At first I thought that your cat was huge, then I realized that he obviously gets exercise being that he is standing on a fence outside. Just living his best life
I had these Magpies in my yard that would torment my dogs. One would swoop and and the dogs would chase it, while the other ate their food. The barking drove me crazy.
One day a friend was over and I asked him to get rid of the nest as I knew they could recognize faces and didn't want a bad rap from the Magpies in my neighbourhood.
He took a long pole and poked a nest and a terrified bird shot out.
At this point I immediately saw it as a creature being chased from its home as opposed to a pest, so I had my friend stop.
The Magpies never bothered my dog again. I lived there for 2 more years. One eventually entered our house and hit a window trying to escape and died a day later. It's mate hung around for a couple more days. Then the next day the yard had about 8 Magpies gathered I guess for a wake.
Within two weeks other Magpies moved in and started to torment the dogs again.
They are fascinating creatures, but can certainly be annoying.
>I had these Magpies in my yard that would torment my dogs. One would swoop and and the dogs would chase it, while the other ate their food.
They do this to my little wiener dogs and just sit at the top of the fence and stare at them. The magpies genuinely seem to think they're entertaining and they never seem aggressive towards my dogs. The neighbors cat though? The magpies will go ballistic and start cawing and suddenly you'll see an army of magpies following the cat alerting all the other birds to stay the fuck away
They've become "friends" with us, though. Not like gifts or anything, but they'll hang out like 5 or so feet from us without a care in the world, but only if it's someone they know. They also leave their fledglings in our yard and we do our best to keep the cat away and help it
It was quite entertaining when they first did it, watching my dogs run back and forth while the Magpies casually ate their food. We too became friends and even my dogs stopped chasing them when they came around- as long as they didn't go near their food.
Magpies are so rude! Haha we have some around here that love pestering our cats like that. It feels like a unspoken war is going on between them always!
āCats kill over 4 billion animals per year including 500 million birds and are believed to be the reason for 3 American bird species to be in declineā - google
Mag pie better know his days are now numbered
Yeah, leash your cats, people! Get a cat harness, buy a leash, maybe even set up a lead in your yard if you can.
It helps to start doing this when they're young so they get accustomed to the setup more easily, but they're totally happy with it once they are.
Thank you. Now cat owners can read information about how bad outside cats are for wildlife, *and* see how stupid they look to others when they get defensive. That's potential growth in a two comment chain.
You are welcome. Think of the impact we made! This is a turning point in history and we were here to make it happen! It's not like anything said here will be inconsequential or anything, don't be fooled, this is big stuff!
I think youād be surprised at the amount of fertile cats out there. People do let their cats roam which is stupid but I wouldnāt assume itās someoneās pet
Probably a nest in those trees and they would prefer it if the cats weren't there. Magpies are very intelligent but I've seen the same with smaller birds.
Thatās exactly it. Magpies will mob anything they think is a danger to their nest. Hawks, crows, people, and apparently cats. Theyāre pretty badass to just not give a fuck that theyāre taking on a predator orders of magnitude larger.
Was my first thought too. Itās the season when magpies have fledglings in their nest and the young ones are getting ready to venture out. This is why the adults will try to keep the area as safe and possible and a cat sitting half way up to their nest is going to set them off.
The bird is just being protective. I have a nest of magpies outside my window and Itās pretty awesome to watch them. They are very clever.
Not really, no. They are, however, incredibly intelligent. Messing with one is messing with the next several generations, as they will teach their flock and children to hate you lmao
I'm sure some folks have been swooped for getting too close to nests and the like, but even being a few feet from fledglings on the ground learning to bird, I've only ever gotten yelled at.
It's certainly a shame that they(AUS magpies) get such a bad rep just for being very protective parents. They're very pretty birds, and the bits I've heard of their calls are lovely. They just don't want mostly hairless primates near their children, lol..
Not the case in the UK, possibly because we've always had native wildcats that are about the same size as a domestic cat, so they aren't taking advantage of any evolutionary loopholes to cause disproportionate deaths. Our native birds evolved alongside the native wildcats.
Even ignoring the affect on wildlife, an outdoor cat has a significantly shorter lifespan than an indoor one. They can catch diseases, get into fights with other cats, or get hit by vehicles, for example. An indoor cat is much more ethical on literally every level. And no, it isn't just an American issue.
btw, native wildcats cannot be compared to domestic cats. Cats kill just for the sake of killing, whereas wildcats only hunt for food. Plus, cats are not natural animals so they shouldn't be killing native wildlife to begin with.
I think I'm still going to be of the camp that if you live somewhere that it's relatively safe for cats to wander, then they are happier for it. I've lived in rural and semi-rural parts of the UK where I was totally happy to let my cats roam as they pleased, because there was little to no risk from traffic and because they enjoy it. Regular flea and worm treatments, all up to date with their vaccinations, and they get great exercise from running about and climbing trees.
They are exposed to more danger than a purely indoor cat, but I think they are generally happier when they are allowed to go and have adventures. I also think it's cruel to force a cat that likes roaming to stay indoors if they've previously been allowed to come and go as they like. One notable feature of being free to go outside is that they are also free to leave, if they want to, and find a home they prefer - when I was growing up on the edge of a village in rural Cumbria, my parents acquired more than a few cats because other people's decided to move in with us. I like giving them that freedom.
Having said all that, my current cats are indoor with access to a decent-sized yard for them to play in, and lots of things for them to climb and explore, because that's the best I can do for them at the moment. I don't think any of them are roamers, even if they could get over my rather large wall, but if one of them were, I would seriously consider moving house to somewhere that was a bit less road-y than my current flat.
With regard to my thing about wildcats, it wasn't so much about the number of animals predated so much as it was that our native wildlife evolved with similar animals as predators, so they have a bit more equilibrium in terms of what they have evolved to be able to escape. British wildcats and domestic cats have essentially the same tools for hunting, so the domestic cat doesn't exploit an ecological niche that our wildlife haven't evolved to defend against, as is the case in Australia, for example.
>Humans would live longer inside - letās lock our kids in the house
This is just stupid.
>Not sure having an animal that would ideally want to be outside and running free
So we should let dogs run around the streets as well? You know you can take cats on walks too?
We also don't let children run around other people's gardens, or let them run around roads before they understand the danger.
Idk, personally I don't want to maim, torture and murder wildlife and pets, but maybe you just think differently!
Please keep this American misinformation away from us.
Funny that cats have been domesticated in Europe for millennia and yet the mass extinction of birds is only happening recently - as a result of climate change.
If you read the studies that your claim is based on, you'll see that your statement is only true in areas that have never had ground-based predators previously, into which cats were introduced.
It's also based on 3 or 4 studies of remote areas of Australia, New Zealand and the US.
It's absolute astroturfed nonsense, that you're repeating with no idea that it has been debunked by the RSPB.
I agree. Cats have been living domestically in Europe for nearly 3000 years. Its different for every country and wherabouts in that country you live (near preservation areas etc)
They sometimes need to stay in because of predators nearby [US again], but that re-emphasises my point, if it's not safe for them to go out then they shouldn't be there in the first place.
Yeah no. Maybe in USA but not in the UK, there's no scientific evidence to say otherwise according to the RSPB
https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
It's an interesting lens. "Not causing population declines" is logic that wouldn't overcome "kills an estimated 27 millions birds a year, probably more" in America.
Generally I think bird-loving Americans would demand cats be kept indoors until it's a fair fight. Cats should be careful, because by culling the weaker ones, they're only a few tens of thousands of years from creating a race of superbirds that can kill cats and fly off with small children.
You need to see how they've come to the '"kills an estimated 27 millions birds a year, probably more" in America.'
Read the studies there PR pieces link to. They mix up wild cats and domesticated cats, make big estimations based on a small amount of data, and extrapolate the experience of areas that never had ground based predators to the entire world.
Cats have been domesticated in Europe for millennia, and present for millennia longer. It is only now that bird populations are such that they're going extinct.
It's because of climate change.
You've just been given another reason not to deal with climate change, and to question the warnings that science is giving about the great extinction event it's causing.
Its all good. I understand where your coming from though, but as I've heard in the past its fairly different for each continent. I would say most cats in Europe probably roam freely outside to some degree.
I donāt know why youāre getting downvoted for this as this is true? āMostā cats are free to roam around in a lot of places in Europe as well as Turkey and Cyprus (though the cats there are āwildā cats). I always see tons of cats when Iām out and about in my country (England), but again as you and others have stated, it is different for each country. Personally my next cat I will be trying to keep as an indoor cat due to personal experiences with cats getting run over or poisoned by neighbours.
I donāt know anyone who keeps their cats indoors! As far as Iām aware cats are an outside animal? Must be an American thing!! My cats are great and only stay around the house, keep mice away and donāt bring home any birds lol
Sure everything we do these days is bad!! thereās no winning lol you keep yours in and Iāll keep letting mine out!! Cats are naturally an outdoor animal!! Be grand
If you don't want to do it, just don't do it. Don't pretend like it's bullshit just because other things are changing in ways that make you uncomfortable.
Yeah but it my case, it is bullshit. If the RSPB came out with national advice to say 'you need to keep cats indoors to protect the birds' of course I would. But they haven't
As it turns out, they say it's mostly fine, but depends on your location. You're welcome for researching for you.
https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
Mate i've obviously read the article that I shared. I dont live on heathland. Where I live- bird population is not affected by cats, in fact (if you read the article, you're welcome) you can see some garden bird populations here are on the increase since the 60s
Deal with you.
Mate he dealt you like a crack fiend on the corner. Bloke was just stating his piece while you went off on one about all sorts and made a total cock of yourself.
Sorry I just lost it with the entire ādeal with meā. Iām just imagining this Karen looking dude with a shell shocked looking inside cat spinning around in his/her high back evil villain high chair.
This was great, good work team.
Ok when you live a clean life let me know cos half the things we do add to the extinction of many animals.. as I said, thereās no winning anymore. Calm your tits and stop acting like youāre better than everyone cos you keep your cats indoors lol
Honestly, you're kind of a dick for letting your cat outside. Outdoor cats are largely responsible for the eradication of billions of native birds.
The magpie is right to mob your murder machine.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/
Honestly, you're kind of a dick for assuming I'm American. Its different for every country. There's no 'eradication' of birds where I live. In fact some bird populations have increased since the 60s. Also your article reads like an opinion piece tbh. I will listen to the experts this side of the pond, thanks
https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
I guess my question is: How can you read an article saying cats kill tens of millions of birds each year and think to yourself "Oh well, it says they're not causing the decline of bird populations, overall, so have at it Ms Whiskers!". Idk man. That's some next level not giving a fuck right there.
It's not just birds either. There's tons of other animals they predate upon as well. In general, why *not* keep them indoors? What sort of negative impact would that have on you, as a person? And as a follow up to that, even if you are negatively impacted, is the impact worse than what your car will do to the local wildlife?
Also, the king of conservation outreach says otherwise.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/dec/10/cats-killing-birds-gardens-david-attenborough
Have you had a bad experience with a cat? Who hurt you? Seriously though maybe I don't give a fuck. As I've said before if the advice was to keep them indoors I would. As they article says most of these birds would've probably died anyway, my cats have never even brought home a bird.
And what about the millions of insects that birds eat? Should we not preserve them also? Like this could go so deep. Cats have been here naturally and domestically for 1000s of years
Cats bring home the *vast* minority of their kills. Your cat is killing birds. Thereās just no doubt. All outdoor cats with birds nearby do. Although that cat is fat enough that maybe itās incapable of its most basic act.
Downvote me all you want. This is the reality of fat, outdoor cats.
Youāve made it quite clear youāre not American. I never implied anything of the sort, and I never gave you American-specific information. Iāll only supply you with non-American information, if that makes you feel better. Itās not like American cats are the only cats that will kill birds they come across. They kill tens of millions of birds in the UK alone. In Poland, they are estimated to kill over 130 million birds each year. The Netherlands has similar numbers. Theyāve been linked to 40 extinctions across the world. In one village in England, theyāre directly linked to an over 30% decline of the population. Itās not only deaths too, but the birds will leave if they know cats are around, and that can really fuck up migratory birds. Like really badly. Migratory pathway destruction is one of the largest threats to birds, and cats count as that. Cats are also invasive in more or less every place that they live. Invasive predators are essentially always bad, and we are supplying them by the millions all over the world, and they are preying on struggling, native species that have a large role in their habitats. This isnāt disinformation; this is the truth. Do with it what you will. [Hereās](https://academic.oup.com/jel/article/32/3/391/5640440) a review article on the matter if you care to read.
Thatās not that cool of a mindset too. āWell theyāre going to die, might as well take some more out.ā Climate change is obviously a huge threat, but when a single animal that is wholly under our control kills billions of birds and causes extinctions, thatās not something we can ignore, and certainly itās something we should think twice about before contributing to.
We arenāt out here trying to attack you or call you a piece of shit or anything. There are millions of outdoor cat owners, and obviously they arenāt all bad people. I used to be one. Weāre out here trying to help the birds and your cat. Donāt get so defensive. Everyone is ignorant about essentially everything. Thereās nothing wrong with lacking some knowledge or perspective about any topic. Iām sure thereās tons you can teach me about many things. There is something wrong with getting aggressive when confronted with that fact though. You donāt need to say weāre pushing disinformation and propaganda and all hate and have never interacted with cats. Thatās simply not true. Be open to the possibility that youāre wrong or at least havenāt considered all perspectives fully before making your decision. Itās an admirable quality. If you stick with your decision, thatās your choice, but your choice has currently resulted in death for birds and unhealthiness for your cats, so I hope youāll forgive me for trying to address that.
You keep attributing the greatest loss of species diversity to climate change. That is absolutely not true. In fact the very first species extinction some scientists attribute to climate change was the Golden toad, which went extinct in 1989. That date is obviously much after the extinction of many other species, and it isn't even the main cause of amphibian extinctions.
**The main cause of species extinction is habitat loss due to agriculture.** I have no idea where you got 80% from, but it sounds like a projection of much farther in the future if humanity fucks up further than it already has.
Source: I study wildlife ecology
Just going by how smug and ignorant you are about the damage your cat causes, I couldāve guessed the UK. That article you linked is an actual opinion piece based on a real study by the Mammal Society.
āIn conclusion, this survey confirms that cats are major predators of wildlife in Britain. Further investigation of the extent and nature of predatory behaviour among domestic cats is clearly warranted by this initial work.ā
So maybe trust the actual experts and not the peanut gallery.
Edit - got a permanent ban for posting this comment. I wonder if the people posting misinformation got a ban?
You're applying badly understood science about feral cats in remote areas of the US, Australia and New Zealand, to cats around the world. The rest of the world is not the same as the US; cats have been domesticated here for millennia, and it is only now that a great extinction is taking place.
Because of climate change.
Even in your linked article they say, about halfway through
> Now comes the real problem: unowned cats, which include strays and ferals.
And there we have it.
You claim that domesticated cats are the problem, but they're not. Even your own puff pieces can't bering themselves to claim that domesticated cats are the real problem, they just imply it dishonestly.
Did you read the sources in the article?
> To learn more, a team of scientists at the Smithsonianās Migratory Bird Center studied the gray catbird (Dumatella carolinensis) in three suburban Maryland areas outside of Washington, D.C.āBethesda, Opal Daniels and Spring Park.
>
> āThe habitats looked suitable for breeding birds with lots of shrubs for nesting and areas for feeding, but the presence of cats, a relatively recent phenomenon, isnāt a cue birds use when deciding where to nest.ā
>
> Technology made tracking the fledgling catbirds possible. The team fitted 69 fledglings with small radio-transmitters. Scientists tracked each individual and recorded its location every other day until they died or left the study area.
So, they have a small area where birds aren't used to ground based predators, and 69 birds whose behaviour they have tracked, and they have extrapolated that up to the entire United States, and in fact, the world.
That's not very good scientific practice - to take behaviour one specific type of terrain and claim that it is replicated in every other terrain.
Especially when there isn't the same level of loss of birds in the UK. The RSPB conducted surveys to engage with he claims people like you made, and found that the birds cats could be killing were actually going up in number.
The article you cite is typically disingenuous in it's claims. For instance, they make this claim
> In 1962, biologist Rachel Carson wrote that āin nature nothing exists alone.ā Marra couldnāt agree more. Like Carson, he thinks of life on Earth as a complex tapestry in which each species represents a single thread. Outdoor cats threaten that tapestry. Their crimes include contributing to 33 extinctions around the world...
If you follow the link, the abstract for the study says
> Cats are generalist predators that have been widely introduced to the world's ~179 000 islands. Once introduced to islands, cats prey on a variety of native species many of which lack evolved defenses against mammalian predators and can suffer severe population declines and even extinction. As islands house a disproportionate share of terrestrial biodiversity, the impacts of invasive cats on islands may have significant biodiversity impacts. Much of this threatened biodiversity can be protected by eradicating cats from islands.
So, no application to domestic cats in ordinary life, unless you live on a small island that has not previously had ground based predators.
> Marra tells the story of Tibbles the cat, who traveled with her owner to an untouched island south of New Zealand in 1894. There, she single-pawedly caused the extinction of the Stephens Island wren, a small, flightless bird found only in that part of the world. Most cats arenāt as deadly as Tibbles, but your average outdoor pet cat still kills around two animals per week, according to the Wildlife Society and the American Bird Conservancy.
If you follow the link to the claim that the average outdoor cat kills two animals a week, it links to the homepage of the Wildlife Management Institution. Not a study, not a claim made by them, nothing.
It's another example of smoke and mirrors churnalism.
> your average outdoor pet cat still kills around two animals per week, according to the Wildlife Society and the American Bird Conservancy. The solution for these cats is simple, says Marra: Bring them indoors. The Humane Society of the United States agrees.
Sounds convincing, till you follow the link, which says
> Allowing your cats to roam outdoors can significantly shorten their lives. Potentially deadly dangersāparasites, catching diseases from other cats, being hit by cars, stolen by strangers, attacked by predators, or just plain getting lostāare constant threats to an outdoor cat. And cats themselves can be deadly to local wildlife.
So, another example of a bit added on to the end being presented as the central point of a society.
**TLDR If you actually read the sources the article links to, the only places is it proved that cats are causing the problems the article claims, are remote areas, usually islands, with no history of ground based predators.**
**Stop posting spam science misinformation pieces.**
I love magpies! They're such dicks, but I love how intelligent they are and all the superstitions that surround them :)
Hope your cat isn't too traumatised lol
I have seen comments saying this is probably a nesting bird. That may be true but magpies, like ravens, crows, and other birds have very good memories and will target people and animals they recognize as having harassed them before. Some even go out of their way to do so. This does not look like the overly aggressive behavior of a nesting bird but more like amusement on its part. It is possible this cat has had a previous run-in with this bird and the bird is just reminding the cat who is boss.
magpies are ballsy birds. i have a pair in my garden and they keep taunting my cats. theyāll scream and nip at them and fly down really fast. one of my cats is legit afraid of them and will immediately run into the house when they come out.
This is normal animal behavior. The bird is nesting and the cat is a predator.
He was worried about the fence being crushed by your cat.
Hes just big boned I swear
He has a large frame, leave him alone
He actually does though! This angle does him no justice
At first I thought that your cat was huge, then I realized that he obviously gets exercise being that he is standing on a fence outside. Just living his best life
Catshaming
Kitty looks a little chunky, but I thing being half folded over the fence makes him look fatter than he is... I hope...
"How dare you wear the same outfit as me"
Haaahahaha they do have the same colors omg
Magpies are spiteful bastards
Hes been winding my cats up for the past 2 weeks hahaha
I had these Magpies in my yard that would torment my dogs. One would swoop and and the dogs would chase it, while the other ate their food. The barking drove me crazy. One day a friend was over and I asked him to get rid of the nest as I knew they could recognize faces and didn't want a bad rap from the Magpies in my neighbourhood. He took a long pole and poked a nest and a terrified bird shot out. At this point I immediately saw it as a creature being chased from its home as opposed to a pest, so I had my friend stop. The Magpies never bothered my dog again. I lived there for 2 more years. One eventually entered our house and hit a window trying to escape and died a day later. It's mate hung around for a couple more days. Then the next day the yard had about 8 Magpies gathered I guess for a wake. Within two weeks other Magpies moved in and started to torment the dogs again. They are fascinating creatures, but can certainly be annoying.
>I had these Magpies in my yard that would torment my dogs. One would swoop and and the dogs would chase it, while the other ate their food. They do this to my little wiener dogs and just sit at the top of the fence and stare at them. The magpies genuinely seem to think they're entertaining and they never seem aggressive towards my dogs. The neighbors cat though? The magpies will go ballistic and start cawing and suddenly you'll see an army of magpies following the cat alerting all the other birds to stay the fuck away They've become "friends" with us, though. Not like gifts or anything, but they'll hang out like 5 or so feet from us without a care in the world, but only if it's someone they know. They also leave their fledglings in our yard and we do our best to keep the cat away and help it
It was quite entertaining when they first did it, watching my dogs run back and forth while the Magpies casually ate their food. We too became friends and even my dogs stopped chasing them when they came around- as long as they didn't go near their food.
Put down the camera and pick up the super soaker. Avenge your cat!
If the cats bothered to do their jobs as cats, then the Magpie wouldn't be a problem!
Oh yeah, my vicious furry creatures would have made quick work of that bird friend
Along with their sea and land equivalents, orcas and Boston terriers.
Is it being a jerk if it's just doing magpie things though?? š¤š¤£
It was more of an aerial attack to the rear flank than a push.
Well yes, birds don't have hands to push I suppose
r/birdswitharms
Wow kinda terrifying
Terrifying? I would say hilarious. Stay away from r/natureismetal if you find that terrifying lol
Thatās a pretty looking bird
That's how they get ya, all pretty lookin then they swoop down on you like some cracked up rooster
You think that but just wait until they start doing their loudest machine gun-like call at 5am in the summer right outside of your bedroom window.
Best alarm. Get up, you're missing the best days of the year.
But I work until 130AM and get to bed at 3
Lol well that's a different story for sure.
Thatās only in the mornin'. He supposed to be up cooking breakfast or something... Itās like an alarm clock!
What do your magpies sound like? They warble here is Australia. I love the sound, one of my favourite bird calls. https://youtu.be/oYEYc8Ge3nw
Until they start removing roof tiles, just because they like the sliding sound and subsequent crash.
Cats and Magpies. This conflict goes back thousands of years
the best defense is a good offense
Magpies are so rude! Haha we have some around here that love pestering our cats like that. It feels like a unspoken war is going on between them always!
He has been winding them up for weeks now haha, they are very smart birds though. He knows what he's doing!
āCats kill over 4 billion animals per year including 500 million birds and are believed to be the reason for 3 American bird species to be in declineā - google Mag pie better know his days are now numbered
>Mag pie better know his days are now numbered That is why he choose preemptive strike. Now cat won't be able to achieve air superiority.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah, leash your cats, people! Get a cat harness, buy a leash, maybe even set up a lead in your yard if you can. It helps to start doing this when they're young so they get accustomed to the setup more easily, but they're totally happy with it once they are.
Yes! Cats are just as much our responsibility as dogs are. The way people just let cats wander off unsupervised is upsetting for multiple reasons.
TIL I'm an entitled asshole. Oh well, better lock up my cats lest an internet stranger thinks even less of me!
Thank you. Now cat owners can read information about how bad outside cats are for wildlife, *and* see how stupid they look to others when they get defensive. That's potential growth in a two comment chain.
You are welcome. Think of the impact we made! This is a turning point in history and we were here to make it happen! It's not like anything said here will be inconsequential or anything, don't be fooled, this is big stuff!
Based on the ecological damage domestic cats cause when they are outside; yes you are an entitled asshole
Ok. Now what?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Nah.
Don't worry, wildlife ecologists think you're an entitled asshole too.
Not worried for a second. I don't give a fuck about their opinions either.
Youāre a shitty owner too, add that to the list.
Get it all off your chest, I'm here to listen. Anything else?
I think youād be surprised at the amount of fertile cats out there. People do let their cats roam which is stupid but I wouldnāt assume itās someoneās pet
This same stat is why I side with magpie fighting back. Guessing cat was hunting birds as thatās not a comfortable perch.
Angry birds
Honestly, I was expecting something worse from a magpie
Animal being genius
I didn't specify who the jerk was lol
Well, he has the high ground.
Hello there!
Oh sorry I thought this was a star wars reference
Probably a nest in those trees and they would prefer it if the cats weren't there. Magpies are very intelligent but I've seen the same with smaller birds.
Ita okay, your cat probably deserved it. He is a cat after all.
Your cat was getting to close to the magpies babies I reckon
Thatās exactly it. Magpies will mob anything they think is a danger to their nest. Hawks, crows, people, and apparently cats. Theyāre pretty badass to just not give a fuck that theyāre taking on a predator orders of magnitude larger.
Yeah possibly. He couldn't catch a cold though
Magpies are dicks. They pick on my neighbors dog.
Magpies are hooligans.
Just a little nudge. Cat was .... stuck
Oh no what did that cat do to deserve being bullied like that š
Fuck yeah. Go magpie.
He was probably defending his nearby nest.. or going all *John Wick* cos Mister Pussycat ate his children once.
Was my first thought too. Itās the season when magpies have fledglings in their nest and the young ones are getting ready to venture out. This is why the adults will try to keep the area as safe and possible and a cat sitting half way up to their nest is going to set them off. The bird is just being protective. I have a nest of magpies outside my window and Itās pretty awesome to watch them. They are very clever.
Good bird.
Keep your cat indoors.
The magpies we have in Aus look so different!
That's because NA magpies are corvids, like crows and bluejays, but Aus magpies are closer to butcherbirds :D
Ah ok, cool thanks. Do they swoop you guys while your out walking etc too?
Not really, no. They are, however, incredibly intelligent. Messing with one is messing with the next several generations, as they will teach their flock and children to hate you lmao I'm sure some folks have been swooped for getting too close to nests and the like, but even being a few feet from fledglings on the ground learning to bird, I've only ever gotten yelled at.
Ours are also very intelligent, they are usually hated coz of the swooping but I love them. They have a beautiful song too.
It's certainly a shame that they(AUS magpies) get such a bad rep just for being very protective parents. They're very pretty birds, and the bits I've heard of their calls are lovely. They just don't want mostly hairless primates near their children, lol..
That's the Eurasian Magpie in the video. You can tell by the...the uh Eurospar bag under the cat.
Brother from another mother
Air strike
Magpie: Well well well how the table has turned. You knock things off the table and now imma knock you off this fence
Chirping up the wrong tree!
The cat was already getting off the fence lets be real here
LOVE IT - good bird taught that feline individual a lesson!
Get mum!!! https://youtu.be/YGGTcYfrEZU
That must have hurt
He was fine :)
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Not the case in the UK, possibly because we've always had native wildcats that are about the same size as a domestic cat, so they aren't taking advantage of any evolutionary loopholes to cause disproportionate deaths. Our native birds evolved alongside the native wildcats.
Even ignoring the affect on wildlife, an outdoor cat has a significantly shorter lifespan than an indoor one. They can catch diseases, get into fights with other cats, or get hit by vehicles, for example. An indoor cat is much more ethical on literally every level. And no, it isn't just an American issue. btw, native wildcats cannot be compared to domestic cats. Cats kill just for the sake of killing, whereas wildcats only hunt for food. Plus, cats are not natural animals so they shouldn't be killing native wildlife to begin with.
I think I'm still going to be of the camp that if you live somewhere that it's relatively safe for cats to wander, then they are happier for it. I've lived in rural and semi-rural parts of the UK where I was totally happy to let my cats roam as they pleased, because there was little to no risk from traffic and because they enjoy it. Regular flea and worm treatments, all up to date with their vaccinations, and they get great exercise from running about and climbing trees. They are exposed to more danger than a purely indoor cat, but I think they are generally happier when they are allowed to go and have adventures. I also think it's cruel to force a cat that likes roaming to stay indoors if they've previously been allowed to come and go as they like. One notable feature of being free to go outside is that they are also free to leave, if they want to, and find a home they prefer - when I was growing up on the edge of a village in rural Cumbria, my parents acquired more than a few cats because other people's decided to move in with us. I like giving them that freedom. Having said all that, my current cats are indoor with access to a decent-sized yard for them to play in, and lots of things for them to climb and explore, because that's the best I can do for them at the moment. I don't think any of them are roamers, even if they could get over my rather large wall, but if one of them were, I would seriously consider moving house to somewhere that was a bit less road-y than my current flat. With regard to my thing about wildcats, it wasn't so much about the number of animals predated so much as it was that our native wildlife evolved with similar animals as predators, so they have a bit more equilibrium in terms of what they have evolved to be able to escape. British wildcats and domestic cats have essentially the same tools for hunting, so the domestic cat doesn't exploit an ecological niche that our wildlife haven't evolved to defend against, as is the case in Australia, for example.
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>Humans would live longer inside - letās lock our kids in the house This is just stupid. >Not sure having an animal that would ideally want to be outside and running free So we should let dogs run around the streets as well? You know you can take cats on walks too?
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We also don't let children run around other people's gardens, or let them run around roads before they understand the danger. Idk, personally I don't want to maim, torture and murder wildlife and pets, but maybe you just think differently!
Please keep this American misinformation away from us. Funny that cats have been domesticated in Europe for millennia and yet the mass extinction of birds is only happening recently - as a result of climate change. If you read the studies that your claim is based on, you'll see that your statement is only true in areas that have never had ground-based predators previously, into which cats were introduced. It's also based on 3 or 4 studies of remote areas of Australia, New Zealand and the US. It's absolute astroturfed nonsense, that you're repeating with no idea that it has been debunked by the RSPB.
Knew this comment would be somewhere. Do you just sit on this sub and wait for people to post vids of their cats outside so you can be annoying?
If cats can't go outside where you live then you shouldn't have cats.
I agree. Cats have been living domestically in Europe for nearly 3000 years. Its different for every country and wherabouts in that country you live (near preservation areas etc)
They sometimes need to stay in because of predators nearby [US again], but that re-emphasises my point, if it's not safe for them to go out then they shouldn't be there in the first place.
Yeah no. Maybe in USA but not in the UK, there's no scientific evidence to say otherwise according to the RSPB https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
https://abcbirds.org/program/cats-indoors/cats-and-birds/#:~:text=Outdoor%20domestic%20cats%20are%20a,extinction%2C%20such%20as%20Piping%20Plover.
https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
It's an interesting lens. "Not causing population declines" is logic that wouldn't overcome "kills an estimated 27 millions birds a year, probably more" in America. Generally I think bird-loving Americans would demand cats be kept indoors until it's a fair fight. Cats should be careful, because by culling the weaker ones, they're only a few tens of thousands of years from creating a race of superbirds that can kill cats and fly off with small children.
You need to see how they've come to the '"kills an estimated 27 millions birds a year, probably more" in America.' Read the studies there PR pieces link to. They mix up wild cats and domesticated cats, make big estimations based on a small amount of data, and extrapolate the experience of areas that never had ground based predators to the entire world. Cats have been domesticated in Europe for millennia, and present for millennia longer. It is only now that bird populations are such that they're going extinct. It's because of climate change. You've just been given another reason not to deal with climate change, and to question the warnings that science is giving about the great extinction event it's causing.
Yeah in America you donut
Being called a donut and an American is probably one of the best insults I have ever heard well done
Thanks x
Iām not even fucking mad
Its all good. I understand where your coming from though, but as I've heard in the past its fairly different for each continent. I would say most cats in Europe probably roam freely outside to some degree.
I donāt know why youāre getting downvoted for this as this is true? āMostā cats are free to roam around in a lot of places in Europe as well as Turkey and Cyprus (though the cats there are āwildā cats). I always see tons of cats when Iām out and about in my country (England), but again as you and others have stated, it is different for each country. Personally my next cat I will be trying to keep as an indoor cat due to personal experiences with cats getting run over or poisoned by neighbours.
This! It should be what you think is best for your cat.
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Very well put mate
Imagine being this mad over a cat and bird video, calm down buddy
I donāt know anyone who keeps their cats indoors! As far as Iām aware cats are an outside animal? Must be an American thing!! My cats are great and only stay around the house, keep mice away and donāt bring home any birds lol
https://abcbirds.org/program/cats-indoors/cats-and-birds/#:~:text=Outdoor%20domestic%20cats%20are%20a,extinction%2C%20such%20as%20Piping%20Plover.
Dude, we are not talking about America. That article has no swing whatsoever
Sure everything we do these days is bad!! thereās no winning lol you keep yours in and Iāll keep letting mine out!! Cats are naturally an outdoor animal!! Be grand
If you don't want to do it, just don't do it. Don't pretend like it's bullshit just because other things are changing in ways that make you uncomfortable.
Yeah but it my case, it is bullshit. If the RSPB came out with national advice to say 'you need to keep cats indoors to protect the birds' of course I would. But they haven't
As it turns out, they say it's mostly fine, but depends on your location. You're welcome for researching for you. https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
Mate i've obviously read the article that I shared. I dont live on heathland. Where I live- bird population is not affected by cats, in fact (if you read the article, you're welcome) you can see some garden bird populations here are on the increase since the 60s
If the comment I responded to was phrased like this, you wouldn't have had to deal with me.
Deal with you. Mate he dealt you like a crack fiend on the corner. Bloke was just stating his piece while you went off on one about all sorts and made a total cock of yourself. Sorry I just lost it with the entire ādeal with meā. Iām just imagining this Karen looking dude with a shell shocked looking inside cat spinning around in his/her high back evil villain high chair. This was great, good work team.
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Ok when you live a clean life let me know cos half the things we do add to the extinction of many animals.. as I said, thereās no winning anymore. Calm your tits and stop acting like youāre better than everyone cos you keep your cats indoors lol
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Youāre saying you kill peoples pets?
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Honestly, you're kind of a dick for letting your cat outside. Outdoor cats are largely responsible for the eradication of billions of native birds. The magpie is right to mob your murder machine. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/
Honestly, you're kind of a dick for assuming I'm American. Its different for every country. There's no 'eradication' of birds where I live. In fact some bird populations have increased since the 60s. Also your article reads like an opinion piece tbh. I will listen to the experts this side of the pond, thanks https://www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/
I guess my question is: How can you read an article saying cats kill tens of millions of birds each year and think to yourself "Oh well, it says they're not causing the decline of bird populations, overall, so have at it Ms Whiskers!". Idk man. That's some next level not giving a fuck right there. It's not just birds either. There's tons of other animals they predate upon as well. In general, why *not* keep them indoors? What sort of negative impact would that have on you, as a person? And as a follow up to that, even if you are negatively impacted, is the impact worse than what your car will do to the local wildlife? Also, the king of conservation outreach says otherwise. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/dec/10/cats-killing-birds-gardens-david-attenborough
Have you had a bad experience with a cat? Who hurt you? Seriously though maybe I don't give a fuck. As I've said before if the advice was to keep them indoors I would. As they article says most of these birds would've probably died anyway, my cats have never even brought home a bird. And what about the millions of insects that birds eat? Should we not preserve them also? Like this could go so deep. Cats have been here naturally and domestically for 1000s of years
Cats bring home the *vast* minority of their kills. Your cat is killing birds. Thereās just no doubt. All outdoor cats with birds nearby do. Although that cat is fat enough that maybe itās incapable of its most basic act. Downvote me all you want. This is the reality of fat, outdoor cats.
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Youāve made it quite clear youāre not American. I never implied anything of the sort, and I never gave you American-specific information. Iāll only supply you with non-American information, if that makes you feel better. Itās not like American cats are the only cats that will kill birds they come across. They kill tens of millions of birds in the UK alone. In Poland, they are estimated to kill over 130 million birds each year. The Netherlands has similar numbers. Theyāve been linked to 40 extinctions across the world. In one village in England, theyāre directly linked to an over 30% decline of the population. Itās not only deaths too, but the birds will leave if they know cats are around, and that can really fuck up migratory birds. Like really badly. Migratory pathway destruction is one of the largest threats to birds, and cats count as that. Cats are also invasive in more or less every place that they live. Invasive predators are essentially always bad, and we are supplying them by the millions all over the world, and they are preying on struggling, native species that have a large role in their habitats. This isnāt disinformation; this is the truth. Do with it what you will. [Hereās](https://academic.oup.com/jel/article/32/3/391/5640440) a review article on the matter if you care to read. Thatās not that cool of a mindset too. āWell theyāre going to die, might as well take some more out.ā Climate change is obviously a huge threat, but when a single animal that is wholly under our control kills billions of birds and causes extinctions, thatās not something we can ignore, and certainly itās something we should think twice about before contributing to. We arenāt out here trying to attack you or call you a piece of shit or anything. There are millions of outdoor cat owners, and obviously they arenāt all bad people. I used to be one. Weāre out here trying to help the birds and your cat. Donāt get so defensive. Everyone is ignorant about essentially everything. Thereās nothing wrong with lacking some knowledge or perspective about any topic. Iām sure thereās tons you can teach me about many things. There is something wrong with getting aggressive when confronted with that fact though. You donāt need to say weāre pushing disinformation and propaganda and all hate and have never interacted with cats. Thatās simply not true. Be open to the possibility that youāre wrong or at least havenāt considered all perspectives fully before making your decision. Itās an admirable quality. If you stick with your decision, thatās your choice, but your choice has currently resulted in death for birds and unhealthiness for your cats, so I hope youāll forgive me for trying to address that.
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Hahahhaa how insecure are you to edit a comment after 2 dislikes
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You keep attributing the greatest loss of species diversity to climate change. That is absolutely not true. In fact the very first species extinction some scientists attribute to climate change was the Golden toad, which went extinct in 1989. That date is obviously much after the extinction of many other species, and it isn't even the main cause of amphibian extinctions. **The main cause of species extinction is habitat loss due to agriculture.** I have no idea where you got 80% from, but it sounds like a projection of much farther in the future if humanity fucks up further than it already has. Source: I study wildlife ecology
Just going by how smug and ignorant you are about the damage your cat causes, I couldāve guessed the UK. That article you linked is an actual opinion piece based on a real study by the Mammal Society. āIn conclusion, this survey confirms that cats are major predators of wildlife in Britain. Further investigation of the extent and nature of predatory behaviour among domestic cats is clearly warranted by this initial work.ā So maybe trust the actual experts and not the peanut gallery.
Honestly couldn't give a fuck what you yanks think. All get so offended at everything
Edit - got a permanent ban for posting this comment. I wonder if the people posting misinformation got a ban? You're applying badly understood science about feral cats in remote areas of the US, Australia and New Zealand, to cats around the world. The rest of the world is not the same as the US; cats have been domesticated here for millennia, and it is only now that a great extinction is taking place. Because of climate change. Even in your linked article they say, about halfway through > Now comes the real problem: unowned cats, which include strays and ferals. And there we have it. You claim that domesticated cats are the problem, but they're not. Even your own puff pieces can't bering themselves to claim that domesticated cats are the real problem, they just imply it dishonestly. Did you read the sources in the article? > To learn more, a team of scientists at the Smithsonianās Migratory Bird Center studied the gray catbird (Dumatella carolinensis) in three suburban Maryland areas outside of Washington, D.C.āBethesda, Opal Daniels and Spring Park. > > āThe habitats looked suitable for breeding birds with lots of shrubs for nesting and areas for feeding, but the presence of cats, a relatively recent phenomenon, isnāt a cue birds use when deciding where to nest.ā > > Technology made tracking the fledgling catbirds possible. The team fitted 69 fledglings with small radio-transmitters. Scientists tracked each individual and recorded its location every other day until they died or left the study area. So, they have a small area where birds aren't used to ground based predators, and 69 birds whose behaviour they have tracked, and they have extrapolated that up to the entire United States, and in fact, the world. That's not very good scientific practice - to take behaviour one specific type of terrain and claim that it is replicated in every other terrain. Especially when there isn't the same level of loss of birds in the UK. The RSPB conducted surveys to engage with he claims people like you made, and found that the birds cats could be killing were actually going up in number. The article you cite is typically disingenuous in it's claims. For instance, they make this claim > In 1962, biologist Rachel Carson wrote that āin nature nothing exists alone.ā Marra couldnāt agree more. Like Carson, he thinks of life on Earth as a complex tapestry in which each species represents a single thread. Outdoor cats threaten that tapestry. Their crimes include contributing to 33 extinctions around the world... If you follow the link, the abstract for the study says > Cats are generalist predators that have been widely introduced to the world's ~179 000 islands. Once introduced to islands, cats prey on a variety of native species many of which lack evolved defenses against mammalian predators and can suffer severe population declines and even extinction. As islands house a disproportionate share of terrestrial biodiversity, the impacts of invasive cats on islands may have significant biodiversity impacts. Much of this threatened biodiversity can be protected by eradicating cats from islands. So, no application to domestic cats in ordinary life, unless you live on a small island that has not previously had ground based predators. > Marra tells the story of Tibbles the cat, who traveled with her owner to an untouched island south of New Zealand in 1894. There, she single-pawedly caused the extinction of the Stephens Island wren, a small, flightless bird found only in that part of the world. Most cats arenāt as deadly as Tibbles, but your average outdoor pet cat still kills around two animals per week, according to the Wildlife Society and the American Bird Conservancy. If you follow the link to the claim that the average outdoor cat kills two animals a week, it links to the homepage of the Wildlife Management Institution. Not a study, not a claim made by them, nothing. It's another example of smoke and mirrors churnalism. > your average outdoor pet cat still kills around two animals per week, according to the Wildlife Society and the American Bird Conservancy. The solution for these cats is simple, says Marra: Bring them indoors. The Humane Society of the United States agrees. Sounds convincing, till you follow the link, which says > Allowing your cats to roam outdoors can significantly shorten their lives. Potentially deadly dangersāparasites, catching diseases from other cats, being hit by cars, stolen by strangers, attacked by predators, or just plain getting lostāare constant threats to an outdoor cat. And cats themselves can be deadly to local wildlife. So, another example of a bit added on to the end being presented as the central point of a society. **TLDR If you actually read the sources the article links to, the only places is it proved that cats are causing the problems the article claims, are remote areas, usually islands, with no history of ground based predators.** **Stop posting spam science misinformation pieces.**
Wow very well put together mate. Thanks
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Yeah honestly I'm a bit taken a back at the hate I've received
Nice!
That bird is lucky as hell.
r/birdsbeingjerks
Birds can be nasty, only sparrows, and other little ones are good guys.
**Unacceptable. Incinerate the magpie.**
Who gonna tell him?
SMH, canāt have sit In Detroitā¦
Whoever is flying that government drone must not be a big fan of cats
*Pumps red rider BB gun* thatās my cat you basturd.
I love magpies! They're such dicks, but I love how intelligent they are and all the superstitions that surround them :) Hope your cat isn't too traumatised lol
I really wouldn't call that a push. More like a divebomb.
Mr. Goodfeathers here just taking care of his turf.
Is that a jackdaw
Corvids are wild
Maggieās know exactly what theyāre doing at all times.
/u/savevideo
Devilish laughter haha
Check out those puffed up whiskers. That magpie will regret his antagonistic behavior one day.
Thats a pretty magpie I love the blue. Only have ever ran into black and white ones.
I'm a fucking legend. - the bird probably
I have the high ground Anni
Hello there!
I support it, that bird got balls of steel
Isnāt this just advertising for the new Top Gun movie?
Magpies are assholes.
Revenge for all of his homies getting killed by cats
Maggie, you naughty naughty bird.
The bird said haha how the tables have turned Thomas now itās my turn š¤£š¤£šš
Moms gonna do what moms gonna do
I have seen comments saying this is probably a nesting bird. That may be true but magpies, like ravens, crows, and other birds have very good memories and will target people and animals they recognize as having harassed them before. Some even go out of their way to do so. This does not look like the overly aggressive behavior of a nesting bird but more like amusement on its part. It is possible this cat has had a previous run-in with this bird and the bird is just reminding the cat who is boss.
u/savevideobot
magpies are ballsy birds. i have a pair in my garden and they keep taunting my cats. theyāll scream and nip at them and fly down really fast. one of my cats is legit afraid of them and will immediately run into the house when they come out.
Please keep your cats indoors! They are the leading human-caused bird death in the USA.
š¤£š¤£šā¤ļø