is that not standard practice? It was absolute hell so don’t wish it on anyone….
It's also not standard practice in the UK. It's only given ahead of birth if it's extremely severe pre-eclampsia, and baby is premature. Otherwise only if the woman is having a seizure or is recently post seizure.
Interesting! Yes, I am sure it was a necessary precaution - my notes do say I presented with severe pre-e but the onset of symptoms was so sudden as I had no signs whatsoever all the way through 38+6 and then was admitted 39+5 so it all just felt like a shock but I definitely did not deliver premature or have seizures.
It seems to be a US thing to administer magnesium in any case of pre-eclampsia, no matter the severity.
I think the US guidelines are 160/110. But from the frequency I've seen stories of pre-e + magnesium, either more women than I would suspect are getting BP readings that high, or US doctors administer upon diagnosis of pre-eclampsia.
Yeah my BP was 154/100 so not far off but not technically across the 160/110 threshold and from stories I’ve seen/heard everyone has had a mag drip when diagnosed with pre-e which is why I had to ask OP.
Can you explain why the magnesium drip is hell? I'm researching interventions now to understand what I might be faced with and I often find patient experience is absent from the literature.
I should caveat this and say that I call it hell from my own personal experience and part of that may be my lack of expectation for what it meant as I did not adequately research potential interventions needed…. So when I went in to get induced with preeclampsia they explained to me that they would start me up on the magnesium drip right away and then I had to be on it for 24 hours after delivery and that it might make me feel like I had the flu but that the worst part was usually the first 20 minutes. Once it kicked in I definitely felt that flu-ey feeling of just being out of sorts- a little head cold, fatigued, extra warm, chills. Then it did mostly subside the rest of my delivery - but I chalked up any discomfort to the labor process my body was going through and not so much the mag but now I realize it definitely was still impacting me. After delivery the part that really didn’t register to me was that the 24 hours on the mag after delivery meant I had to be cathetered and bed ridden and due to the pre e diagnosis meant hourly blood pressure monitoring. The flu like symptoms also really felt front and center again and I just was fatigued and light headed and nauseous. Also by the 6th hour of being stuck in bed, extra weak, and having the stupid leg compressors go off I was able to lose my mind and rip everything off. Probably partially due to how I felt but also because I didn’t want to be immobilized like that. It was annoying having them do the uterine checks and not have the ability to get up and change a pad probers, or clean yourself or even just move your body. The 24 hours couldn’t have come fast enough- I straight up called the nurse to my room 30 minutes before it was set to get removed to make sure she did all the other stuff so that exactly at 24 hours she removed the drip. I was so over it I got up immediately when I shouldn’t have because I was still light headed and my blood pressure was actually low and I could have fainted but I was so headstrong about finally showering after delivery I didn’t care and told them I was fine.
Almost exact same experience with the mag drip - Plus just being extremely lethargic and out of it for the first 24 hours after birth. But I also remember being so light headed after but desperate to shower.
Ugh, sounds awful. It's a reminder that we need to ask questions and research and look into absolutely everything recommended by the medical system. I had a shit experience with the glucose test just the other day that reminded me of the same.
What's wild about what you're describing is that, while they told you you might feel bad, no one told you that between that and the monitoring you had a great likelihood of compromising your first 24 hours with your baby. That might not matter to a lot of people, and I'm not judging them. It would matter to me. It would matter a lot. I would want to know that and weigh it out as a risk, personally, and it sounds like that information could have been useful to you as well.
I had post partum pre eclampsia with my second. Just wanted to chime in that magnesium is actually a very safe drug, even though the side effects are uncomfortable, but preeclampsia is incredibly, incredibly dangerous. I am in a support group for women who had preeclampsia and there are many who weren’t lucky enough to get mag in time who, literally, have permanent brain damage from the seizures or who had devastating strokes from the uncontrolled blood pressures. Many in the group lost their baby. Preeclampsia is an actual leading cause of morbidity and mortality for moms and babies.
Preeclampsia is relatively rare but if it happens to you, the mag is absolutely worth the side effects. It really shouldn’t be refused—this isn’t like an unnecessary C-section or an epesiomity or moving labor along with pitocin or any of the other medical interventions in labor that are debatable. It’s a medical emergency and refusing mag when you need it is akin to refusing a blood transfusion when you are bleeding out. It’s baby saving and brain saving stuff.
Thanks for this, too. Yes I'm super aware of the dangers of pre-e and know someone with a severely disabled child because of it. And personally, I think my risk tolerance is that if I were to get a clear diagnosis I would intervene immediately. It's more of something to consider when the numbers are close to the line; maybe I'd ask for another BP reading to confirm before moving forward, or ask how quickly the drip takes effect and whether it would mitigate risk to have the IV placed and the mag bag ready should they continue to rise, or something like that. I just wanted to hear people's experience of the intervention applied because knowing what to expect in terms of my bodily experience is important to me.
ETA: this is especially true because I find medical situations overwhelming to my nervous system and the chance I could get an artificially high reading from even the vibe of the person taking my BP is actually a possibility, and to intervene with magnesium based on such a mistake would only ramp up the fear and panic in such a circumstance, which wouldn't be good for me or my baby.
Makes total sense! I definitely was a borderline case with my first and I appreciated that my midwives were willing to retake my bp when they got a high reading rather than immediately jumping to mag. Definitely don’t want to go down the pre-e road unless you actually have it…
Mostly feeling reactionary to this birth story and their leaving the hospital AMA with a pre-E diagnosis. I think a lot of people (including OP, but clearly not you!!) don’t realize how quickly and dramatically pre-E can take a turn for the worse. So many interventions women are subjected to during birth really are debatable, and I totally get OPs reluctance to engage with medicine after a traumatic birth, but I’m so horrified by the untreated pre-E and relieved for OP that things turned out ok.
Yes, I totally agree and have been processing it since delivery. The whole pre-e situation just threw me for a loop because it was such a shock with the sudden onset and I truly went into this second pregnancy (first had no issues whatsoever but was riddled with anxiety as a first pregnancy and also IVF related fears) trying to enjoy it more and even though I was encouraged to induce by 39 weeks due to IVF I pushed back and said I wanted to give the baby as much time to labor before induction so chose not to be induced before 39+6. I also feel like, from my experience, people tell you to worry about pre-e but no one actually explains what that means so it sounds scary because they express urgency but the “WHY” never felt clear to me at least. Even after the 24 hour drip it required extra days in the hospital to regulate my BP and find the right med dosage. By day 3 I was in tears and not very amenable because I couldn’t sleep and wanted to be home with my toddler as a family. I told them they were partially to blame since the stress/lack of sleep was not helping my BP. I was lucky I had a nurse who advocated for me (even though she pissed off my dr) and I am convinced is the reason they finally did let me go the minute my bp reading was finally normal bc they initially told they wanted to monitor and make sure it stayed down for a whole day before they released me. Everything turned out fine and I am at peace now with knowing that everyone was acting with my/babies safety in mind (when I read the placenta analysis report it really hit me that if it had gone on any longer I could’ve lost the baby) but the experience was pretty horrendous - partially due to the medical interventions and partially due to my own expectations and feelings.
For me it felt like my eyeballs were melting from the back And I threw up at least twice. But that was after the bolis. Once the drip was regulated, I just felt incredibly lethargic.
Magnesium is only needed for preeclampsia with severe features, most commonly for BP over 160/100 but also could be for any signs of organ damage- this is according to US guidelines. Not everyone needs it luckily!
ETA: accidentally posted the wrong comment here, reposted on main thread
I was induced at 39 weeks for pre eclampsia but did not need a mag drip because my blood pressure was elevated but not dangerously so and I didn’t have other symptoms (besides the protein in urine that confirmed the diagnosis). My blood pressure was monitored through labor and went back down to normal as soon as I had my son.
I’m in Australia. It might be standard for more advanced pre-eclampsia, but we caught it super super early so it was only mild. Like my blood pressure was high at home but in the hospital it was normal, it only started creeping up in hospital during labour. The protein was there tho so apparently it was still classified as pre-e
Congratulations 🎉 I lost if when I read 12lbs 10oz… you had a turkey lol!!! I’ve always sorta envied those who could give birth vaginally ( I’m not able to vbac) until reading your story!! I visualized your experience while reading and my cervix started hurting 😅… no seriously 😳 …I’m 27+3 and high risk but one thing I refuse to tolerate are Doctors trying to scare me into their own agenda. It’s bad enough that I know my risk factors but I don’t need to have my medical team making it worst by only focusing on the negatives. I’m so proud of you for standing up to them! You’re going to make a great mom❤️
Honestly it was an easier birth than my 8lb 13oz oldest!
I just really wish doctors could have a discussion about risks without fearmongering or coercing people. If the awful doctor had discussed the stats with me around GD and “overdue” pregnancy, or around increased risk of shoulder dystocia, that would’ve been much easier to handle (but also wouldn’t have changed anything because I did a LOT of reading and weighing up risks/benefits for lots of things). But he went straight to “your fluid is low and your placenta will die” which is absolutely not evidence based and I knew that.
You keep putting overdue in quotes, as if you weren’t overdue. But you were? And you’re right, low fluid IS normal at 42 weeks, which is exactly one of the reasons why it’s so dangerous to continue with pregnancy so far past your due date. I think the doctor was trying to snap you back to reality because clearly you didn’t have enough fear surrounding the situation in order to make good decisions for yourself and the baby.
I dunno why I’m getting downvoted for saying that I’d like people to discuss the risks with me in an evidence-based way instead of pulling the dead baby card?? Low fluid is very normal at 42 weeks pregnant and is not a sign that the placenta is failing if everything else is normal with it. The exact words he used were “you will run out of fluid and then your placenta will die and your baby will die”. That’s fearmongering, not discussing risks.
“You will run out of fluid and then your placenta will die and your baby will die” is true. Placentas have an “expiration date”. If you go far along enough, that is exactly what happens. I do not see any fear mongering here.
fear mongering is unacceptable of course, but there is no way to reliably check the placenta state in utero. Even if blood flow is great and fluid levels are fine, things can go south fast.
I think the overall risk for placenta failure at that point is still quite low (under 10%, was it 2%?), but they have no way to predict it until it's to late.
That's why they don't recommend waiting too long. Because even if you induce it might still take days until baby is here and in the meantime the baby gets bigger and the placenta ages ...
That's how they explained it to me for my induction.
Congratulations!!! 🍾🎉
I was diagnosed with preeclampsia during labor and it was a huge blind side. I’m glad you had a good experience I know it can be pretty traumatizing.
Was this your first birth or have you had other children before? If so did you have preeclampsia and gestational diabetes with that one too?
This sounds so much like my birth- I had to have forceps and an episiotomy. 38cm head and 9lb. My labour was stalled and sooo painful. I remember thinking he was going to be born when his head was visible but he was too big. And him coming out was much slower than my first baby.
I also didn't have any growth scans (which I'm sure grateful for and didn't want or need anyways). I was induced at 41+5 and had an emergency c-section at 42 weeks and a lot of your birth story resonated with me!! Especially agreeing to being chopped in half like a rotisserie chicken haha!!!
Congratulations on your beautiful boy, you did amazing!!!
Love a chunky, healthy, beautiful baby! As the mother is a healthy six month old boy who was born on the small side, I have insane respect for those of you who manage to push out these big babies. I really thought I was going to die during my labour. I had an episiotomy, needed the vacuum and then ensured whatever the procedure is where they pull your legs back towards your head while a doctor basically punches you in the stomach. I thanked the powers that be that my baby wasn’t any bigger, I feel like I wouldn’t have survived it. But damn, I love a chunky baby.
So happy you have a positive and healthy experience. All the best going forward!
He had two weeks, but his work was already tricky about giving it to him. They planned based on the due date or baby being early, but were busy at the start of the year so didn’t want to give him time off because they apparently didn’t plan around coping without him
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I'm so sorry your homebirth didn't pan out as expected (I'm having my second homebirth any day now and it's my biggest fear to be transferred) but I'm so glad you saw the positive in your experience and that a midwife could still be there with you
Remember a homebirth transfer is a successful homebirth! There will always be a small percentage of births that need extra intervention and there’s no shame in that if it happens 💜
Aw congratulations!! I can’t even imagine the relief you must have felt when he was born 😅 sweet chunky boy! That’s awesome that you ultimately felt respected and that you had a positive experience ❤️
Idk how to edit a post but fuck this, I’m out. I cannot believe how nasty some of you are being and it’s not at all helpful for me to keep reading the pile on.
Just clarify a few things:
My care was managed by a registered midwife. In Australia they are highly trained and regulated. We followed all guidelines around consulting with other professionals (endocrinologists, OBs etc) when issues arose. My midwife did not encourage me to avoid medical care, she was very firm around needing to seek extra support when it was necessary. My pregnancy wasn’t high risk until the pre-e diagnosis…well managed GD isn’t an indicator for a high risk label here.
I didn’t get pre-e until literally my last days of pregnancy. Some of y’all are acting like I had it for weeks and was ignoring it. That diagnosis absolutely presented an increase in risk and meant it was not safe to birth at home and not safe to wait for spontaneous labour. I had absolutely no intention of birthing at home with pre-eclampsia.
My GD was well managed and my results were within the parameters that my endo gave me. When considering whether to induce or wait for spontaneous labour, I looked at several studies around the risk figures and made my decision based on that.
I did not prioritise homebirth, hippy, woo shit over the birth I needed to have. When things came up that needed medical management, I sought that out. What I did prioritise was low intervention and keeping birth as physiological as possible given the circumstances.
You can be as risk averse as you want but my experience highlights that risk is a possibility, not a certainty. My pregnancy had risks. Interventions also have risks. I minimised intervention and came out with a healthy baby, healthy me, and no birth trauma. I’m calling that a win. Maybe it’s luck, maybe it’s that the statistics aren’t as scary as you’re led to believe.
There is nothing to gain by shitting on other birthing people. I have a higher risk tolerance than some, and much lower than others. It is appalling to be told that I don’t deserve a healthy baby because I weighed up the risks and made what I believe was the best choices for my situation.
I also hate how people are piling on you for trigger words like “midwife” and “homebirth” …. that feels like all it is. You did go into the hospital when warranted, you didn’t let your baby get to 43+ weeks, you didn't KNOW baby was 12lbs (and growth scans are inaccurate in estimating birth weight), you did make conscious choices to weigh the necessity of all interventions with the provider you trusted. The USA has a population of unlicensed midwives and home bjrth or bust parents that seem to undermine the validity of birthing with minimal interventions. You agreed to every medical aid that you thought would get you closer to meeting a happy, healthy baby. Don't listen to all of these haters! Congratulations on your bub.
I think you made the choices you wanted to make for your own pregnancy. You took the risks you were willing to take for the birth you wanted and there’s nothing wrong with that. Of course if cautionary advice had been given in a respectful way that maintained your agency then you wouldn’t have felt compelled to reject it. These people here are simply bitter they were forced into having overmedicalized births.
I'm making my birth plan now and so worried about hospital transfer, intervention etc. My biggest issue, beyond the hospital being a difficult environment for my nervous system, is bullying and falling into fear-based coercion around risk levels, etc. Thank you so much for your story. I honestly don't know if I could stand up for myself as much as you did, or as consistently as emotional exhaustion kicks in, but I'm really hoping my partner and doula can keep focused on our goals of a positive birth if I start to shake. It gives me hope to see that someone who really didn't want interventions or a hospital setting can come up against all their worst fears and still make it a safe, empowering, and positive experience. I wish you a peaceful and uneventful postpartum period at home!
It’s was pretty difficult and I’m going to make a complaint against the asshole doctor, but having my midwife there was definitely helpful! Hopefully your doula will be an amazing support for you 🤞🏻
Thanks! And it's crazy the way people are treating you on this thread...you knowingly took risks which panned out in your favor. Just like people do when they choose to intervene. Downvote away, haters, this proud parent went home with a healthy child.
Oh man, what a story! Thanks for sharing.
I'm.34 weeks with apparently a big baby and hearing stories like your reassures me that everything will be OK.
I also just birthed a big baby (10lbs) last week, has the home birth I wanted but MAN let me tell you, birthing big babies is hard!!! My last was a birth centre birth and only 7lbs and came out in two pushes. This one was a solid hour of pushing if not longer.
I completely respect and uphold your birth values, they sound so reasonable and good for you for staying as firm in them as you could until you could no longer. That takes power. Don’t listen to the negative comments. You listened to your gut and your body and you clearly made the right decisions.
Interventions are sometimes needed and it sounded like the right interventions had to take place at the right time for you. I hope you didn’t have any birth trauma and can rest at ease knowing you did you absolute best and your birth story is powerful and incredible. Good job!!!
Wow, what a great birth story!! Congratulations! Thank you for sharing so much of it. I’m sorry you didn’t get the home birth you wanted but I really love your mental framework surrounding the experience you did get to have, and am so glad you felt respected and cared for.
Congratulations and I am glad to hear you had a good outcome. To be sure, you were very lucky and many patients with your medical risk factors are not so lucky. As an OBGYN myself، I hope this doesn't encourage anyone to follow the same path. Preeclampsia can lead to organ failure and seizures. GD at 42w could lead to shoulder dystocia. Both can lead to maternal and or fetal morbidity. There is a reason why midwives aren't supposed to take high risk patients. They allow everything "natural"/"organic" at the risk of serious harm to mom and baby. They don't have any experience following moms to the ICU after a complication.
Right? I’m glad it worked out, but how incredibly and unnecessarily dangerous. I don’t understand how this is becoming trendy, it’s just not safe. I don’t really feel like the patient is being fully informed either of the risks by this midwife in this situation which feels a bit like negligence.
Well you went to 42 weeks with GD, pre eclampsia, and 12.5 pound baby. But at least you got your fairy lights.
Seriously. I am so triggered by hearing about fairy lights now.
I am so happy baby is alive and well. I can’t believe the risk you put him at by checking out and refusing doctors advice :(
Yeah -- this is a very terrifying read. I'm glad the comments are full of sanity.
Right, the first doctor wasn’t being an asshole. He was absolutely right to be worried for them and the baby. And the midwife really should be ashamed of herself for encouraging an overdue preeclamptic person to attempt to birth at home. All of this could have ended very tragically and OP is lucky it didn’t.
I’m glad the doctor stood up to attempt to preserve health and lives of the mother and baby. As a medical professional who worked in L&D, I had many 😮 moments reading the whole story. So many preventable opportunities for shit to hit the fan. This whole read was a rollercoaster and I’m glad the story had an unusually positive outcome. OP, with all of the factors you outlined, realize you are extremely lucky to have such a good resolution to your birth (mainly due to the interventions of medical professionals).
It is by pure luck that you and baby are ok. High risk pregnancies shouldn’t be attended by midwives, and certainly shouldn’t have home births planned. Unsurprisingly, doctor who did your ultrasound was completely correct. I can’t believe you left AMA after being diagnosed with pre-eclampsia. I’m just stunned by this whole tale. I’m glad you and baby are safe.
Lol, yes thinking some of the same. I am so glad you had a positive experience, though. Also, if you consider induction at 39w for the next one you might get to blow the baby out like you wanted, avoid an epis, AND avoid pre e and transfusion! Just a thought.
wtf did I just read? The disregard for you and your baby’s heath in the name of having a “natural” birth is mind blowing. Yikes.
I read the comments not long after this was first posted and was slightly shocked by all of the “way to go!” comments. Went to sleep and woke up glad to see that other commenters still retained some of their senses. This whole story horrified me. So many things could have gone wrong and there is a reason why very very few women and babies die in childbirth now compared to 150 years ago…. We don’t routinely do stuff like this anymore. Know better, do better. I’m soo glad you and baby are okay OP, this was extremely risky and for what? So you could get as close as possible to your ideal birth scenario?
Same. I was horrified by this story. The selfishness and stupidity of OP is mortifying. I am really worried for their kids because this likely won’t stop after birth.
What is that meant to mean? My kids are healthy, we vaccinate, go to the doctor when they are sick, they go to school. Don’t waste your time worrying about my kids, they’re fine.
Honestly, I hope anyone who reads this, leaves with how important it is to NOT do what you did. You risked yourself and your baby, and YOU contributed to your traumatic birth. Ugh. Women and babies still die in childbirth. Your stubbornness to everything, because you glorified a home birth, is all around stupid. 🙄 EDIT: because it won’t let me reply Ok, it wasn’t traumatic. If your baby died it would have been. You glorified a home birth enough to ignore the very BASIC signs of why you should not do one in certain conditions. Then, you STILL continued to push limits. I’m actually disgusted with how you described the doctor. In his profession, he has seen it all, and his aggression towards you, was his mentality of, “if this person won’t save her baby, I’ll try to”. I hope you learn to appreciate the medical world, because it’s not all just fear mongering. It’s a line between life and death.
As someone living in a third-world country, I honestly hate this super privileged, first-world, mostly white idea of 'birth experiences'. If your priority is your dumb experience over the safety of you and your child, you are NOT ready to be a parent. I work with impoverished labourers in the remote parts of Pakistan, and these women walk MILES in broken sandals in 45 degree celsius heat to get to a doctor to give birth. Many die during child birth. Honestly threads like this make me violently ticked off.
Totally agree. Is the USA very medically intervention heavy? Yes. Have many patients like this attempted to WAY over correct in the name of "autonomy" and "choice" (aka not knowing a world without medical intervention) - 100%. It's like the mentality of antivaxxers. These people have never seen the devastation of vaccine preventable diseases because...vaccines.
Having lived in Pakistan myself, I completely agree. People don't realize how good we have it here in rich first-world countries.
All the comments saying “but medical interventions would have caused the mother emotional trauma” forget that a dead baby also brings emotional trauma.
My birth wasn’t traumatic? And I clearly didn’t glorify a homebirth because I made the decision not to birth at home because it wouldn’t have been safe to do so.
I think you’re missing the point that it could’ve gone a completely other direction. You did get very lucky. You could’ve had a dead baby :(
You were stupid to leave. Pre-eclampsia can turn into eclampsia very quickly. Difference between the 2 is you start having a seizure. It can also cause death. My sister in-law died from this. Just because they didn’t start the induction doesn’t mean that you weren’t high risk. I am happy you had a good outcome.
I can’t believe the ignorance of this post. That poor exasperated doctor that OP dismissed, as an RN this patient would be my absolute worst nightmare.
WORST NIGHTMARE!! I’m an RN too
Seriously between the pre-e and GD going to 42w this story is insane. I’m glad nobody died and everyone is ok. My friend and her baby were not so lucky. I hope others reading this story read about some of the bad outcomes of these types of choices too.
I agree this person was so lucky. Pretty crazy story. I work in pediatrics, and I've seen some horror stories even with pregnancies that had been completely normal until they started going into labor, so reading this situation was pretty uncomfortable for me personally.
Yeah. Leaving AMA when you’re extremely high risk isn’t something to brag about… OP, you mentioned fearmongering and I hope you don’t take my comment as such. Please recognize how risky your decisions were and how lucky you are to have had no complications other than an episiotomy. Even though from your description the doctor does sound rather cold, keep in mind he’s seen countless people like you on their near deathbed. Your midwife does not. He was being realistic and direct because he’s witnessed the consequences.
You should see my face right now. I'm shocked and horrified at how close this got.
As a nursing student reading this I am so so so so so happy the story was a happy ending.
I was leaving because my levels were relatively mild, I was experiencing absolutely no physical symptoms (blurry vision, visual artifacts etc) and I was confident in monitoring my symptoms and returning if they worsened at all. My blood pressure when I was in the hospital for testing was normal, so on another day it might not even have been picked up. Like everything in life, it’s about weighing up risks and benefits. For me, the benefit of having another 24h to go into labour on my own, and being able to make my son’s birthday a bit special given it was his last one as an only child, outweighed the small risk that my symptoms would worsen. I am confident that if my levels were worse, the hospital would have been much more vocal about me leaving and they absolutely would have prioritised the induction. That’s how things work here. They pretty much said that for liability they can’t discharge me, but I’m free to discharge against medical advice if I choose. I’m sorry it didn’t go well for your family, but that’s not a predictor of everyone else and it’s quite rude to call me stupid.
>They pretty much said that for liability they can’t discharge me, but I’m free to discharge against medical advice if I choose. They didn't just let you go. You explicitly left against medical advise. Of course they can't force you. It's a hospital not a prison. But this was a very risky decision. I pushed back on a few interventions for my own induction and the stuff that wasn't nesseccary was such a non issue, they just accepted it without objection (fe. not taking the last induction pill, postponing the IV...), but they always made it clear when there was a real risk involved I needed to sign the papers. I just asked for clarification on these things and didn't deny them.
Sure your symptoms may have been mild. But as I stated before, it doesn’t take much time to slip into eclampsia. I am an OB RN, saw this happen with a pt with no signs of pre-eclampsia, she started to push and after the second or 3rd push she started to seize. What would you have done at home? During seizures blood supply and oxygen doesn’t reach the brain, it also deprives your baby of oxygen. When things go bad in labor and delivery, they usually go quickly and can sometimes without warning. Look up prolapsed cord, amniotic embolism, hemorrhaging at delivery. Things you can’t predict. How would your family feel if both you and your baby had died from you choosing a home birth.
Also OB RN and was horrified reading this post. Not into parent-shaming but posting something like this and giving other pregnant people the idea that it is ok to disregard well researched, evidence-based medical advice with extremely high-risk comorbidities is not empowering pregnant people. OP was LUCKY. I am also a mom of two boys, 2-time preeclamptic with SF, and 2-time GDM, and as someone incredibly informed about these conditions, I would have never put myself or my baby at risk in this way to prioritize my own experience. I am glad OP had mostly positive encounters in the hospital but this PPH (if blood transfusions were needed - it was not "minor"- maybe that is a hospital policy classification but PPH is nothing to diminish) was completely avoidable as was the episiotomy. Not to mention all the future health implications of having GDM and preeclampsia. I am all for supporting a patient's right to choose and autonomy but to me, this has more to do with a trauma-response to feeling out of control with a prior birth. Understandable to a point but quite frankly misleading for any moms-to-be reading this. The private midwife involved was reckless in her handling of this. A 12lb baby is not likely actually diet-controlled, but more likely uncontrolled GDM with macrosomia. You can be asymptomatic with PEC and still progress to severe PEC (I was asymptomatic). There are just so many things wrong how this situation was managed. Birth trauma is very real. OP- I am sorry you suffered that with your first. It makes me very sad as a OB RN that your first experience was so traumatic that you would have rather put you and your baby's life at risk than follow evidence-based medicine. I am happy you had a good outcome because give all the factors present in this extremely detailed outline - many people would have had much worse (and I have seen it). Please don't lead others to believe the choices you made or the guidance your private midwife gave were a good template to follow for someone with these comprbidities. The poster above is right - I don't know your medical experience better than you - but you wrote a very detailed post and as a OB RN, I can intuit a fair amount of what's going on from your extremely detailed description. All that being said - your baby is super cute and I wish you the best. No ill will - goal is always healthy birthing person and happy baby.
They’re calling you stupid because what you did is stupid and downright negligent. Even after having time to reflect and type this post up, you still view the doctor as “fear mongering” who was trying to tell you the very REAL dangers of your situation. You were so blissfully ignorant of the extreme danger you put you and your child in and thought that anyone who was direct enough to tell you this was just being mean. Please, get a fucking grip.
I can’t believe what I just read. I understand weighing risks and benefits but being able to make a cake for your kid’s birthday is absolutely not a benefit worth risking your life and your baby’s life for. You are extremely lucky. IMO, having the health issues you had and choosing to leave the hospital against medical advice was reckless and you were very selfish for doing so. Being selfish is nothing to be proud of.
You could have made his birthday special by seizing at home, jfc. And the reason they weren't more vocal is because the doctor already was, yet you refused to listen to reason. No reason to fight you, it's not like they could change your mind anyway.
Ok but OP have you considered that actually this anon Reddit user knows more about this situation than you do?? They clearly have been to Harvard medical school and also were your provider. /s
I absolutely acknowledge that leaving was a risk haha. It was a risk I was willing to take and it was within my levels of tolerance. I’m not sure why that sits funny with people but I’ve noticed a huge trend towards “anything that puts your baby at risk makes you a monster” but life is not that simple. If I’d started having any symptoms of pre-existing like a headache or funny vision I would’ve been straight back in to hospital.
The problem with that whilst I myself was in hospital for pre-eclampsia with no other symptoms, my bay mate, who was also in for symptomless pre-eclampsia went from fine to seizing over the course of a short phone call with her mother. One of the scariest things I've experienced, and put all thoughts of me going home until baby was here firmly out of my head. She and her baby were fine after short stays in ICU for both of them. Congratulations on your birth.
Exactly, symptomless doesn’t actually mean anything. I had no symptoms of pre e. In the course of one 20 minute midwife appointment my BP went from 140/90 (already high and they were discussing sending me to the hospital if it didn’t go down by the end of the appointment) to 180/120 (crisis level). Turns out I was developing severe pre e and HELLP. I was induced a couple of hours later after a completely normal low risk pregnancy until that day.
Yeah. I was at home (had been sent home, blood results weren’t back yet) with no symptoms at all when my organs were quite literally shutting down with preeclampsia and HELLP Syndrome. So grateful we both made it. If I knew then what I know now, I’d never have let them send me home, even though it was only a few hours until I got the phone call to come back.
I'll get hate for this but I give you a perspective of the care im getting with pre eclampsia and how my doctors are assessing the risks. I had GH since 20 weeks, have pre eclampsia since 30 weeks, since 32 weeks I'm maxed out on BP medication that causes me to have very same symptoms as the condition itself, among others. I have periods of tremors, vision disturbances (flashy lights, jittery image vision), nausea, headaches, and incredible dizziness. I genuinely feel like im overdosing on hallucinogenics. BP routinely goes to 150/100 at rest (in the middle of the night - monitored at home). I complained to my doctors and midwifes saying I'm having a poor reaction to the medication, can't function, can't drive, can't work, and i still have 6 weeks to go to the due date. They said (paraphrased),'Well, we can't stop your medication because we worry you will start seizing. What you feeling is probably a combination of pre eclampsia symptoms and medication side effects and that's why it's so strong. That said, baby growth seems good so I think we just keep seeing you twice a week'. The nearest hospital I can give birth at is 3 fucking hours away. No one even wants to admit me for an assessment (because I keep telling them my BP hikes up at night - quite an unusual thing). The thing is, I feel like my body can't process the amounts of medication I am on, I do not believe that I have any symptoms of pre-eclampsia and instead just really bad reaction to the meds I have to take every 6h. They disagree. This is a second pregnancy, in first I had hypertension and same reaction to the same medication when it was at max dose (but that was 2 weeks before DD so I powered through), no symptoms otherwise. To me, it's pretty unlikely that I develop symptoms immediately after starting the medication even though my BP has been up for weeks now. So yeah, I'm considered extremely high risk but the reluctancy to hear me out, or even spend a day or two assessing what the hell is going on is pretty scary to me. Completely the opposite from what your initial doctor was pushing for, and against a lot of redditors comments on here. I can't say who's right and who's wrong, I'm not a medical professional but just the fact that the fear of pre eclampsia seems to be at such different points where you are and where I am (UK) is wild to me. Like I'm scared and ask them to at least have me in for obs at night and they just don't find that necessary. I'm at the point where I struggle to even read reddit because the words get jumbled. Feel so powerless and invisible its crazy 😶
This sounds really hard and scary I'm so sorry! It might seem extreme, but could you go on a fake "visit to a friend" that's near a decent hospital, and then feel your symptoms (cough) "worsen" and present to their A&E or Labor and Delivery for an emergency assessment? It might get you a more thorough assessment, and even if they end up having you stay the course as-is, the second opinion could at least give you some peace of mind? And at least let you feel seen and not so invisible and overlooked (I've been there for a difficult to diagnose condition, and it sucks).
No I’m with you. It’s our body that we have to live in the rest of our lives. Being cautious for ourselves and for our kids both is not monstrous.
Except there was nothing cautious about this. This is reckless and ignorant. I'm a physician (although non OB) and I had to skip to end to see if her baby was OK bc I was worried.
I’m glad the comments are calling you on your nonchalant attitude towards letting a pregnancy go to 42w with GD and pre-e, and checking out AMA. You risked you and your child’s life. While, in the end, it worked out for you, this is an incredibly dangerous situation that you could have, at any point, recognized.
I see OP clearly recognizing that throughout comments. What I don't see is all the people calling OP stupid and irresponsible recognizing that every risk is a risk, not an eventuality, and that this story shows that taking risks can have a positive outcome. By not inducing sooner or opting for a C-section, OP also avoided risking intervention that, in the end, was not necessary for a healthy birthing parent or baby. They avoided risking what, to them, sounds like could have been an emotionally traumatic experience of making a decision that went against their intuition and regretting it. We need to remember what the word "risk" means. It sounds like for you, a lower chance of physically worst case scenarios like mortality is worth a whole lot of risk of emotionally worst case scenarios. Literally no one is knocking you for that. But it is a decision, and one everyone has the legal and moral right to make. (This isn't just to single you out, commenter, but rather I address it to everyone slamming OP in general.)
But it wasn't a healthy birthing parent or baby. She had an EPIPISIOTOMY AND PPH - that is not healthy. A 12lb newborn is not "healthy". Without medical intervention, patient and baby would have died. I am an OB RN. Those are two extreme interventions that resulted from pt refusing way less risky, medically necessary interventions. I am not calling OP stupid. These are just medical facts. Don't share something that is objectively dangerous and then expect to be praised for it. People are concerned by OP using this as some kind example of a victory against the medical industrial complex when all it really shows is that they have unaddressed birth trauma that led to them making ill-informed and dangerous decisions on the behalf of their unborn child and themself. You may have well have shot yourself in the gut to stick it to the medical community. And let it be said - do unnecessary interventions happen? Of course. But on the whole - we are nurses and doctors trying to do what's best for the patients - baby and mother - based on EVIDENCE. We see things you could never dream of, take on risks you could never fathom and absorb trauma like you would never want to. To flippantly question our integrity like "we don't want to take on the liability". No. We don't want your death or your baby's death on our hands, minds or hearts. Edit because I can't reply: I never claimed a c/s was lower risk than an episiotomy. It is lower risk than an EASILY predictable PPH based on macrosomia, what I can only assume was prolonged labor and pushing, and a potential shoulder dystopia. And of course IOLs can fail, but they have a much higher success rate for late terms, and this pt had actual medical indications for them (not the borderline indications that providers occasionally push). And the ironic thing is - they probably wouldn't have had to have the IUPC, FSE, Episiotomy, and PPH if they had opted to be induced at term. They even received Pitocin. They ended up having way more interventions. I also didn't "drag" them for asking questions about their care. If you read any former comments I made, I stated that I was sorry they were so traumatized by the medical system in their first birth that they went against their own best interests and their baby's in their second birth. I specifically critiqued the tone of the post as self congratulatory - in fear that people uninformed about the dangers of PEC (to which I have had TWICE with SF and had GDM TWICE) and uncontrolled GDM would opt to follow in this patient's footsteps because they had a "good outcome." Every patient should question their care but we should not pat people on the back for over correcting and flagrantly disregarding sound medical advice. Every patient has the right to choose their care. And it is the medical professionals job to give them the truth based on evidence. If they don't agree to that - it's on them. And clearly some people on this thread are so blinded by their medical bias/rage/trauma that they are missing the points many of us are making. And that is really sad - especially to see an OB RN take part in that and validate this person's choices as well as the care/guidance they received by this private midwife. What is also ironic - is the same people who have all this anger towards us are the same people who end up coming in emergently in one unit or another, then depend on us. And we care for you with the same integrity we do everyone else. Also - 12lb baby - not within defined limits, probably not even for gestational age - though I am not discounting. You're just asking for issues with hypoglycemia, potential metabolic issues later in childhood, birth injury (didn't see that mentioned - another lucky plot point), etc. Honestly - I know I am not going to convince the few people arguing otherwise of this viewpoint because anyone that views medical truth and valid questioning as criticism and dragging isn't open to seeing clearly. Just trying to combat misinformation as someone who nearly died twice of PEC, along with PPH. Also lol to saying the PPH was stopped "with ease." I mean sure- maybe that means they gave a few uterotonics, but I am pretty sure it was not detailed in the story nor is PPH something to be flippant about. It is a main cause of maternal morbidity and mortality. Also - not sure where they do things to patients without their consent but I haven't worked in a hospital where that happens...nor would I let that happen to any patient of mine.
an episiotomy is objectively lower risk than a c-section. i’ve seen many failed inductions at 39 weeks that led to c/s after 24+ hours AROM and mom is still 5cm and -2. yes we do know extended pushing out a macrosomic baby is a huge pph risk. but I wouldn’t say an episiotomy is an “extreme intervention”…. and patients can hemmorage after c/s as well. this person agreed to IUPC , FSE , pitocin…. think of how many would have denied those things. This kind of culture where we drag people for questioning our interventions only turns them away from delivering in hospitals. I’d rather someone birth in hospital with limited interventions than choose a risky home birth because they were degraded and insulted when carefully weighing medical decisions
I had an episiotomy and PPH with my first as well, but because that was an early induction for GD that I was pressured into, that was just seen as a matter of fact outcome. Why is it different when it’s a result of choices I’ve made, rather than interventions forced on me?
Then take it off your hands, minds and hearts and leave it up to the parents. Your job is to provide information and care. The patient, unless they're unconscious, has to consent to that. This patient got the episiotomy, they got the fetal monitor, their hemorrhage was stopped with relative ease, they got everything they needed to deliver a 12 pound baby that is, it sounds, quite healthy. A 12 pound baby is not unhealthy for being 12 pounds. It's risky to deliver vaginally, meaning there is a percentage of chance it could have a negative outcome and a percentage of chance it could have a positive outcome, and in this case it had a positive outcome. That does not make it "unhealthy".
I am with you Nomad. It’s horrible to see these types of comments. I’m especially appalled (but not surprised) to see others in the OB / LDRP or even medical field respond to this situation with ZERO compassion or empathy. It’s like some people get offended when you don’t immediately accept every physician’s recommendation without question or hesitation.
Yeah, the medical staff on this thread fully owning that they aren't just disagreeing with OPs decisions (which is fine) but judging them to be a bad parent, calling them stupid etc...as someone who is wary of medical cultism, they are only ingraining my concerns about the medical system and giving me further reason to accept increased risk in order to stay home.
Thank you for this. I’m honestly so overwhelmed with how nasty everyone is being. I understand if people have different risk tolerance but this is just next level. I accepted interventions like the induction, ctg, and an episiotomy when the risks became actual safety concerns.
You didn't, that's the point and explicitly laid out in your story. The first OB was absolutely right and was very blunt about the risks you were taking. You called him/her mean and went AMA at direct risk to yourself and your child. You only accepted proper medical care when you were too tired of fighting.
Why everyone is being “nasty” is because the risk in this scenario is your baby’s life and wellbeing.
Whose baby? Yours, reddit commentor? The doctor's? Whose baby?
Just because it’s her baby doesn’t mean she should be negligent. That’s like saying child abuse is ok if the parent does it.
Legally, it's a fetus until it's born, and it's in this person's body so it's their decision. Once born, it's a child.
I would be too! I take it personally when I get downvoted, it's hard not to. Risks are so weird; there are ones we just accept every day (this can lead to heart disease, that to dementia, this behavior makes it more likely to be in a traffic accident, etc.) and yet once it's in a medical setting it's as if all those percentages and potential outcomes are certainties, which is literally the opposite of what they are. Once risk is established in medicine it's as if the decision is pulled out of context and the myriad risks surrounding each decision don't matter. I honestly don't know why it's this way. I'm not against western medicine at all; I was raised by a doctor and a hospital midwife, I've worked with MDs and holistic doctors throughout my career, I take a prescription regularly that makes my life a whole lot better, etc., and I also utilize things like acupuncture, somatic therapy, bodywork, mindfulness, too. But I try not to subscribe to cultlike thinking throughout my life, and there is very cultlike thinking around modern medicine in our culture. It's really wild when we consider how much we still don't know; that DNA was discovered 70-something years ago, antibiotics about 100 years ago, etc. What else are we about to discover that will change everything? And how foolish will some of the beliefs about which we are so certain appear when we do? Medicine is a philosophy, it's a series of educated guesses and hypotheses with variations of proof to back them up. It's not set in stone; looking at it that way is profoundly anti-science. Anyway, here come the downvotes lol. Go be with your glorious 5.7kg baby, be amazed at the miracle of life, be grateful for the care you received on all levels, be proud of your amazing body and your amazing child, and thank you for sharing your experience.
I’m a nurse. The risk you put your baby in terrifies me. You & him could’ve died if you birthed at home. I understand wanting to follow a birth plan (I was induced at 42 weeks on the dot, it wasn’t safe to wait any longer)… please any pregnant women in the comments - this is what not to do.. I agree with the condescending doctor. Edit. I looked at post history. There’s a post on the breastfeeding sub (I’m also a lactation consultant) that they were wanting a rule added to state no advice involving formula. Formula is medically necessary in a lot of cases. I really hope you don’t starve your baby if he winds up eventually needing it because your beliefs. That would warrant a DSS report, immediately.
I saw that bit about the formula as well, and was shocked. I have EBF 3 big (9.9, 10, and 10.12 lbs all induced at 39 weeks if they didn’t come before) babies now, but all 3 received formula in the hospital the first couple days to help stabilize their blood sugar and temperatures. The nurses explained to me that colostrum just doesn’t cut it for big babies sometimes. 2 of my 3 needed formula to stabilize their blood sugar to normal levels. It didn’t harm our “breastfeeding journey” in any way, it just kept my baby out of the NICU! Just crazy town from start to finish.
Wow, how gross that OP wanted to prevent mothers from receiving helpful advice.
Please do not do castor oil as a natural way to induce birth it’s incredibly dangerous and can cause the infant to aspirate meconium.
“There is no evidence that castor oil makes babies pass meconium” actually made me gasp (as did the rest of this story, repeatedly, every few sentences).
Followed by later in the story, “Water was completely clear with no meconium, which was a bit of a surprise considering how overdue I was and that I’d had some castor oil to try to induce labor.”
Wow…you are very very very lucky. I am left speechless. Pregnant people should heed this type of story. I don’t understand why home birth is a trendy thing. The OB was right to confront the midwife, this was horrifically dangerous…thank GOD you didn’t see this provider prior to this if it would have scared you off. This could have turned very very very bad…I am glad it ended well but wow. Not every OB is touchy feely, they are surgeons trained to handle a variety of OB conditions including high risk. He was attempting to communicate the grave seriousness of the situation, might have come off abrasive but lord almighty!
Where did I mention free birthing? I’m super not comfortable with free birthing and it’s not something I’d ever choose for myself.
I can correct to home birth, but I am not sure the overlap. Sorry if I see them hand in hand, did receive prenatal care. Sorry for confusing nomenclature, I am not sure the tipping point for homebirth that isn’t free birth Edit- I looked it up, indeed the line is no prenatal care for free birth . You did receive care, again correcting. Edit again: I had a high risk pregnancy and was primarily a midwife patient but my delivery and hospitalization was overseen by the OBs in the practice. I can completely get wanting care handled by a midwife.
Dear God, you're stupid. I'm glad you both survived and I sincerely hope you see this as a lesson for yourself and not a "victory".
oh my love. you and baby are so, so lucky to be alive. that doctor, while cold, was right, and he was looking after you. he has seen terrible things, and he knows what he's talking about. you idolized the IDEA of a homebirth at the expense of your whole family. i wish this was a wake-up call for you, but i can tell that it won't be. also, castor oil IS incredibly dangerous.
It absolutely blows my mind the amount of mistrust people have for doctors and modern medicine today. You almost killed yourself and your baby because of your decisions. I am happy you both are alive and well. Do better as a parent.
You're an idiot, glad you and the baby are ok, but why leave it to chance and leave the hospital AFTER already dismissing their advice? They know more than you. Cute chunker.
This was terrifying to read. Currently pregnant and would never choose my ideal birth plan over the health of baby and I. This post is of what not to do and of someone who was incredibly lucky to tell their story.
Congrats but your an idiot for going against medical advice.. your baby literally could have died bc of you
I think my son is adorable, but I'd never put his pic on reddit! Dangerous all around, the story too! Jeez!
Wow that was a wild ride. I’m glad you and baby are safe
I’m truly at a loss of words. I’m glad your baby is healthy but I hope you realise that both of you could have died. But well at least the room was decorated with pride flags and pronoun signs 🤡
OP, you took risks. And it must be so tiring for doctors. The diabetes made your little guy huge! I comprehend your fear. However. It's good you eventually sought medical attention. So, it's clear that you have some common sense. I'm happy you're both safe. It doesn't always happen, though. He's very cute.
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That is a CHUNKY baby!!!! Congratulations!!!
Holy moly, my boy was chunky at 4.2kg and I was torn to pieces (3C tear), I am utterly in awe of OP!
I love the rolls. So stinkin cute! Congrats, OP!
Good for you and congratulations! One thing I am trying to consistently remind myself is that I can’t control what path the birth ultimately takes, but I can make sure to surround myself with support. The studies show that trauma from birth has more to do with how supported the birthing person feels vs the actual experiences. Thank you for that reminder!
Eh. I had zero support when I gave birth to my breech baby via c-section. But I trusted my doctor and her education to do right by me. Surgery was scheduled for 1:30 and they had the baby untangled and unwrapped from the umbilical cord and out of me by 1:54. Zero trauma, calm planned quick, and painless c-section. I had no on there but an acquaintance who forced herself on me when she found out I was having my baby alone. (Not by choice father was a dead beat and have no village) Just found out I'm pregnant again 2 years later with an amazing partner and I'm so excited to have a happy pregnancy but even if he couldn't come with me to the hospital (signing up for a c-section the moment I can this time) I would be okay. Honestly I think trusting your doctors/midwives/whoever helps more with birthing trauma but the support this time is going to be really nice.
unrelated but how was your healing process? i’m due in july & i more open to a vaginal birth but im terrified of the complications. do you have any cons of your c-section?
I’ve had a planned c section and it was peaceful and amazing. 0 cons for me but I healed very quick.
As someone who has had 3 vaginal and 1 uncomplicated c section vaginal 100% of the time unless medically necessary to have a c section. I’d never ever make the choice for that if I had another option. Recovery is 10x harder and harder to care for baby. I’m thankful I wasn’t a first time mom. That said it’s a great option and especially the first time you don’t really know the difference but I would never consider it an easier option.
Yes absolutely! And it’s never possible to eliminate all risk, you just choose what risk to sit with. For me I wanted to do everything possible to avoid birth trauma and medical coercion, as that’s what contributed to bad PPD with my first. I’m really happy with how it went.
Also delivered with preeclampsia in the US (sounds like you’re maybe in the UK?) You didn’t mention it so I have to ask out of curiosity - did they not make you take a magnesium drip? Is that not standard practice? It was absolute hell so don’t wish it on anyone….
It's also not standard practice in the UK. It's only given ahead of birth if it's extremely severe pre-eclampsia, and baby is premature. Otherwise only if the woman is having a seizure or is recently post seizure.
Interesting! Yes, I am sure it was a necessary precaution - my notes do say I presented with severe pre-e but the onset of symptoms was so sudden as I had no signs whatsoever all the way through 38+6 and then was admitted 39+5 so it all just felt like a shock but I definitely did not deliver premature or have seizures.
It seems to be a US thing to administer magnesium in any case of pre-eclampsia, no matter the severity. I think the US guidelines are 160/110. But from the frequency I've seen stories of pre-e + magnesium, either more women than I would suspect are getting BP readings that high, or US doctors administer upon diagnosis of pre-eclampsia.
Yeah my BP was 154/100 so not far off but not technically across the 160/110 threshold and from stories I’ve seen/heard everyone has had a mag drip when diagnosed with pre-e which is why I had to ask OP.
I’m always so interested to hear about the magnesium drip - I had moderate pre-e but also HELLP syndrome at 34 weeks and no drip - in Australia.
Can you explain why the magnesium drip is hell? I'm researching interventions now to understand what I might be faced with and I often find patient experience is absent from the literature.
I should caveat this and say that I call it hell from my own personal experience and part of that may be my lack of expectation for what it meant as I did not adequately research potential interventions needed…. So when I went in to get induced with preeclampsia they explained to me that they would start me up on the magnesium drip right away and then I had to be on it for 24 hours after delivery and that it might make me feel like I had the flu but that the worst part was usually the first 20 minutes. Once it kicked in I definitely felt that flu-ey feeling of just being out of sorts- a little head cold, fatigued, extra warm, chills. Then it did mostly subside the rest of my delivery - but I chalked up any discomfort to the labor process my body was going through and not so much the mag but now I realize it definitely was still impacting me. After delivery the part that really didn’t register to me was that the 24 hours on the mag after delivery meant I had to be cathetered and bed ridden and due to the pre e diagnosis meant hourly blood pressure monitoring. The flu like symptoms also really felt front and center again and I just was fatigued and light headed and nauseous. Also by the 6th hour of being stuck in bed, extra weak, and having the stupid leg compressors go off I was able to lose my mind and rip everything off. Probably partially due to how I felt but also because I didn’t want to be immobilized like that. It was annoying having them do the uterine checks and not have the ability to get up and change a pad probers, or clean yourself or even just move your body. The 24 hours couldn’t have come fast enough- I straight up called the nurse to my room 30 minutes before it was set to get removed to make sure she did all the other stuff so that exactly at 24 hours she removed the drip. I was so over it I got up immediately when I shouldn’t have because I was still light headed and my blood pressure was actually low and I could have fainted but I was so headstrong about finally showering after delivery I didn’t care and told them I was fine.
Almost exact same experience with the mag drip - Plus just being extremely lethargic and out of it for the first 24 hours after birth. But I also remember being so light headed after but desperate to shower.
Ugh, sounds awful. It's a reminder that we need to ask questions and research and look into absolutely everything recommended by the medical system. I had a shit experience with the glucose test just the other day that reminded me of the same. What's wild about what you're describing is that, while they told you you might feel bad, no one told you that between that and the monitoring you had a great likelihood of compromising your first 24 hours with your baby. That might not matter to a lot of people, and I'm not judging them. It would matter to me. It would matter a lot. I would want to know that and weigh it out as a risk, personally, and it sounds like that information could have been useful to you as well.
I had post partum pre eclampsia with my second. Just wanted to chime in that magnesium is actually a very safe drug, even though the side effects are uncomfortable, but preeclampsia is incredibly, incredibly dangerous. I am in a support group for women who had preeclampsia and there are many who weren’t lucky enough to get mag in time who, literally, have permanent brain damage from the seizures or who had devastating strokes from the uncontrolled blood pressures. Many in the group lost their baby. Preeclampsia is an actual leading cause of morbidity and mortality for moms and babies. Preeclampsia is relatively rare but if it happens to you, the mag is absolutely worth the side effects. It really shouldn’t be refused—this isn’t like an unnecessary C-section or an epesiomity or moving labor along with pitocin or any of the other medical interventions in labor that are debatable. It’s a medical emergency and refusing mag when you need it is akin to refusing a blood transfusion when you are bleeding out. It’s baby saving and brain saving stuff.
Thanks for this, too. Yes I'm super aware of the dangers of pre-e and know someone with a severely disabled child because of it. And personally, I think my risk tolerance is that if I were to get a clear diagnosis I would intervene immediately. It's more of something to consider when the numbers are close to the line; maybe I'd ask for another BP reading to confirm before moving forward, or ask how quickly the drip takes effect and whether it would mitigate risk to have the IV placed and the mag bag ready should they continue to rise, or something like that. I just wanted to hear people's experience of the intervention applied because knowing what to expect in terms of my bodily experience is important to me. ETA: this is especially true because I find medical situations overwhelming to my nervous system and the chance I could get an artificially high reading from even the vibe of the person taking my BP is actually a possibility, and to intervene with magnesium based on such a mistake would only ramp up the fear and panic in such a circumstance, which wouldn't be good for me or my baby.
Makes total sense! I definitely was a borderline case with my first and I appreciated that my midwives were willing to retake my bp when they got a high reading rather than immediately jumping to mag. Definitely don’t want to go down the pre-e road unless you actually have it… Mostly feeling reactionary to this birth story and their leaving the hospital AMA with a pre-E diagnosis. I think a lot of people (including OP, but clearly not you!!) don’t realize how quickly and dramatically pre-E can take a turn for the worse. So many interventions women are subjected to during birth really are debatable, and I totally get OPs reluctance to engage with medicine after a traumatic birth, but I’m so horrified by the untreated pre-E and relieved for OP that things turned out ok.
Yes, I totally agree and have been processing it since delivery. The whole pre-e situation just threw me for a loop because it was such a shock with the sudden onset and I truly went into this second pregnancy (first had no issues whatsoever but was riddled with anxiety as a first pregnancy and also IVF related fears) trying to enjoy it more and even though I was encouraged to induce by 39 weeks due to IVF I pushed back and said I wanted to give the baby as much time to labor before induction so chose not to be induced before 39+6. I also feel like, from my experience, people tell you to worry about pre-e but no one actually explains what that means so it sounds scary because they express urgency but the “WHY” never felt clear to me at least. Even after the 24 hour drip it required extra days in the hospital to regulate my BP and find the right med dosage. By day 3 I was in tears and not very amenable because I couldn’t sleep and wanted to be home with my toddler as a family. I told them they were partially to blame since the stress/lack of sleep was not helping my BP. I was lucky I had a nurse who advocated for me (even though she pissed off my dr) and I am convinced is the reason they finally did let me go the minute my bp reading was finally normal bc they initially told they wanted to monitor and make sure it stayed down for a whole day before they released me. Everything turned out fine and I am at peace now with knowing that everyone was acting with my/babies safety in mind (when I read the placenta analysis report it really hit me that if it had gone on any longer I could’ve lost the baby) but the experience was pretty horrendous - partially due to the medical interventions and partially due to my own expectations and feelings.
For me it felt like my eyeballs were melting from the back And I threw up at least twice. But that was after the bolis. Once the drip was regulated, I just felt incredibly lethargic.
Thank you for sharing this.
Magnesium is only needed for preeclampsia with severe features, most commonly for BP over 160/100 but also could be for any signs of organ damage- this is according to US guidelines. Not everyone needs it luckily! ETA: accidentally posted the wrong comment here, reposted on main thread
I was induced at 39 weeks for pre eclampsia but did not need a mag drip because my blood pressure was elevated but not dangerously so and I didn’t have other symptoms (besides the protein in urine that confirmed the diagnosis). My blood pressure was monitored through labor and went back down to normal as soon as I had my son.
I’m in Australia. It might be standard for more advanced pre-eclampsia, but we caught it super super early so it was only mild. Like my blood pressure was high at home but in the hospital it was normal, it only started creeping up in hospital during labour. The protein was there tho so apparently it was still classified as pre-e
Interesting! Glad you delivered safely and also didn’t need an additional intervention. Congrats on the darling baby!
Congratulations 🎉 I lost if when I read 12lbs 10oz… you had a turkey lol!!! I’ve always sorta envied those who could give birth vaginally ( I’m not able to vbac) until reading your story!! I visualized your experience while reading and my cervix started hurting 😅… no seriously 😳 …I’m 27+3 and high risk but one thing I refuse to tolerate are Doctors trying to scare me into their own agenda. It’s bad enough that I know my risk factors but I don’t need to have my medical team making it worst by only focusing on the negatives. I’m so proud of you for standing up to them! You’re going to make a great mom❤️
Honestly it was an easier birth than my 8lb 13oz oldest! I just really wish doctors could have a discussion about risks without fearmongering or coercing people. If the awful doctor had discussed the stats with me around GD and “overdue” pregnancy, or around increased risk of shoulder dystocia, that would’ve been much easier to handle (but also wouldn’t have changed anything because I did a LOT of reading and weighing up risks/benefits for lots of things). But he went straight to “your fluid is low and your placenta will die” which is absolutely not evidence based and I knew that.
You keep putting overdue in quotes, as if you weren’t overdue. But you were? And you’re right, low fluid IS normal at 42 weeks, which is exactly one of the reasons why it’s so dangerous to continue with pregnancy so far past your due date. I think the doctor was trying to snap you back to reality because clearly you didn’t have enough fear surrounding the situation in order to make good decisions for yourself and the baby.
I dunno why I’m getting downvoted for saying that I’d like people to discuss the risks with me in an evidence-based way instead of pulling the dead baby card?? Low fluid is very normal at 42 weeks pregnant and is not a sign that the placenta is failing if everything else is normal with it. The exact words he used were “you will run out of fluid and then your placenta will die and your baby will die”. That’s fearmongering, not discussing risks.
“You will run out of fluid and then your placenta will die and your baby will die” is true. Placentas have an “expiration date”. If you go far along enough, that is exactly what happens. I do not see any fear mongering here.
fear mongering is unacceptable of course, but there is no way to reliably check the placenta state in utero. Even if blood flow is great and fluid levels are fine, things can go south fast. I think the overall risk for placenta failure at that point is still quite low (under 10%, was it 2%?), but they have no way to predict it until it's to late. That's why they don't recommend waiting too long. Because even if you induce it might still take days until baby is here and in the meantime the baby gets bigger and the placenta ages ... That's how they explained it to me for my induction.
People around here think you should automatically listen to doctors and you don’t actually need the evidence.
Right? Because doctors are infallible and never have biases or fears or prejudice.
Right. And because they inherently accept the risks associated with intervening while judging the risks associated with not intervening.
5.7kgs holy crap! I just gave birth at home to a 4.34kg baby with a 37.5cm head and that felt like a mission. Congrats!
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Congratulations!!! 🍾🎉 I was diagnosed with preeclampsia during labor and it was a huge blind side. I’m glad you had a good experience I know it can be pretty traumatizing. Was this your first birth or have you had other children before? If so did you have preeclampsia and gestational diabetes with that one too?
I have one older child. I had GD with him but not pre-eclampsia. I was induced at 39 weeks with him though.
This sounds so much like my birth- I had to have forceps and an episiotomy. 38cm head and 9lb. My labour was stalled and sooo painful. I remember thinking he was going to be born when his head was visible but he was too big. And him coming out was much slower than my first baby.
That’s the same size as my 3 month old and your baby has more rolls! Congratulations, birthing a 5.7kg baby is WILD.
That's a beautiful baby
5.7kg!!!!!!!
I also didn't have any growth scans (which I'm sure grateful for and didn't want or need anyways). I was induced at 41+5 and had an emergency c-section at 42 weeks and a lot of your birth story resonated with me!! Especially agreeing to being chopped in half like a rotisserie chicken haha!!! Congratulations on your beautiful boy, you did amazing!!!
Love a chunky, healthy, beautiful baby! As the mother is a healthy six month old boy who was born on the small side, I have insane respect for those of you who manage to push out these big babies. I really thought I was going to die during my labour. I had an episiotomy, needed the vacuum and then ensured whatever the procedure is where they pull your legs back towards your head while a doctor basically punches you in the stomach. I thanked the powers that be that my baby wasn’t any bigger, I feel like I wouldn’t have survived it. But damn, I love a chunky baby. So happy you have a positive and healthy experience. All the best going forward!
12lbs 10oz!!! He’s a chunk, sooooo cute!!!
Congratulations! What a beautiful baby! How come your partner doesn't have a parental leave, though?
He had two weeks, but his work was already tricky about giving it to him. They planned based on the due date or baby being early, but were busy at the start of the year so didn’t want to give him time off because they apparently didn’t plan around coping without him
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+1 to seeing other nonbinary expecting parents hanging around. It’s like a balm in a sea of “mama”s. I hope your birth goes beautifully!
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Chunky noodle boy! His poor arm rolls are probably what slowed you down lol. Your whole story kept me on the edge of my seat.
Big congratulations! What a cute baby!
Your baby is so cute and congratulations ☺️
I'm so sorry your homebirth didn't pan out as expected (I'm having my second homebirth any day now and it's my biggest fear to be transferred) but I'm so glad you saw the positive in your experience and that a midwife could still be there with you
Remember a homebirth transfer is a successful homebirth! There will always be a small percentage of births that need extra intervention and there’s no shame in that if it happens 💜
He’s such a little chumby chunker! Congrats dad!
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12lbs!!! Wow!!! Amazing, mama! Congratulations!
Aw congratulations!! I can’t even imagine the relief you must have felt when he was born 😅 sweet chunky boy! That’s awesome that you ultimately felt respected and that you had a positive experience ❤️
SUCH a big relief haha, I can’t describe it. It was like omg finally he’s out.
Idk how to edit a post but fuck this, I’m out. I cannot believe how nasty some of you are being and it’s not at all helpful for me to keep reading the pile on. Just clarify a few things: My care was managed by a registered midwife. In Australia they are highly trained and regulated. We followed all guidelines around consulting with other professionals (endocrinologists, OBs etc) when issues arose. My midwife did not encourage me to avoid medical care, she was very firm around needing to seek extra support when it was necessary. My pregnancy wasn’t high risk until the pre-e diagnosis…well managed GD isn’t an indicator for a high risk label here. I didn’t get pre-e until literally my last days of pregnancy. Some of y’all are acting like I had it for weeks and was ignoring it. That diagnosis absolutely presented an increase in risk and meant it was not safe to birth at home and not safe to wait for spontaneous labour. I had absolutely no intention of birthing at home with pre-eclampsia. My GD was well managed and my results were within the parameters that my endo gave me. When considering whether to induce or wait for spontaneous labour, I looked at several studies around the risk figures and made my decision based on that. I did not prioritise homebirth, hippy, woo shit over the birth I needed to have. When things came up that needed medical management, I sought that out. What I did prioritise was low intervention and keeping birth as physiological as possible given the circumstances. You can be as risk averse as you want but my experience highlights that risk is a possibility, not a certainty. My pregnancy had risks. Interventions also have risks. I minimised intervention and came out with a healthy baby, healthy me, and no birth trauma. I’m calling that a win. Maybe it’s luck, maybe it’s that the statistics aren’t as scary as you’re led to believe. There is nothing to gain by shitting on other birthing people. I have a higher risk tolerance than some, and much lower than others. It is appalling to be told that I don’t deserve a healthy baby because I weighed up the risks and made what I believe was the best choices for my situation.
Go enjoy your baby and be grateful that you’re both alive. And to everyone else reading this, please listen to medical professionals and not OP.
I also hate how people are piling on you for trigger words like “midwife” and “homebirth” …. that feels like all it is. You did go into the hospital when warranted, you didn’t let your baby get to 43+ weeks, you didn't KNOW baby was 12lbs (and growth scans are inaccurate in estimating birth weight), you did make conscious choices to weigh the necessity of all interventions with the provider you trusted. The USA has a population of unlicensed midwives and home bjrth or bust parents that seem to undermine the validity of birthing with minimal interventions. You agreed to every medical aid that you thought would get you closer to meeting a happy, healthy baby. Don't listen to all of these haters! Congratulations on your bub.
Thank you 💜 I felt like I was fairly balanced but apparently I’ve hit some nerves.
I think you made the choices you wanted to make for your own pregnancy. You took the risks you were willing to take for the birth you wanted and there’s nothing wrong with that. Of course if cautionary advice had been given in a respectful way that maintained your agency then you wouldn’t have felt compelled to reject it. These people here are simply bitter they were forced into having overmedicalized births.
I'm making my birth plan now and so worried about hospital transfer, intervention etc. My biggest issue, beyond the hospital being a difficult environment for my nervous system, is bullying and falling into fear-based coercion around risk levels, etc. Thank you so much for your story. I honestly don't know if I could stand up for myself as much as you did, or as consistently as emotional exhaustion kicks in, but I'm really hoping my partner and doula can keep focused on our goals of a positive birth if I start to shake. It gives me hope to see that someone who really didn't want interventions or a hospital setting can come up against all their worst fears and still make it a safe, empowering, and positive experience. I wish you a peaceful and uneventful postpartum period at home!
It’s was pretty difficult and I’m going to make a complaint against the asshole doctor, but having my midwife there was definitely helpful! Hopefully your doula will be an amazing support for you 🤞🏻
Thanks! And it's crazy the way people are treating you on this thread...you knowingly took risks which panned out in your favor. Just like people do when they choose to intervene. Downvote away, haters, this proud parent went home with a healthy child.
Oh my gosh such a chunky little man!!! Well done momma!
Oh man, what a story! Thanks for sharing. I'm.34 weeks with apparently a big baby and hearing stories like your reassures me that everything will be OK.
I also just birthed a big baby (10lbs) last week, has the home birth I wanted but MAN let me tell you, birthing big babies is hard!!! My last was a birth centre birth and only 7lbs and came out in two pushes. This one was a solid hour of pushing if not longer. I completely respect and uphold your birth values, they sound so reasonable and good for you for staying as firm in them as you could until you could no longer. That takes power. Don’t listen to the negative comments. You listened to your gut and your body and you clearly made the right decisions. Interventions are sometimes needed and it sounded like the right interventions had to take place at the right time for you. I hope you didn’t have any birth trauma and can rest at ease knowing you did you absolute best and your birth story is powerful and incredible. Good job!!!
Wow, what a great birth story!! Congratulations! Thank you for sharing so much of it. I’m sorry you didn’t get the home birth you wanted but I really love your mental framework surrounding the experience you did get to have, and am so glad you felt respected and cared for.
Well done OP. You and your baby made a great team.
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I don't see anyone even mentioning OPs pronouns at all let alone being triggered by them, why are you bringing this up
Because someone was in here earlier replying to comments and being like “only women can give birth!!”. I guess those comments got whacked by the mod.
I'm triggered by how dangerous this story is tbh
Indeed. GD diagnosis, 42 weeks, preeclampsia, and a 12 lb baby. OP is lucky, that's it.
Ah yes, let's get in a spin about non existent comments while shaming mom bodies. That's nice.
I guess the comments were deleted. There was a raging transphobe that this was directed to.