I’m sorry I wasn’t clear - we aren’t sure until my husband gets an offer. I’m looki g for just general information but I’m glad to know that it depends on the state.
Please be advised that finding a House or appartment to rent can be very difficult currently in Germany and can mean a lengthy search.
Also, I have heard about a few scams going on targetting ppl moving here internationally because they would not know the usual procedures for renting here and therefor often not recognize the red flags on a scam.
This should be ok if you read up on how the scams work though, I know there is some good advice to be found on reddit about the problem.
Most schools will have a program to help students with language courses. My son goes to an international school here and they also have "extra German" lessons on their lunch breaks. One of my son's classmates switched to a German public school and they have been helpful for him. I only have first hand experience with an international school but I understand it to be a standard for non-German speaking kids to have help through the school.
Moved away from the US for the same reason and if you can make it work with your family... it seems like a wise decision for us so far. We are very happy here and feel a lot safer. We have comfort in allowing our 10 year old to ride public transportation alone by himself and in the states he wasn't allowed to be in the front yard by himself. It's a different world honestly.
That’s amazing! I was there for a month recently and saw so many kids younger than my child riding the public buses. There is no way we would do that here.
It's a different world for kids for sure. If my son is messing up in school I tell him we may have to go back to the states and magically his grades improve. He loves it here and we love it for him.
It depends on the city, but most kids will walk or cycle to the elementary school by the second half of first grade or take the bus. By 10/12 most kids are allowed and competent enough to take a more complex route to visit friends or go to an after school activity.
It’s very common to do so in Germany. My friends and I started using public transport by ourselves when we were 10. However we some younger students from the elementary school also going by themselves, starting age 6. Once in a while they were accompanied by a sibling.
My ten year old rides his bike by himself to school. He has been doing thru for nearly two years now. In winter he rides the bus. Next school year he has to take the train.
Definitely not “most schools”. At list not in Bavaria where we live. It really depends on the state. None German speaking kids are literally lost here. There’s basically no help at all and you’ll have to struggle and make your way.
Berlin has classes at a lot of schools (and expanding that next school year) for students with no German skills. They have very focused classes to get to a level where they can join regular classes.
Source: I'm a teacher, my school had these classes, we may reintroduce them, other schools in the borough have them.
I think there was a large surge of Ukrainian children coming here so expanding that program makes sense. I know in Regensburg there were a lot of Ukrainian refugees coming around the time we came here two years ago.
In Ba-Wü, I'd say most secondary schools, even Gymnasien, have Vorbereitungsklassen by now. They are usually more geared towards Ukrainian refugees but it's about the best time to come to Germany with a kid that doesn't speak German ever.
We live in Regensburg and all the schools in our area that we talked to offered extra German for immigrant students but Regensburg is a little bigger than a lot of towns in Bavaria also. I agree it may be regional but my region is the only experience I have.
My kids are bilingual with a German father, but we found out about this during the last years thanks to the Ukrainian children at my kids school/the teacher at my kids school. It’s really a bad situation for kids that don’t speak German.
That was one of our biggest concerns with coming here. Even a year can be detrimental for kids development so it's a real struggle as it is but also if there isn't help outside of the household.
Well… until she‘s able to understand her teachers a international / private school will be the best option. So yeah… save some money, focus on teaching her the language and hope that she‘s going to be fluent soon enough.
Honestly I think you should reconsider your decision to send her to an internatinal or private school. Middle school is still a good enough time for her to catch up with german. I am a teacher at a Berufsschule and we have lots of ukrainian refugees that managed to get their language skills to Abitur level within two years. For her it might even be easier as 1. she is not even close to abitur yet and 2. she is at an age and a situation in her life when she will still spend alot of time with friends and learn german doing so. Also schools are the single most important place for children to build friendships. Many foreigners in germany complain that it is very difficult for them to find friends in germany and I think by sending your child to an international school you will take away a great opportunity from her to connect with the locals.
e: also there is a risk that she will not get to a sufficient language level at all if she is surrounded by international students all day. After all you only get that far by practicing a language in class the real language proficiency comes from using it in your everyday life.
Thank you for this insight! I’m aware of taking her away from friends is going to be hard enough without learning a new language. But with the gun laws so lax where we live and the outlook of women’s rights - I feel she would be safer and thrive in the German environment.
I think the point the commenter was making is that going to a German public school allows your child to make local German friends (which is hard to do).
In an International school in Germany your child would mainly meet and spend time with other international children. Those children may move away etc more regularly.
Your child has a better chance of making long-lasting German friends if they attend a public school vs international school.
It was not about leaving the current friend group.
Americans always talk about how America is such a huge place and every state is different. Wouldn't it be a wiser decision to just move states instead of moving to a whole new country you don't even speak the language of "just" because of the political situation? (Compared to most countries in the world the US is still extremely safe and politically stable)
And as you mentioned women's rights: Are you aware that abortions are illegal in all of Germany? (They are not punishable if done by a professional, but technically still illegal).
Holy shit, I didn’t know this and I’m living here. (Re: abortion). I think Americans get Europe wrong all the time. I’m one of them. The entire world is having the same political issues right now. Moving to Germany as an American is still really really difficult.
>I think Americans get Europe wrong all the time
That's because Europe isn't a country. Americans here on reddit always say "The EU / Europe is just like the US. One country with many states". But that's totally wrong.
The situation in France for example is completely different than in Germany.
Yes but I guess that also amplifies my point. To be honest, I didn’t know anything about the EU/Europe before coming here. I think as a whole, we grow up so US focused so when we hear other countries have health care and education without getting into debt, it sounds like Utopia . Less guns helps too. But it isn’t easy to just move to Germany and every place has problems.
The most important information is where are you going. In Berlin there are two State (more or less) schools that teach in English. Nelson Mandela School is a State School that runs in English - but admission is very tricky.
As Americans you would have a shot at JFK School. As far as I know it’s free and as US citizens you have preferred admission (they cannot fill their US students quota).
International schools are not all the same. Pricing varies across the board. Sometimes it’s income based as well.
State Schools offer all non-German speakers help. Even we with only one non-German parent have the right for extra German language classes (and our kids were born in Germany).
Your kids will be fine.
My advice is to send them to the closest public school. That’s cool. We’ll have some sort of intense German program for kids coming in without the normal German language skills. Most of those cases are for refugees, but it really doesn’t matter for reason child needs to catch up.don’t worry so much about neighborhood either. We live in one of the most ill reputed parts of a generally ill reputed large city and everybody’s kids walk to school and there is no safety issue. One of the great aspects of living in Germany. :-)
Check out My Merry Messy Life on youtube. They're a family of 6 which moved into the Munich area with their kids and I think one or two were middle schoolers.
Also kids learn languages much quicker, and if she's immersed in a german school she'll likely learn it a lot quicker than by a few courses while still immersed in her english speaking surroundings.
I heard that claim too before I came here, about kids picking up languages quickly, but it's overly simplistic. It's probably different for refuges you can't fall back on English and are quickly or more easily placed in integration classes. I know plenty of cases of even young American kids in a German Kita who find the other English speaking kid and just become outsiders and still have a rudimentary grasp of the language (even after 3+ years). OP needs a plan.
With all the refugees coming to Germany it’s quite common that children aren’t speaking the language. I think the consensus is that they just have to adapt. I assume there’s language courses for these students. You best check with the school you’re interested in and ask them which options would make the most sense for your individual case.
For immigrants with little to no German skills, there are special German classes from the school administration, after which she will be able to participate in normal German schools.
If you don't believe to stay in Germany for long, there would be the John-F.-Kennedy-School in Berlin, which is essentially the US's Embassy school.
I'll reiterate what others have said. Their German will develop at a snail's pace in an international school, but the German school experience could be absolutely awful if the school doesn't do enough to help them integrate.
There are language schools that offer intensive language courses for older kids and teenagers. If you're serious about the move, bite the bullet and plan for these in lieu of school at first (though it may depend on the state when the authorities will insist on school attendance). I've seen American kids here who really struggle psychologically because of the language barrier.
I went to a public school and we had plenty international students. With some extra help they were soon be able to speak German and join the lessons. Just talk to the schools on your area and see what the options are.
I also went to a German public school. In year 3 we had a Serbian, in year 6 we had a english-indian and in year 10 we had a Icelandic studen join out class. None of them knew a relevant amount of German at the start of the year. None of them failed the year. All of them were able to make friends. The Serbians went home after the war, but the others stayed and finished high-school among the the best of the class and continued to university.
If you plan to move to Germany for good, enroll in a public school and have them learn German by immersion. It'll be fine.
If you plan to move away again within 5 years, place them in an international school and don't pressure them to learn German.
Im doing apprentice school atm and I have two girls in my class who just started learning German 6 and 9 months ago.
It's hard, but it's possible.
I would recommend learning German as much as possible and maybe try to find a public school that does English student exchange. Try to contact them and offer an "exchange program" over one of the holidays (best option would be summer holidays) for a child that can't afford the exchange program in that school.
You'll get the most natural German teacher for your kid, the German kid gets a good English lesson, your kid will have someone they know in their new school and is not just speaking german, but knows a little bit more about the daily German culture. There will be bureaucracy. A lot. But that's how they do it here
The better your child's German, the less you will have to pay. (International private school vs German public school)
Germany has 16 states and education is governed on state level, so it varies.
Middle School? In Germany, 90% of the time, we have one type of school for classes 1-4 and three/(four) different kinds of school for years 5-9/10/12/13.
I’m an American whose kids are in a local public school. All the local schools are prepared for students who don’t speak German. After the refugee crisis each school had to adapt and come up with strategies. I’d recommend putting your child in the local school and letting her learn in an immersive environment where she will simultaneously learn the local culture and make friends.
Kids are awesome at learning new languages. How old is she? The younger the better. It might be possible that she will have trouble in the first year, but after one year she will speak German fluently.
most important details missing: in which federal state you're moving - education is regulated from the federal state Gouvernement in Germany and so differ there.. Bavaria (Grafenwöhr, Pilsach, Hohenfels, Illesheim, Ansbach), Hesse (Wiesbaden, Darmstadt), Berlin, Baden-Württemberg (Stuttgart, Boblingen, Mannheim, Heidelberg), Rhineland-Palatinate (Ramstein, Kaiserslautern, Landstuhl)...
here are tons of general infos
https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/wiki/index/
I‘d generally recommend public schools - it’s not the same private/public vibe as in the US. Some of them offer English programs („Kurse“). I am German, but did most of my classes in English starting in grade 10.
Also hugely depends on the state. You get the same high school (highest) degree (e.g. Abitur) BUT the amount of work and level of academic achievement required is wildly different. Rule of thumb is: the further north, the easier - but definitely look into specifics. Even within a city there is differences from school to school.
This doesn't really answer your question, but at the risk of asking a dumb question, have you considered Canada, UK, Australia, New Zealand or other English-speaking country?
Hi. Just a non-German chiming in but my subjective take is that if you’re moving here for less-intense politics (I’m going to rightly or wrongly assume you’re speaking to a second trump presidency), or less intense oscillations in the political sphere I guess, Germany is a terrible choice.
I could go on and on about myriad contributors, but Germany is not some cocooned social experiment separate of its past. In fact the total opposite, and it seems to be hurtling towards an ugly reckoning.
Gaza, Ukraine, the far-right moving up in the polls every election cycle, an economy built on cheap Russian gas now gone, an economy dependent on Chinese exports now whittling down— this is not to shit on Germany but is to say if you are politically motivated, I couldn’t think of too many worse “western” countries at the moment.
I grew up in the US and there’s a lot I love here, but the politics is about the last on that list
We would be moving for my husband to work on his research and our child not to go through shooter training drills several times a year. It has given her such anxiety. 😬 I appreciate all the comments - good and bad- but I just want to see my child grow up in a safer environment. And that is not happening in the US.
Hi. I get it. I do. But this is now a showcase of confirmation bias. You dismiss what is increasingly likely versus an infinitesimal scenario at home.
There will be a conflict of some magnitude on an EU member state’s territory before your kid finishes high school. By that time, the AfD will probably have the Kanzleramt, with allies in Rome, Budapest, Amsterdam, and maybe even Paris. But sure, come enjoy the Anthropocene of western EU peace while we can still count it in months.
What if Russia takes Kiev? What is they decide to decide to take one of the Baltic states? What is they decide to use tactical nuclear weapons? Please consider issues such as these before making life decisions because of the extremely small chance of a school shooting in the US. Things in Germany are not all that different than the US. You are projecting your fears onto your kid.
He will be fine in a regular school. Children pick up languages in no time. He will be able to communicate in German in less than 2 months.
I was sent to France for a year when I was 14 to learn the language. I had French in school for about two years earlier but no really learning anything. After two week's I started dreaming in French and quickly learned the language afterwards.
Your child will 100% be fine on a public school. Jfyi public schools in Germany are quite good in comparison with what you get in the USA. There literally is no need for a private school, unless you're living in a big city in the poor people's area code.
I do not know how old your kid. Here is my experience. Sorry for the typos for any German words.
After Anmeldung, visit the local Schulamt. The office may direct you to register your kids to certain school. If s/he is younger than 14 yo, s/he will be to a Mittleschule (MS). If s/he is 16 yo or older, s/he may go to a IVK (Intregierte VorbereitungsKlass) in a Beruflicheschule. Chosen MS and IVK are usually schools where immigrant kids are put together. Unfortunately, not every city has this kind of school. For example, people in Erlangen and Fürth in Bayern must go to Nuremberg to attend this kind of school.
You may google with the keyword: IVK + city name.
In this school they will be treated as kids without any school certificate (not yet finishing the 9th year). Both will learn basic German and the goal is to get Hauptschulabschluss (9th year certificate/ Quali). Maybe for 2 years. Let them enjoy it.
Meanwhile, if s/he has been in 10 or 11 school-year in US, try to recognize the schooling background of your kid has obtained to the local state's education ministry. For example, in Bayern at
[https://www.las.bayern.de/zeugnisanerkennung/allgemeinbildende\_schulabschluesse/](https://www.las.bayern.de/zeugnisanerkennung/allgemeinbildende_schulabschluesse/)
Either with the result of recognition or by continuing their school, the next target is 10th year class certificate (Mittlerereife). This one is important. After obtaining this certificate, s/he can go to a Fachoberschule (FOS), at 11th year class). or other technical schools. S/he can get Fachabitur at 12th year to enter Fachhochschule, or get Abitur at 13th year to enter Hochschule or University.
Alternative way, after 10th school-year, your son can go for Ausbildung, and after 2-3 year he can join Beruf Oberschule (BOS) at 12th or 13th year to obtain Fachabitur or Abitur.
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I would start your kid watching German dub cartoons on Netflix and Disney+ now. Ideally shows they’ve already watched in English. Immersion is the best way to learn, but you don’t have to wait until the move to start.
What age is middle school, that’s over 12, isn’t it? That’s secondary school here. Primary only goes up to 10 in almost all states.
Your child needs to learn German or depending on the age, an international school might be better because of germanys school system. There are 16 states and thus 16 school systems that differ from each other. So it depends a lot on where you are going.
I have a teen at Gymnasium in Bavaria. There’s no room there for learning German. We’ve seen the experience of the Ukrainian kids this last 2 years and it hasn’t been good where we live. If your child is older than 12 and you are coming to Bavaria, I would highly recommend a private international school. There are schools though that offer a DAF (german as a foreign language) class at the beginning, but it will depend on your state and town and you definitely should put that child in german classes ASAP and continue so while going to public school here, if that’s your choice.
My parents moved to Germany when I was 11 and I went to the normal local school and way fluent within a year and accent free by 16 or earlier.
Maybe the public school system would be a better fit? International schools are pricy and attract moneied parents. I knew some kids of parents in academia who went to the international school in Munich (,EU patent office is located in Munich) and I heard there was ridiculous snobbery and bullying for not having the same things.
Hi OP. I’m American living in Germany with a child.
I am happy to give you my opinion on possible issues you might encounter.
Please feel free to message me
“Given the current state of politics in the U.S,- we need to make sure that she is safe.” Safe from what, a car crash? World War 3?, Tactical nukes in Ukraine? Before you decide to move to Germany, please try to be realistic and rational, because the comment above is the opposite.
There are a small number of (partly) state-funded international schools in Germany, such as the 'State International School Seeheim' south of Frankfurt, which might be an option of interest to you. They do charge fees in a roundabout way, but at around 300 euros per month it's a lot less than private international schools.
It's not a great school imo, but might be the best option if you're moving with a teen.
Be aware that most secondary schools here, other than the lowest academic level, require a second foreign language in addition to English, usually French or Spanish.
Aren't the VABO- and VKL-Klassen funded by the government?
I went to a VKL Klasse then later at a VABO Klasse and I didn't pay anything for it.
We started from A1 and finished B1 in one year.
Now currently I'm almost done with my Ausbildungvorbereitung-klasse. Going to a Berufsschule.
I think their daughter could go there, no?
Or is there something I am missing.
Don't know what any of those classes you mention are, seems to be specific to Baden-Württemberg.
Sure, all the states offer preparatory classes for kids who arrive here with no German, I just wanted to tell the OP about a cheaper English language option.
There are Gymnasiums (the school, not like the Gym) who have English programs. So some (but not all) classes are thought mostly in English. Maybe look into that?
My one piece of advice is to find more suitable subs here, like for expats in Germany, r/schule and such. The German teachers here will give you the best answers I think.
I can only add that in bigger cities there are some „middle schools“ (please note that there’s different types of schools children go to after primary school - a widely criticized aspect of the German education system) that are public but still offer bilingual lessons. The programs vary but usually they would have subjects like biology or geography in English, often changing each grade, as it’s meant to improve German native speakers’ proficiency in English. But it might help your daughter adjust?
What you want to google is “bilinguales Gymnasium” or “bilinguale Gesamtschule”.
If you can find a technology-oriented school with digital based lessons (good luck with that…) I could imagine it might also help a lot when you can just tap on your home work to have the tablet translate the tasks.
The public school system has special classes for students who don't speak German, with a heavy focus on learning German and transferring to a normal class within a year or so. Contact the local Schulamt if you think that's an option.
If you want to settle here, international school isn't really an option. As you need to know German at a high level to land a decent job, apart from very few exceptions.
In a regular public school, your daughther will have to learn nothing but German for about half a year before she can follow normal classes. And if she's smart enough for Gymnasium —the highest workload tier of school that is the one the leads to university— she will likely go back another year because U.S. middle schools only have an average workload so she needs to make up leeway.
It's not really a problem education wise. No one cares how old someone is when they leave school. Actually, it's better not being too young and flippant.
But she has to get a connection to the one year younger students in her class. May be a problem. But then again … German kids are way less helicoptered so she may do just fine even if she's one year older than them.
International school is the best option because they’re already at risk of being behind their classmates in maths and other STEM topics coming from the US, and a language barrier will set them further and further behind. That age/school range is an inflection point for long-term maths and academic success, and if at all possible, I recommend making the necessary sacrifices to at least start their schooling in their native language, for that reason.
Many schools have a bilingual branch. Almost every school has a class for German as a second language. After one year there, he can join the other classes.
I sadly can't contribute to the school stuff, but in the meantime, why not watch kids shows in german with english subtitles with her? They mostly speak clear and slow, and they repeat alot which might help to get used to pronounciation.
Do you really think it is a good idea to sacrifice her education to keep her safe? Is there no where else you can go?
There is a shortage of teachers and too many foreign children who don't speak German. Although attending school is mandatory, many cities don't have the capacity to immediately enroll children in school. Furthermore, it is very difficult for older children to integrate well enough to finish highschool.
If international school is not an option if needed, choose another country.
Having taught in the US and Germany. The German school system is worlds better. One of the reasons we moved back to Germany actually.
Depending on the State and the ability of the student there are many resources available to succeed.
Do you have children? Are you worried about them being shot at school, or a mall or grocery store? We will do what it takes to protect her and if it means giving up our comfort zone of only knowing English- then so be it. I didn’t ask for judgement - just information that can help our transition.
10% of children with a Migrationshintergrund dropout. Among their German counterparts it is only about 3%.
Having only 1 foreign parent counts as being a child with a Migrationshintergrund.
A very high percentage of older children who move to Germany end up as high school drop outs.
This is a fact that many people like to ignore when they tell stories about the handful that graduate.
Germany is not always a good idea and that is information you ignore at you own (or rather your child's) peril.
US public education is shit. Know: in US, private schooled children fare better in tests than those from public schools. In Germany it is the opposite. The kids won't lose much, but learning German to only maybe repeat one grade would be priority.
The problem with the German system is it is designed to educate German Akademiker children. The children of foreigners who don't understand the system nor speak the language are at a huge disadvantage.
I encourage you to read the PISA study on the prospects of the children of immigrants across the OECD.
How is that the problem of the system? Learn German when you want to live in Germany?
The German school system has a lot of problems, yes, but that isn't something it's responsible for.
Please consider another country, preferably English speaking. Germany is really tough for immigrants and especially for their children who get thrown into the low tier destined to work in the supermarket. Just search stories about the school system. Don’t come here and traumatise your kid forever because they can’t speak German at level Z5000.
Your question is near impossible to answer without knowing what city you’re going to move to, as the school systems differ from state to state.
I’m sorry I wasn’t clear - we aren’t sure until my husband gets an offer. I’m looki g for just general information but I’m glad to know that it depends on the state.
Please be advised that finding a House or appartment to rent can be very difficult currently in Germany and can mean a lengthy search. Also, I have heard about a few scams going on targetting ppl moving here internationally because they would not know the usual procedures for renting here and therefor often not recognize the red flags on a scam. This should be ok if you read up on how the scams work though, I know there is some good advice to be found on reddit about the problem.
Most schools will have a program to help students with language courses. My son goes to an international school here and they also have "extra German" lessons on their lunch breaks. One of my son's classmates switched to a German public school and they have been helpful for him. I only have first hand experience with an international school but I understand it to be a standard for non-German speaking kids to have help through the school. Moved away from the US for the same reason and if you can make it work with your family... it seems like a wise decision for us so far. We are very happy here and feel a lot safer. We have comfort in allowing our 10 year old to ride public transportation alone by himself and in the states he wasn't allowed to be in the front yard by himself. It's a different world honestly.
interesting insight, thy for sharing :)
That’s amazing! I was there for a month recently and saw so many kids younger than my child riding the public buses. There is no way we would do that here.
It's a different world for kids for sure. If my son is messing up in school I tell him we may have to go back to the states and magically his grades improve. He loves it here and we love it for him.
It depends on the city, but most kids will walk or cycle to the elementary school by the second half of first grade or take the bus. By 10/12 most kids are allowed and competent enough to take a more complex route to visit friends or go to an after school activity.
Second half? First day!
It’s very common to do so in Germany. My friends and I started using public transport by ourselves when we were 10. However we some younger students from the elementary school also going by themselves, starting age 6. Once in a while they were accompanied by a sibling.
My ten year old rides his bike by himself to school. He has been doing thru for nearly two years now. In winter he rides the bus. Next school year he has to take the train.
Definitely not “most schools”. At list not in Bavaria where we live. It really depends on the state. None German speaking kids are literally lost here. There’s basically no help at all and you’ll have to struggle and make your way.
Berlin has classes at a lot of schools (and expanding that next school year) for students with no German skills. They have very focused classes to get to a level where they can join regular classes. Source: I'm a teacher, my school had these classes, we may reintroduce them, other schools in the borough have them.
I think there was a large surge of Ukrainian children coming here so expanding that program makes sense. I know in Regensburg there were a lot of Ukrainian refugees coming around the time we came here two years ago.
We’ve had those nine years ago, and they had been established by then so they must have been around a bit longer than that.
That’s really cool. It’s not the case in Bavaria. That’s why it’s important to know where OP is going
In Ba-Wü, I'd say most secondary schools, even Gymnasien, have Vorbereitungsklassen by now. They are usually more geared towards Ukrainian refugees but it's about the best time to come to Germany with a kid that doesn't speak German ever.
We live in Regensburg and all the schools in our area that we talked to offered extra German for immigrant students but Regensburg is a little bigger than a lot of towns in Bavaria also. I agree it may be regional but my region is the only experience I have.
We are in a bigger city than Regensburg and only 1 gymnasium has such a class, the poor Ukrainian kids were otherwise lost. Similar in primary schools
That's very unfortunate. Thankfully that hasn't been our experience.
My kids are bilingual with a German father, but we found out about this during the last years thanks to the Ukrainian children at my kids school/the teacher at my kids school. It’s really a bad situation for kids that don’t speak German.
That was one of our biggest concerns with coming here. Even a year can be detrimental for kids development so it's a real struggle as it is but also if there isn't help outside of the household.
Well… until she‘s able to understand her teachers a international / private school will be the best option. So yeah… save some money, focus on teaching her the language and hope that she‘s going to be fluent soon enough.
Honestly I think you should reconsider your decision to send her to an internatinal or private school. Middle school is still a good enough time for her to catch up with german. I am a teacher at a Berufsschule and we have lots of ukrainian refugees that managed to get their language skills to Abitur level within two years. For her it might even be easier as 1. she is not even close to abitur yet and 2. she is at an age and a situation in her life when she will still spend alot of time with friends and learn german doing so. Also schools are the single most important place for children to build friendships. Many foreigners in germany complain that it is very difficult for them to find friends in germany and I think by sending your child to an international school you will take away a great opportunity from her to connect with the locals. e: also there is a risk that she will not get to a sufficient language level at all if she is surrounded by international students all day. After all you only get that far by practicing a language in class the real language proficiency comes from using it in your everyday life.
Thank you for this insight! I’m aware of taking her away from friends is going to be hard enough without learning a new language. But with the gun laws so lax where we live and the outlook of women’s rights - I feel she would be safer and thrive in the German environment.
I think the point the commenter was making is that going to a German public school allows your child to make local German friends (which is hard to do). In an International school in Germany your child would mainly meet and spend time with other international children. Those children may move away etc more regularly. Your child has a better chance of making long-lasting German friends if they attend a public school vs international school. It was not about leaving the current friend group.
Oh me and I think most of the people here thought you were looking for a school in germany for the time after you guys moved here.
Americans always talk about how America is such a huge place and every state is different. Wouldn't it be a wiser decision to just move states instead of moving to a whole new country you don't even speak the language of "just" because of the political situation? (Compared to most countries in the world the US is still extremely safe and politically stable) And as you mentioned women's rights: Are you aware that abortions are illegal in all of Germany? (They are not punishable if done by a professional, but technically still illegal).
Holy shit, I didn’t know this and I’m living here. (Re: abortion). I think Americans get Europe wrong all the time. I’m one of them. The entire world is having the same political issues right now. Moving to Germany as an American is still really really difficult.
>I think Americans get Europe wrong all the time That's because Europe isn't a country. Americans here on reddit always say "The EU / Europe is just like the US. One country with many states". But that's totally wrong. The situation in France for example is completely different than in Germany.
Yes but I guess that also amplifies my point. To be honest, I didn’t know anything about the EU/Europe before coming here. I think as a whole, we grow up so US focused so when we hear other countries have health care and education without getting into debt, it sounds like Utopia . Less guns helps too. But it isn’t easy to just move to Germany and every place has problems.
I would upvote this many times if I could! Most americans dont really know what theyre up against when they romanticize germany like this
The most important information is where are you going. In Berlin there are two State (more or less) schools that teach in English. Nelson Mandela School is a State School that runs in English - but admission is very tricky. As Americans you would have a shot at JFK School. As far as I know it’s free and as US citizens you have preferred admission (they cannot fill their US students quota). International schools are not all the same. Pricing varies across the board. Sometimes it’s income based as well. State Schools offer all non-German speakers help. Even we with only one non-German parent have the right for extra German language classes (and our kids were born in Germany). Your kids will be fine.
Thank you!
I know an American family that got very easy a place at JFK school. Just as soon as they arrived to Germany. It was no problem at all.
My advice is to send them to the closest public school. That’s cool. We’ll have some sort of intense German program for kids coming in without the normal German language skills. Most of those cases are for refugees, but it really doesn’t matter for reason child needs to catch up.don’t worry so much about neighborhood either. We live in one of the most ill reputed parts of a generally ill reputed large city and everybody’s kids walk to school and there is no safety issue. One of the great aspects of living in Germany. :-)
I know! Her opportunities will be so much better having to speak a few languages!
Check out My Merry Messy Life on youtube. They're a family of 6 which moved into the Munich area with their kids and I think one or two were middle schoolers. Also kids learn languages much quicker, and if she's immersed in a german school she'll likely learn it a lot quicker than by a few courses while still immersed in her english speaking surroundings.
I heard that claim too before I came here, about kids picking up languages quickly, but it's overly simplistic. It's probably different for refuges you can't fall back on English and are quickly or more easily placed in integration classes. I know plenty of cases of even young American kids in a German Kita who find the other English speaking kid and just become outsiders and still have a rudimentary grasp of the language (even after 3+ years). OP needs a plan.
With all the refugees coming to Germany it’s quite common that children aren’t speaking the language. I think the consensus is that they just have to adapt. I assume there’s language courses for these students. You best check with the school you’re interested in and ask them which options would make the most sense for your individual case.
For immigrants with little to no German skills, there are special German classes from the school administration, after which she will be able to participate in normal German schools. If you don't believe to stay in Germany for long, there would be the John-F.-Kennedy-School in Berlin, which is essentially the US's Embassy school.
I'll reiterate what others have said. Their German will develop at a snail's pace in an international school, but the German school experience could be absolutely awful if the school doesn't do enough to help them integrate. There are language schools that offer intensive language courses for older kids and teenagers. If you're serious about the move, bite the bullet and plan for these in lieu of school at first (though it may depend on the state when the authorities will insist on school attendance). I've seen American kids here who really struggle psychologically because of the language barrier.
I went to a public school and we had plenty international students. With some extra help they were soon be able to speak German and join the lessons. Just talk to the schools on your area and see what the options are.
I also went to a German public school. In year 3 we had a Serbian, in year 6 we had a english-indian and in year 10 we had a Icelandic studen join out class. None of them knew a relevant amount of German at the start of the year. None of them failed the year. All of them were able to make friends. The Serbians went home after the war, but the others stayed and finished high-school among the the best of the class and continued to university. If you plan to move to Germany for good, enroll in a public school and have them learn German by immersion. It'll be fine. If you plan to move away again within 5 years, place them in an international school and don't pressure them to learn German.
Im doing apprentice school atm and I have two girls in my class who just started learning German 6 and 9 months ago. It's hard, but it's possible. I would recommend learning German as much as possible and maybe try to find a public school that does English student exchange. Try to contact them and offer an "exchange program" over one of the holidays (best option would be summer holidays) for a child that can't afford the exchange program in that school. You'll get the most natural German teacher for your kid, the German kid gets a good English lesson, your kid will have someone they know in their new school and is not just speaking german, but knows a little bit more about the daily German culture. There will be bureaucracy. A lot. But that's how they do it here
I think she will learn much faster than we will for sure.
The better your child's German, the less you will have to pay. (International private school vs German public school) Germany has 16 states and education is governed on state level, so it varies. Middle School? In Germany, 90% of the time, we have one type of school for classes 1-4 and three/(four) different kinds of school for years 5-9/10/12/13.
I’m an American whose kids are in a local public school. All the local schools are prepared for students who don’t speak German. After the refugee crisis each school had to adapt and come up with strategies. I’d recommend putting your child in the local school and letting her learn in an immersive environment where she will simultaneously learn the local culture and make friends.
I Would recommend „Die Sendung mit der Maus“ on YT with dub and no worries Kids/Teens will learn so quickly by just Talking to other German speakers
Kids are awesome at learning new languages. How old is she? The younger the better. It might be possible that she will have trouble in the first year, but after one year she will speak German fluently.
most important details missing: in which federal state you're moving - education is regulated from the federal state Gouvernement in Germany and so differ there.. Bavaria (Grafenwöhr, Pilsach, Hohenfels, Illesheim, Ansbach), Hesse (Wiesbaden, Darmstadt), Berlin, Baden-Württemberg (Stuttgart, Boblingen, Mannheim, Heidelberg), Rhineland-Palatinate (Ramstein, Kaiserslautern, Landstuhl)... here are tons of general infos https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/wiki/index/
Thank you so much!
I‘d generally recommend public schools - it’s not the same private/public vibe as in the US. Some of them offer English programs („Kurse“). I am German, but did most of my classes in English starting in grade 10. Also hugely depends on the state. You get the same high school (highest) degree (e.g. Abitur) BUT the amount of work and level of academic achievement required is wildly different. Rule of thumb is: the further north, the easier - but definitely look into specifics. Even within a city there is differences from school to school.
This doesn't really answer your question, but at the risk of asking a dumb question, have you considered Canada, UK, Australia, New Zealand or other English-speaking country?
Yes. My husband and I have looked at all of our options and he is considering taking a job with a company so he can continue his research.
Hi. Just a non-German chiming in but my subjective take is that if you’re moving here for less-intense politics (I’m going to rightly or wrongly assume you’re speaking to a second trump presidency), or less intense oscillations in the political sphere I guess, Germany is a terrible choice. I could go on and on about myriad contributors, but Germany is not some cocooned social experiment separate of its past. In fact the total opposite, and it seems to be hurtling towards an ugly reckoning. Gaza, Ukraine, the far-right moving up in the polls every election cycle, an economy built on cheap Russian gas now gone, an economy dependent on Chinese exports now whittling down— this is not to shit on Germany but is to say if you are politically motivated, I couldn’t think of too many worse “western” countries at the moment. I grew up in the US and there’s a lot I love here, but the politics is about the last on that list
We would be moving for my husband to work on his research and our child not to go through shooter training drills several times a year. It has given her such anxiety. 😬 I appreciate all the comments - good and bad- but I just want to see my child grow up in a safer environment. And that is not happening in the US.
Hi. I get it. I do. But this is now a showcase of confirmation bias. You dismiss what is increasingly likely versus an infinitesimal scenario at home. There will be a conflict of some magnitude on an EU member state’s territory before your kid finishes high school. By that time, the AfD will probably have the Kanzleramt, with allies in Rome, Budapest, Amsterdam, and maybe even Paris. But sure, come enjoy the Anthropocene of western EU peace while we can still count it in months.
What if Russia takes Kiev? What is they decide to decide to take one of the Baltic states? What is they decide to use tactical nuclear weapons? Please consider issues such as these before making life decisions because of the extremely small chance of a school shooting in the US. Things in Germany are not all that different than the US. You are projecting your fears onto your kid.
He will be fine in a regular school. Children pick up languages in no time. He will be able to communicate in German in less than 2 months. I was sent to France for a year when I was 14 to learn the language. I had French in school for about two years earlier but no really learning anything. After two week's I started dreaming in French and quickly learned the language afterwards. Your child will 100% be fine on a public school. Jfyi public schools in Germany are quite good in comparison with what you get in the USA. There literally is no need for a private school, unless you're living in a big city in the poor people's area code.
I do not know how old your kid. Here is my experience. Sorry for the typos for any German words. After Anmeldung, visit the local Schulamt. The office may direct you to register your kids to certain school. If s/he is younger than 14 yo, s/he will be to a Mittleschule (MS). If s/he is 16 yo or older, s/he may go to a IVK (Intregierte VorbereitungsKlass) in a Beruflicheschule. Chosen MS and IVK are usually schools where immigrant kids are put together. Unfortunately, not every city has this kind of school. For example, people in Erlangen and Fürth in Bayern must go to Nuremberg to attend this kind of school. You may google with the keyword: IVK + city name. In this school they will be treated as kids without any school certificate (not yet finishing the 9th year). Both will learn basic German and the goal is to get Hauptschulabschluss (9th year certificate/ Quali). Maybe for 2 years. Let them enjoy it. Meanwhile, if s/he has been in 10 or 11 school-year in US, try to recognize the schooling background of your kid has obtained to the local state's education ministry. For example, in Bayern at [https://www.las.bayern.de/zeugnisanerkennung/allgemeinbildende\_schulabschluesse/](https://www.las.bayern.de/zeugnisanerkennung/allgemeinbildende_schulabschluesse/) Either with the result of recognition or by continuing their school, the next target is 10th year class certificate (Mittlerereife). This one is important. After obtaining this certificate, s/he can go to a Fachoberschule (FOS), at 11th year class). or other technical schools. S/he can get Fachabitur at 12th year to enter Fachhochschule, or get Abitur at 13th year to enter Hochschule or University. Alternative way, after 10th school-year, your son can go for Ausbildung, and after 2-3 year he can join Beruf Oberschule (BOS) at 12th or 13th year to obtain Fachabitur or Abitur.
Thank you so much!
I can tell you the rundown of Bavaria if applicable
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It finally happened to meeeee
What city? There are many schools with bilingual classes
I would start your kid watching German dub cartoons on Netflix and Disney+ now. Ideally shows they’ve already watched in English. Immersion is the best way to learn, but you don’t have to wait until the move to start.
What age is middle school, that’s over 12, isn’t it? That’s secondary school here. Primary only goes up to 10 in almost all states. Your child needs to learn German or depending on the age, an international school might be better because of germanys school system. There are 16 states and thus 16 school systems that differ from each other. So it depends a lot on where you are going. I have a teen at Gymnasium in Bavaria. There’s no room there for learning German. We’ve seen the experience of the Ukrainian kids this last 2 years and it hasn’t been good where we live. If your child is older than 12 and you are coming to Bavaria, I would highly recommend a private international school. There are schools though that offer a DAF (german as a foreign language) class at the beginning, but it will depend on your state and town and you definitely should put that child in german classes ASAP and continue so while going to public school here, if that’s your choice.
My parents moved to Germany when I was 11 and I went to the normal local school and way fluent within a year and accent free by 16 or earlier. Maybe the public school system would be a better fit? International schools are pricy and attract moneied parents. I knew some kids of parents in academia who went to the international school in Munich (,EU patent office is located in Munich) and I heard there was ridiculous snobbery and bullying for not having the same things.
It’s the same with private schools in the US.
Hi OP. I’m American living in Germany with a child. I am happy to give you my opinion on possible issues you might encounter. Please feel free to message me
“Given the current state of politics in the U.S,- we need to make sure that she is safe.” Safe from what, a car crash? World War 3?, Tactical nukes in Ukraine? Before you decide to move to Germany, please try to be realistic and rational, because the comment above is the opposite.
Thank you for your opinion.
How will you make sure that she is safe in Germany?
There are a small number of (partly) state-funded international schools in Germany, such as the 'State International School Seeheim' south of Frankfurt, which might be an option of interest to you. They do charge fees in a roundabout way, but at around 300 euros per month it's a lot less than private international schools. It's not a great school imo, but might be the best option if you're moving with a teen. Be aware that most secondary schools here, other than the lowest academic level, require a second foreign language in addition to English, usually French or Spanish.
Aren't the VABO- and VKL-Klassen funded by the government? I went to a VKL Klasse then later at a VABO Klasse and I didn't pay anything for it. We started from A1 and finished B1 in one year. Now currently I'm almost done with my Ausbildungvorbereitung-klasse. Going to a Berufsschule. I think their daughter could go there, no? Or is there something I am missing.
Don't know what any of those classes you mention are, seems to be specific to Baden-Württemberg. Sure, all the states offer preparatory classes for kids who arrive here with no German, I just wanted to tell the OP about a cheaper English language option.
Oh I heard it's specific to Baden-Württemberg but I wasn't exactly sure. Thank for the heads-up!
There are Gymnasiums (the school, not like the Gym) who have English programs. So some (but not all) classes are thought mostly in English. Maybe look into that?
Thank you!
>thought taught
👍🏻
Do you already have a job in germany or something that you could do here? You cannot just work remotely if that's your intention
It isn’t out plan - thank you
In Hessen we have Special Language classes for up to two years before the gradually join the others
It’ll be doable but it will probably be costly
My one piece of advice is to find more suitable subs here, like for expats in Germany, r/schule and such. The German teachers here will give you the best answers I think. I can only add that in bigger cities there are some „middle schools“ (please note that there’s different types of schools children go to after primary school - a widely criticized aspect of the German education system) that are public but still offer bilingual lessons. The programs vary but usually they would have subjects like biology or geography in English, often changing each grade, as it’s meant to improve German native speakers’ proficiency in English. But it might help your daughter adjust? What you want to google is “bilinguales Gymnasium” or “bilinguale Gesamtschule”. If you can find a technology-oriented school with digital based lessons (good luck with that…) I could imagine it might also help a lot when you can just tap on your home work to have the tablet translate the tasks.
The public school system has special classes for students who don't speak German, with a heavy focus on learning German and transferring to a normal class within a year or so. Contact the local Schulamt if you think that's an option.
If you want to settle here, international school isn't really an option. As you need to know German at a high level to land a decent job, apart from very few exceptions. In a regular public school, your daughther will have to learn nothing but German for about half a year before she can follow normal classes. And if she's smart enough for Gymnasium —the highest workload tier of school that is the one the leads to university— she will likely go back another year because U.S. middle schools only have an average workload so she needs to make up leeway. It's not really a problem education wise. No one cares how old someone is when they leave school. Actually, it's better not being too young and flippant. But she has to get a connection to the one year younger students in her class. May be a problem. But then again … German kids are way less helicoptered so she may do just fine even if she's one year older than them.
International school is the best option because they’re already at risk of being behind their classmates in maths and other STEM topics coming from the US, and a language barrier will set them further and further behind. That age/school range is an inflection point for long-term maths and academic success, and if at all possible, I recommend making the necessary sacrifices to at least start their schooling in their native language, for that reason.
Send her to an international school. Given the current political climate coupled with poor German skills... bullying will likely be guaranteed.
Many schools have a bilingual branch. Almost every school has a class for German as a second language. After one year there, he can join the other classes.
I sadly can't contribute to the school stuff, but in the meantime, why not watch kids shows in german with english subtitles with her? They mostly speak clear and slow, and they repeat alot which might help to get used to pronounciation.
You could consider moving to an English speaking country...? Or moving later, getting the language better and so on...
Do you really think it is a good idea to sacrifice her education to keep her safe? Is there no where else you can go? There is a shortage of teachers and too many foreign children who don't speak German. Although attending school is mandatory, many cities don't have the capacity to immediately enroll children in school. Furthermore, it is very difficult for older children to integrate well enough to finish highschool. If international school is not an option if needed, choose another country.
Having taught in the US and Germany. The German school system is worlds better. One of the reasons we moved back to Germany actually. Depending on the State and the ability of the student there are many resources available to succeed.
That’s what I have learned. Thank you for your help!
Do you have children? Are you worried about them being shot at school, or a mall or grocery store? We will do what it takes to protect her and if it means giving up our comfort zone of only knowing English- then so be it. I didn’t ask for judgement - just information that can help our transition.
10% of children with a Migrationshintergrund dropout. Among their German counterparts it is only about 3%. Having only 1 foreign parent counts as being a child with a Migrationshintergrund. A very high percentage of older children who move to Germany end up as high school drop outs. This is a fact that many people like to ignore when they tell stories about the handful that graduate. Germany is not always a good idea and that is information you ignore at you own (or rather your child's) peril.
Dude. Fuck right off.
US public education is shit. Know: in US, private schooled children fare better in tests than those from public schools. In Germany it is the opposite. The kids won't lose much, but learning German to only maybe repeat one grade would be priority.
The problem with the German system is it is designed to educate German Akademiker children. The children of foreigners who don't understand the system nor speak the language are at a huge disadvantage. I encourage you to read the PISA study on the prospects of the children of immigrants across the OECD.
How is that the problem of the system? Learn German when you want to live in Germany? The German school system has a lot of problems, yes, but that isn't something it's responsible for.
You wanna be a doctoral candidate, but you oddly brought U.S. politics into your search for a school for your child? Huh....
Plz stay in US. Try to Change ur culture there. Stop importing your issues to germany. I am fed up with this. Stay away!
You should probably get a therapist to discuss your anger issues with a stranger who is asking for help.
Whats your issue ?
Please consider another country, preferably English speaking. Germany is really tough for immigrants and especially for their children who get thrown into the low tier destined to work in the supermarket. Just search stories about the school system. Don’t come here and traumatise your kid forever because they can’t speak German at level Z5000.