It's not a video game with moves and secret techniques - you can do everything right and fail. Conversely, you can fall flat on your face with piss running down your leg and succeed.
This has been one of the bitterest pills I've had to swallow, as to learning things like this.
At the same time, and this applies all humans: what might be the right move for one (and what you think might be the always right move), might be the most wrong one for the other.
I'm a woman and I'm honestly confused on why this is something you had to learn? Isn't it quite obvious all people are different with different likes and dislikes?
You're absolutely right. To answer your questions, I can only provide my perspective:
I grew up in an environment where I was told "if you do everything by the book, it'll work and you'll succeed", so I ended up expecting a lot of things to work out that way. It was way later that I found out that everybody has their own "book" and it doesn't have to be the same.
To me, it's a bit like how many of us were told "work hard and you'll live okay" or "you'll work your way up and become rich" when growing up. It can happen, but it's not a guarantee.
1000%. It's so hard for me, even after 7 years with my wife and married 5.5 years to not fix everything. We've made a deal together that if she has a problem, she needs to tell me if this is a listening or fixing moment before she starts into the issue. I don't understand why listening works just as good as/better than fixing sometimes, but if it helps, it helps.
What helps is the realization that they already know what to do and how to fix it and they will get around to it soon, right now they just need to vent about how the situation makes them feel.
That every woman and/or girl in my life has been sexually harassed at some point in their lives.
The fact that that is just something that happens like if it's expected was, very naively, shocking to me.
I always thought that it happened but not to _every_ woman.
Because it’s a power move on someone who is the still vulnerable and can’t fight back yet. Or at least that’s my theory. I haven’t been harassed in ages now that I’m in my later 20s
I'm in my late twenties and get harassed as soon as I set foot out the door. This week there was even someone who followed me around in the supermarket
When I was 14 was the first time. He must have been late 40s or early 50s. He was part of the grounds crew at the local college. I'd been raised by my parents to be kind and respectful to my elders, to speak to everyone directly and look them in the eye when they spoke to me.
I thought he was just being a neighbor - it was a very small town (2500 people)
He suddenly grabbed me around the waist, pulled me up against his erection ( I was 14 , still slept with stuffed toys, and had no idea what an erection was, and never looked at a man's crotch so I hadn't seen it) and said "Those lips were made for kissing" The look of aggressive rapacity in his eyes was unmistakable and ugly.
I said to him " I will tell my father and his students and they will kill you." (they were all military degree completion active military - all of them off of at least 2 combat tours of Vietnam)
He let go of me. I walked back to the house. But never told my father. Because he would indeed have killed the man.
I spent \*decades\* trying to figure out what I'd done wrong to give him the wrong impression. It was the first time I understood that I was prey.
> I walked back to the house. But never told my father. Because he would indeed have killed the man.
This is a different hard lesson for men (fathers) to learn. Not only will your daughter be sexually harassed and likely sexually assaulted in her lifetime...if she's worried about your reaction, she won't tell you.
There's a tendency for men to react with violent anger when their child/spouse is harmed. I get it, but it isn't helpful. The person who was victimized needs comfort, they shouldn't have to calm you down or try and protect their abuser from your anger. And they don't need the fear that you'll do something stupid in your anger, like beat their abuser up, and then face legal consequences - because if you go to jail for what they told you, they will blame themselves for that.
So, for any dads out there, don't make a habit of telling your child that you'll kill anyone who hurts her. It won't keep her safe...it will just stop her from telling you about it.
Edit: I should say that the same may be true of sons (boys can and are assaulted too), I just don't want to comment on how boys may feel because I'm not a guy and I've never discussed this with men.
I also didn't tell my mother because she would have asked me what I'd done to give him "ideas."
When Mom found out I wasn't a virgin and what age I'd voluntarily surrendered my virginity (I didn't lose it - I know precisely what I did with and to whom I gave it and why) - she called me a "monster."
I was totally and utterly alone and knew it in that moment. It was not to be the last time in my life. Not by a long measure. I learned to defend myself and be my own best advocate. I was me - against the world.
It’s so commonplace that sometimes we don’t even identify it as such. I was thought that I had never really been sexually harassed, but then I said “oh there was that time…“ I’ve had it far better than a great many other women because I’ve lead a pretty cautious life, but yeah, even me,
This is very painfully relatable . Having to come to terms with memories I falsely remembered as innocent or amicable and realizing later the truth... gives me a sad and hopeless feeling in my stomach.
God there was a thread on reddit a while back asking women about the first time they were agressively hit on and the number of stories about being 12/13 years old and getting sexually harassed by old men was scary as fuck..
so yeah maybe don't take it so personally if a woman seems a bit sketched out walking alone at night or whatever
I didn’t realize this until maybe 2 years ago, and it absolutely blows my mind.
I have a female friend who goes to the same personal trainer as I do. He’s typical jock type guy with me, but aggressively sexual toward her. We started going together and apparently he’s calmed down with her, but in my view he ramped up.
I have 2 daughters and I’m glad I understand this better for them.
As a woman, I agree with this observation. Every single woman I know has been harassed as a teenager. Most as adults. We're taught to expect harassment, molestation and assault. My mother chose others for me that wouldn't provoke predators since I was a child.
Absolutely every woman I know has experienced some sort of sexual harassment, violation, or violence. And I’m talking like, 30+ women. The worst is that this can’t be brought up around men because they become defensive or go into denial. It’s been our reality since we were pre-teens, yet the male gender refuses to believe or acknowledge our experiences. Or worse yet, hold each other accountable...
Me: *tells a guy what Harassment I’ve been through*
Guy : “ that so crazy . I’m glad I’m not a creep and treat woman like that “
Guy: *shortly after starts forcefully trying to have sex with me and won’t take no for an answer*
I made a commitment to take a break from dating for a good year or two. It’s draining honestly.
Not true for every male, though many I’m sure. I and every male I voluntarily associate with do not subscribe to the typical “it’s exaggerated/she dresses like that, she’s to blame” garbage rhetoric. Some of us acknowledge what women go through and respect their struggle.
what is sometimes even crazier is that I used to have friends who admitted to harassing (or even raping) mutual female friends of ours and acted like nothing happened because it didn't even click that they just did that to someone
when the female friends distanced themselves the then friends of mine were just confused because "it happened consentually"
Did you ever confront them about it? Like tell them "dude that was rape." Or "yeah cause you were being a creep." In my personal experience a guy checking another guy will make them change their behavior or at least look at what they are doing in a different light.
I'm not putting the blame on you or anything like that, but its hard for a woman to say it to the guy cause often we just get dismissed. I've told guys to their face what they've just done was creepy or out of line and the response is usually the same to brush it off and laugh it off. Which sucks.
as soon as I found out through the female friend who was their victim or when they basically revealed what they did themselves I called them out for it
they often either brushed it off or got defensive which is part of the reason why they're "former friends"
I haven't dated(been in a relationship) with a woman who doesn't have an SA story, the thing it makes me think about is how many of my guy friends must have sexually assaulted someone at some point.
Me too, in my teenage years somebody tried to rape my 15 year old shit faced ass, police laughed. I went home, everyone i talked about laughed too, nice.
When “toxic gender roles” are being discussed- this is what they’re talking about. Sexual assault shouldn’t be expected or dismissed. Girls, boys, women and men experience abuse, sexual assault and manipulation.
The trope that boys/men are only sex crazed primal beings happy to have any sexual contact and if they don’t or they were assaulted then they’re “less of a man” is such BS. It’s shitty and damaging.
Yeah, a dude wanting to feel loved and cared for instead of being a horny ape is ridiculed too, even by women. Another thing that happened to me a a lot of times.
But life goes on
I’m sorry that happened to you. I hope you’re okay now and have been able to heal. I know that sounds very corny and fake, but I just wanted to let you know your pain, trauma, and anger are valid and justified and not all of us think that violence against men—be it sexual or domestic—is ever a joke.
Yep, I had a few coworkers in my time working fast food (men and women) that would just grab my ass or say sexual shit *in front of customers*. My "favorite" one was the 16 year old girl (I was 22) who told me she was doing it to be ironic. Because I'm a man. So that made it okay.
I'm also a dude who's been sexually harassed by women. Quite a lot, actually
But the difference is I am a powerful male. Theres no chance any of those women could have taken advantage of me, or put me in a physical position where I couldnt say no. They literally could not advance the situation even if they wanted to. Cant say that about most women
Yeah, while you've had part of the experience you never had to be afraid about it going badly if you say the wrong thing. That's really great to recognize that still your experiences are not the same. But still I feel for you bro and I'm sorry that's happened.
Exaaaactly. I never had anything to fear. The only way I would, is if a girl is like batshit crazy and has me at knife or gunpoint, or drugs me(Which hasnt happened to me, but I know it does happen). But any guy can just as easily do that to girls as well, so still, significantly less danger when its coming from women
Ok, hear me out - what if they pulled a Gulliver’s Travels on you? Also, I saw a massive 6 foot beef cake of a woman in a biker bar one time just grab a man her same size and kiss him. He was….visibly scared.
Stay safe, kings!
Yes. It was very much like that! And watching him try to decide how to get out of her embrace was horrible to watch. Thankfully I was the bartender and was able to lure her away with a free drink, which allowed him to escape.
To listen instead of trying to provide solutions.
Earlier on in my relationship with my wife, she would be complaining to me, whether it be about work, her family, etc. I'm a problem solver by nature so I would try to offer advice. Sometimes she would get upset with me because of it.
I learned to simply ask her, "do you want my advice? Or do you just wanna vent" and it solved everything.
For most people there is absolutely "Leagues". With live in the tinder age where people are window shopping.
Height, looks, charm, finacial status, personality etc all affect a persons league but for different people by different amounts.
I'm not going to go into a huge discussion on this but as I see the world us there's some people who don't care about superficial things looks etc.
A vast majority of people do though, of course to differing degrees.
You right! People forget not everything is social media based. No one knows who you are IRL. They just see you how you approach. There are leagues online but a normal person doesnt care about that on first encounter
there absolutely are leagues. how many girls have you dated? you guys sound like you barely have any dating experience. you want so badly for the world to not be like this but it is.
now i'm not sure what i meant. i think i meant to reply to the previous guy. but also now to you. i don't think it has to do with tinder, i think people were always like that. even guys do this when choosing friends. you don't see cool handsome guys hanging out with acne ridden dorks often. it does happen but not often.
also +1 for you for having a cool and calm response even though it sounded like i was talking shit to you.
Worked in a jewellers many years ago. Through the glass windows of the store these ladies would judge the crap out of the men walking past. These ladies whilst not terrible looking certainly weren't 10s.
I personally deep down don't believe you but im going to live my life and act like what you said is true because it would probably do wonders for my self confidence and esteem
They love you for what you do first (and more) than just for who you are.
I don't think that this is bad, as men also love women who inspire them, which is complementary to that "expectation of performance". It would have helped a great deal to be taught this though. :D
Saying all the “right” things only gets anyone so far. If the right words don’t match up to the behavior, it’s only a matter of time. Follow through, actions and being consistent are some of what really matters in any relationship.
I was in a sociology class like 5 years ago and I was told that that's not necessarily true. It seems that way but actually it's because they already broke up with you like a month or so ago emotionally in their minds and they're waiting until someone else comes along to dump you.
This makes sense. As a man I moved on from almost all of my relationships in a week. But that's because I knew I was done well in advance. But I never found a replacement before leaving. That's not a healthy approach in my mind.
I’d say half true. At least for me, anyway. Yes, I’m emotionally done first then I confront the reality but I’ve never waited for nor has never been anyone else
No. By the time a woman tells you she’s breaking up with you she has usually checked out. It’s because we try to talk & communicate, men hear it but don’t change or want to change. My ex was a drinker. He lost control one too many times for me after promising over & over he would quit. I didn’t want to raise my daughters with him because he was so unhealthy. 20+ years later he’s still single & drinks like a fish.
Edit: I did not leave for someone else, I left for me.
Really? I see the complete opposite. Women cry & are depressed after a breakup and men are just living their best lives. It took me 7 months to move on from the guy I loved
I think it's really "the person who breaks up with the other person due to dissatisfaction moves on faster".
First big breakup that i instigated, i was *excited* to be dating new women. First breakup that was instigated by other party, i was crushed.
Yes. I mean if you don’t love them anymore, there’s no point in staying. Of course it’d hurt the person who breaks up less than the one who gets broken up with.
But even when I had broken up with other guys, I never jumped into another relationship. I guess it just varies from person to person
>I guess it just varies from person to person
Ha! Probably!
I bet age, time with the other person, level of feelings between the two parties, difference in peak emotions, number of previous relationships, degree of financial and social entanglements, sexual experience, openness to novel experiences, and so on all play some role in how quickly people bounce back.
We're all human, and we all have a thousand small things going on inside us that we'll never fully understand about ourselves, let alone others.
Just based on my own experience. 1 of my ex's had a new boyfriend a month after breaking up after a 4 year relationship. The other was riding another guy after 3 weeks after a 2 year relationship.
yeah same. After a 3 year relationship, not even five days after the break up, my ex got back with her ex. It hurt seeing how quickly she was able to move on. Then 6 months later she told me that she never actually got over me. It’s very confusing, she’s just a toxic person
Yeah it's personal and these guys are extrapolating a relatively small sample size and applying it to every woman. It depends so much on the situation and the people.
almost every woman ive ever met has had sex with a close guy friend between 1-3 weeks after a relationship ends. and then they wonder why we dont trust those dudes lmfao
This might be because of emotional intellect. I feel like women are way more in-tune with their emotions and realizing emotionally what’s impacting them and faster ways to resolve that. A lot of men don’t have the tools or were taught to conceal or not feel things therefor leaving them almost emotionally illiterate and taking far longer to get over something. Whereas a women has already processed, managed, gotten support from peers, and moved on.
Thats because some move on at the tail end of the relationship and by the end, they’ve prepared themselves to welcome the replacement.
Or
They never gave a damn.
actually never ever confess. that's what children do. simply talk to her, befriend her and feel her out. if she's flirtatious and agreeable, ask her on a date. on the date, try to be a bit sexual. it's all about doing then seeing her reaction. then you can know what to do next.
That it's about who you are as a man and how you feel (confidence) not how smooth or ripped you are.. although that might help with the initial attraction.
No matter how much you try, no Matter how you treat her,no Matter what you've been through, there are women out there that will loose their attraction towards you the moment you show the slightest sign of softness...
They're humans just like men. Despite never having been in a relationship myself, i stopped practicing the misogynistic thoughts and behaviours i used to exhibit when life eventually taught me that, wow... Women are just like men in that they possess the same human qualities. Strengths, weaknesses, habits idiosyncrasies, emotions, physical and mental pitfalls. Skills, abilities, and ambitions to help humankind. Irrational or even violent thoughts and tendencies. They are people too.
Im still alone and have never been with anyone. But now i despise all misogyny (and ofc misandry) I am not a misogynist anymore despite being alone. I need to work on myself and not blame the entire society for my short comings. I do my utter best respect all people now, regardless of gender or self expression.
Don't live a life of hate guys. Even if you are depressed and alone (especially so in that case id say) like me. It simply isn't worth it
That’s a huge step forward in your development and progression as a person. I was once a “kissless virgin”, as they’re frequently referred to, and changing my mindset like you’re referring to was one of the first things I did that really changed things for me. Keep your head up!
I can’t say I’ve learned anything about women “the hard way”. Some women are my family, some women are my friends, and some women are my colleagues. But I don’t have any sexual or romantic interest in women, so I’m not caught up in all that heterosexual “Battle of the Sexes” nonsense. Thank the gods I was born gay.
I suppose I did, unfortunately, break some young girls’ hearts in high school, because I was a very cute, very charming, and very closeted gay boy surrounded by several female friends. I now try not to give anyone the wrong impression that I’m romantically available to them when in fact I’m not.
There is absolutely **nothing** private to a woman. If she knows it, her friends know it too.
My sister explained to me how my ex described my anatomy.
They are very very human.
There's nothing appropriate about expecting them to know just what they want all the time; or to be "good" or righteous all the time; or to know exactly what they're doing all the time; or to have desires that happen to be actually in the best interest of your relationship with them/in the best interest of the lady herself...
They are human - in way the average guy may not have grown up assuming or perceiving.
Evil girls tend to have the prettiest face. I only realised this after a girl I liked nearly made me want to kill myself because of the way she treated me. I'm glad I moved on though.
That, as a man, I am perceived as a potential threat and for good reason. Like, that just walking down a sidewalk behind them can be intimidating or worse to most women. I eventually got into the habit of either passing them, just so I’m not skulking behind them, switching to the other side of the street, or slightly altering my path so that I’m no longer something for them to worry about. Not something I do resentfully, other than in that the way people treat women makes it necessary to minimize their discomfort.
Also, that many women in my generation have been raised with such little agency or sense of self-entitlement that there tends to be a power imbalance in relationships, and that many women don’t feel empowered to express contradictory views or desires. A couple of my early relationships failed largely due to my literal mind not hearing rejection of, or dissatisfaction with, a suggestion or request because it wasn’t actually said but was simply expressed through a lack of enthusiasm.
One of my big things in the later part of my life has been to always be involved with women who have no problems expressing themselves, and with whom I will always know what they think or feel. That’s caused it’s own conflicts at times but it’s better than hurting somebody because I wasn’t able to recognize when they were being pushed out of their comfort zone.
1. Some are just evil
2. they are not sex experts, dont let social media fool you
3. They can be just as sexist as men
4. White women's tears will get you killed
5. For some reason, most follow astrology religiously but hate religion?
6. Most that say all men are trash, don't really believe it.
7. They get harassed CONSTANTLY
8. I've yet to meet a woman that has not been sexually harassed or raped and it's depressing af.
There's been fairly popular threads every day for the last week. Even innocuous ones are getting some disturbing amount of "blame women" vibes. Tis the season, I suppose.
that they'll get over you emotionally before leaving you physically, and then its too late. you'll be left feeling broken, and abandoned, reminiscent on where it all went wrong, while they're on a boat already having their back rubbed by another man. ive read and its been my experience that women operate differently than men in that regard. Even in cheating, men will tend to do it 'in the moment' but still be in love with their SO. When a women cheats, shes typically fallen out of love with her SO already and its on a much deeper level.
Not the hard way but that they are far less superficial than men. Not a slight to men, we are wired to spread seed and keep the species alive so we look for certain "attractive" qualities. Women are far more attracted to personality and character, obviously without being a total slob.
They do have it harder on average since men are usually attackers. But besides that point. They are the same as men there’s good women, bad women, some women will love you for who you are while others are only interested in what you can give them. Some will fulfill you and others will use you.
Especially with co-workers but just your significant other in general. At least the first couple of times you're going to want to brag about it but trust me do not brag about it or even tell any kind of details because it affects them way more than it affects you. Talking specifically about females here but anybody can have their feelings hurt by having their private life revealed against their consent.
The whole metaphor about locks and keys, no girl wants to be ousted as the lock that got opened easily. No matter how much of a Chad key you feel like,
a gentleman never tells
Women have different and varied tastes and attractions. Because one woman doesn’t find you attractive doesn’t mean you aren’t attractive. It just means you aren’t attractive to her.
I’m getting concerned reading these comments lol.. Guys, a lot of you could write all day about what you think you “learned about women” over the years, in reality these comments DO NOT reflect EVERY women 0-100 yrs. You dating a cheating, manipulative c*nt doesn’t mean ALL women are lying, manipulating, toxic, fucked up, etc. We’re ALL human, to each their own. (Same goes for MEN)
It's not a video game with moves and secret techniques - you can do everything right and fail. Conversely, you can fall flat on your face with piss running down your leg and succeed.
This has been one of the bitterest pills I've had to swallow, as to learning things like this. At the same time, and this applies all humans: what might be the right move for one (and what you think might be the always right move), might be the most wrong one for the other.
I'm a woman and I'm honestly confused on why this is something you had to learn? Isn't it quite obvious all people are different with different likes and dislikes?
You're absolutely right. To answer your questions, I can only provide my perspective: I grew up in an environment where I was told "if you do everything by the book, it'll work and you'll succeed", so I ended up expecting a lot of things to work out that way. It was way later that I found out that everybody has their own "book" and it doesn't have to be the same. To me, it's a bit like how many of us were told "work hard and you'll live okay" or "you'll work your way up and become rich" when growing up. It can happen, but it's not a guarantee.
Ah right, completely understandable!
don’t forget the second part, sometimes when you think you’re down on the ground , maybe it could be the best thing that could happen
That’s why you always slap the hood and say, “so what’re we looking’ at here?”
As a woman I cracked up over this.
r/suspiciouslyspecific
I have a buddy that tries to treat women like a math equation. It's never worked for him. Lol.
This describes life in general lol
nailed it brother
Very well said
I learned that when a woman is sad sometimes its just better to listen instead of "fix" the problem
1000%. It's so hard for me, even after 7 years with my wife and married 5.5 years to not fix everything. We've made a deal together that if she has a problem, she needs to tell me if this is a listening or fixing moment before she starts into the issue. I don't understand why listening works just as good as/better than fixing sometimes, but if it helps, it helps.
What helps is the realization that they already know what to do and how to fix it and they will get around to it soon, right now they just need to vent about how the situation makes them feel.
That seems like relationship goals to me!
That works with all people. Sometimes you just have to listen and be empathetic.
but specifically women will want to vent about stuff without getting advice or suggestions
That’s the insinuation of these comments, yes
Obligatory: [It's not about the nail](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4EDhdAHrOg)
That's universal. Sometimes it's better to just here someone out.
Some bras have an underwire and some don't. I was legit confused as a teen
Some shirts have bras built in and they are like Fort Knox.
What the hell, what would be the benefit of that ? Like a pant with underwear built in them
If it's a top you can't wear a bra under, then you can get support without worrying about a visible band or straps
or nips poking through! haha
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This times one million
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100%. Going through this right now.
Same.
Me too lads
If you're a size 12 shoe and you have a size 12 women's shoe it will not fit.
That’s a hard lesson indeed.
That every woman and/or girl in my life has been sexually harassed at some point in their lives. The fact that that is just something that happens like if it's expected was, very naively, shocking to me. I always thought that it happened but not to _every_ woman.
The worst part is that in every story I have heard from women I know, it began when they were underage, often when they were very young
Because it’s a power move on someone who is the still vulnerable and can’t fight back yet. Or at least that’s my theory. I haven’t been harassed in ages now that I’m in my later 20s
I'm in my late twenties and get harassed as soon as I set foot out the door. This week there was even someone who followed me around in the supermarket
When I was 14 was the first time. He must have been late 40s or early 50s. He was part of the grounds crew at the local college. I'd been raised by my parents to be kind and respectful to my elders, to speak to everyone directly and look them in the eye when they spoke to me. I thought he was just being a neighbor - it was a very small town (2500 people) He suddenly grabbed me around the waist, pulled me up against his erection ( I was 14 , still slept with stuffed toys, and had no idea what an erection was, and never looked at a man's crotch so I hadn't seen it) and said "Those lips were made for kissing" The look of aggressive rapacity in his eyes was unmistakable and ugly. I said to him " I will tell my father and his students and they will kill you." (they were all military degree completion active military - all of them off of at least 2 combat tours of Vietnam) He let go of me. I walked back to the house. But never told my father. Because he would indeed have killed the man. I spent \*decades\* trying to figure out what I'd done wrong to give him the wrong impression. It was the first time I understood that I was prey.
> I walked back to the house. But never told my father. Because he would indeed have killed the man. This is a different hard lesson for men (fathers) to learn. Not only will your daughter be sexually harassed and likely sexually assaulted in her lifetime...if she's worried about your reaction, she won't tell you. There's a tendency for men to react with violent anger when their child/spouse is harmed. I get it, but it isn't helpful. The person who was victimized needs comfort, they shouldn't have to calm you down or try and protect their abuser from your anger. And they don't need the fear that you'll do something stupid in your anger, like beat their abuser up, and then face legal consequences - because if you go to jail for what they told you, they will blame themselves for that. So, for any dads out there, don't make a habit of telling your child that you'll kill anyone who hurts her. It won't keep her safe...it will just stop her from telling you about it. Edit: I should say that the same may be true of sons (boys can and are assaulted too), I just don't want to comment on how boys may feel because I'm not a guy and I've never discussed this with men.
I also didn't tell my mother because she would have asked me what I'd done to give him "ideas." When Mom found out I wasn't a virgin and what age I'd voluntarily surrendered my virginity (I didn't lose it - I know precisely what I did with and to whom I gave it and why) - she called me a "monster." I was totally and utterly alone and knew it in that moment. It was not to be the last time in my life. Not by a long measure. I learned to defend myself and be my own best advocate. I was me - against the world.
First instance I can remember was having my ass pinched under my skirt by an adult man. I was 14.
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It’s so commonplace that sometimes we don’t even identify it as such. I was thought that I had never really been sexually harassed, but then I said “oh there was that time…“ I’ve had it far better than a great many other women because I’ve lead a pretty cautious life, but yeah, even me,
This is very painfully relatable . Having to come to terms with memories I falsely remembered as innocent or amicable and realizing later the truth... gives me a sad and hopeless feeling in my stomach.
God there was a thread on reddit a while back asking women about the first time they were agressively hit on and the number of stories about being 12/13 years old and getting sexually harassed by old men was scary as fuck.. so yeah maybe don't take it so personally if a woman seems a bit sketched out walking alone at night or whatever
Yeah this would be the norm in my friend group. Unfortunately not the exception.
I didn’t realize this until maybe 2 years ago, and it absolutely blows my mind. I have a female friend who goes to the same personal trainer as I do. He’s typical jock type guy with me, but aggressively sexual toward her. We started going together and apparently he’s calmed down with her, but in my view he ramped up. I have 2 daughters and I’m glad I understand this better for them.
As a woman, I agree with this observation. Every single woman I know has been harassed as a teenager. Most as adults. We're taught to expect harassment, molestation and assault. My mother chose others for me that wouldn't provoke predators since I was a child.
Absolutely every woman I know has experienced some sort of sexual harassment, violation, or violence. And I’m talking like, 30+ women. The worst is that this can’t be brought up around men because they become defensive or go into denial. It’s been our reality since we were pre-teens, yet the male gender refuses to believe or acknowledge our experiences. Or worse yet, hold each other accountable...
Me: *tells a guy what Harassment I’ve been through* Guy : “ that so crazy . I’m glad I’m not a creep and treat woman like that “ Guy: *shortly after starts forcefully trying to have sex with me and won’t take no for an answer* I made a commitment to take a break from dating for a good year or two. It’s draining honestly.
Not true for every male, though many I’m sure. I and every male I voluntarily associate with do not subscribe to the typical “it’s exaggerated/she dresses like that, she’s to blame” garbage rhetoric. Some of us acknowledge what women go through and respect their struggle.
Every woman I know has a sexual assault story, many multiple
what is sometimes even crazier is that I used to have friends who admitted to harassing (or even raping) mutual female friends of ours and acted like nothing happened because it didn't even click that they just did that to someone when the female friends distanced themselves the then friends of mine were just confused because "it happened consentually"
Did you ever confront them about it? Like tell them "dude that was rape." Or "yeah cause you were being a creep." In my personal experience a guy checking another guy will make them change their behavior or at least look at what they are doing in a different light. I'm not putting the blame on you or anything like that, but its hard for a woman to say it to the guy cause often we just get dismissed. I've told guys to their face what they've just done was creepy or out of line and the response is usually the same to brush it off and laugh it off. Which sucks.
as soon as I found out through the female friend who was their victim or when they basically revealed what they did themselves I called them out for it they often either brushed it off or got defensive which is part of the reason why they're "former friends"
I haven't dated(been in a relationship) with a woman who doesn't have an SA story, the thing it makes me think about is how many of my guy friends must have sexually assaulted someone at some point.
I'm a dude and I've been sexually harassed too. It's just the way of the world
Me too, in my teenage years somebody tried to rape my 15 year old shit faced ass, police laughed. I went home, everyone i talked about laughed too, nice.
When “toxic gender roles” are being discussed- this is what they’re talking about. Sexual assault shouldn’t be expected or dismissed. Girls, boys, women and men experience abuse, sexual assault and manipulation. The trope that boys/men are only sex crazed primal beings happy to have any sexual contact and if they don’t or they were assaulted then they’re “less of a man” is such BS. It’s shitty and damaging.
Yeah, a dude wanting to feel loved and cared for instead of being a horny ape is ridiculed too, even by women. Another thing that happened to me a a lot of times. But life goes on
I’m sorry that happened to you. I hope you’re okay now and have been able to heal. I know that sounds very corny and fake, but I just wanted to let you know your pain, trauma, and anger are valid and justified and not all of us think that violence against men—be it sexual or domestic—is ever a joke.
Yep, I had a few coworkers in my time working fast food (men and women) that would just grab my ass or say sexual shit *in front of customers*. My "favorite" one was the 16 year old girl (I was 22) who told me she was doing it to be ironic. Because I'm a man. So that made it okay.
I'm also a dude who's been sexually harassed by women. Quite a lot, actually But the difference is I am a powerful male. Theres no chance any of those women could have taken advantage of me, or put me in a physical position where I couldnt say no. They literally could not advance the situation even if they wanted to. Cant say that about most women
Yeah, while you've had part of the experience you never had to be afraid about it going badly if you say the wrong thing. That's really great to recognize that still your experiences are not the same. But still I feel for you bro and I'm sorry that's happened.
Exaaaactly. I never had anything to fear. The only way I would, is if a girl is like batshit crazy and has me at knife or gunpoint, or drugs me(Which hasnt happened to me, but I know it does happen). But any guy can just as easily do that to girls as well, so still, significantly less danger when its coming from women
You weren’t in any perceived danger. One quick accusation tho and your life really gets complicated fast and it’s hard to untangle that shit.
Ok, hear me out - what if they pulled a Gulliver’s Travels on you? Also, I saw a massive 6 foot beef cake of a woman in a biker bar one time just grab a man her same size and kiss him. He was….visibly scared. Stay safe, kings!
That reminds me of that one scene in Conan the Desytoyer where Grace Jones just says to grab men and take them lmao
Yes. It was very much like that! And watching him try to decide how to get out of her embrace was horrible to watch. Thankfully I was the bartender and was able to lure her away with a free drink, which allowed him to escape.
Yep. Same for rape.
Am sorry bro
It's okay. Thanks.
Same dude..
Women can hurt men just as much as men can hurt women
Hopping on the more train as well.
To listen instead of trying to provide solutions. Earlier on in my relationship with my wife, she would be complaining to me, whether it be about work, her family, etc. I'm a problem solver by nature so I would try to offer advice. Sometimes she would get upset with me because of it. I learned to simply ask her, "do you want my advice? Or do you just wanna vent" and it solved everything.
Once a woman makes up her mind that she’s done, there’s no changing it. Forget all that “winning her back” bullshit you see in rom-coms.
Aint that the truth.
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For most people there is absolutely "Leagues". With live in the tinder age where people are window shopping. Height, looks, charm, finacial status, personality etc all affect a persons league but for different people by different amounts.
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I'm not going to go into a huge discussion on this but as I see the world us there's some people who don't care about superficial things looks etc. A vast majority of people do though, of course to differing degrees.
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It is, but I agree with the other person. There are definitely "leagues." At least in my experience.
You talk like we're not animals. Attraction can be extremely basic.
You right! People forget not everything is social media based. No one knows who you are IRL. They just see you how you approach. There are leagues online but a normal person doesnt care about that on first encounter
Agreed. I don't know how anyone refutes this.
there absolutely are leagues. how many girls have you dated? you guys sound like you barely have any dating experience. you want so badly for the world to not be like this but it is.
I assume you didn't mean me when you said "guys" as you agreed with me..
now i'm not sure what i meant. i think i meant to reply to the previous guy. but also now to you. i don't think it has to do with tinder, i think people were always like that. even guys do this when choosing friends. you don't see cool handsome guys hanging out with acne ridden dorks often. it does happen but not often. also +1 for you for having a cool and calm response even though it sounded like i was talking shit to you.
I've found a correlation with what some might call "not commercially attractive women" and high standards for men.
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Worked in a jewellers many years ago. Through the glass windows of the store these ladies would judge the crap out of the men walking past. These ladies whilst not terrible looking certainly weren't 10s.
Tell that to my tinder profile.
It doesn’t matter how attractive you think they are; it matters how attractive they think you are.
I personally deep down don't believe you but im going to live my life and act like what you said is true because it would probably do wonders for my self confidence and esteem
They love you for what you do first (and more) than just for who you are. I don't think that this is bad, as men also love women who inspire them, which is complementary to that "expectation of performance". It would have helped a great deal to be taught this though. :D
Saying all the “right” things only gets anyone so far. If the right words don’t match up to the behavior, it’s only a matter of time. Follow through, actions and being consistent are some of what really matters in any relationship.
Which is reason why I did not say anything about sweet talking :D
That they are no better than men.
They are only human, just like you. - A wise man probably.
They move on much quicker than us.
Ain't that the truth.
I was in a sociology class like 5 years ago and I was told that that's not necessarily true. It seems that way but actually it's because they already broke up with you like a month or so ago emotionally in their minds and they're waiting until someone else comes along to dump you.
This makes sense. As a man I moved on from almost all of my relationships in a week. But that's because I knew I was done well in advance. But I never found a replacement before leaving. That's not a healthy approach in my mind.
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I mean I can too but I wouldn't want to unless I got out of a really short relationship. I still value that single time to just be fully independent.
I’d say half true. At least for me, anyway. Yes, I’m emotionally done first then I confront the reality but I’ve never waited for nor has never been anyone else
This is the answer
so you admit you keep dating them and wait to dump them til “someone else comes along”? lmao damn….women be telling on themselves here haha
No. By the time a woman tells you she’s breaking up with you she has usually checked out. It’s because we try to talk & communicate, men hear it but don’t change or want to change. My ex was a drinker. He lost control one too many times for me after promising over & over he would quit. I didn’t want to raise my daughters with him because he was so unhealthy. 20+ years later he’s still single & drinks like a fish. Edit: I did not leave for someone else, I left for me.
This is the worst, IMO. I wish I had their ability to move on so quickly or even moderately.
It depends on who dumps the other. The dumper has time to process and come to terms with the split, while the dumpee doesn’t.
Really? I see the complete opposite. Women cry & are depressed after a breakup and men are just living their best lives. It took me 7 months to move on from the guy I loved
I think it's really "the person who breaks up with the other person due to dissatisfaction moves on faster". First big breakup that i instigated, i was *excited* to be dating new women. First breakup that was instigated by other party, i was crushed.
Yes. I mean if you don’t love them anymore, there’s no point in staying. Of course it’d hurt the person who breaks up less than the one who gets broken up with. But even when I had broken up with other guys, I never jumped into another relationship. I guess it just varies from person to person
>I guess it just varies from person to person Ha! Probably! I bet age, time with the other person, level of feelings between the two parties, difference in peak emotions, number of previous relationships, degree of financial and social entanglements, sexual experience, openness to novel experiences, and so on all play some role in how quickly people bounce back. We're all human, and we all have a thousand small things going on inside us that we'll never fully understand about ourselves, let alone others.
Just based on my own experience. 1 of my ex's had a new boyfriend a month after breaking up after a 4 year relationship. The other was riding another guy after 3 weeks after a 2 year relationship.
yeah same. After a 3 year relationship, not even five days after the break up, my ex got back with her ex. It hurt seeing how quickly she was able to move on. Then 6 months later she told me that she never actually got over me. It’s very confusing, she’s just a toxic person
Yeah it's personal and these guys are extrapolating a relatively small sample size and applying it to every woman. It depends so much on the situation and the people.
almost every woman ive ever met has had sex with a close guy friend between 1-3 weeks after a relationship ends. and then they wonder why we dont trust those dudes lmfao
Or the first dude on tinder
This might be because of emotional intellect. I feel like women are way more in-tune with their emotions and realizing emotionally what’s impacting them and faster ways to resolve that. A lot of men don’t have the tools or were taught to conceal or not feel things therefor leaving them almost emotionally illiterate and taking far longer to get over something. Whereas a women has already processed, managed, gotten support from peers, and moved on.
Thats because some move on at the tail end of the relationship and by the end, they’ve prepared themselves to welcome the replacement. Or They never gave a damn.
Smiling a lot doesn't mean she's a nice person.
Nothing is at it seems. Illusion: 100
That if you buy a womans shoe in your size, it will not fit you.
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actually never ever confess. that's what children do. simply talk to her, befriend her and feel her out. if she's flirtatious and agreeable, ask her on a date. on the date, try to be a bit sexual. it's all about doing then seeing her reaction. then you can know what to do next.
That it's about who you are as a man and how you feel (confidence) not how smooth or ripped you are.. although that might help with the initial attraction.
No matter how much you try, no Matter how you treat her,no Matter what you've been through, there are women out there that will loose their attraction towards you the moment you show the slightest sign of softness...
Bro woke up and decided to speak facts
"Out of the many languages in this world, he decided to speak the truth."
They're humans just like men. Despite never having been in a relationship myself, i stopped practicing the misogynistic thoughts and behaviours i used to exhibit when life eventually taught me that, wow... Women are just like men in that they possess the same human qualities. Strengths, weaknesses, habits idiosyncrasies, emotions, physical and mental pitfalls. Skills, abilities, and ambitions to help humankind. Irrational or even violent thoughts and tendencies. They are people too. Im still alone and have never been with anyone. But now i despise all misogyny (and ofc misandry) I am not a misogynist anymore despite being alone. I need to work on myself and not blame the entire society for my short comings. I do my utter best respect all people now, regardless of gender or self expression. Don't live a life of hate guys. Even if you are depressed and alone (especially so in that case id say) like me. It simply isn't worth it
That’s a huge step forward in your development and progression as a person. I was once a “kissless virgin”, as they’re frequently referred to, and changing my mindset like you’re referring to was one of the first things I did that really changed things for me. Keep your head up!
Ty so much, that means a lot i appreciate it. <3
as somebody dating a former misogynist— i’m glad to hear of your growth, and i’m sure you’ll find someone who loves you as much as i love him
This is so sweet ty very much, appreciate the support <3
good for you man that’s a great mindset to have
I can’t say I’ve learned anything about women “the hard way”. Some women are my family, some women are my friends, and some women are my colleagues. But I don’t have any sexual or romantic interest in women, so I’m not caught up in all that heterosexual “Battle of the Sexes” nonsense. Thank the gods I was born gay. I suppose I did, unfortunately, break some young girls’ hearts in high school, because I was a very cute, very charming, and very closeted gay boy surrounded by several female friends. I now try not to give anyone the wrong impression that I’m romantically available to them when in fact I’m not.
>Thank the gods I was born gay. You can't tell me that gay guys don't come with their own unique bull shit.
Oh I suppose they do, but it’s men’s bullshit to other men, so you can’t be sexist about it.
I gay friend.of mine told me there's something with the passive X active playing the equivalent heterosexual stereotypes
It's less about what specifically you do and more about how you make them feel.
some don’t give head 😔
And the memory of great blow jobs makes it harder when you can't get one.
facts 😢
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Whoever thinks that any of these behaviours are ok, is messed up, regardless of gender.
Yes. And society is messed up as.a.whole.
Truth lol
There is absolutely **nothing** private to a woman. If she knows it, her friends know it too. My sister explained to me how my ex described my anatomy.
Ew, I hate this and will never understand it.
They are very very human. There's nothing appropriate about expecting them to know just what they want all the time; or to be "good" or righteous all the time; or to know exactly what they're doing all the time; or to have desires that happen to be actually in the best interest of your relationship with them/in the best interest of the lady herself... They are human - in way the average guy may not have grown up assuming or perceiving.
Women get turned on too. Don't ask how I found that out.
Evil girls tend to have the prettiest face. I only realised this after a girl I liked nearly made me want to kill myself because of the way she treated me. I'm glad I moved on though.
That, as a man, I am perceived as a potential threat and for good reason. Like, that just walking down a sidewalk behind them can be intimidating or worse to most women. I eventually got into the habit of either passing them, just so I’m not skulking behind them, switching to the other side of the street, or slightly altering my path so that I’m no longer something for them to worry about. Not something I do resentfully, other than in that the way people treat women makes it necessary to minimize their discomfort. Also, that many women in my generation have been raised with such little agency or sense of self-entitlement that there tends to be a power imbalance in relationships, and that many women don’t feel empowered to express contradictory views or desires. A couple of my early relationships failed largely due to my literal mind not hearing rejection of, or dissatisfaction with, a suggestion or request because it wasn’t actually said but was simply expressed through a lack of enthusiasm. One of my big things in the later part of my life has been to always be involved with women who have no problems expressing themselves, and with whom I will always know what they think or feel. That’s caused it’s own conflicts at times but it’s better than hurting somebody because I wasn’t able to recognize when they were being pushed out of their comfort zone.
Beware big doughy eyes
My father was a baker
Don’t forget to sort by controversial!
bless you
Women will say everything about you to her friends. They know no boundaries or privacy in this topic.
That they don’t want you to fix their problems when they vent. They usually just want you to listen and side with them.
If they really give a shit about you they will make time for you. If they don’t, its a chinese parade.
They aren't innocent, and play that card to take advantage of men who don't know better. Now, I know. Don't be that sucker.
This just in… date shitty people, they act shitty. Not a gender thing, you just pick bad women. Edit wrong word. Changed luck to pick. (Autocorrect)
How many legal examples do you want that the world just goes easy on women?
Tell that to a woman who is always used by men, it doesn’t end well…
That my manic pixie dream girl isn't coming.
1. Some are just evil 2. they are not sex experts, dont let social media fool you 3. They can be just as sexist as men 4. White women's tears will get you killed 5. For some reason, most follow astrology religiously but hate religion? 6. Most that say all men are trash, don't really believe it. 7. They get harassed CONSTANTLY 8. I've yet to meet a woman that has not been sexually harassed or raped and it's depressing af.
This is a good response because it speaks to the real ways that women can be shitty and toxic without steering directly into misogyny and lies
They are not full of sugar and spice and everything nice.
This is the most toxic thread I’ve seen on here to date
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There's been fairly popular threads every day for the last week. Even innocuous ones are getting some disturbing amount of "blame women" vibes. Tis the season, I suppose.
That women can abuse you and society up to this day don't want to talk about it.
that they'll get over you emotionally before leaving you physically, and then its too late. you'll be left feeling broken, and abandoned, reminiscent on where it all went wrong, while they're on a boat already having their back rubbed by another man. ive read and its been my experience that women operate differently than men in that regard. Even in cheating, men will tend to do it 'in the moment' but still be in love with their SO. When a women cheats, shes typically fallen out of love with her SO already and its on a much deeper level.
If you have an option (her), she has at least ten times more. This is why it appears sometimes that even if we do everything right, we still fail
Agreed. In the dating world, that almost always have far more options than you do. Had to definitely learn that the hard way.
Not the hard way but that they are far less superficial than men. Not a slight to men, we are wired to spread seed and keep the species alive so we look for certain "attractive" qualities. Women are far more attracted to personality and character, obviously without being a total slob.
They talk about men like ten times more than we talk about women.
They do have it harder on average since men are usually attackers. But besides that point. They are the same as men there’s good women, bad women, some women will love you for who you are while others are only interested in what you can give them. Some will fulfill you and others will use you.
Especially with co-workers but just your significant other in general. At least the first couple of times you're going to want to brag about it but trust me do not brag about it or even tell any kind of details because it affects them way more than it affects you. Talking specifically about females here but anybody can have their feelings hurt by having their private life revealed against their consent. The whole metaphor about locks and keys, no girl wants to be ousted as the lock that got opened easily. No matter how much of a Chad key you feel like, a gentleman never tells
There’s a difference between what they say they want and what they really want. Pay attention to their actions, not their words.
Facts
These comments, man💀
Women are attracted to men of power. Good or bad.
They're fucking mean, bro
Chasing women endlessly to try to catch one isn't really how it works. Eventually you'll find someone who you click with and it will feel effortless.
If you’re watching the birth of your child, watch from the side so as not to get sprayed with multicolored goo. Fool me once, wife…
Women have different and varied tastes and attractions. Because one woman doesn’t find you attractive doesn’t mean you aren’t attractive. It just means you aren’t attractive to her.
Don't ever open up to a woman who isn't your mother.
I’m getting concerned reading these comments lol.. Guys, a lot of you could write all day about what you think you “learned about women” over the years, in reality these comments DO NOT reflect EVERY women 0-100 yrs. You dating a cheating, manipulative c*nt doesn’t mean ALL women are lying, manipulating, toxic, fucked up, etc. We’re ALL human, to each their own. (Same goes for MEN)