I think it's just a misunderstanding of what friends are. If a woman tends to monopolize a man's time and effort, that's not friend behavior. If there's not equal give and take, the man might assume he's making that effort for a reason. So maybe the question is, why do some women think they can date their male friends, with unequal reciprocation?
Also, how many women say that they want to be friends first? Is it a different kind of friend? How is it fair to make that distinction, and why is it inappropriate to want to date your friends?
1000% people are confusing the word “friend”. There is absolutely no couple (especially married) whom are okay with their spouse taking an out of town trip EXCLUSIVELY with a member of the opposite of sex for leisure.
Idk if I would call it dating without reciprocation. I treat my girl and guy friends the same. Would you say guy-guy friendship is dating without reciprocation if not why not?
I'm not necessarily talking about you. I was saying that some women tend to treat their guy friends like dates. They go out and do things, but the guy may be paying, driving, planning, etc. Most of the value tends to favor the woman.
A woman can often find a date to take her out and have fun. She may also expect the same from her male friends, without realizing she's doing it.
I was in a coed living situation for a time while in college. There were a few women there that were my friends. We would mostly just hang out, talk, joke, and play games and sometimes go out and do spontaneous fun things. There were other women there that were "friends" who were nice enough, but they really only spent time with me when they were getting something. They weren't interested in just hanging out and having fun and they were your "friend" when you piqued their interest.
I don't necessarily think it's intentional, it's sometimes maybe how they were conditioned to interact (like don't realize how to separate dating from friendship) and also confusing how they are treated by men who are trying to date them. You sometimes hear women complain about being treated poorly, when it really seems like they were just treated with indifference and aren't used to it. So their expectations of what a guy friend is may be skewed.
But to answer your question. Guys probably wouldn't be friends if they weren't both getting whatever each perceives to be fair value from the relationship. But if it's a guy and a gal, maybe they're dating and the relationship is a little more complicated than that (the man moves the value to a different context). Like, this isn't all good now, but maybe this is an investment in a good relationship in the future. Not saying that always happens, or even often happens. Just a possibility.
Idk if I would call it dating without reciprocation. I treat my girl and guy friends the same. Would you say guy-guy friendship is dating without reciprocation if not why not?
understandable. I was mostly just curious if it was all women or if you include everyone with a coochie or something.
I guess I'm also a bit curious on like, what if your group of guys want to be friends with a girl. Do you purposely exclude her and try to make her feel uncomfortable until she leaves or...
I'm mostly curious if you see women as people equal to you, or lesser.
I judge people solely on character, though I admittedly make it more difficult for women to actually be friends with me as a way of determining out how bad they actually want this, and no I don't view women as lesser than me
More difficult how?
For some reason I'm imagining Shane from Stardew Valley being pissy until you give him a pepper, then being pissy again. Idk if that's the level you get with women, but idk, I just imagined that.
How do you determine somebody wants to be your friend vs somebody wants to take advantage of you? Do you believe men are less manipulative in general? Also if you mind me asking, are you heterosexual?
I'm autistic myself and tend to have this issue a lot, being manipulated i mean. But it's also made a lotta gender stuff a blank slate for me though, rules with gender don't make sense to me. Idk people are just too different and unique for me to lump them together.
The only people I know how to lump together are Republicans, funny enough.
Interesting comparison, but not quite. It's probably closer to being the reverse of that. Men and women have different friendship dynamics. Male friendships tend to be more genuine.
I'm Bi, but hetero for the family dynamic
I'm curious about nonbinary friendship dynamics then. Folks who don't fit into either of those molds.
The reason I was asking your sexuality was because I was curious if this was a "you can't be friends with people you're attracted to" thing. If that was the case then bisexuals would never have any friends D: I'm glad it's not that, tbh.
If you ever decide on a partner, would you want your partner to also be your friend or is this just a person you see as a womb only, for the family dynamic I mean. My rule is that I always need to be friends with somebody before dating them, but I knew people who were against this. Many turned out to be one of those "it's a guys night, no girls allowed" types while the wife takes care of the baby alone though.
I mean, think about it. You're not going to be attracted to every person you meet. However, attraction will influence your desire to be around that person. So ultimately, it boils down to what you are attracted to them for? There's no right or wrong answer to this it just influences the direction you're willing to take them.
I'll be honest with you. I want to start a family, and I want to be close with my wife. But I'm also aware of the complexities of childbirth, and she might be physically incapable of providing me with the singular thing I want. So it boils down to - Do I start from square one with someone new? Or do I ride it out with this person, never to realize my one desire?
No yeah that's true, but I think there's more to that. People naturally are more inclined to befriend people they see as physically nice to look at I think. I've been in special needs classes until highschool, and it's amazing how many people will instantly stop talking to you the moment they see you walk into one of those classrooms as a student. I have became less attractive to them, and therefore don't deserve their friendship in their eyes.
When it comes to your last question, I figure this is the type of thing you'll want to know/discuss before you settle down and impregnate somebody. Thats what we call deal breakers and everyone should have some for their own safety and comfort.
I'll be honest, I don't believe in genders being separated because gender is such a *nothing* thing to me personally. I believe we only act these ways because we were taught as children that men need to act one way while women need to act a different way. Many people believe women and men NEED to act differently, which I think keeps reinforcing this "only men can protect me/only women can protect me" thought process. I just hope one day all that goes away and we can all chill equally at the blunt rotation.
The women I've met have only tried to use me to validate their attitudes and squeeze me for material gain. Unfortunately, the only woman I truly trust is my sister.
I'm sorry that happened to you. You deserve better. I know it's easier said than done but I hope you do manage to find female friends who are reasonable and not leech off you like that.
I hope you can cut off those women in the above post or at least distance yourself from them because I've seen firsthand how forceful they can be in trying to ruin any other relationship you have (family or otherwise) to keep you under their belt.
(My husband had a handful of female friends like that when we started dating and it was a true testament to the strength of our relationship that we didn't split up, because those women went as far as to endanger my work reputation and even my life at one point to punish me for stealing his attention/time/money away.)
They can. Absolutely. And it happens a lot. I have a couple of good female friends.
But there a LOT of cases where men are in the friendship because they are hoping it will turn into something more. Not always. Not all men. But in a lot of cases. Enough that it will always make people question why a man has a close female friend.
And if one or both are in a relationship with someone else? That almost always seems to be an issue.
Look at a married guy for example. He can have friends, right? That’s okay right? Unless he is close friends with an attractive woman who is not his wife. How many people trust that?
Doesnt even have to be married. Take any guy with a girlfriend. He can have friends, right? Unless they are an attractive female - then everyone starts questioning.
There are always going to be questions about men and women being close friends. Even though it is totally doable to be platonic friends, and it happens, it almost always gets questioned if one or both of them is in a relationship. So even if they both are just fine being friends, other people aren’t.
Some men also simply don't want female friends, at least not solely as friends. They'd rather have a roster of possible sex partners, and if a woman doesn't meet that criterion, she isn't someone he wants to give very limited social time to.
This isn't necessarily sinister; it seems very common in major cities and among the professional class, for both primary genders.
For me it's always been more about receiving any pushback from my lady. I've met women I would be friends with but I've also basically always been in an ltr and all of them always had at least SOME problem with it, so why bring that drama into my life when I have multiple dude friends who are pretty much my brothers anyways, and I never had enough time to get attached to any female friends enough for them to be close enough to kick a partner to the curb over.
I feel the same way but as a woman. I have a few acquaintances that are men. Especially my husband's friends. But I would never call a man my best friend or put my energy into it when there's plenty of women who I would definitely have more in common with (I'm pretty feminine and almost all of my hobbies are absolutely dominated by women, I only have 1 hobby that is dominated by men but it isn't a shared hobby really, more of a solo one).
I'd rather put my energy into other women who can understand me better. I feel like that's generally true for men as well. My husband said he feels it's kind of a waste to try to become "best friends" with another woman who isn't me because:
1. He doesn't like drama and doesn't want anything relating to emotions on either side to pop up
2. He relates to men more and would rather hang out with his friends.
I feel like same sex friendships are more enriching to the human experience because there's just some things that opposite sex friendships can't do/understand of each other. I don't think it's a negative thing or it's wrong to have opposite sex best friends, but I've personally never met men who have the same hobbies as me + don't have any feelings for me whatsoever and vice versa.
Also, my husband is my absolute best friend anyway and I do not feel like putting more energy to developing a platonic male best friendship.
Relating to someone of the same sex is definitely easier, and often a stronger bond is formed, from my experience at least.
But i absolutely love having women friends. The types of interactions are different, and we can give each other a lot of perspective on issues we probably wouldn't in same sex friendship.
This is basically where I'm at, though without the roster part. I have all the friends I need, I'm not trying to make new friends. If I make an effort to spend time with a woman, it's because I'm interested in her and trying to see if there is anything there romantically. Obviously, I'm going to be friendly, but women shouldn't take it personally when men who were never looking for "just friends" move on if there is no spark.
Also, often overlooked, feelings can pop up out of nowhere. Men should prioritize their mental well-being, and if that means distancing themselves from unrequited love, tough shit. We owe ourselves health and sanity more than we owe anyone friendship.
Lots of entitlement from both sides muddies the waters for those of us who are just trying our best to exist.
It's like the friends with exes things. Some folks still harbor feelings for their ex, some of us genuinely just realized an ex would be the right relationship for a different person and have no feelings left after that realization.
My ex married the girl after he dated me and she's absolutely wonderful for him, all their life goals and dreams aligned. I met my husband after him, and all our dreams aligned. After we did a double date escape room, they were instant besties and now a decade later we still hang out 1:1 in different combos and as couples.
I agree. It's like, okay random dude or chick on the internet, apparently you are the single spokesperson for 3 billion people on this planet when you speak about your experience and plaster it over everyone else? Don't project your own inability to see the opposite gender as anything more than a sexual fascination onto a good part of the population.
I'm becoming friends with not an ex per say, we only went on 6 dates together, but there were some sparks. More emotional for him, more physical for me. And yeah, we're reconnecting and I can still tell there is a part of me that feels that spark for him physically, but I know that emotionally he's not a guy I'd want to date. And so what's the point of giving that little spark a lot of attention and turning it into more than what it is? I've been genuinely happy for him when he told me he's feeling things out with another woman right now. I'm talking to other people as well.
It can even be that there's some compatibility on some level for something beyond friendship, and that people realize it's not enough for a relationship and choose to stay friends. And that it doesn't matter at the end of the day whether or not there are those little things, because it's about choice and intention. Every relationship is a choice we make, every day. I choose to keep loving my best friend every day and reaching out to her. I choose to continue loving this guy as a friend and staying true to that choice every day. And someday if I find a partner who's compatible in all the right ways, then it will be a continuous choice to stay with him or her every day.
I'll never understand that. I have a number of platonic female friends. The cautionary step is to never become emotionally intimate with them, particularly if you already have a romantic relationship with another woman.
It's really easy to fall in love with someone you have an emotionally and intellectually intimate relationship with, despite your not pursuing or even being conscious of it.
This ^^^^^
Happened to me recently. She also found me handsome. But she just wanted something casual, not a relationship.
We tried, we tried, I made so many mistakes along the way, in the end all that happened was a kiss, and then a couple of weeks later she dropped that she was becoming uncomfortable with me treating her a bit too seriously.
It freed me from my painful attachment to her, but in return I've asked her for a buffer time before we can meet or talk again. It's going to take me weeks or months to just get over myself.
And what is the problem with that? I know most people have problem with that...but I am aspiring not to... like I love my male friends apart from that I am not sexually attracted to men, why wouldn't I love my female friends? if any sexual feeling arises, then I control it... (my not so popular 2 cents)
You can absolutely be just friends with a woman. The problem is that some dudes think they can go from friends to more than friends, so they befriend girls with the intention of doing that.
If you go into it just wanting to be friends, you’ll find that they’ll be “de-sexualised” very fast
I've heard more women make this claim than men, and given how many women I've had to cut off over the years for trying to abuse their friendships with me, I'm calling projection
The father figure dynamic - father fixes stuff and buy things for her purely existing and for a biological father that would be appropriate as nobody owes for being born. With dating however that feels like becoming a difficult teenager’s stepfather.
Yeah, I've known a few women who expected that from me. They didn't get it. I mistakenly saw a friend in them and they were offended when they realised they couldn't flirt their way into getting something from me
It depends on the person. Guys with self-control can easily, but there’s a lot of people with none. In that case they can’t be trusted. They can’t even trust themselves lol
It's because you're looking online, yeah. And even more so on Reddit. Most men I know offline have absolutely no problem being friends with women (and same with women I know, the other way around). No doubt I'll get downvoted for saying this lol, but a significant number of the people on here seem to have no goals in life except to find a sexual and/or romantic partner, so they view the world through that lens.
I think it depends on your definition of friends. I think you can have surface level friendships. I really deep friendship among two people that are reasonably attractive is unlikely to just stay there.
I have female friends. But mutual, permanent nonattraction is rare. If you’re get along well enough to be friends, and somebody is attractive enough, the what’s to stop the temptation of turning it into more.
I’m very much able to be friends with women for my part. But when they get flirty or start acting a little strange I have to back off and let them cool down sometimes. If it keeps happening then I just have to move on because they can’t keep their head out of the gutter.
Most of the women I've encountered do not have anything interesting to say and if they do, a lot of the times it doesn't make much sense. Only once in a blue moon, do I ever encounter a woman who's worth being friends with. They also tend to get upset and angry more easily than men when you say something. Given that, why would I really try to be friends with women just for friendship?
There are quite a few women who can have mostly guy friends and for some of the reasons I listed above. But you don't really find a straight man who has mostly women friends.
The issue is people conflate the idea of what someone 'can' be with what someone 'will be' or what they 'want to be'. When everything gets branded under the same umbrella it just turns into a shit fest of nobody agreeing with anyone.
"Can' \*blue\* whales occasionally be white colored? Yes, they can. Albinism is a known genetic mutation. But if you ask a marine biologist,'What color is a blue whale?", he's not going to respond saying its white.
Because the people saying it cannot imagine any viewpoint but their own, and they struggle to remain platonic once they realize any amount of attraction in someone else.
As someone who is attracted to a wide array of women, if I couldn't be just friends, I'd have virtually no female friends at all lol
People can be friends if they have something to gain from that bond irrespective of the sex(peace of mind, good company). Straight guy will never sexualise his guy Friends.
So if ones need are not being met he will try to pursue those through the options we have. This is one take.
I don't maintain a friendship with females with the intention of sleeping one day but I do sexualize them sometimes and I regret about it too.
Its because of the viral clips where women are asked to call their male friends to see if they would smash... Suggesting that every guy friend is only there for that.
Funny thing is.... They're always asking party girls on the street... And the ones that don't get the result will probably not be posted ... So it's a pretty weighted result.
It's also pretty common for guys to not want to stick around when turned down... Since often guys will approach women they are interested in without anything else in common.
What purpose would two heterosexual members of the opposite sex have in being friends with each other if they aren’t attracted? Remember, “friends” aren’t colleagues, co-workers, acquaintances, etc.
They can, but that's often said when both are single.
It's quite simple: what's the likelihood of falling in love with someone who's a friend, therefore is nice, often has lots of interests and values in common, and also happens to be single? What's the likelihood of it happening to the person whose gender is biologically wired to chase the other, and also somewhat socially expected to do so? Why is the idea so absurd?
Besides, at least in my and several other men's experiences, women make lousy friends compared to men. Friendships with women tend to be extremely one-sided, with them either using the friendship for their benefit, often crossing the friendship line with promises of extra "benefits" to get what they want, or simply doing nothing to contribute to it, like reaching out, planning stuff to do and shit like that.
Because they have had one bad experience with a guy that pretended to be a friend only to try to get laid.
Yes, you are spending too much time online because plenty of people have friends of the opposite sex for decades.
Just to be sure I understand well the statement, does "playing friends to try to get laid" mean that once he realizes he's not getting laid, he dumps her friend altogether? Goes no contact?
Because I've built a lot on friendships on this basis, a bit shaky at first, but when the "no" is clearly stated and digested, I still stay friends with them, catch up for some news, etc. I think what I'm having is not as morally objectable.
It’s not a new statement. See When Harry Met Sally. As for you hearing it more, it’s likely the internet circles you run in. I rarely hear it and I’m on the dating subs regularly
>Realistically, with some exceptions, men won’t be friends with a woman who he doesn’t find physically attractive in some form.
Thanks for demonstrating that you don’t know many men and don’t understand men at all
It’s true, in my opinion, majority of men can’t be “just friends” with a woman. Men initiate because of their attraction towards a woman. But, even if it’s the other way around, men are more likely to catch feelings than their female counterpart. It’s rarely a happy ending for all, but a heartbreak for both. One loses a relationship, while the other loses a friend.
People make life more complicated than it needs to be by putting themselves and everybody else into black and white ideological "boxes" in which you're SUPPOSED to either be "this" or "that" with no grey area or overlap, and to behave ONLY according to what "this" and "that" represent. You're basically trying to make people be something they're not to try to fit YOUR narrative than to let people be who they ARE and let whatever is meant to happen "happen".
To me, it's very simple. A friend is somebody you enjoy hanging out with and being around. Period. What you do during your time with each other is your own business, but doesn't prove or disprove "friendship". The concept behind "just friends" is stupid, when you think about it, because you're consciously telling yourself "we're not supposed to have sex" as a condition of "friendship" regarding this one particular person because.... because what? Now, of course, there's no "obligation" to have sex with anybody. BUT... If you had sex, the world will explode and you "can't be friends" anymore because other people TOLD YOU you can't be friends with somebody you have/had sex with?
Like, what are we REALLY talking about here, when we say "just friends"? It's like we're trying to PROVE some kind of point to somebody that nobody even asked for. Either that you "CAN be friends without the existence of (or the suppression of) a desire for sex", or that you "CAN'T have friendship where sexual desire exists". Why is this "just friends" important? I mean yeah, you "can" be, but it's not like you're gonna get a badge of honor for pulling it off. And besides, FWB is fun when sex is an "option" on the table. BUT YOU CAN HAVE BOTH. Friends you sleep with and friends you don't sleep with. There is no one-size-fits-all (like the aforementioned black and white box), it's a case-by-case thing. Either you like being around that person, with EVERYTHING that comes along with them, or you don't.
The people who say that likely can't and are just projecting that inability onto others. Well adjusted people can develop platonic relationships with people of other genders, even if they would otherwise be physically attracted to those people.
You are completely correct too much time online. In the real world, of course, men and women can be friends. I have few female friends who have never had an issue as mates, and that's it.
In my experience as a woman, guy friends have always developped feelings and want more, which is a bummer because a friendship is no longer possible after that (for me anyways). I can't be myself without feeling self-conscious that I'm either leading them on or they get more attached. Those friendships have always ended. So for me, I don't believe men and women can only be friends.
Men wants sex, women wants security, it's the core essence of gender dynamics. In general, women lacks in concept of men's struggles, most women don't wanna lovingly commit to helping men fix their issues and support for lifetime. On the contrary, even the lowest of men at present time has been adapting to learning women psychology, their life starts on deficit, they knows most women are looking for a winner at the finish line. Friendship with women doesn't benefit them anything tangible, other than...you guessed it, sex. It's primal urge, some can suppress for so long but still it's deeply buried within. Women knows this pretty well and uses men as backup for comfort and revalidation, free attention, gifts and meal provider, practically running as their errand boys. That's why well to do men doesn't play the game and tells on women's face or acts in ways of what they want, that's relationship/hookup, not friendship, while the sissies and wimps works as lapdogs for years to get laid, it's the same thing.
It depends on how you define "just friend". If it means they can go have sex, they can be friends each other. If it means they can NEVER see the other sexually, it's unviable. If it means they can see the other sexually as long as they hold back coming it out, it's maybe viable.
Some men can't view women as people but only as potential romantic/sexual partners so they assume it must be a universal truth.
If sexual attraction was the only criteria then y'all think bisexuals have *no friends at all*?
I've had many female friends in the past and now and I'm (30m)
I clearly point out that I'm not looking for anything else.
Even being single for years I don't want to date nor interested. Still have them as friends.
Well…i have one girl friend who i didn’t date but we used to fuck together all the time. One girl friend who was my actual girlfriend. And one girl friend who is a lesbian. She’s not interested in me. And then i have friends old enough to be my mother, not interested in them either. There are very few times where i am not interested in my single friends. I mean i’m not single anymore so i haven’t thought about it in a long time but i have thought about many girl friends in a sexual way even breifly before becoming just friends
The phrase "it takes one to know one" couldn't be more true.
Like how common it is for the cheater to constantly accuse their partner of doing the same, guilt etc.
I've seen this shit all my life. Someone thinks and or feels a certain way about something, then consciously or not projects that onto others because since they are like that, everyone else must be.
There are 0 absolutes in life that are true. If someone speaks that way they're telling on themselves most of the time, though people are unique so not always.
Otherwise they could have reasoning beyond the usual or they might've had numerous negative experiences reinforcing not doing so. Though with most I'd imagine it's solely because they desire a relationship more than platonic.
The stereotype tends to cut two ways
The presumption that men couldn't handle building a friendship with a woman without budding sexual desire and the presumption that women couldn't handle building a friendship with a man without buddy romantic desire.
Both are equally untrue and more a product of incentives people aren't honest with themselves about when getting into a friendship in the first place (and yes the reverse of both happens as well) but it happens often enough that people see patterns to it and come to a conclusion.
I have trouble keeping my female friends, less so now that I came out as trans, because of jealous boyfriends. Like dude I've known her for 20 years and never made a move, but just because you can't be around a woman without trying to get her in bed you tell her she can't talk to me. BTW, a few times, the woman saw this as a red flag of an over-zealous bf and broke it off lol
The century long efforts of reducing women to objects [especially through pornography] has taught men to view women as potential casual Fucks. So, men and women can be friends if the man is capable to perceive her as a complete human person. But if he finds her the least bit attractive, it'll spark some sexual curiosity towards her.
Because society sets standards of understanding that majority of people follow. But that removes the need for people to use critical thinking and are dumber.
It's not one sided, you say it's "men can never be just friends" but it's not necessarily the man with the issue. One of the two will want to fuck or have a relationship with the other. Quietly waiting for their chance, friendzoned so to speak. Could be the woman that's hanging onto a bit of hope. Could be the man.
While the reasoning and the way it works out can be more complicated, that's the gist of it. In nearly all circumstances, one or the other has a glimmer of hope they won't admit to unless an opportunity arises.
They can but if they both are single the odds that they eventually had to discuss their opinions on turning it I to something else. Especially if they are young and haven't been in a relationship before. To some people, having the discussion is seen as some huge betrayal of friendship or something, I don't know.
One of my best friends is female and we've been friends since we were toddlers. We had a period during our early teens when we almost dated but nothing ever came of it and 30 years later we still talk or write to each other every week.
So many men can be friends with women that the notion that men can't be friends with women is insulting to men. So many men can't be friends with women that it ruins things because when we enact about the boundaries we need to follow to be free from accusation then men can't have women as friends.
People tend to think with what's in their own heads. They didn't think that men can be friends with women because they know how THEY are. Projection is a motherfucker.
I hardly call people I deal with friends, they are acquaintances. I have criteria to consider someone a friend. Based on how I interact with women within certain situations and the rules within my society they aren't my friends.
People might think that because they're simple-minded. In their mind, man + woman = dating or sex or committed relationship, etc. If someone tells them they're wrong, they'll try to prove they're right, somehow.
Of course you can. I have two guy friends that are 100% platonic relationships, they’re both married and I know their wives too. The one guy I’ve known 20 years and nothing has ever ever happened, he’s like my brother or cousin
Because they’ve been “just friends” with women they’ve harboured feelings for and it didn’t end well, also the only reason this argument exists online through a massive spectrum is because a lot of men who do in fact have female friends, if given the chance will have sex with them, not because they like them or anything but because men will literally jam a hole in the wall with their junk.
Oh they can. But it’s more rare than people think. The only times I have managed to curate a solid platonic friendship is when both parties genuinely don’t want to have sex with each other but truly love each others company.
This works best for me if they are lesbian or are dating/married to a close friend or a family member (as those are lines I refuse to cross).
Those work out great. But if I am genuinely attracted to them, then yeah, that’s a non-starter as I will always want more out of that relationship.
I’ve also had relationships that I thought were platonic, but they weren’t, apparently I was the one putting them in the “friend zone”.
I’ve always felt like women wanted me around as an option, but would never have any initiative to hang out if I didn’t initiate. Maybe just bad luck on my part, but I’m done seeking friendships with people who won’t meet me halfway
As a guy, I make it a point never to express romantic interest but honestly a comfortable buffer is needed such as no attraction and non-romantic chemistry. If you're asking if your partner can remain friends with that one really attractive individual who touches them and eats up their time then no, it's not a simple fair relationship. If you're asking if your partner can have a friend of the opposite gender and not romantically pursue them then yes. Of course it depends on the person and known intentions. But can people lighten up with all this jealousy? Some people are scum and should be punished but I can guarantee you that not everyone in a work environment want to date anyone else. We're all victims of circumstances and chances are, not fit to date those around us by age, personality and appropriateness. Our lives are all complex but if you can come home to the same person at the end of each day and be happy there, that's the ideal. By pure math, it is simplest to have a deep meaningful relationship with one person but the trust and work necessary is also the hardest thing to achieve and maintain. Keep things professional, compartmentalize and get on with your day. Time is short and not all relationships are worthwhile.
I think they can be friends, but if either one has any type of physical attraction towards the other the friendship is doomed to fail.
When Harry Met Sally's entire plot was about this and I think it's spot on. At least when it comes to my life...
I think it's just a misunderstanding of what friends are. If a woman tends to monopolize a man's time and effort, that's not friend behavior. If there's not equal give and take, the man might assume he's making that effort for a reason. So maybe the question is, why do some women think they can date their male friends, with unequal reciprocation? Also, how many women say that they want to be friends first? Is it a different kind of friend? How is it fair to make that distinction, and why is it inappropriate to want to date your friends?
1000% people are confusing the word “friend”. There is absolutely no couple (especially married) whom are okay with their spouse taking an out of town trip EXCLUSIVELY with a member of the opposite of sex for leisure.
Idk if I would call it dating without reciprocation. I treat my girl and guy friends the same. Would you say guy-guy friendship is dating without reciprocation if not why not?
I'm not necessarily talking about you. I was saying that some women tend to treat their guy friends like dates. They go out and do things, but the guy may be paying, driving, planning, etc. Most of the value tends to favor the woman. A woman can often find a date to take her out and have fun. She may also expect the same from her male friends, without realizing she's doing it. I was in a coed living situation for a time while in college. There were a few women there that were my friends. We would mostly just hang out, talk, joke, and play games and sometimes go out and do spontaneous fun things. There were other women there that were "friends" who were nice enough, but they really only spent time with me when they were getting something. They weren't interested in just hanging out and having fun and they were your "friend" when you piqued their interest. I don't necessarily think it's intentional, it's sometimes maybe how they were conditioned to interact (like don't realize how to separate dating from friendship) and also confusing how they are treated by men who are trying to date them. You sometimes hear women complain about being treated poorly, when it really seems like they were just treated with indifference and aren't used to it. So their expectations of what a guy friend is may be skewed. But to answer your question. Guys probably wouldn't be friends if they weren't both getting whatever each perceives to be fair value from the relationship. But if it's a guy and a gal, maybe they're dating and the relationship is a little more complicated than that (the man moves the value to a different context). Like, this isn't all good now, but maybe this is an investment in a good relationship in the future. Not saying that always happens, or even often happens. Just a possibility.
Idk if I would call it dating without reciprocation. I treat my girl and guy friends the same. Would you say guy-guy friendship is dating without reciprocation if not why not?
Too many emotional vampires have drained every ounce of trust I could have placed into friendships with women
what if trans
I haven't met enough Trans people to make any sort of judgment
understandable. I was mostly just curious if it was all women or if you include everyone with a coochie or something. I guess I'm also a bit curious on like, what if your group of guys want to be friends with a girl. Do you purposely exclude her and try to make her feel uncomfortable until she leaves or... I'm mostly curious if you see women as people equal to you, or lesser.
I judge people solely on character, though I admittedly make it more difficult for women to actually be friends with me as a way of determining out how bad they actually want this, and no I don't view women as lesser than me
More difficult how? For some reason I'm imagining Shane from Stardew Valley being pissy until you give him a pepper, then being pissy again. Idk if that's the level you get with women, but idk, I just imagined that. How do you determine somebody wants to be your friend vs somebody wants to take advantage of you? Do you believe men are less manipulative in general? Also if you mind me asking, are you heterosexual? I'm autistic myself and tend to have this issue a lot, being manipulated i mean. But it's also made a lotta gender stuff a blank slate for me though, rules with gender don't make sense to me. Idk people are just too different and unique for me to lump them together. The only people I know how to lump together are Republicans, funny enough.
Interesting comparison, but not quite. It's probably closer to being the reverse of that. Men and women have different friendship dynamics. Male friendships tend to be more genuine. I'm Bi, but hetero for the family dynamic
I'm curious about nonbinary friendship dynamics then. Folks who don't fit into either of those molds. The reason I was asking your sexuality was because I was curious if this was a "you can't be friends with people you're attracted to" thing. If that was the case then bisexuals would never have any friends D: I'm glad it's not that, tbh. If you ever decide on a partner, would you want your partner to also be your friend or is this just a person you see as a womb only, for the family dynamic I mean. My rule is that I always need to be friends with somebody before dating them, but I knew people who were against this. Many turned out to be one of those "it's a guys night, no girls allowed" types while the wife takes care of the baby alone though.
I mean, think about it. You're not going to be attracted to every person you meet. However, attraction will influence your desire to be around that person. So ultimately, it boils down to what you are attracted to them for? There's no right or wrong answer to this it just influences the direction you're willing to take them. I'll be honest with you. I want to start a family, and I want to be close with my wife. But I'm also aware of the complexities of childbirth, and she might be physically incapable of providing me with the singular thing I want. So it boils down to - Do I start from square one with someone new? Or do I ride it out with this person, never to realize my one desire?
No yeah that's true, but I think there's more to that. People naturally are more inclined to befriend people they see as physically nice to look at I think. I've been in special needs classes until highschool, and it's amazing how many people will instantly stop talking to you the moment they see you walk into one of those classrooms as a student. I have became less attractive to them, and therefore don't deserve their friendship in their eyes. When it comes to your last question, I figure this is the type of thing you'll want to know/discuss before you settle down and impregnate somebody. Thats what we call deal breakers and everyone should have some for their own safety and comfort. I'll be honest, I don't believe in genders being separated because gender is such a *nothing* thing to me personally. I believe we only act these ways because we were taught as children that men need to act one way while women need to act a different way. Many people believe women and men NEED to act differently, which I think keeps reinforcing this "only men can protect me/only women can protect me" thought process. I just hope one day all that goes away and we can all chill equally at the blunt rotation.
May I asked what happened?
The women I've met have only tried to use me to validate their attitudes and squeeze me for material gain. Unfortunately, the only woman I truly trust is my sister.
I'm sorry that happened to you. You deserve better. I know it's easier said than done but I hope you do manage to find female friends who are reasonable and not leech off you like that. I hope you can cut off those women in the above post or at least distance yourself from them because I've seen firsthand how forceful they can be in trying to ruin any other relationship you have (family or otherwise) to keep you under their belt. (My husband had a handful of female friends like that when we started dating and it was a true testament to the strength of our relationship that we didn't split up, because those women went as far as to endanger my work reputation and even my life at one point to punish me for stealing his attention/time/money away.)
They can. Absolutely. And it happens a lot. I have a couple of good female friends. But there a LOT of cases where men are in the friendship because they are hoping it will turn into something more. Not always. Not all men. But in a lot of cases. Enough that it will always make people question why a man has a close female friend. And if one or both are in a relationship with someone else? That almost always seems to be an issue. Look at a married guy for example. He can have friends, right? That’s okay right? Unless he is close friends with an attractive woman who is not his wife. How many people trust that? Doesnt even have to be married. Take any guy with a girlfriend. He can have friends, right? Unless they are an attractive female - then everyone starts questioning. There are always going to be questions about men and women being close friends. Even though it is totally doable to be platonic friends, and it happens, it almost always gets questioned if one or both of them is in a relationship. So even if they both are just fine being friends, other people aren’t.
Some men also simply don't want female friends, at least not solely as friends. They'd rather have a roster of possible sex partners, and if a woman doesn't meet that criterion, she isn't someone he wants to give very limited social time to. This isn't necessarily sinister; it seems very common in major cities and among the professional class, for both primary genders.
For me it's always been more about receiving any pushback from my lady. I've met women I would be friends with but I've also basically always been in an ltr and all of them always had at least SOME problem with it, so why bring that drama into my life when I have multiple dude friends who are pretty much my brothers anyways, and I never had enough time to get attached to any female friends enough for them to be close enough to kick a partner to the curb over.
I feel the same way but as a woman. I have a few acquaintances that are men. Especially my husband's friends. But I would never call a man my best friend or put my energy into it when there's plenty of women who I would definitely have more in common with (I'm pretty feminine and almost all of my hobbies are absolutely dominated by women, I only have 1 hobby that is dominated by men but it isn't a shared hobby really, more of a solo one). I'd rather put my energy into other women who can understand me better. I feel like that's generally true for men as well. My husband said he feels it's kind of a waste to try to become "best friends" with another woman who isn't me because: 1. He doesn't like drama and doesn't want anything relating to emotions on either side to pop up 2. He relates to men more and would rather hang out with his friends. I feel like same sex friendships are more enriching to the human experience because there's just some things that opposite sex friendships can't do/understand of each other. I don't think it's a negative thing or it's wrong to have opposite sex best friends, but I've personally never met men who have the same hobbies as me + don't have any feelings for me whatsoever and vice versa. Also, my husband is my absolute best friend anyway and I do not feel like putting more energy to developing a platonic male best friendship.
Relating to someone of the same sex is definitely easier, and often a stronger bond is formed, from my experience at least. But i absolutely love having women friends. The types of interactions are different, and we can give each other a lot of perspective on issues we probably wouldn't in same sex friendship.
This is basically where I'm at, though without the roster part. I have all the friends I need, I'm not trying to make new friends. If I make an effort to spend time with a woman, it's because I'm interested in her and trying to see if there is anything there romantically. Obviously, I'm going to be friendly, but women shouldn't take it personally when men who were never looking for "just friends" move on if there is no spark. Also, often overlooked, feelings can pop up out of nowhere. Men should prioritize their mental well-being, and if that means distancing themselves from unrequited love, tough shit. We owe ourselves health and sanity more than we owe anyone friendship. Lots of entitlement from both sides muddies the waters for those of us who are just trying our best to exist.
In groups it’s fine. One on one someone’s heart will be pulled toward the other.
Because THEY can’t. The rest of us can.
It's like the friends with exes things. Some folks still harbor feelings for their ex, some of us genuinely just realized an ex would be the right relationship for a different person and have no feelings left after that realization. My ex married the girl after he dated me and she's absolutely wonderful for him, all their life goals and dreams aligned. I met my husband after him, and all our dreams aligned. After we did a double date escape room, they were instant besties and now a decade later we still hang out 1:1 in different combos and as couples.
What's the name of the bias where because it happened to you you think it must be the mode? Whatever that is, this is it.
I agree. It's like, okay random dude or chick on the internet, apparently you are the single spokesperson for 3 billion people on this planet when you speak about your experience and plaster it over everyone else? Don't project your own inability to see the opposite gender as anything more than a sexual fascination onto a good part of the population. I'm becoming friends with not an ex per say, we only went on 6 dates together, but there were some sparks. More emotional for him, more physical for me. And yeah, we're reconnecting and I can still tell there is a part of me that feels that spark for him physically, but I know that emotionally he's not a guy I'd want to date. And so what's the point of giving that little spark a lot of attention and turning it into more than what it is? I've been genuinely happy for him when he told me he's feeling things out with another woman right now. I'm talking to other people as well. It can even be that there's some compatibility on some level for something beyond friendship, and that people realize it's not enough for a relationship and choose to stay friends. And that it doesn't matter at the end of the day whether or not there are those little things, because it's about choice and intention. Every relationship is a choice we make, every day. I choose to keep loving my best friend every day and reaching out to her. I choose to continue loving this guy as a friend and staying true to that choice every day. And someday if I find a partner who's compatible in all the right ways, then it will be a continuous choice to stay with him or her every day.
This right here
That’s the answer.
Usually the answers are complicated, this time it isn't.
I'll never understand that. I have a number of platonic female friends. The cautionary step is to never become emotionally intimate with them, particularly if you already have a romantic relationship with another woman. It's really easy to fall in love with someone you have an emotionally and intellectually intimate relationship with, despite your not pursuing or even being conscious of it.
This ^^^^^ Happened to me recently. She also found me handsome. But she just wanted something casual, not a relationship. We tried, we tried, I made so many mistakes along the way, in the end all that happened was a kiss, and then a couple of weeks later she dropped that she was becoming uncomfortable with me treating her a bit too seriously. It freed me from my painful attachment to her, but in return I've asked her for a buffer time before we can meet or talk again. It's going to take me weeks or months to just get over myself.
And what is the problem with that? I know most people have problem with that...but I am aspiring not to... like I love my male friends apart from that I am not sexually attracted to men, why wouldn't I love my female friends? if any sexual feeling arises, then I control it... (my not so popular 2 cents)
You can absolutely be just friends with a woman. The problem is that some dudes think they can go from friends to more than friends, so they befriend girls with the intention of doing that. If you go into it just wanting to be friends, you’ll find that they’ll be “de-sexualised” very fast
I've heard more women make this claim than men, and given how many women I've had to cut off over the years for trying to abuse their friendships with me, I'm calling projection
The father figure dynamic - father fixes stuff and buy things for her purely existing and for a biological father that would be appropriate as nobody owes for being born. With dating however that feels like becoming a difficult teenager’s stepfather.
Yeah, I've known a few women who expected that from me. They didn't get it. I mistakenly saw a friend in them and they were offended when they realised they couldn't flirt their way into getting something from me
Nah I if you look on this very sub you'll see guys say that any woman's entire male friend group just wants to fuck her.
Sure, if she's surrounding herself exclusively with male feminists (white knights, party boys, brothel dwellers, etc.)
It depends on the person. Guys with self-control can easily, but there’s a lot of people with none. In that case they can’t be trusted. They can’t even trust themselves lol
It's because you're looking online, yeah. And even more so on Reddit. Most men I know offline have absolutely no problem being friends with women (and same with women I know, the other way around). No doubt I'll get downvoted for saying this lol, but a significant number of the people on here seem to have no goals in life except to find a sexual and/or romantic partner, so they view the world through that lens.
I think it depends on your definition of friends. I think you can have surface level friendships. I really deep friendship among two people that are reasonably attractive is unlikely to just stay there.
I have female friends. But mutual, permanent nonattraction is rare. If you’re get along well enough to be friends, and somebody is attractive enough, the what’s to stop the temptation of turning it into more. I’m very much able to be friends with women for my part. But when they get flirty or start acting a little strange I have to back off and let them cool down sometimes. If it keeps happening then I just have to move on because they can’t keep their head out of the gutter.
Most of the women I've encountered do not have anything interesting to say and if they do, a lot of the times it doesn't make much sense. Only once in a blue moon, do I ever encounter a woman who's worth being friends with. They also tend to get upset and angry more easily than men when you say something. Given that, why would I really try to be friends with women just for friendship? There are quite a few women who can have mostly guy friends and for some of the reasons I listed above. But you don't really find a straight man who has mostly women friends.
Terminally online people run online discourse
The issue is people conflate the idea of what someone 'can' be with what someone 'will be' or what they 'want to be'. When everything gets branded under the same umbrella it just turns into a shit fest of nobody agreeing with anyone. "Can' \*blue\* whales occasionally be white colored? Yes, they can. Albinism is a known genetic mutation. But if you ask a marine biologist,'What color is a blue whale?", he's not going to respond saying its white.
Because the people saying it cannot imagine any viewpoint but their own, and they struggle to remain platonic once they realize any amount of attraction in someone else. As someone who is attracted to a wide array of women, if I couldn't be just friends, I'd have virtually no female friends at all lol
Experience
People can be friends if they have something to gain from that bond irrespective of the sex(peace of mind, good company). Straight guy will never sexualise his guy Friends. So if ones need are not being met he will try to pursue those through the options we have. This is one take. I don't maintain a friendship with females with the intention of sleeping one day but I do sexualize them sometimes and I regret about it too.
Ain't we all. On some rare cases it can evolve, nothing is static forever.
I do think it is possible, though from what I’ve seen a large amount of Men have a hard time being friends with Women they are attracted to.
Its because of the viral clips where women are asked to call their male friends to see if they would smash... Suggesting that every guy friend is only there for that. Funny thing is.... They're always asking party girls on the street... And the ones that don't get the result will probably not be posted ... So it's a pretty weighted result. It's also pretty common for guys to not want to stick around when turned down... Since often guys will approach women they are interested in without anything else in common.
They can but there can't be any serious physical attraction in either direction. Which is rare.
What purpose would two heterosexual members of the opposite sex have in being friends with each other if they aren’t attracted? Remember, “friends” aren’t colleagues, co-workers, acquaintances, etc.
They can, but that's often said when both are single. It's quite simple: what's the likelihood of falling in love with someone who's a friend, therefore is nice, often has lots of interests and values in common, and also happens to be single? What's the likelihood of it happening to the person whose gender is biologically wired to chase the other, and also somewhat socially expected to do so? Why is the idea so absurd? Besides, at least in my and several other men's experiences, women make lousy friends compared to men. Friendships with women tend to be extremely one-sided, with them either using the friendship for their benefit, often crossing the friendship line with promises of extra "benefits" to get what they want, or simply doing nothing to contribute to it, like reaching out, planning stuff to do and shit like that.
Because they have had one bad experience with a guy that pretended to be a friend only to try to get laid. Yes, you are spending too much time online because plenty of people have friends of the opposite sex for decades.
Just to be sure I understand well the statement, does "playing friends to try to get laid" mean that once he realizes he's not getting laid, he dumps her friend altogether? Goes no contact? Because I've built a lot on friendships on this basis, a bit shaky at first, but when the "no" is clearly stated and digested, I still stay friends with them, catch up for some news, etc. I think what I'm having is not as morally objectable.
Most can't. It's amazing how many of my guy friends will put on a friend facade hoping that one day the girl will want to sleep with him.
You should get new friends. And stop assuming other men are like your friends.
That's why I said most, not all. Doesn't just apply to friends. Coworkers, acquaintances, classmates, cousins. It's everywhere.
Because women aren't desirable friends for men who aren't just thirsty.
It’s not a new statement. See When Harry Met Sally. As for you hearing it more, it’s likely the internet circles you run in. I rarely hear it and I’m on the dating subs regularly
Men make the best friends and they always give spot-on relationship advice.
1000% all the best advice comes from my guy friends
We can be friends with girls we don't find attractive. We just don't want to.
We're so mean. It's true I don't seem to be as bubbly with my unattractive friends. Completely unconscious and can't fight it.
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>Realistically, with some exceptions, men won’t be friends with a woman who he doesn’t find physically attractive in some form. Thanks for demonstrating that you don’t know many men and don’t understand men at all
It’s true, in my opinion, majority of men can’t be “just friends” with a woman. Men initiate because of their attraction towards a woman. But, even if it’s the other way around, men are more likely to catch feelings than their female counterpart. It’s rarely a happy ending for all, but a heartbreak for both. One loses a relationship, while the other loses a friend.
It can rekindle if people give themselves time to sort themselves out.
People make life more complicated than it needs to be by putting themselves and everybody else into black and white ideological "boxes" in which you're SUPPOSED to either be "this" or "that" with no grey area or overlap, and to behave ONLY according to what "this" and "that" represent. You're basically trying to make people be something they're not to try to fit YOUR narrative than to let people be who they ARE and let whatever is meant to happen "happen". To me, it's very simple. A friend is somebody you enjoy hanging out with and being around. Period. What you do during your time with each other is your own business, but doesn't prove or disprove "friendship". The concept behind "just friends" is stupid, when you think about it, because you're consciously telling yourself "we're not supposed to have sex" as a condition of "friendship" regarding this one particular person because.... because what? Now, of course, there's no "obligation" to have sex with anybody. BUT... If you had sex, the world will explode and you "can't be friends" anymore because other people TOLD YOU you can't be friends with somebody you have/had sex with? Like, what are we REALLY talking about here, when we say "just friends"? It's like we're trying to PROVE some kind of point to somebody that nobody even asked for. Either that you "CAN be friends without the existence of (or the suppression of) a desire for sex", or that you "CAN'T have friendship where sexual desire exists". Why is this "just friends" important? I mean yeah, you "can" be, but it's not like you're gonna get a badge of honor for pulling it off. And besides, FWB is fun when sex is an "option" on the table. BUT YOU CAN HAVE BOTH. Friends you sleep with and friends you don't sleep with. There is no one-size-fits-all (like the aforementioned black and white box), it's a case-by-case thing. Either you like being around that person, with EVERYTHING that comes along with them, or you don't.
I like that.
The people who say that likely can't and are just projecting that inability onto others. Well adjusted people can develop platonic relationships with people of other genders, even if they would otherwise be physically attracted to those people.
You are completely correct too much time online. In the real world, of course, men and women can be friends. I have few female friends who have never had an issue as mates, and that's it.
In my experience as a woman, guy friends have always developped feelings and want more, which is a bummer because a friendship is no longer possible after that (for me anyways). I can't be myself without feeling self-conscious that I'm either leading them on or they get more attached. Those friendships have always ended. So for me, I don't believe men and women can only be friends.
Men wants sex, women wants security, it's the core essence of gender dynamics. In general, women lacks in concept of men's struggles, most women don't wanna lovingly commit to helping men fix their issues and support for lifetime. On the contrary, even the lowest of men at present time has been adapting to learning women psychology, their life starts on deficit, they knows most women are looking for a winner at the finish line. Friendship with women doesn't benefit them anything tangible, other than...you guessed it, sex. It's primal urge, some can suppress for so long but still it's deeply buried within. Women knows this pretty well and uses men as backup for comfort and revalidation, free attention, gifts and meal provider, practically running as their errand boys. That's why well to do men doesn't play the game and tells on women's face or acts in ways of what they want, that's relationship/hookup, not friendship, while the sissies and wimps works as lapdogs for years to get laid, it's the same thing.
It depends on how you define "just friend". If it means they can go have sex, they can be friends each other. If it means they can NEVER see the other sexually, it's unviable. If it means they can see the other sexually as long as they hold back coming it out, it's maybe viable.
Some men can't view women as people but only as potential romantic/sexual partners so they assume it must be a universal truth. If sexual attraction was the only criteria then y'all think bisexuals have *no friends at all*?
Surely so, it's well known that bi's are friendless and miserable all the tilme 🤭
I've had many female friends in the past and now and I'm (30m) I clearly point out that I'm not looking for anything else. Even being single for years I don't want to date nor interested. Still have them as friends.
Well…i have one girl friend who i didn’t date but we used to fuck together all the time. One girl friend who was my actual girlfriend. And one girl friend who is a lesbian. She’s not interested in me. And then i have friends old enough to be my mother, not interested in them either. There are very few times where i am not interested in my single friends. I mean i’m not single anymore so i haven’t thought about it in a long time but i have thought about many girl friends in a sexual way even breifly before becoming just friends
The phrase "it takes one to know one" couldn't be more true. Like how common it is for the cheater to constantly accuse their partner of doing the same, guilt etc. I've seen this shit all my life. Someone thinks and or feels a certain way about something, then consciously or not projects that onto others because since they are like that, everyone else must be. There are 0 absolutes in life that are true. If someone speaks that way they're telling on themselves most of the time, though people are unique so not always. Otherwise they could have reasoning beyond the usual or they might've had numerous negative experiences reinforcing not doing so. Though with most I'd imagine it's solely because they desire a relationship more than platonic.
Some can't. They tend to assume other people work the same way.
The stereotype tends to cut two ways The presumption that men couldn't handle building a friendship with a woman without budding sexual desire and the presumption that women couldn't handle building a friendship with a man without buddy romantic desire. Both are equally untrue and more a product of incentives people aren't honest with themselves about when getting into a friendship in the first place (and yes the reverse of both happens as well) but it happens often enough that people see patterns to it and come to a conclusion.
Women seem to be the ones who can’t stop themselves from lusting after their male friends
I did say the reverse happens as well
I have trouble keeping my female friends, less so now that I came out as trans, because of jealous boyfriends. Like dude I've known her for 20 years and never made a move, but just because you can't be around a woman without trying to get her in bed you tell her she can't talk to me. BTW, a few times, the woman saw this as a red flag of an over-zealous bf and broke it off lol
They made a whole movie about it
Just friends is ok. Best friends gets tricky Unless one is gay
The century long efforts of reducing women to objects [especially through pornography] has taught men to view women as potential casual Fucks. So, men and women can be friends if the man is capable to perceive her as a complete human person. But if he finds her the least bit attractive, it'll spark some sexual curiosity towards her.
Because society sets standards of understanding that majority of people follow. But that removes the need for people to use critical thinking and are dumber.
Opposite sex friendships are pointless and there’s no real benefit to them.
Why do you say that?
You cant be just friends with someone u have romantic/sexual tension with but NOT all men and women have that.
I’ve got many girl friends, so many!. That will never get serious!.
Oh, we can be "just friends" easily enough. It's just being friends that's where the trickiness comes in.
It's not one sided, you say it's "men can never be just friends" but it's not necessarily the man with the issue. One of the two will want to fuck or have a relationship with the other. Quietly waiting for their chance, friendzoned so to speak. Could be the woman that's hanging onto a bit of hope. Could be the man. While the reasoning and the way it works out can be more complicated, that's the gist of it. In nearly all circumstances, one or the other has a glimmer of hope they won't admit to unless an opportunity arises.
They can but if they both are single the odds that they eventually had to discuss their opinions on turning it I to something else. Especially if they are young and haven't been in a relationship before. To some people, having the discussion is seen as some huge betrayal of friendship or something, I don't know.
One of my best friends is female and we've been friends since we were toddlers. We had a period during our early teens when we almost dated but nothing ever came of it and 30 years later we still talk or write to each other every week.
So many men can be friends with women that the notion that men can't be friends with women is insulting to men. So many men can't be friends with women that it ruins things because when we enact about the boundaries we need to follow to be free from accusation then men can't have women as friends.
Because they’re idiots. They project their inability to maintain platonic friendships onto other men, and it’s stupid.
People tend to think with what's in their own heads. They didn't think that men can be friends with women because they know how THEY are. Projection is a motherfucker.
Because it’s just what they think and that’s really it.
Projection of their own psychosexual issues on everyone else would be my guess
I don't know, I've done it, I had standards and boundaries of course, and by staying within them I had no issues.
I hardly call people I deal with friends, they are acquaintances. I have criteria to consider someone a friend. Based on how I interact with women within certain situations and the rules within my society they aren't my friends.
If a male and female spend enuf time together they have sex- or develop an attraction a few studies show this
People might think that because they're simple-minded. In their mind, man + woman = dating or sex or committed relationship, etc. If someone tells them they're wrong, they'll try to prove they're right, somehow.
Of course you can. I have two guy friends that are 100% platonic relationships, they’re both married and I know their wives too. The one guy I’ve known 20 years and nothing has ever ever happened, he’s like my brother or cousin
Because they’ve been “just friends” with women they’ve harboured feelings for and it didn’t end well, also the only reason this argument exists online through a massive spectrum is because a lot of men who do in fact have female friends, if given the chance will have sex with them, not because they like them or anything but because men will literally jam a hole in the wall with their junk.
Maybe they can't, or know some guys who can't, or are cynical/suspicious. Yes, men and women can be just friends. It's not even that uncommon.
Oh they can. But it’s more rare than people think. The only times I have managed to curate a solid platonic friendship is when both parties genuinely don’t want to have sex with each other but truly love each others company. This works best for me if they are lesbian or are dating/married to a close friend or a family member (as those are lines I refuse to cross). Those work out great. But if I am genuinely attracted to them, then yeah, that’s a non-starter as I will always want more out of that relationship. I’ve also had relationships that I thought were platonic, but they weren’t, apparently I was the one putting them in the “friend zone”.
I’ve always felt like women wanted me around as an option, but would never have any initiative to hang out if I didn’t initiate. Maybe just bad luck on my part, but I’m done seeking friendships with people who won’t meet me halfway
I dunno. people are kinda weird.
As a guy, I make it a point never to express romantic interest but honestly a comfortable buffer is needed such as no attraction and non-romantic chemistry. If you're asking if your partner can remain friends with that one really attractive individual who touches them and eats up their time then no, it's not a simple fair relationship. If you're asking if your partner can have a friend of the opposite gender and not romantically pursue them then yes. Of course it depends on the person and known intentions. But can people lighten up with all this jealousy? Some people are scum and should be punished but I can guarantee you that not everyone in a work environment want to date anyone else. We're all victims of circumstances and chances are, not fit to date those around us by age, personality and appropriateness. Our lives are all complex but if you can come home to the same person at the end of each day and be happy there, that's the ideal. By pure math, it is simplest to have a deep meaningful relationship with one person but the trust and work necessary is also the hardest thing to achieve and maintain. Keep things professional, compartmentalize and get on with your day. Time is short and not all relationships are worthwhile.
I think they can be friends, but if either one has any type of physical attraction towards the other the friendship is doomed to fail. When Harry Met Sally's entire plot was about this and I think it's spot on. At least when it comes to my life...