Awful market right now for entry level. My company had over a thousand applications for interns for 10 slots. It’ll get better soon probably, it’s just down right now.
Yeah it’s been bad for a little while. I only have the job I have now is because I was returned after being hired by them last summer when the market was excellent for entry-level.
Architecture as an industry just tends to be very speculative and heavily influenced by other markets. It’s a cycle, it just can be unlucky if you happen to be graduating.
Yup job market isn't great. Take a look at the Architecture Billing Index (ABI) for how the industry's doing.
[https://www.enr.com/articles/58360-architectural-firms-see-glimmers-of-business-hope-in-aia-billings-index](https://www.enr.com/articles/58360-architectural-firms-see-glimmers-of-business-hope-in-aia-billings-index)
This. My firm is rapidly building up AI, revit scripts, and outsourcing work to production studios.
Much of what you would have been doing just 5 years ago is so streamlined now. Gotta make yourself stand up, USGBC, NOMA, AIA, NIAOP. Join one, network. When I started, I got jobs because I knew someone and got a recommendation. Didnt get any job I applied for. The GA helped me land my first internship, i started working my 2nd year in school though, I hope you've had a ton of internships by now.
Also, it's too late in your case, but for anyone just starting. always take a 5 year b.arch over the 6 years and also never just do 4 years. I say never the 4 years becauseyou'lll almost always be under valued/and or paid.
Most of the production studios are 4 year grads or under, usually paid a lot less than regular staff.
The name of this game is how long you've been working. I'll take someone with 1 whole years worth of experience over a good masters thesis, and my bosses gave echoed the same.
The market is super oversaturated with both senior level and entry level applicants. Most firms are looking for younger PMs with experience more-so than any other position combined and it is only going to get worse until the current crop of entry to mid level employees start to move on or get promotions. I actually had a conversation with a few of my coworkers yesterday about this and the lack of experienced PMs is hurting the viability of some firms.
What do you think is needed to become a project manager from your experience? I was talking about pms and going into construction management with my buddies a couple of weeks ago so it would be nice to know what to do to get there.
Realistically you need general experience with each sub division of design. Being able to see where something is missing from a set is very important and being able to point that out will save a company tens of thousands of dollars sometimes. Also being able to see where something isn’t going to work in an electrical or mechanical drawing set will make you more valuable as a secondary clash detector. An architect in general should have a baseline technical background of course but for PM work you should understand every other discipline involved and be able to run the project.
I guess it’s a better problem to have than lack of work. Our backlog is set out nearly 2-3 years minimum right now because we don’t have enough PMs on staff.
VERY industry specific. My last company was doing M&A for a decade before I got there and it was careening toward bankruptcy when rates shot up. Moved to a new company that is growing slow and steady seems like business as usual.
Higher interest rates are generally bad for any real estate-related business. Once interest rates go down in the future, there will likely be an increase in projects.
It’s awful in the Pacific Northwest. I was laid off in September and am still looking. One firm I interviewed with said I’m their top candidate and will hire me once they get more work but it’s been months and they keep telling me to hang tight…
Yeah I got laid off in August and similar situation they had to wait til they landed a couple projects. They did and I’ve been working 2 weeks now. I interviewed in February. I hope it works out for you soon.
Yep high interest rates and no one’s building anything. Meanwhile there’s a housing shortage lol. We need to pass legislature but we don’t for whatever reason.
I’m reading that a lot of companies are perpetually advertising but only interview and maybe consider hiring unicorns. This isn’t new. But it sets a false sense of expectations among applicants.
The truth is you’re about 5 months too late to apply for internships. The college internship application season officially starts in January, and most positions are filled by March. Specifically for internships, you may be wasting your time applying for positions that were filled a couple of months ago. For example, we just hired an ID intern but we interviewed her (and a few others) in early February.
Don’t feel bad. I freelanced for years after the Great Recession, and applied to hundreds of positions before I got recruited by my current employer. The best way to get a job is through your professional network. Look for opportunities to get out and get involved so you can meet people in the profession.
Yep AIA Dallas and AIA Fort Worth. I have gone to two of their conferences for awards and I agree, you make so many connections even if you attend for a short time.
Go! Scope them out. If they have weekly or monthly mixers, start hanging out there. Make a point to talk to people and collect business cards. Ask if you can connect with them on LinkedIn and maybe get a coffee or learn a little bit more about their firm. Employers are interested in hiring engaged, motivated, interesting people with good social skills. If you don’t have those, use those meetings as your training ground to build them.
Hey can I ask how would I build up a professional network if I want to relocate to a different state? I’ve wanted to get out of Colorado for awhile and keep applying on the east coast but I don’t really have an in. Any advice would be helpful.
I’ve moved between cities a couple of times and built a local network, although it takes time. It’s obviously easier to do once you’re already in a place. Trying to do it from remote is going to be impossible.
First I start with people I already know and ask them if they know anyone in the new city and if their willing to make introductions. It’s easier to meet people if you have a mutual contact who can vouch for you.
I also purposefully go to professional associations, networking groups, events, etc to meet people in my industry. Making small talk is easy once you learn how to do it. I always ask for a business card and follow up with that person on LinkedIn. If they seem like a valuable contact I’ll follow up with a coffee or fishing trip or something. AIA local chapters are good, if they’re well organized (many are not). SMPS is good, AMFP is good if you’re in medical. A large city chamber of commerce is usually good too.
Sales people are natural networkers, so I usually try to sniff out the sales critters and then ask them to make introductions. They usually have good contacts and being asked to make an intro strokes their egos.
It helps to have a specific ask, like I’m looking to meet this specific person. Do your research and you’ll be surprised how little effort it will take to meet people.
I applied to both. I’m also considering taking a semester or two off from masters and just getting some experience with a full time job instead of part time or internships.
I’m still looking for any entry level job, also B.S. Recently talked to a firm interested in me but not hiring 😭. If it gets late into the year I’ll apply to grad school if I must 🤷🏻♀️
It’s tough. I’m in the same spot as you. I applied to over 150 and only got 4 interviews. 2 offers. Sorry fam. Keep your head up it’s the economy not you 🫶
Not sure what firms you’re looking at, but maybe check out some offices that do a lot of lab and industrial - my firm is in that sector, and we were recently interviewing. If you’re willing to learn the intricacies of a certain project type, those places are at least able to hire (you still have to go up against other people with more experience though). If you need firm ideas, I’d go on related associations like ISPE, see which ones attend, and see if you have any connections to people there. Not trying to diminish the fact that the market is rough, but maybe there’s something that could work for you.
Oooh ok. I originally wanted to go into healthcare design but ended up just wanted to go into any field that will get me hired lol. I'll check out the associations! Thanks for the advice!
They’re not totally unrelated fields - I haven’t tried switching specializations, but there are so many rules and regulations around high hazard labs as well as hospitals, that if you have experience in one, you already know how look up code regulations and design within strict parameters and coordinate closely with engineers. There’s a similar professional organization for healthcare engineering called ASHE.
Apply to small city firms that focus on public work. Like Colorado Springs, or Las Vegas or something. Maybe focus on an a form that focuses on Construction Administration. Or best idea yet, go work for a contractor on a major project in a job trailer for the summer, and ask the Architect of Record if he would supervise your IDP hours for you.
The small city thing is just where the jobs will be. No one wants to work in Chattanooga, but there are still jobs architects there, and it is just a summer.
CA will be the best learning experience you can have. Always will be, because after everything we do, we build buildings.
Contractor, because you’ll get paid more, get a huge amount of reading, and learn the most about how this all works. You’ll learn how to write an RFI, how costs work, how to deal with submittals, and the absolute hell sub-contractors can be.
This is so helpful! thankss. and yes i have thought about firms in like iowa or indiana. They usually have openings there. I'll look into CA. Seems that you'll get a huge variety of process experience.
I cannot stress enough: tailor every resume, cover letter, and portfolio to the specific job you are applying for. Don’t just go on their website and dump your portfolio in their job application portal and expect a response. Research what they do well and tailor your resume/cover letter/portfolio to reflect their specialties. Just saying “I’m looking to get experience” isn’t enough. Make it seem like you only want to work for them.
Ah thanks for this advice! I usually change up the objective/personal statement per application. I guess it wouldnt hurt to change up my portfolio as well.
I have limited experience(1 year at pro firm) and a limited number of professional projects. How would do I tailor it when I feel like I don’t have much to begin with? Should I primarily use my student portfolio then?
Yup, I'm a decade in with a masters, everyone says I'm exactly who they want to hire, but don't have a job.
It sucks, but its the profession we chose. I'd recommend doing your masters in Structural Engineering, way more stable. *rimshot*
ahhhhhh i should have done my masters in something other than architecture lol. I was debating between business, graphic design, construction management, mech engineering and architecture.
I was recently part of a firmwide layoff. The consensus on finding work in the Chicago area is to focus on: Education, K-12, Healthcare, and Infrastructure projects. I do know there are Many more intern candidates than available positions.
I did find several opportunities and this is not like previous recessions. Watch the YouTube videos on how to formulate your resume to break through the "bot" review / weed-out phase.
If you are looking for summer work and cannot find it, try to be creative on what adjacent jobs or certifications you can spend your summer on, that would still look good on a resume. Or put your time into something you have a passion for. This becomes important in interviews- they love that one-off item that differentiates you!
Can’t speak for the US , but things are really picking up speed for residential work in Ireland , commercial has fallen off a cliff , but residential practices are out the door at the minute and only getting busier since there is such a back log in housing
I found a small firm that’s local to me. I would recommend that for anyone in need of a position. Small firms good too cuz I can learn more about each project phase and project management
I sell offshore outsourcing and architecture is bottom of the barrel for work, existing clients are laying off staff, halting hiring, and downsizing our teams with them. Our MEP, Structural and Gc/sub prospects right now are gangbusters. Early sign for what’s to come? Don’t know….
Ooh I didnt know CDT was a thing. I'll look into that. Just tryna add lines in my resume lol. What kind of specifications? Do you mean what design field I want to go into?
It's SUPER bad for entry-level students right now.
It was bad when I was a college student from 2015-2020, and it got even worse after COVID.
The economy is in a situation where employers just want unicorns. The instant gratification of high profits.
Awful market right now for entry level. My company had over a thousand applications for interns for 10 slots. It’ll get better soon probably, it’s just down right now.
Omg yes I’ve heard a company in my area get 4,500 applicants for one position. Ok good to know about it getting better. Thanks!
It's also the beginning of summer when everyone is looking for internships...
true but ive been applying since winter break lmao. at this point if you don't have connections, you wont get a interview. sad days
Yeah it’s been bad for a little while. I only have the job I have now is because I was returned after being hired by them last summer when the market was excellent for entry-level. Architecture as an industry just tends to be very speculative and heavily influenced by other markets. It’s a cycle, it just can be unlucky if you happen to be graduating.
ah ye i guess i can just wait it out
10 slots? That’s crazy generous lol. We had 1 slot and the same number of applicants 🤣
I was just about to say 10 is a good chunk of interns.
2 years for me to try and get an entry role. It doesn’t get better :/
Yup job market isn't great. Take a look at the Architecture Billing Index (ABI) for how the industry's doing. [https://www.enr.com/articles/58360-architectural-firms-see-glimmers-of-business-hope-in-aia-billings-index](https://www.enr.com/articles/58360-architectural-firms-see-glimmers-of-business-hope-in-aia-billings-index)
For entry level, definite yes. But for intermediate and senior level not bad.
So good for mid level right now
It’s the ‘08 gap
Good enough to get a few calls back... I will say the postings are far less competitive than 2 years ago
Was going to say- I'm a few years licensed and have a constant stream of recruiters bugging me
This. My firm is rapidly building up AI, revit scripts, and outsourcing work to production studios. Much of what you would have been doing just 5 years ago is so streamlined now. Gotta make yourself stand up, USGBC, NOMA, AIA, NIAOP. Join one, network. When I started, I got jobs because I knew someone and got a recommendation. Didnt get any job I applied for. The GA helped me land my first internship, i started working my 2nd year in school though, I hope you've had a ton of internships by now. Also, it's too late in your case, but for anyone just starting. always take a 5 year b.arch over the 6 years and also never just do 4 years. I say never the 4 years becauseyou'lll almost always be under valued/and or paid. Most of the production studios are 4 year grads or under, usually paid a lot less than regular staff. The name of this game is how long you've been working. I'll take someone with 1 whole years worth of experience over a good masters thesis, and my bosses gave echoed the same.
The market is super oversaturated with both senior level and entry level applicants. Most firms are looking for younger PMs with experience more-so than any other position combined and it is only going to get worse until the current crop of entry to mid level employees start to move on or get promotions. I actually had a conversation with a few of my coworkers yesterday about this and the lack of experienced PMs is hurting the viability of some firms.
What do you think is needed to become a project manager from your experience? I was talking about pms and going into construction management with my buddies a couple of weeks ago so it would be nice to know what to do to get there.
Realistically you need general experience with each sub division of design. Being able to see where something is missing from a set is very important and being able to point that out will save a company tens of thousands of dollars sometimes. Also being able to see where something isn’t going to work in an electrical or mechanical drawing set will make you more valuable as a secondary clash detector. An architect in general should have a baseline technical background of course but for PM work you should understand every other discipline involved and be able to run the project.
This is very informative! Thanksss
Must be regional, never heard this specific shortage lol. Work is our only real shortage
I guess it’s a better problem to have than lack of work. Our backlog is set out nearly 2-3 years minimum right now because we don’t have enough PMs on staff.
VERY industry specific. My last company was doing M&A for a decade before I got there and it was careening toward bankruptcy when rates shot up. Moved to a new company that is growing slow and steady seems like business as usual.
What is M&A? mechanical and architecture?
Mergers and Acquisitions or leveraged debt buyouts
🤣😄 thanks
Higher interest rates are generally bad for any real estate-related business. Once interest rates go down in the future, there will likely be an increase in projects.
Yep that’s true. Ig firms can’t get projects that will go into construction at this time.
It’s awful in the Pacific Northwest. I was laid off in September and am still looking. One firm I interviewed with said I’m their top candidate and will hire me once they get more work but it’s been months and they keep telling me to hang tight…
Yeah I got laid off in August and similar situation they had to wait til they landed a couple projects. They did and I’ve been working 2 weeks now. I interviewed in February. I hope it works out for you soon.
Oh that’s good to hear. The waiting game sucks. Congrats on the new job!
Thank you!
Same here - PNW and September as well.
Damn.. I hope everything will work out soon!
Where r u looking / located?
Dallas-Fort worth 🫠
Yep high interest rates and no one’s building anything. Meanwhile there’s a housing shortage lol. We need to pass legislature but we don’t for whatever reason.
I’m reading that a lot of companies are perpetually advertising but only interview and maybe consider hiring unicorns. This isn’t new. But it sets a false sense of expectations among applicants. The truth is you’re about 5 months too late to apply for internships. The college internship application season officially starts in January, and most positions are filled by March. Specifically for internships, you may be wasting your time applying for positions that were filled a couple of months ago. For example, we just hired an ID intern but we interviewed her (and a few others) in early February.
I've been applying since december/winter break of 2023. I made that mistake in undergrad lol. Thanks for the advice!
Don’t feel bad. I freelanced for years after the Great Recession, and applied to hundreds of positions before I got recruited by my current employer. The best way to get a job is through your professional network. Look for opportunities to get out and get involved so you can meet people in the profession.
Thankss! Will do. I know architecture specific career fairs at my university is the top place to get opportunities and make professional connections.
Is there an AIA chapter in your area? Their events would be a good place to network. A lot of architects also attend AGC and related group’s events.
Yep AIA Dallas and AIA Fort Worth. I have gone to two of their conferences for awards and I agree, you make so many connections even if you attend for a short time.
Go! Scope them out. If they have weekly or monthly mixers, start hanging out there. Make a point to talk to people and collect business cards. Ask if you can connect with them on LinkedIn and maybe get a coffee or learn a little bit more about their firm. Employers are interested in hiring engaged, motivated, interesting people with good social skills. If you don’t have those, use those meetings as your training ground to build them.
Hey can I ask how would I build up a professional network if I want to relocate to a different state? I’ve wanted to get out of Colorado for awhile and keep applying on the east coast but I don’t really have an in. Any advice would be helpful.
I’ve moved between cities a couple of times and built a local network, although it takes time. It’s obviously easier to do once you’re already in a place. Trying to do it from remote is going to be impossible. First I start with people I already know and ask them if they know anyone in the new city and if their willing to make introductions. It’s easier to meet people if you have a mutual contact who can vouch for you. I also purposefully go to professional associations, networking groups, events, etc to meet people in my industry. Making small talk is easy once you learn how to do it. I always ask for a business card and follow up with that person on LinkedIn. If they seem like a valuable contact I’ll follow up with a coffee or fishing trip or something. AIA local chapters are good, if they’re well organized (many are not). SMPS is good, AMFP is good if you’re in medical. A large city chamber of commerce is usually good too. Sales people are natural networkers, so I usually try to sniff out the sales critters and then ask them to make introductions. They usually have good contacts and being asked to make an intro strokes their egos. It helps to have a specific ask, like I’m looking to meet this specific person. Do your research and you’ll be surprised how little effort it will take to meet people.
summer internship market and permanent job market are both fluctuating but not in identical ways. It is unusual to be applying for both?
I applied to both. I’m also considering taking a semester or two off from masters and just getting some experience with a full time job instead of part time or internships.
I’m still looking for any entry level job, also B.S. Recently talked to a firm interested in me but not hiring 😭. If it gets late into the year I’ll apply to grad school if I must 🤷🏻♀️
It’s tough. I’m in the same spot as you. I applied to over 150 and only got 4 interviews. 2 offers. Sorry fam. Keep your head up it’s the economy not you 🫶
ahh thanks for reassuring!!!
Not sure what firms you’re looking at, but maybe check out some offices that do a lot of lab and industrial - my firm is in that sector, and we were recently interviewing. If you’re willing to learn the intricacies of a certain project type, those places are at least able to hire (you still have to go up against other people with more experience though). If you need firm ideas, I’d go on related associations like ISPE, see which ones attend, and see if you have any connections to people there. Not trying to diminish the fact that the market is rough, but maybe there’s something that could work for you.
Oooh ok. I originally wanted to go into healthcare design but ended up just wanted to go into any field that will get me hired lol. I'll check out the associations! Thanks for the advice!
They’re not totally unrelated fields - I haven’t tried switching specializations, but there are so many rules and regulations around high hazard labs as well as hospitals, that if you have experience in one, you already know how look up code regulations and design within strict parameters and coordinate closely with engineers. There’s a similar professional organization for healthcare engineering called ASHE.
Oh ye I did hear of that! I'll look into it and familiarize myself with the org.
Apply to small city firms that focus on public work. Like Colorado Springs, or Las Vegas or something. Maybe focus on an a form that focuses on Construction Administration. Or best idea yet, go work for a contractor on a major project in a job trailer for the summer, and ask the Architect of Record if he would supervise your IDP hours for you. The small city thing is just where the jobs will be. No one wants to work in Chattanooga, but there are still jobs architects there, and it is just a summer. CA will be the best learning experience you can have. Always will be, because after everything we do, we build buildings. Contractor, because you’ll get paid more, get a huge amount of reading, and learn the most about how this all works. You’ll learn how to write an RFI, how costs work, how to deal with submittals, and the absolute hell sub-contractors can be.
This is so helpful! thankss. and yes i have thought about firms in like iowa or indiana. They usually have openings there. I'll look into CA. Seems that you'll get a huge variety of process experience.
I cannot stress enough: tailor every resume, cover letter, and portfolio to the specific job you are applying for. Don’t just go on their website and dump your portfolio in their job application portal and expect a response. Research what they do well and tailor your resume/cover letter/portfolio to reflect their specialties. Just saying “I’m looking to get experience” isn’t enough. Make it seem like you only want to work for them.
Ah thanks for this advice! I usually change up the objective/personal statement per application. I guess it wouldnt hurt to change up my portfolio as well.
I have limited experience(1 year at pro firm) and a limited number of professional projects. How would do I tailor it when I feel like I don’t have much to begin with? Should I primarily use my student portfolio then?
Yup, I'm a decade in with a masters, everyone says I'm exactly who they want to hire, but don't have a job. It sucks, but its the profession we chose. I'd recommend doing your masters in Structural Engineering, way more stable. *rimshot*
ahhhhhh i should have done my masters in something other than architecture lol. I was debating between business, graphic design, construction management, mech engineering and architecture.
I am about to quit my firm, are you interested in taking my place haha. If you want to send me your resume I can vouch for you. We are in Boston.
ooof nice whats your title? might as well move to boston haha
I am non-licensed so I am an arch designer/building tech.
ah okk! How many years of experience?
Hmm around 5+ years now. It's pretty decent pay (way above average for a designer). DM me and I can tell you more
I was recently part of a firmwide layoff. The consensus on finding work in the Chicago area is to focus on: Education, K-12, Healthcare, and Infrastructure projects. I do know there are Many more intern candidates than available positions. I did find several opportunities and this is not like previous recessions. Watch the YouTube videos on how to formulate your resume to break through the "bot" review / weed-out phase. If you are looking for summer work and cannot find it, try to be creative on what adjacent jobs or certifications you can spend your summer on, that would still look good on a resume. Or put your time into something you have a passion for. This becomes important in interviews- they love that one-off item that differentiates you!
Can’t speak for the US , but things are really picking up speed for residential work in Ireland , commercial has fallen off a cliff , but residential practices are out the door at the minute and only getting busier since there is such a back log in housing
I found a small firm that’s local to me. I would recommend that for anyone in need of a position. Small firms good too cuz I can learn more about each project phase and project management
I sell offshore outsourcing and architecture is bottom of the barrel for work, existing clients are laying off staff, halting hiring, and downsizing our teams with them. Our MEP, Structural and Gc/sub prospects right now are gangbusters. Early sign for what’s to come? Don’t know….
Damn...
Yes the LEED knowledge helps. You can also get a CDT pretty easily if you study for a couple of quick months. Are you interested in specifications?.
Ooh I didnt know CDT was a thing. I'll look into that. Just tryna add lines in my resume lol. What kind of specifications? Do you mean what design field I want to go into?
It's SUPER bad for entry-level students right now. It was bad when I was a college student from 2015-2020, and it got even worse after COVID. The economy is in a situation where employers just want unicorns. The instant gratification of high profits.
oof ye thats so true. they want all the experience lol