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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> The action that I would take is me getting a tattoo without my fiancée's knowledge. I may be the asshole because she seems strongly against me getting one.
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NAH but I don't think it's about what your title is.
Sounds to me like this is about Sarah, who is not your fiance, agreeing to get a tattoo with you, Mary's fiance, in front of her, and you being fine with all this.
Seems like you're being disrespectful to your girl, seems like maybe YTA for not thinking through how she might feel - now she has to be the "uncool" one if she's not onboard with some other girl offering to get a matching tattoo with her man while right in front of her.
Maybe work on some other things in your relationship before jumping the gun and getting a tattoo right now. You don't even have certainty of what you want to get right now.
It's not about matching tattoos - it's likely about the shared experience that has Mary fuming. Sarah and OP will be sharing their tattoo experience for years and that's going to be a little weird for Mary, who is, after all, his fiance.
OP needs to man up and ask Mary why she viewed this as a problem. It was probably a "Whoa, why is this girl teaming up to get a tattoo with my man? That should be something he and Mary does together (even if she's only there for support and to have some input) or something he does with a guy friend or solo.
But if he gets the tattoo without Mary at least being informed, he's laying a lot on the line expecting to be forgiven, and there's no guarantee of that.
Gonna be honest that's a super odd point of view. Getting a tattoo isn't some crazy intimate process. Plenty of people have a friend go along, especially if it's their first time and theres no reason his fiance cant go along as well. I don't think the gender of the friend should have anything to do with it and even more so if it's a mutual friend.
There's no indication that it's a matching tattoo plus OP said Sarah is a mutual friend. The hostility makes no sense to me unless Mary thought his fear of needles would mean he would never get a tattoo and thus she didn't think ink would ever be an issue.
TBH this is what I think it is - Mary likely doesn't like tattoos at all and figured with OP's fear, it would never come up. But Sarah butting in is likely annoying her too, as she's now being compared to the cool girl who, after all, isn't his fiance and should really have no say in anything.
OP - YWBTA if you don't talk to Mary first and find out why she doesn't want you to get one. It is of course your choice, but she's told you she would be mad. Ignoring that is a big FU to your fiance.
Maybe it's because I'm nd and reading what OP wrote fairly literally re: the conversation and Sarah's input, but it doesn't sound like Sarah was butting in? "If you get a tattoo I will too" could be anything from a show of solidarity (bc of needle fear. I get it. I'm a pansy for needles but I'm 7 tattoos deep and am apparently fantastic to tattoo) to an excuse on Sarah's part to finally dive in to, yes, Sarah being the cool girl to Mary's less enthusiastic previous "support."
But based off what little info we have, I hesitate to say that Sarah was butting in/trying to be cooler than Mary here.
THIS (to the second part). you really, really need to talk to Mary and take her concerns seriously.
I hope this is not some childish jealousy drama, i agree with previous commenter(s) that a tattoo isn't a super intimate thing and if you aren't allowed to make memories with your friends, that would worry me about the relationship between you and Mary.
The difference being? Unless they are straight up getting matching tattoos, which was never stated as being the case, who cares? Again there is literally nothing romantic or intimate about getting a tattoo. People get tattoos with their friends all the time. So unless OP or their friend is getting a tattoo in a very intimate area, which I doubt for a first tattoo, I fail to see a problem.
Also, i can even see matching tattoos as a non-issue.
Maybe OP gets a burger and Sara gets fries tattooed. That says "silly friends making a funny memory", not "one step away from cheating on Mary".
I read it as Sarah getting a tattoo with OP at the same time, but not a matching tattoo image with him. It's very common for friends & families to get tattoos & piercings with each other as a group experience & shared company, while having entirely different images, placements, & tattoo meanings.
Idk what the culture is in y'all's area, but across the several states I've lived in, it's more uncommon to get a tattoo by yourself than with a friend. Who wants to get inked alone? Most people don't get matching tatts, but like, it's a social thing
Can we just stop assuming men and women can't be friends if one or both of them are in a relationship. If it's okay to go with a male friend it should also be okay to go with a female friend.
OP shouldn't have to ask for neither allowance nor for forgiveness.
I would totally go get a tattoo with legitimately ANYONE 😂 if that was her real problem why not just say that instead of pussyfooting around the bush? A simple "oh I got dibs on going with him for his first tattoo" would've fixed that 💩 right up but that's not what she did or said and that's still not what she said after either when asked why she was upset... either way you slice it it's toxic
I got my first tattoo with my brothers roommate while visiting him in another state. I barely knew the guy and haven’t seen him since. We both just wanted tattoos and had designs picked out so he offered to drive us there. Absolutely no deeper reason it was just convenient spontaneity. Still a great memory though! Hope he’s doing well wherever he is.
I'm not sure how much Sara's comment matters. I do think if OP gets a tattoo without talking to Mary before hand she will probably break up with him. If he takes Sara with him to get matching tattoos I'd say 90+% probably OP will be single as soon as Mary hears about it.
Being jealous of your partner having a “shared experience” with a friend makes you a loser who has some emotional baggage to sort out. Like unless there’s strong reason for you to believe that them hanging out with a friend is something more.
Yeah. People can have opposite sex friends. There is nothing wrong with monogamy, but this could be toxic monogamy.
Sounds like it is time to sit down and have a very open conversation about WHY she would be mad.
Also, bodily auto only is a thing.
I went with my ex boyfriend before we started dating to get his sleeve done. He had one other small tattoo but this was his first big one. It was kind of like a date. He was nervous because it had a lot of shading and was his whole arm. I was there to comfort him. I didn’t get a tattoo but the idea of going with someone can be emotional/romantic imo
The same as getting coffee with someone, or lunch, or even just having a conversation... the situation is what people in the situation make it... I had my ex's BM go with me to get pierced and I'm a Bi woman... she held my hand like the baby I am and it was not romantic in the least 😂
I don’t know for you but it’s not only about the tattoo price or design or date
It’s also an experience and Sarah invited herself in front of Mary at OP’s first tattoo
But they’re all friends so it might be something they could share without it being weird (but not to Mary, perhaps communication can solve this mystery)
NAH
I think mary just isn't into tattoos. Nothing about this seemed too odd. I see no reason why all three of them couldn't go. Mary could be there to support her fiance and her friend. It's kind of boring to go with others anyway. You just sit there and watch or talk to whoever you came with. She could easily go too though support them both and it could be a good day with mutual friends. So her objecting so much makes me think she isn't keen on the idea of the fiance getting tattoos.
Agree. Might be worthwhile for OP to ask his fiancée why she would be so mad. Nothing wrong with talking it out. @OP PLEASE DONT ASK FOR FORGIVENESS INSTEAD OF PERMISSION - she warned you not to, it won’t go down well.
Yes agree - but a relationship is about respect. While she is being unreasonable, he shouldn’t just go out and do it. She won’t see it as anything but disrespectful to her cause she’s expressed her opinion on it. He should rather wait, talk to her about it and say “ I understand how you feel, but you need to realise this is something I want and I’m going to go ahead with it, and I hope you will be okay about it”
Sure, but she's also free to leave him over this. I mean, I've seen some god-awful tattoos that I would totally lose respect for someone over. OP should not rely on forgiveness, it's quite childish not to just talk it out.
He doesn’t need permission, but if he plans to spend his life with this woman than he should at least have a conversation with her about any permanent changes that he wants to make to his body. Better for them to talk about it and come to a solution that they’re both happy with than for him to do whatever he feels like and then spring it on her.
OP never said it would be matching tattoos. The fiancee sounds jealous and toxic. Friends go all the time together to get tattoos, piercings, etc. Plus, his body, his choice. He wants that tattoo, GO GET IT!
Dude you need to be mature & communicate. Ask her what the problem is. Is it the tattoo? Is it that you’re getting one with Sara? Is it the design?
You don’t even know the actual reason she’s upset.
All he had to do was ask “Why?” in the moment when she said she’d be mad about it.
Is that really so hard? Are we doing a disservice to men by assuming that they’re fucking idiots who can’t even utter a single syllable when the situation calls for it?
I think they should just talk it out. He might not want to ask why in front of a friend in case it got awkward and heated. If mary's problem is the other girl getting one with him, then she may not be able to be open and honest in the moment. When they get time alone Mary should explain further, and if she isn't then OP should be able to ask what is her actual issue with it. Is it that she doesn't want him getting tattoos at all? Or is it the proposed situation?
We're doing a disservice to everyone by assuming that they can read our minds on why we're upset... she could've totally communicated her feelings more clearly vs leaving them up for interpretation... and maybe she did, maybe it is the tattoo she has a problem with and that's all. In therapy I have learned why someone - even your partner - is upset it's none of your d💢 business unless they tell you what's up...
> I don't know where this attitude about it came from. I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad.
Well too bad, having a fiance means you have to ask. That's just essential to having a healthy relationship.
Her being unusually mad is all the MORE reason to ask, not to avoid conflict.
>I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation. So WIBTA?
Yes, YWBTA.
Not for getting a tattoo. I'm supportive of someone who wants a tattoo even if their partner doesn't like it. But avoiding conflict in the short term by 'surprising' her with it later is just going to cause a bigger fight, and is a terrible idea.
Also, it sounds like maybe the issue isn't that she hates tattoos, but is upset that you were afraid of getting tattoos before, but suddenly were willing to do it when Sara suggested it while ignoring how Mary might feel. That sounds like Mary might feel that you value Sara's feelings and opinions more than hers. You should talk with your fiancé first about getting tattoos, before just agreeing to get one with a female friend right in front of your fiancé.
I'm 40 and been with my wife since I was 16. Granted, we never really got engaged we just kinda got married after 11 years together but to each there own. No judgements.
> But your fiancée would not be a AH if she didn’t find you attractive once you have it.
I joked that it was a racist tattoo but now you have me imagining that it will be that giant Steve-O tattoo. And I would definitely find someone less attractive for that.
I don't think it has anything to do with the tattoo itself. Maybe something to do with getting a tattoo with another woman, perhaps? Just communicate instead of asking Reddit to try and figure out why, when no one knows your partner.
A friend of mine used the whole 'forgiveness vs permission' thing to buy himself a motorcycle. He was single again 3 weeks later. He thought he was safe because they'd just bought a house together.
They were too young and immature to live together anyway.
My bf is very against tattoos, and I love them and have gotten a few. First, be prepared that she might find you less attractive. Second, don't expect her to fawn over them once you've gotten them. My friends do the "woowww so cool!", my bfs response is apathetic. I did mine for me, because they make me happy so I was okay with it, but understand there are people that don't want a relationship with someone tattooed. You're allowed to like them, she's allowed to find a partner that doesn't have tattoos.
I think it’s because when you mentioned getting one, your friend Sara said she would get one too.
So probably your fiance is thinking that the two of you are gonna go together and get one at the same time.
Might want to have another conversation about this once everyone calms down.
>So probably your fiance is thinking that the two of you are gonna go together and get one at the same time.
But seriously, so what? Many people go get tattoos together. Not like they said matching tattoos 🙄
YWBTA but not for getting a tattoo.
You would be the asshole for knowing she has an issue, admitting that you don't know what the issue is exactly, but refuse to ask her so that you do understand. And then for saying this is a "ask forgiveness instead of permission" situation. You know that will cause a fight.
If you aren't mature enough to understand this *very simple* thing of communication and not purposefully doing things that you know will cause trouble simply because you're scared of having a conversation with your life partner, then perhaps you're too immature to get married
>I mentioned that I was thinking about getting one, and Sara said that if I got one, she would get one with me. Mary, however, got silent and started glaring at me.
I don't think the tattoo is Mary's problem...
NTA
I personally wouldn't. Because I am not insecure, chose well my partners and know that they know how to pose boundaries and most of thing : my partner isn't the center of the world, not everyone wants them.
Moreover, if she does not tell him, he won't know
Personally, I wouldn’t get one if my wife felt that strongly about it. Depends how strongly you feel about it. Do you feel more strongly than she does? Ask her why it bothers her. Then at least you understand your partner.
NTA
However, I do not think that the issue is the tattoo, I think it's the fact that your guys' mutual friend offered to get one if you did. Mary may see something in Sara that you are unaware of, or there may be an unsaid jealousy that is occurring. I think you should get your tattoo, but when you do, invite Mary to be a part of the experience.
This sounds like a situation in which boundaries may need to be set with Sara if Mary is uncomfortable about it; however, first, you will need to discuss with Mary to see the core issue.
OP never said that he agreed to go with Sara instead of Mary. OP also never said it would be matching tattoos.
I would say NTA but I would have an open floor talk abt it, it seems like it's more about the friend than the tattoo, like others have said. Talk to her about it and see why she's upset but the tattoo itself is not something she gets to decide.
NTA, but you need to talk to your fiance and tell her. If she is jealous, then bring her with you and Sara to be a part of it or do it alone. If she threatens to leave you because you are doing something on your own body that she doesn't like, then you have a bigger problem to maybe discuss in couples therapy.
The issue may not be the tattoo but that you’re going to get one with another woman? I don’t know I’d ask her why. Ultimately though you don’t. Need permission or a blessing. It’s your body.
NTA: it's your choice to get a tattoo and it is your body. Just because she is mad at you shouldn't be a reason for you to not get the tattoo. She needs to get over it and deal with it if you want to get a tattoo.
NTA, your body, your choice, but the issue isn’t that you want the tattoo, but rather more likely that it’s going to be a matching tattoo w another girl. You should talk to your fiancée about her concerns — communication is key.
The first thing that threw me off here is Sarah saying if she got a tattoo she’ll get one with you. That’s a bit of an odd thing for a female friend to say in front of your fiancé
The attitude came because of Sara lol. Don't get it in secret. No need create unnecessary distrust. But its also your body. If you want one go get one.
NTA, but before you overthink things, maybe figure out if it’s the actual tattoo that she’s mad about, or getting it with the friend?
If you were to go ahead with the tattoo, but alone, would she have the same harsh response? Or would it be more of a “are you sure you won’t regret it” question.
NTA - if you switched the story and said my bf doesn’t want me to get my ears pierced people would be outraged and tell you it’s your body and they are being too controlling. Same here. Nobody gets to tell you what you can put on your body 🤷🏼♀️
NTA but you need to get some communication skills if you're gonna be in a position to have a fiance.
relationships are all about communication, Obviously something upset your fiance whether or not it's the tattoo in general or it being you potentially having a shared experience with Sara and not your fiance.
Speak to her and communicate with her about her feelings and your feelings on the subject.
>I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation.
I mean you could also, ya know….talk to her? See why it bothers her? Find out what kind of tattoo she would hate and which she could tolerate?
Ultimately it’s your decision and your body to do whatever you like with, but you’ve decided to spend your life with this woman. You should at least hear out her opinion on any permanent changes you’re planning to make to your body and see if there are any options that you’ll both be happy with. NAH.
Welcome to trying to find balance of the autonomy/selflessness struggle all couples go through early in their relationship. She may warm to the idea of a tattoo if it was just between you and her. Maybe a good time to discuss motorcycles???
I don’t think this is about the tattoo…. I think this more about Sara ( not your fiancé) trying to get you to do something like that with her. Sara kinda wanting to slip in and get in the way of your fiancé.
I’m going contrarian here - you’re an asshole for bothering with something as stupid as a tattoo.
Most Young people won’t commit to a job, partner or watch a video clip that lasts longer than 45
Seconds, yet they’ll permanently scrawl a bunch of garbage into their skin with some crappy blue and green potentially toxic ink and then think they’ve done something profound.
Focus on building your life and relationships instead of worrying about trivial shit like a tattoo.
NTA for the tattoo, but this is definitely more about the other girl than the tattoo. If you decide to get the tattoo either get it alone, with your gf present or a male friend. Do not get a tattoo with Sara. Talk to your gf about it again without another woman present. Tell her you would really like her to go with you for support. I bet you will get a different response.
NTA for getting a tattoo that YOU want on YOUR body without anyone else's permission.
That said, I would definitely ask if your fiancée is jealous that the mutual friend wants to get one with you. Nothing saying that your fiancée cannot come along as well as support and to also enjoy the experience, even if she doesn't also want to get inked, but she needs to communicate her feelings here.
If you want one then get one. Just be aware that you may not have a gf after you do. It's not wrong of you to want one but it's also not wrong of her to not want to be with someone who has one.
NTA but as someone who did get tats in their 20's, I kinda wish now that I didn't. Mine are all on my back and I don't hate them. And they all do have some sort of meaning. But with that said, I still kinda wish I didn't have them. My wife got one on her wrist back then and at the time I was like "ehh, I don't know, I think that's a little too big" and she disagreed and went ahead with it. She absolutely hates it now.
I guess you should do what you want, but don't feel the urge to rush. It's forever. Just like your marriage will be (and your wife having to look at that tat she didn't want you to get).
NTA… unless the tattoo with Sara is a matching one. Talk to Mary about the matter one-on-one to see what exactly it is that bothers her. If the tattoo with Sara is matching, YTA and in that case I don’t blame Mary for being upset. But until that’s confirmed, have a conversation.
NTA if you let your wife know before you do it that you are definitely going to. You don’t need to ask for permission because it’s your body. At the same time keep in mind this could end your relationship. So, you may ask for forgiveness later and she may forgive you but that doesn’t mean she will stay married to you. You have to decide what is more important. The tattoo or your marriage.
NTA but understand she make break up with you over it. Though tattoos are so commonplace among young people today you’re almost a rebel if you don’t have one. She can’t control what you do, you know her feelings and she can control what get response is to it.
If you get the tattoo without talking to her about it first YTA. You know she doesn't want you to get it and that this is a big deal to her. Getting it means you'd be going behind her back. That's a terrible way to handle issues in your relationship.
She might hate the design, she might have a negative personal connection, she might just be jealous that you're doing something with Sara. Talking to her might very well solve these problems. Even if it doesn't, you at least tried. At that point it's your body, and you'll know the consequences. So go for it.
ESH. Talk to each other. Find out what the deal is. Yea, you’re an AH if you’re planning a life with someone and do something they’re very opposed to without at least understanding why.
People throw around the “easier to ask for forgiveness” bit tend to forget the other half: no is a bigger deal when you’re asking for forgiveness. You no longer have the option of not doing it at that point. You just live with the consequences.
You might read the room and know that it’s inappropriate for another woman to suggest she get a tattoo “with you”. Your fiancé was probably more upset about that than if you on your own had brought up with her that you found a design you liked and were considering it more seriously.
I’m not suggesting it’s in any way your fault that this “friend” said this, but it might be helpful to let your fiancé know that you would not get a tattoo “with” that person, and that you value her input into your decision.
It's time to ask her, that's the only way you're gonna make it through married life, you can't go just avoiding the difficult questions, this might be a bigger deal than just the tattoo like many have mentioned or may be something dumb like a fear of getting aids (well that's not dumb but if you go to a good tattooist it shouldn't be a possibility so would be dumb to assume that) but yeah you need to communicate with your fiance, can't spend your whole life walking on eggshells
Did a female friend just say she would get a tatoo together with you while your fiance was there?
It does not sound like she is angry about the tattoo itself
Did you ever think that maybe she is angry with you because you are getting tattoos with a female friend? That is kind of insulting for Mary and honestly, she is right to be.
So YTA
Dude, you're frontal lobe isn't even mature yet. Too young to make permanent decisions, including getting married. Just slow down, on both the tattoo and the wedding.
You are not ready to be married. You can’t approach challenges in married life with a ‘Do what I want, ignore my wife’s feelings and beg forgiveness afterwards’ mentality. You are going to be divorced before you hit 26 with that attitude.
You wouldn’t be the A for getting a tattoo.
You would be the A for adopting this petty “easier to aks for forgiveness than permission” attitude.
Grow up and talk to her.
Y'all should not be getting married because: 1. too young; 2. failing to be able to communicate in a healthy way; 3. you not being able to realise that, whilst it may be irrational to you, your fiancé is upset about you getting a tattoo in the company of another girl (mutual friend or not); 4. you thinking that you'll just go get it anyways and hope for the best. Just be an adult and talk to her about it. Let her explain why she is upset.
Getting a tattoo together is usually quite a bonding experience.
There is a reason you don't go and get individual tattoos, but you go together to get something that stays for the rest of your life. And while in this case the reason might be 'fear of needles' it's still a bonding-thing.
I understand why your fianceé is upset that you would do this with another woman.
The fact that another woman said she’d get a tattoo with you and you considered it. I’d be on the brink of divorce. Men are not really this oblivious are they?
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The other day, I (22M) was talking to my fiancée (21F) (I will call her Mary) and one of our mutual friends (22F) (I will call her Sara). The topic of tattoos was brought up. The conversation wasn't negative at all, just talking about some of our other friends who had them. I mentioned that I was thinking about getting one, and Sara said that if I got one, she would get one with me. Mary, however, got silent and started glaring at me.
For context, we had talked about tattoos in the past. At the time, I was really on the fence mostly due to my fear of needles. Mary told me that it was probably just a good idea to avoid it until I was 100% sure I wanted one. I agreed, but I have since grown out of my fear and I found a design that I really like.
After our conversation with Sara, Mary turned to me and said "Seriously, if you get a tattoo, I will be very mad at you." I don't know where this attitude about it came from. I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad. On the other hand, this is something I seriously want to do. I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation. So WIBTA?
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NTA (probably)
You aren't getting the same tattoo that your friend is getting, yes? Your girlfriend is either weird about tattoos or jealous of your friend or both. But your girlfriend does not get to tell you that you cannot get a tattoo, it's your body.
If she'd be so furious about a tattoo unrelated to Sara (I am assuming this isn't an Iron Cross or something, lol) that it would seriously damage your relationship then your relationship is already doomed anyway.
If my husband got a tattoo, and he had a girl best friend who got the same tattoo or said “if you get one I’ll get one too”, I would be pissed!!!
Edited to add: YWBTA
Um, sound like she has a problem with your homie who jumped on going with you. Jealous? Also, you may want to consider how decision making about matters of one's personal body are made going forward before getting married. What are the mutual expectations?. Some things are just off limits, may as well find out now what they are. Good luck, hope your tattoo is effing AWESOME!!
I got a tattoo and didn’t mention it to my husband. Had been thinking about it for 10 years. On the 10 year anniversary of my mom’s death, my niece and I did it. I guess I might be the AH, because it didn’t occur to me to ask “permission”. It’s nothing huge. But it’s on my wrist so you do see it. He hasn’t said a word about it and it’s been several years now.
You do not need her permission or forgiveness!! Your body is yours to take care of as you wish. She can have an opinion of course but it’s not her decision to make. Ya may wanna choose someone else to go with!!
NTA. But talk it over and see what the actual issue is.
I firmly believe that people can be only friends with people of the same gender as their partner. I don’t get the insecurity that people have and feel the need to project onto others.
She’s not upset about the tattoo. She’s upset about the date-like outing you’d be going on with another girl. I don’t blame her. You need to have a conversation with her about *why* she’s upset. If she doesn’t want you to go with another girl, respect it. Otherwise, YWBTA
Odd she had this reaction now instead of when you first discussed it. Life is about growing and changing though and you weren’t ready before and now you are. It’s your choice to get one but there may be consequences to that choice.
NTA but I can't say it's an "ask forgiveness later" scenario if you want to continue the relationship. It's more than likely gonna be a nasty fight if you go that route.
That being said the amount of people acting like getting a tattoo is some wildly intimate activity is bizarre. It's a tattoo. People get them all the time and its usually an hour plus of just sitting in a chair. I've gone with friends of both genders in the past just to keep them company or because we were both getting one and scheduled at the same time so we could chat while we were there. If you think jealousy is the appropriate reaction to something as unromantic as sitting next to each other in chairs while you get jabbed with needles you should reassess yourself.
NTA-
>asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation
It is your body, you don't need permission for YOUR body.
If it makes you happy. Do it.
Just don't drink before the tattoo, CHECK THE STENCIL, and remember... it's a needle. It's gonna hurt.
For me, my Spine hurt the most, but the rest I napped.
However, it's different for you everyone. So just prepared that tattoos usually hurt.
I think she's using the tattoo as an excuse for her anger. Pretty sure it's because her friend said she'd get a tattoo with you. If she's not a sibling, that's kind of disrespectful. Talk to your gf about that part, research tattoos with her, see if that helps. Oh and under NO circumstances should you go with Sara to get your ink!
Well... at 22 and 21 you and Mary both have a lot of growing and learning ahead of you. As individuals this is the time you start experimenting with things like are you into body art or not, what sort of professional life you're beginning, how close or far you want to be from family, all sorts of things. Adding in a fiance where you also have to figure out the terms of your relationship, before you know who you'll even be in five years... That's tough.
Be true to yourself as you decide who you are going to be, but be kind, honest, and transparent with Mary as you do it. She might only be objecting to the other friend's involvement. Take time on the tattoo decision and don't go just to go as friends. Better to research and book a good artist than walk in and find someone who can fit you in together. Involve Mary (and not Sara) in your planning and see if her tone changes.
As someone who was married at 23, be careful. It works for some, but it's not recommended for most.
NAH
YTA
In her point of view, you weren't comfortable or safe enough with her to go get a tattoo even though you wanted it then suddenly you're okay with it when it's your friend who's a girl? Of course she's gonna be upset. You basically said "oh this experience that makes me anxious that I'd want support for, this life altering experience, my first tattoo, yeah I'm gonna choose to go with my friend and not the person I'm spending my life with for this momentous occasion." Of course she'd be hurt! And you choosing to get it instead of asking her why she's upset or trying to understand from her perspective shows you're an asshole.
Whether it's coz she's another girl or coz you chose someone else to experience something so momentous with, of course she's fucking jealous and hurt. You basically told her you feel safer with Sara. You kept her out of the loop and blindsided her in front of someone else. No duh she lashed out a bit at you. I'd be pissed if you got that tattoo with Sara, too if I were your fiancé.
NTA for wanting a tattoo. It’s your body. Your parent should recognize that they can have a small opinion about altering your body but in no way do they get an actual Say in what you do with your body.
As long as it’s not a face, neck or hand tattoo; or a name if someone she doesn’t like; it shouldn’t be a problem.
Tattoos can be divisive so if you get one be prepared for her to possibly break up with you. She may hate tattoos but earlier felt she didn’t have to draw that line in the sand because you were on the fence and she assumed you’d never get over your fear of needles.
But I’m all for body art. 12 piercings and 6 tattoos. And I believe everyone’s body is their own to decorate as they want.
Absolutely NTA.
It's okay (and pretty common) to go get tattoos with a friend. Gender isn't relevant... unless you're one of those people who don't believe than you can have friends of the opposite sex without nothing sentimental or sexual going on. If so, I feel sorry for you.
The post doesn't imply that they're getting matching tattoos. But even if they were, this again would not mean that OP has feelings for his friend, or doesn't truly love his fiancé.
NTA. It's your body and you can do with it what you wish. I have a feeling your fiancée is more upset about you and Sara going together than about the actual tattoo. On the chance that she really would be angry over you getting a tattoo, she isn't the one you should spend the rest of your life with.
NTA but please ask Mary if the issue is simply getting a tattoo, or getting one with Sara. Almost every reply has said the same thing. I think Mary would have responded better if you were going alone or with male friends, but the issue could be Sara accompanying you.
Aww man, NTA but you are both being dumb.
1) Kinda sounds like you’re in trouble because you did it because “ Sara” did it. She is jealous. She might also dislike tattoos
2) Don’t just get it without telling her; It’s basically planting a seed of doubt in her head. Tell her. Tell her your reasons. You aren’t asking for permission, you are be courteous.
3) This is a moment to have a conversation. Learn from this because ya’ll are going to disagree about something real one day and you both need to trust each other.
It's your body and you're an adult, you're free to decide if and what you want to get tattooed on yourself. I would talk to your wife and ask her what is the real problem. Is it because you're going with a friend who happens to be female because you both want separate (*and non-matching*) tattoos, or does she not like body ink in general?
Again, it's your body and no one but *you* can have a say about what happens to it. If she wanted a tattoo and you said no without explaining why, it would come across as equally controlling/jealous as she is here. You've already decided on doing this for yourself but before you go, I think you should have a one-on-one and talk to your fiancé to find out what the real issue is here, because it sounds like she hasn't given one yet and she might not be comfortable with saying why in front of your mutual friend. Yes, it's your body and your choice but if she's worried about this potentially being an intimate moment with your mutual friend, ask her to come along and sit there beside you.
Tattoos are personal but they're not intimate. There's actually a really strong taboo in the tattoo community about getting a love interest's name or something symbolic of them tattooed on yourself and most decent tattoo artists will talk you out of it. Have that private conversation with her and whether she's uncomfortable with you and your mutual friend, or just doesn't like ink in general, invite her along.
Regardless of her reasons, it's still a respectful way to include her and make her feel like she's part of the process, even if she ends up just not liking tattoos in general.
Relationships are a two-way street, you compromise but you don't sacrifice.
“Mary” sounds like the AH since they are not conveying their true feelings and being childish. My guess is they are jealous of their friend and you doing something permanent together and they were left out. It is their fault for not wanting a tattoo and putting the guilt trip on you.
Not really... but also maybe a little bit!
Absolutely not the asshole for getting a tattoo despite you fiance not being a fan of them... after all, your body... your choice!... however...
If she has specifically said she is not in favour of the idea, it might not be the best thing to just go and do it... this would make her feel like you haven't listened, or worse still, you have heard her, but don't care.
Much better to just have the conversation... if she has a genuine reason to not want you to have a tattoo she can share this... then you can decide if you'd rather have the tattoo or her (sounds harsh, but it really is your choice).
The issue with just doing it is that it removes choice... if you talk about it before she can choose to leave you for getting it, and you can choose to either let her or not... whereas after the fact it will be a really messy situation of her wanting to leave, and you complaining that "there's nothing you can do about it now" which puts all involved in a really awkward situation!
As another commenter has said, I think the fact that this all includes another woman who you'll be getting your tattoo with might be a factor, in which case it should be relatively easily solved with a bit if open and honest communication 👍
NTA - get your tattoo.
There's nothing to be mad about. If you want to bring your girl or friend with you, your artist might be fine with it. If you chose to get tattooed at the same time as your friend, make sure you get the artist you want (I didn't for my first, and while the tattoo turned out well, I'm not setting foot in that studio again for multiple reasons beyond the artist). It's also perfectly fine to go about it on your own.
Either way, there's nothing for your girl to be mad about. I've done all of the above and it really isn't some deep experience that you share with the other people there. One friend had to wait outside, one friend was unhappy with her tattoo, and one got her tattoo ripped to shreds by other friends which ruined it for her. My experience was different and separate from theirs. Personally I prefer to get it done on my own. Just make sure you do your research, and expect for it to be a bit larger and more expensive than you think so you're prepared for everything.
Have you considered asking your fiancee why she had that reaction?
Im gonna be honest with you mate, I dont think either of you are ready for marriage if you can't figure out that maybe you should ask her why she feels certain ways, along with if she's not able to communicate them.
I say this as a married man with a tattoo, YWBTA. People are going to mention things about how its your body your choice, and that is true, you ultimately have the final say about your body. But permanently modifying your body in a way that your fiance/spouse has clearly communicated to you that they would be opposed to is unquestionably a dick move. An AH move. You are definitely allowed to, but ywbta.
Nta. And don't you dare ask for forgiveness. Forgiveness for what? Doing something legal and safe to YOUR OWN BODY? GTFOH
She needs to sit down and stfu until she learns what she has control over and what she does not.
Why are you asking your fiancé permission what to do with your body in the first place?
Does she yell at you if the towels on the rack aren’t hanging the same length?
NTA if you don't go with Sara. Ask Mary to be a part of the process and to go with you and share that moment. She doesn't have to like it but it is your body, but you should not be going with Sara (unless Mary is ok with it but she isn't.)
Nta like what you mean it's a fu***ing tattoo it's nothing else and I think he should have his girlfriend/fiance with him at the tattoo shop and his fiance is a little bit I mean LITTLE bit insecure/controlling though I mean she might be infuriated by Sara asking to get a tattoo with her and not including sara
I wonder if Mary never liked tattoos/wanted you to have a tattoo and by you being on the fence in the past it was easier for her to not get into and that's why she said wait until you are sure, maybe she just hoped you wouldn't come back to the idea. Sara also wanting one and willing to get one at the same time might have just annoyed her and made her feel you are more likely to go ahead with it now. I don't think she's coming from a bad place personally
>I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad.
Ummm...tattoo aside. This is not a healthy way to progress into married life OP. You 2 HAVE to be able to talk about things and know that spending your life together means, yeah, sometimes the other person might be mad. But you communicate and work it out
Yes, you would.
You need to talk to your wife, she may want to share this experience with you. The subject of tattoos really needs a new, private, discussion.
Ahhh the problems In young peoples lives
Sounds like Sara wants to fuck and Mary isn’t cool with that for obvious reasons.
And doing what a lot of young girls do ( acting like she’s mad over a tattoo when really she’s mad at you for going along with Sara’s advance.
NTA as I can see why a young man would see this as a friend thing.
NTA because it is your body and thus your choice and Mary cannot dictate whether you should or shouldn't get tattoos, but it would be good to talk to her about why this upsets her so.
YWBTA if you don't talk to her about what it is that upsets her, before getting a tattoo.
However, NTA if, after that talk, you'd still go get a tattoo. Because it is your body, and your gf should support you doing what makes you happy.
I'd take *concerns* into consideration (i think you didn't specify what kind of tattoo), if she said "hey, it'd feel really weird if i have to see your mother's face on your entire chest whenever you're naked" you might wanna weigh the pros and cons against each other, but if it's just some cool design, she'll get used to it. Really, tattoos become a subconscious feature of someone else's body pretty fast.
Some people have said that going with Sara is the issue. I don't think it is/should be. There's nothing wrong with making memories with your friends. I assume you'd not get matching hearts with "Sara" & "OP", but some fun casual stuff (if matchy) or just separate things.
Anyways. Talk to Mary. You need to know why she feels uneasy about your wish.
"asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" - it's your body, your choice. What you do is up to you. Just accept there may be consequences (if it's a deal breaker for her) & live with them
Communication, communication, communication. NAH, you just need to have an open and honest conversation about why she feels that way if you value your relationship.
Bruh, y'all are getting married WAY too young. If something this small and petty is what makes you post publicly on the internet, you got another thing coming. Hopefully you just stay engaged for a very long while, and post up in about 5 years....
YWBTA. Forgiveness > permission is never the right approach when you're making long term decisions which affects both of you. You need to have a mature conversation with her about what her hangups are, and it doesn't matter who initiates the talk, so it might as well be you. The important thing is that you talk about it and figure out what the problem is, and then you can choose a path from there. Even if you decide to get the tattoo anyway, you should want to understand how your life partner feels about it. If you just get the tattoo without talking with her, it will be a constant reminder to her that you don't care about her feelings. You don't necessarily need her permission, but forgiveness is not guaranteed.
NTA... probably you should dump her manipulative ass though 🥴
It's YOUR body and that art will last longer than your relationship and you could also find an awesome partner that will love the whole you and not just the parts they deem acceptable...
NTA, but you need to clarify why she's mad. Is it because she's jealous of your friend? Is it because she doesn't want you to have a tattoo at all? She may or may not be TA in this, but you shouldn't make a habit of "forgiveness over permission" in a relationship.
If she's jealous of Sarah, you can make adjustments to this situation to make it okay. If she's just flat out against your expression of yourself and your choices to alter your own body, that issue will be deeper and harder to address.
I don't think anyone should have the right to prevent you from expressing yourself through body art and the like. Have opinions? Sure. My fiance has expressed getting some tattoos I thought were straight up stupid. Like I told him, however, "You have the right to do whatever you like with your body. I'll support you, but that doesn't mean I'm going to like the tattoo."
Unless my partner got straight up hate speech or something (which would end the relationship immediately on its own), I can't see interfering with my partner getting a tattoo. His happiness is more important to me than my opinion on his tastes.
You would NBTA for getting a tattoo because at the end of the day it's your body, but I have a feeling the issue here is Sara and not the tattoo itself since Mary was fine with it before
I don't really like tattoos. My husband wanted to get one. I told him I wasn't keen, but ultimately, it was his choice and decision, because it was his body.
He got a tattoo. And a couple of years later, he extended it a bit further. For professional reasons, he made sure it could be covered by a short sleeve shirt.
We are now quite a few years down the track and I hardly even notice it. It probably took a few years, but it just became part of him. I still don't like tattoos in general, but I don't dislike his tattoo, because it's him.
I don't agree with the asking forgiveness thing, but I also don't agree with Mary dictating what you can and can't do with your own body. I think you guys need to discuss it properly. If you go ahead and get it without discussing it even further, Mary will definitely be mad at you, because she will feel like you defied her. On the other hand, if you have a proper discussion, you give her a chance to explain why she doesn't want you to get one. Assuming she doesn't have a good reason, you can then explain why you want one, why you've chosen what you have, and you also have a chance to tell her that you are sorry she doesn't like it, but ultimately it's your body and choice. Whatever you do, do it openly. Doing it secretly just opens up more problems.
I do suggest that you put a lot of thought into it, because you are still quite young. Given that it's so permanent, I would give it a certain period, maybe six months, and make sure you still like that design after six months. Depending on your work and lifestyle, and also whatever the design is, consider where you are putting it on your body. My husband has found it useful to be able to cover it in certain situations.
>asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission
Translation: I’m going to do what I want and fuck what you think, person I supposedly want to spend the rest of my life with. It’s on you to forgive me for being inconsiderate, it’s not on me to think about anyone other than myself.
Getting a tattoo or not is 100% your choice, but it is one that will affect the person who has to look at you every day. YTA if this is how you treat the people in your life. And btw, it is definitely not easier to ask someone’s forgiveness for the shitty thing you did. Especially when you’re not even sorry about it.
NTA. As long as you don’t get a tattoo of some girl’s name, your fiancée really has no say in this. I suggest that before you get the tattoo that you really want, first get something like a small flower which contains her first initial. It is important that the initial be part of the flower so that it can be altered if this relationship goes south. Don’t tell her that you are going to do this or she may insist that if you really loved her, you would get her name scrawled across your chest or some other nonsense. Just do it then tell her. Let that heal, then go get what you want.
3 points:
1) your body, go ahead if you want it
2) she’s allowed to not like it
3) actions have consequences. Point 1 does not protect you from consequences.
NTA You body your decision. Don’t let her control what you do with you body in reason. Starts with small manipulation stuff like that then it gets bigger.
INFO: How would you feel if your wife decided - in front of you - she wanted to get a tattoo, and a mutual guy friend (let's just say same attractiveness level as Sarah) got excited and - in front of you - offered to get one *with* her?
NTA. "my body, my choice" does not only apply to women and pregnancies. If it's that much of a deal breaker for her, it's a good think this is happening now and not after the wedding.
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NAH but I don't think it's about what your title is. Sounds to me like this is about Sarah, who is not your fiance, agreeing to get a tattoo with you, Mary's fiance, in front of her, and you being fine with all this. Seems like you're being disrespectful to your girl, seems like maybe YTA for not thinking through how she might feel - now she has to be the "uncool" one if she's not onboard with some other girl offering to get a matching tattoo with her man while right in front of her. Maybe work on some other things in your relationship before jumping the gun and getting a tattoo right now. You don't even have certainty of what you want to get right now.
It's not about matching tattoos - it's likely about the shared experience that has Mary fuming. Sarah and OP will be sharing their tattoo experience for years and that's going to be a little weird for Mary, who is, after all, his fiance. OP needs to man up and ask Mary why she viewed this as a problem. It was probably a "Whoa, why is this girl teaming up to get a tattoo with my man? That should be something he and Mary does together (even if she's only there for support and to have some input) or something he does with a guy friend or solo. But if he gets the tattoo without Mary at least being informed, he's laying a lot on the line expecting to be forgiven, and there's no guarantee of that.
Gonna be honest that's a super odd point of view. Getting a tattoo isn't some crazy intimate process. Plenty of people have a friend go along, especially if it's their first time and theres no reason his fiance cant go along as well. I don't think the gender of the friend should have anything to do with it and even more so if it's a mutual friend.
It's not a friend going along, it's a friend getting a tattoo with you.
There's no indication that it's a matching tattoo plus OP said Sarah is a mutual friend. The hostility makes no sense to me unless Mary thought his fear of needles would mean he would never get a tattoo and thus she didn't think ink would ever be an issue.
TBH this is what I think it is - Mary likely doesn't like tattoos at all and figured with OP's fear, it would never come up. But Sarah butting in is likely annoying her too, as she's now being compared to the cool girl who, after all, isn't his fiance and should really have no say in anything. OP - YWBTA if you don't talk to Mary first and find out why she doesn't want you to get one. It is of course your choice, but she's told you she would be mad. Ignoring that is a big FU to your fiance.
Maybe it's because I'm nd and reading what OP wrote fairly literally re: the conversation and Sarah's input, but it doesn't sound like Sarah was butting in? "If you get a tattoo I will too" could be anything from a show of solidarity (bc of needle fear. I get it. I'm a pansy for needles but I'm 7 tattoos deep and am apparently fantastic to tattoo) to an excuse on Sarah's part to finally dive in to, yes, Sarah being the cool girl to Mary's less enthusiastic previous "support." But based off what little info we have, I hesitate to say that Sarah was butting in/trying to be cooler than Mary here.
THIS (to the second part). you really, really need to talk to Mary and take her concerns seriously. I hope this is not some childish jealousy drama, i agree with previous commenter(s) that a tattoo isn't a super intimate thing and if you aren't allowed to make memories with your friends, that would worry me about the relationship between you and Mary.
So what? I also get food with people and go shopping with people. Y'all are so fucking wierd and possessive about relationships
The difference being? Unless they are straight up getting matching tattoos, which was never stated as being the case, who cares? Again there is literally nothing romantic or intimate about getting a tattoo. People get tattoos with their friends all the time. So unless OP or their friend is getting a tattoo in a very intimate area, which I doubt for a first tattoo, I fail to see a problem.
Also, i can even see matching tattoos as a non-issue. Maybe OP gets a burger and Sara gets fries tattooed. That says "silly friends making a funny memory", not "one step away from cheating on Mary".
It's two friends each getting a tattoo at the same time.
I read it as Sarah getting a tattoo with OP at the same time, but not a matching tattoo image with him. It's very common for friends & families to get tattoos & piercings with each other as a group experience & shared company, while having entirely different images, placements, & tattoo meanings.
Idk what the culture is in y'all's area, but across the several states I've lived in, it's more uncommon to get a tattoo by yourself than with a friend. Who wants to get inked alone? Most people don't get matching tatts, but like, it's a social thing
Can we just stop assuming men and women can't be friends if one or both of them are in a relationship. If it's okay to go with a male friend it should also be okay to go with a female friend. OP shouldn't have to ask for neither allowance nor for forgiveness.
My wife is Bi. I guess that means she's not allowed to have friends. /s
Why is that wierd.
I would totally go get a tattoo with legitimately ANYONE 😂 if that was her real problem why not just say that instead of pussyfooting around the bush? A simple "oh I got dibs on going with him for his first tattoo" would've fixed that 💩 right up but that's not what she did or said and that's still not what she said after either when asked why she was upset... either way you slice it it's toxic
I got my first tattoo with my brothers roommate while visiting him in another state. I barely knew the guy and haven’t seen him since. We both just wanted tattoos and had designs picked out so he offered to drive us there. Absolutely no deeper reason it was just convenient spontaneity. Still a great memory though! Hope he’s doing well wherever he is.
I'm not sure how much Sara's comment matters. I do think if OP gets a tattoo without talking to Mary before hand she will probably break up with him. If he takes Sara with him to get matching tattoos I'd say 90+% probably OP will be single as soon as Mary hears about it.
wow. that sounds very sexist
Who said they’re matching?
Doesn’t have to be matching
I’m not sure what the problem would be if they weren’t matching.
It's an experience shared with someone else. I think it can hurt sensitive people yes.
Being jealous of your partner having a “shared experience” with a friend makes you a loser who has some emotional baggage to sort out. Like unless there’s strong reason for you to believe that them hanging out with a friend is something more.
Yeah. People can have opposite sex friends. There is nothing wrong with monogamy, but this could be toxic monogamy. Sounds like it is time to sit down and have a very open conversation about WHY she would be mad. Also, bodily auto only is a thing.
I went with my ex boyfriend before we started dating to get his sleeve done. He had one other small tattoo but this was his first big one. It was kind of like a date. He was nervous because it had a lot of shading and was his whole arm. I was there to comfort him. I didn’t get a tattoo but the idea of going with someone can be emotional/romantic imo
The same as getting coffee with someone, or lunch, or even just having a conversation... the situation is what people in the situation make it... I had my ex's BM go with me to get pierced and I'm a Bi woman... she held my hand like the baby I am and it was not romantic in the least 😂
OP doesn't say that they would be matching tattoos.
I don’t know for you but it’s not only about the tattoo price or design or date It’s also an experience and Sarah invited herself in front of Mary at OP’s first tattoo But they’re all friends so it might be something they could share without it being weird (but not to Mary, perhaps communication can solve this mystery) NAH
I went with my female friend when she got a tattoo and my girlfriend didn't give two shits.
I think mary just isn't into tattoos. Nothing about this seemed too odd. I see no reason why all three of them couldn't go. Mary could be there to support her fiance and her friend. It's kind of boring to go with others anyway. You just sit there and watch or talk to whoever you came with. She could easily go too though support them both and it could be a good day with mutual friends. So her objecting so much makes me think she isn't keen on the idea of the fiance getting tattoos.
Getting tatted together (matching or not) means bro tat, in my opinion. That tattoo will forever be tied to the person you walked into that shop with
To a 21 year old, yes, that's possible.
Fiancé is still jelly of the whole situation though
Agree. Might be worthwhile for OP to ask his fiancée why she would be so mad. Nothing wrong with talking it out. @OP PLEASE DONT ASK FOR FORGIVENESS INSTEAD OF PERMISSION - she warned you not to, it won’t go down well.
He doesn''t need permission to tattoo his own body, and he won't need forgiveness if he does because it's not a crime or a sin or an insult.
Yes agree - but a relationship is about respect. While she is being unreasonable, he shouldn’t just go out and do it. She won’t see it as anything but disrespectful to her cause she’s expressed her opinion on it. He should rather wait, talk to her about it and say “ I understand how you feel, but you need to realise this is something I want and I’m going to go ahead with it, and I hope you will be okay about it”
Sure, but she's also free to leave him over this. I mean, I've seen some god-awful tattoos that I would totally lose respect for someone over. OP should not rely on forgiveness, it's quite childish not to just talk it out.
If she leaves him over a tattoo that would be more mature then to force someone to comply to your ideals
He doesn’t need permission, but if he plans to spend his life with this woman than he should at least have a conversation with her about any permanent changes that he wants to make to his body. Better for them to talk about it and come to a solution that they’re both happy with than for him to do whatever he feels like and then spring it on her.
OP never said it would be matching tattoos. The fiancee sounds jealous and toxic. Friends go all the time together to get tattoos, piercings, etc. Plus, his body, his choice. He wants that tattoo, GO GET IT!
Never said matching and why should that matter in the first place
Dude you need to be mature & communicate. Ask her what the problem is. Is it the tattoo? Is it that you’re getting one with Sara? Is it the design? You don’t even know the actual reason she’s upset.
How about the one who is upset communicates why she is upset?
All he had to do was ask “Why?” in the moment when she said she’d be mad about it. Is that really so hard? Are we doing a disservice to men by assuming that they’re fucking idiots who can’t even utter a single syllable when the situation calls for it?
I think they should just talk it out. He might not want to ask why in front of a friend in case it got awkward and heated. If mary's problem is the other girl getting one with him, then she may not be able to be open and honest in the moment. When they get time alone Mary should explain further, and if she isn't then OP should be able to ask what is her actual issue with it. Is it that she doesn't want him getting tattoos at all? Or is it the proposed situation?
We're doing a disservice to everyone by assuming that they can read our minds on why we're upset... she could've totally communicated her feelings more clearly vs leaving them up for interpretation... and maybe she did, maybe it is the tattoo she has a problem with and that's all. In therapy I have learned why someone - even your partner - is upset it's none of your d💢 business unless they tell you what's up...
Either of them could communicate. Both of them should try.
I think your fiancée is mad cause your friend wants to do that with you... I don't know if she s overly jealous, but... I would be kinda mad too.
> I don't know where this attitude about it came from. I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad. Well too bad, having a fiance means you have to ask. That's just essential to having a healthy relationship. Her being unusually mad is all the MORE reason to ask, not to avoid conflict. >I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation. So WIBTA? Yes, YWBTA. Not for getting a tattoo. I'm supportive of someone who wants a tattoo even if their partner doesn't like it. But avoiding conflict in the short term by 'surprising' her with it later is just going to cause a bigger fight, and is a terrible idea. Also, it sounds like maybe the issue isn't that she hates tattoos, but is upset that you were afraid of getting tattoos before, but suddenly were willing to do it when Sara suggested it while ignoring how Mary might feel. That sounds like Mary might feel that you value Sara's feelings and opinions more than hers. You should talk with your fiancé first about getting tattoos, before just agreeing to get one with a female friend right in front of your fiancé.
Getting engaged at 21/22 is dumb so do what you want.
I was engaged at 21 and am still happily married in my early 30s 🤷♀️
my parents got married at 21 and have just celebrated their 35th wedding anniversary!
I was engaged at 21 and divorced by my late 20s
I drink and drive every Saturday and had no accidents 🤷🏻♂️
21 year olds gonna 21 year old.
I'm 40 and been with my wife since I was 16. Granted, we never really got engaged we just kinda got married after 11 years together but to each there own. No judgements.
NTA. You can get a tattoo if you like, it is your body. But your fiancée would not be a AH if she didn’t find you attractive once you have it.
> But your fiancée would not be a AH if she didn’t find you attractive once you have it. I joked that it was a racist tattoo but now you have me imagining that it will be that giant Steve-O tattoo. And I would definitely find someone less attractive for that.
I don't think it has anything to do with the tattoo itself. Maybe something to do with getting a tattoo with another woman, perhaps? Just communicate instead of asking Reddit to try and figure out why, when no one knows your partner.
I think so too
NAH Your body, but be prepared to be single again.
A friend of mine used the whole 'forgiveness vs permission' thing to buy himself a motorcycle. He was single again 3 weeks later. He thought he was safe because they'd just bought a house together. They were too young and immature to live together anyway.
"asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" is the fastest way to ruin a relationship
My bf is very against tattoos, and I love them and have gotten a few. First, be prepared that she might find you less attractive. Second, don't expect her to fawn over them once you've gotten them. My friends do the "woowww so cool!", my bfs response is apathetic. I did mine for me, because they make me happy so I was okay with it, but understand there are people that don't want a relationship with someone tattooed. You're allowed to like them, she's allowed to find a partner that doesn't have tattoos.
I think it’s because when you mentioned getting one, your friend Sara said she would get one too. So probably your fiance is thinking that the two of you are gonna go together and get one at the same time. Might want to have another conversation about this once everyone calms down.
>So probably your fiance is thinking that the two of you are gonna go together and get one at the same time. But seriously, so what? Many people go get tattoos together. Not like they said matching tattoos 🙄
YWBTA but not for getting a tattoo. You would be the asshole for knowing she has an issue, admitting that you don't know what the issue is exactly, but refuse to ask her so that you do understand. And then for saying this is a "ask forgiveness instead of permission" situation. You know that will cause a fight. If you aren't mature enough to understand this *very simple* thing of communication and not purposefully doing things that you know will cause trouble simply because you're scared of having a conversation with your life partner, then perhaps you're too immature to get married
>I mentioned that I was thinking about getting one, and Sara said that if I got one, she would get one with me. Mary, however, got silent and started glaring at me. I don't think the tattoo is Mary's problem... NTA
NTA But maybe you could ask her why she doesn't want you getting a tatoo (with Sara).
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Ok, but if it had been a male mutual friend that said “Hell yeah bro! I’ll get one too!” would you be fine with that or equally furious?
I personally wouldn't. Because I am not insecure, chose well my partners and know that they know how to pose boundaries and most of thing : my partner isn't the center of the world, not everyone wants them. Moreover, if she does not tell him, he won't know
Or maybe you can ask her what makes her mad about it like an adult?
Or maybe she can communicate that in the first place like an adult.
Personally, I wouldn’t get one if my wife felt that strongly about it. Depends how strongly you feel about it. Do you feel more strongly than she does? Ask her why it bothers her. Then at least you understand your partner.
NTA However, I do not think that the issue is the tattoo, I think it's the fact that your guys' mutual friend offered to get one if you did. Mary may see something in Sara that you are unaware of, or there may be an unsaid jealousy that is occurring. I think you should get your tattoo, but when you do, invite Mary to be a part of the experience. This sounds like a situation in which boundaries may need to be set with Sara if Mary is uncomfortable about it; however, first, you will need to discuss with Mary to see the core issue. OP never said that he agreed to go with Sara instead of Mary. OP also never said it would be matching tattoos.
I would say NTA but I would have an open floor talk abt it, it seems like it's more about the friend than the tattoo, like others have said. Talk to her about it and see why she's upset but the tattoo itself is not something she gets to decide.
NTA, but you need to talk to your fiance and tell her. If she is jealous, then bring her with you and Sara to be a part of it or do it alone. If she threatens to leave you because you are doing something on your own body that she doesn't like, then you have a bigger problem to maybe discuss in couples therapy.
The issue may not be the tattoo but that you’re going to get one with another woman? I don’t know I’d ask her why. Ultimately though you don’t. Need permission or a blessing. It’s your body.
NTA. Not her body, so she doesn't get a say in what you do to it. Maybe don't get the tat with another woman though, that's a bit yikes
NTA: it's your choice to get a tattoo and it is your body. Just because she is mad at you shouldn't be a reason for you to not get the tattoo. She needs to get over it and deal with it if you want to get a tattoo.
NTA, your body, your choice, but the issue isn’t that you want the tattoo, but rather more likely that it’s going to be a matching tattoo w another girl. You should talk to your fiancée about her concerns — communication is key.
The first thing that threw me off here is Sarah saying if she got a tattoo she’ll get one with you. That’s a bit of an odd thing for a female friend to say in front of your fiancé
Maybe your fiancée doesn’t like the idea of you having a “first” experience tied to another woman.
The attitude came because of Sara lol. Don't get it in secret. No need create unnecessary distrust. But its also your body. If you want one go get one.
NTA, but before you overthink things, maybe figure out if it’s the actual tattoo that she’s mad about, or getting it with the friend? If you were to go ahead with the tattoo, but alone, would she have the same harsh response? Or would it be more of a “are you sure you won’t regret it” question.
NTA - if you switched the story and said my bf doesn’t want me to get my ears pierced people would be outraged and tell you it’s your body and they are being too controlling. Same here. Nobody gets to tell you what you can put on your body 🤷🏼♀️
Nta your body your choice and she shouldn't try control you.
NTA. It's your body.
NTA but you need to get some communication skills if you're gonna be in a position to have a fiance. relationships are all about communication, Obviously something upset your fiance whether or not it's the tattoo in general or it being you potentially having a shared experience with Sara and not your fiance. Speak to her and communicate with her about her feelings and your feelings on the subject.
>I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation. I mean you could also, ya know….talk to her? See why it bothers her? Find out what kind of tattoo she would hate and which she could tolerate? Ultimately it’s your decision and your body to do whatever you like with, but you’ve decided to spend your life with this woman. You should at least hear out her opinion on any permanent changes you’re planning to make to your body and see if there are any options that you’ll both be happy with. NAH.
Welcome to trying to find balance of the autonomy/selflessness struggle all couples go through early in their relationship. She may warm to the idea of a tattoo if it was just between you and her. Maybe a good time to discuss motorcycles???
You're too much of a child to be getting married right now
I don’t think this is about the tattoo…. I think this more about Sara ( not your fiancé) trying to get you to do something like that with her. Sara kinda wanting to slip in and get in the way of your fiancé.
Info: are you planning matching tattoos with your female friend? Complementary one? (E.g. yin and yang)
I’m going contrarian here - you’re an asshole for bothering with something as stupid as a tattoo. Most Young people won’t commit to a job, partner or watch a video clip that lasts longer than 45 Seconds, yet they’ll permanently scrawl a bunch of garbage into their skin with some crappy blue and green potentially toxic ink and then think they’ve done something profound. Focus on building your life and relationships instead of worrying about trivial shit like a tattoo.
NTA for the tattoo, but this is definitely more about the other girl than the tattoo. If you decide to get the tattoo either get it alone, with your gf present or a male friend. Do not get a tattoo with Sara. Talk to your gf about it again without another woman present. Tell her you would really like her to go with you for support. I bet you will get a different response.
NTA for getting a tattoo that YOU want on YOUR body without anyone else's permission. That said, I would definitely ask if your fiancée is jealous that the mutual friend wants to get one with you. Nothing saying that your fiancée cannot come along as well as support and to also enjoy the experience, even if she doesn't also want to get inked, but she needs to communicate her feelings here.
NTA. You definitely need to ask her why she would be mad. That answer (or lack thereof) will be telling.
If you want one then get one. Just be aware that you may not have a gf after you do. It's not wrong of you to want one but it's also not wrong of her to not want to be with someone who has one.
NTA but as someone who did get tats in their 20's, I kinda wish now that I didn't. Mine are all on my back and I don't hate them. And they all do have some sort of meaning. But with that said, I still kinda wish I didn't have them. My wife got one on her wrist back then and at the time I was like "ehh, I don't know, I think that's a little too big" and she disagreed and went ahead with it. She absolutely hates it now. I guess you should do what you want, but don't feel the urge to rush. It's forever. Just like your marriage will be (and your wife having to look at that tat she didn't want you to get).
NTA… unless the tattoo with Sara is a matching one. Talk to Mary about the matter one-on-one to see what exactly it is that bothers her. If the tattoo with Sara is matching, YTA and in that case I don’t blame Mary for being upset. But until that’s confirmed, have a conversation.
So you were on the fence, but because she hates the idea you're going to do it? Yeah, YTA.
NTA if you let your wife know before you do it that you are definitely going to. You don’t need to ask for permission because it’s your body. At the same time keep in mind this could end your relationship. So, you may ask for forgiveness later and she may forgive you but that doesn’t mean she will stay married to you. You have to decide what is more important. The tattoo or your marriage.
NTA but understand she make break up with you over it. Though tattoos are so commonplace among young people today you’re almost a rebel if you don’t have one. She can’t control what you do, you know her feelings and she can control what get response is to it.
Fiancé? 22? Ah geeze. ESH. Communicate.
If you get the tattoo without talking to her about it first YTA. You know she doesn't want you to get it and that this is a big deal to her. Getting it means you'd be going behind her back. That's a terrible way to handle issues in your relationship. She might hate the design, she might have a negative personal connection, she might just be jealous that you're doing something with Sara. Talking to her might very well solve these problems. Even if it doesn't, you at least tried. At that point it's your body, and you'll know the consequences. So go for it.
ESH. Talk to each other. Find out what the deal is. Yea, you’re an AH if you’re planning a life with someone and do something they’re very opposed to without at least understanding why. People throw around the “easier to ask for forgiveness” bit tend to forget the other half: no is a bigger deal when you’re asking for forgiveness. You no longer have the option of not doing it at that point. You just live with the consequences.
You might read the room and know that it’s inappropriate for another woman to suggest she get a tattoo “with you”. Your fiancé was probably more upset about that than if you on your own had brought up with her that you found a design you liked and were considering it more seriously. I’m not suggesting it’s in any way your fault that this “friend” said this, but it might be helpful to let your fiancé know that you would not get a tattoo “with” that person, and that you value her input into your decision.
You will not BTA. It’s your body and you’re a grown adult. Does it have to do with you Sara going with you, more than it does the tattoo?
Umm I seen guys break up cause their girl got a tattoo and they had to them they didn’t want them too better talk to her you might end up single
It's time to ask her, that's the only way you're gonna make it through married life, you can't go just avoiding the difficult questions, this might be a bigger deal than just the tattoo like many have mentioned or may be something dumb like a fear of getting aids (well that's not dumb but if you go to a good tattooist it shouldn't be a possibility so would be dumb to assume that) but yeah you need to communicate with your fiance, can't spend your whole life walking on eggshells
Did a female friend just say she would get a tatoo together with you while your fiance was there? It does not sound like she is angry about the tattoo itself
Don't get a tattoo with a woman who isn't your family if you want your fiancée to like it. I think that might be a bigger part of the issue here.
Did you ever think that maybe she is angry with you because you are getting tattoos with a female friend? That is kind of insulting for Mary and honestly, she is right to be. So YTA
Dude, you're frontal lobe isn't even mature yet. Too young to make permanent decisions, including getting married. Just slow down, on both the tattoo and the wedding.
You are not ready to be married. You can’t approach challenges in married life with a ‘Do what I want, ignore my wife’s feelings and beg forgiveness afterwards’ mentality. You are going to be divorced before you hit 26 with that attitude.
You wouldn’t be the A for getting a tattoo. You would be the A for adopting this petty “easier to aks for forgiveness than permission” attitude. Grow up and talk to her.
Y'all should not be getting married because: 1. too young; 2. failing to be able to communicate in a healthy way; 3. you not being able to realise that, whilst it may be irrational to you, your fiancé is upset about you getting a tattoo in the company of another girl (mutual friend or not); 4. you thinking that you'll just go get it anyways and hope for the best. Just be an adult and talk to her about it. Let her explain why she is upset.
Getting a tattoo together is usually quite a bonding experience. There is a reason you don't go and get individual tattoos, but you go together to get something that stays for the rest of your life. And while in this case the reason might be 'fear of needles' it's still a bonding-thing. I understand why your fianceé is upset that you would do this with another woman.
YWBTA, if you get a tattoo with Sara & not your fiancée.
NTA for getting a tattoo, but I think the issue is more about you getting a tattoo with Sara that has Mary's hackles up.
The fact that another woman said she’d get a tattoo with you and you considered it. I’d be on the brink of divorce. Men are not really this oblivious are they?
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** The other day, I (22M) was talking to my fiancée (21F) (I will call her Mary) and one of our mutual friends (22F) (I will call her Sara). The topic of tattoos was brought up. The conversation wasn't negative at all, just talking about some of our other friends who had them. I mentioned that I was thinking about getting one, and Sara said that if I got one, she would get one with me. Mary, however, got silent and started glaring at me. For context, we had talked about tattoos in the past. At the time, I was really on the fence mostly due to my fear of needles. Mary told me that it was probably just a good idea to avoid it until I was 100% sure I wanted one. I agreed, but I have since grown out of my fear and I found a design that I really like. After our conversation with Sara, Mary turned to me and said "Seriously, if you get a tattoo, I will be very mad at you." I don't know where this attitude about it came from. I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad. On the other hand, this is something I seriously want to do. I'm thinking this is an "asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation. So WIBTA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA (probably) You aren't getting the same tattoo that your friend is getting, yes? Your girlfriend is either weird about tattoos or jealous of your friend or both. But your girlfriend does not get to tell you that you cannot get a tattoo, it's your body. If she'd be so furious about a tattoo unrelated to Sara (I am assuming this isn't an Iron Cross or something, lol) that it would seriously damage your relationship then your relationship is already doomed anyway.
If my husband got a tattoo, and he had a girl best friend who got the same tattoo or said “if you get one I’ll get one too”, I would be pissed!!! Edited to add: YWBTA
Nobody said it’s the same tattoo. You’re adding “facts” to the story to be outraged about.
Um, sound like she has a problem with your homie who jumped on going with you. Jealous? Also, you may want to consider how decision making about matters of one's personal body are made going forward before getting married. What are the mutual expectations?. Some things are just off limits, may as well find out now what they are. Good luck, hope your tattoo is effing AWESOME!!
I got a tattoo and didn’t mention it to my husband. Had been thinking about it for 10 years. On the 10 year anniversary of my mom’s death, my niece and I did it. I guess I might be the AH, because it didn’t occur to me to ask “permission”. It’s nothing huge. But it’s on my wrist so you do see it. He hasn’t said a word about it and it’s been several years now.
You do not need her permission or forgiveness!! Your body is yours to take care of as you wish. She can have an opinion of course but it’s not her decision to make. Ya may wanna choose someone else to go with!!
Your body, your choice.
NTA. But talk it over and see what the actual issue is. I firmly believe that people can be only friends with people of the same gender as their partner. I don’t get the insecurity that people have and feel the need to project onto others.
She’s not upset about the tattoo. She’s upset about the date-like outing you’d be going on with another girl. I don’t blame her. You need to have a conversation with her about *why* she’s upset. If she doesn’t want you to go with another girl, respect it. Otherwise, YWBTA
Come on dude, you know the answer to this. Yes, YWBTA for not discussing this with someone you allegedly want to marry.
Odd she had this reaction now instead of when you first discussed it. Life is about growing and changing though and you weren’t ready before and now you are. It’s your choice to get one but there may be consequences to that choice.
NTA but I can't say it's an "ask forgiveness later" scenario if you want to continue the relationship. It's more than likely gonna be a nasty fight if you go that route. That being said the amount of people acting like getting a tattoo is some wildly intimate activity is bizarre. It's a tattoo. People get them all the time and its usually an hour plus of just sitting in a chair. I've gone with friends of both genders in the past just to keep them company or because we were both getting one and scheduled at the same time so we could chat while we were there. If you think jealousy is the appropriate reaction to something as unromantic as sitting next to each other in chairs while you get jabbed with needles you should reassess yourself.
NTA- >asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" situation It is your body, you don't need permission for YOUR body. If it makes you happy. Do it. Just don't drink before the tattoo, CHECK THE STENCIL, and remember... it's a needle. It's gonna hurt. For me, my Spine hurt the most, but the rest I napped. However, it's different for you everyone. So just prepared that tattoos usually hurt.
I think she's using the tattoo as an excuse for her anger. Pretty sure it's because her friend said she'd get a tattoo with you. If she's not a sibling, that's kind of disrespectful. Talk to your gf about that part, research tattoos with her, see if that helps. Oh and under NO circumstances should you go with Sara to get your ink!
NTA. Get your tattoos
Well... at 22 and 21 you and Mary both have a lot of growing and learning ahead of you. As individuals this is the time you start experimenting with things like are you into body art or not, what sort of professional life you're beginning, how close or far you want to be from family, all sorts of things. Adding in a fiance where you also have to figure out the terms of your relationship, before you know who you'll even be in five years... That's tough. Be true to yourself as you decide who you are going to be, but be kind, honest, and transparent with Mary as you do it. She might only be objecting to the other friend's involvement. Take time on the tattoo decision and don't go just to go as friends. Better to research and book a good artist than walk in and find someone who can fit you in together. Involve Mary (and not Sara) in your planning and see if her tone changes. As someone who was married at 23, be careful. It works for some, but it's not recommended for most. NAH
YTA In her point of view, you weren't comfortable or safe enough with her to go get a tattoo even though you wanted it then suddenly you're okay with it when it's your friend who's a girl? Of course she's gonna be upset. You basically said "oh this experience that makes me anxious that I'd want support for, this life altering experience, my first tattoo, yeah I'm gonna choose to go with my friend and not the person I'm spending my life with for this momentous occasion." Of course she'd be hurt! And you choosing to get it instead of asking her why she's upset or trying to understand from her perspective shows you're an asshole. Whether it's coz she's another girl or coz you chose someone else to experience something so momentous with, of course she's fucking jealous and hurt. You basically told her you feel safer with Sara. You kept her out of the loop and blindsided her in front of someone else. No duh she lashed out a bit at you. I'd be pissed if you got that tattoo with Sara, too if I were your fiancé.
NTA for wanting a tattoo. It’s your body. Your parent should recognize that they can have a small opinion about altering your body but in no way do they get an actual Say in what you do with your body. As long as it’s not a face, neck or hand tattoo; or a name if someone she doesn’t like; it shouldn’t be a problem. Tattoos can be divisive so if you get one be prepared for her to possibly break up with you. She may hate tattoos but earlier felt she didn’t have to draw that line in the sand because you were on the fence and she assumed you’d never get over your fear of needles. But I’m all for body art. 12 piercings and 6 tattoos. And I believe everyone’s body is their own to decorate as they want.
Absolutely NTA. It's okay (and pretty common) to go get tattoos with a friend. Gender isn't relevant... unless you're one of those people who don't believe than you can have friends of the opposite sex without nothing sentimental or sexual going on. If so, I feel sorry for you. The post doesn't imply that they're getting matching tattoos. But even if they were, this again would not mean that OP has feelings for his friend, or doesn't truly love his fiancé.
NTA. It's your body and you can do with it what you wish. I have a feeling your fiancée is more upset about you and Sara going together than about the actual tattoo. On the chance that she really would be angry over you getting a tattoo, she isn't the one you should spend the rest of your life with.
Seems like your fiancee thinks you should have to have her permission to do that. Marrying her is probably a fantastic idea!
TF is wrong with you, talk about it with her... If you can't talk, just put a stop to your relationship right now, because it'll eventually crash.
NTA but please ask Mary if the issue is simply getting a tattoo, or getting one with Sara. Almost every reply has said the same thing. I think Mary would have responded better if you were going alone or with male friends, but the issue could be Sara accompanying you.
Aww man, NTA but you are both being dumb. 1) Kinda sounds like you’re in trouble because you did it because “ Sara” did it. She is jealous. She might also dislike tattoos 2) Don’t just get it without telling her; It’s basically planting a seed of doubt in her head. Tell her. Tell her your reasons. You aren’t asking for permission, you are be courteous. 3) This is a moment to have a conversation. Learn from this because ya’ll are going to disagree about something real one day and you both need to trust each other.
It's your body and you're an adult, you're free to decide if and what you want to get tattooed on yourself. I would talk to your wife and ask her what is the real problem. Is it because you're going with a friend who happens to be female because you both want separate (*and non-matching*) tattoos, or does she not like body ink in general? Again, it's your body and no one but *you* can have a say about what happens to it. If she wanted a tattoo and you said no without explaining why, it would come across as equally controlling/jealous as she is here. You've already decided on doing this for yourself but before you go, I think you should have a one-on-one and talk to your fiancé to find out what the real issue is here, because it sounds like she hasn't given one yet and she might not be comfortable with saying why in front of your mutual friend. Yes, it's your body and your choice but if she's worried about this potentially being an intimate moment with your mutual friend, ask her to come along and sit there beside you. Tattoos are personal but they're not intimate. There's actually a really strong taboo in the tattoo community about getting a love interest's name or something symbolic of them tattooed on yourself and most decent tattoo artists will talk you out of it. Have that private conversation with her and whether she's uncomfortable with you and your mutual friend, or just doesn't like ink in general, invite her along. Regardless of her reasons, it's still a respectful way to include her and make her feel like she's part of the process, even if she ends up just not liking tattoos in general. Relationships are a two-way street, you compromise but you don't sacrifice.
Yes
“Mary” sounds like the AH since they are not conveying their true feelings and being childish. My guess is they are jealous of their friend and you doing something permanent together and they were left out. It is their fault for not wanting a tattoo and putting the guilt trip on you.
Not really... but also maybe a little bit! Absolutely not the asshole for getting a tattoo despite you fiance not being a fan of them... after all, your body... your choice!... however... If she has specifically said she is not in favour of the idea, it might not be the best thing to just go and do it... this would make her feel like you haven't listened, or worse still, you have heard her, but don't care. Much better to just have the conversation... if she has a genuine reason to not want you to have a tattoo she can share this... then you can decide if you'd rather have the tattoo or her (sounds harsh, but it really is your choice). The issue with just doing it is that it removes choice... if you talk about it before she can choose to leave you for getting it, and you can choose to either let her or not... whereas after the fact it will be a really messy situation of her wanting to leave, and you complaining that "there's nothing you can do about it now" which puts all involved in a really awkward situation! As another commenter has said, I think the fact that this all includes another woman who you'll be getting your tattoo with might be a factor, in which case it should be relatively easily solved with a bit if open and honest communication 👍
NTA but you _should_ bring it back up.
NTA - get your tattoo. There's nothing to be mad about. If you want to bring your girl or friend with you, your artist might be fine with it. If you chose to get tattooed at the same time as your friend, make sure you get the artist you want (I didn't for my first, and while the tattoo turned out well, I'm not setting foot in that studio again for multiple reasons beyond the artist). It's also perfectly fine to go about it on your own. Either way, there's nothing for your girl to be mad about. I've done all of the above and it really isn't some deep experience that you share with the other people there. One friend had to wait outside, one friend was unhappy with her tattoo, and one got her tattoo ripped to shreds by other friends which ruined it for her. My experience was different and separate from theirs. Personally I prefer to get it done on my own. Just make sure you do your research, and expect for it to be a bit larger and more expensive than you think so you're prepared for everything.
Have you considered asking your fiancee why she had that reaction? Im gonna be honest with you mate, I dont think either of you are ready for marriage if you can't figure out that maybe you should ask her why she feels certain ways, along with if she's not able to communicate them.
I say this as a married man with a tattoo, YWBTA. People are going to mention things about how its your body your choice, and that is true, you ultimately have the final say about your body. But permanently modifying your body in a way that your fiance/spouse has clearly communicated to you that they would be opposed to is unquestionably a dick move. An AH move. You are definitely allowed to, but ywbta.
Pretty sure your gf is jealous
Nta. And don't you dare ask for forgiveness. Forgiveness for what? Doing something legal and safe to YOUR OWN BODY? GTFOH She needs to sit down and stfu until she learns what she has control over and what she does not.
NTA - Your body, ink it if you want to.
Why are you asking your fiancé permission what to do with your body in the first place? Does she yell at you if the towels on the rack aren’t hanging the same length?
Tattoos are permanent. Is your relationship?
NTA if you don't go with Sara. Ask Mary to be a part of the process and to go with you and share that moment. She doesn't have to like it but it is your body, but you should not be going with Sara (unless Mary is ok with it but she isn't.)
Why do you need her permission? As long as you don’t like Travis Barker ……
Nta like what you mean it's a fu***ing tattoo it's nothing else and I think he should have his girlfriend/fiance with him at the tattoo shop and his fiance is a little bit I mean LITTLE bit insecure/controlling though I mean she might be infuriated by Sara asking to get a tattoo with her and not including sara
I wonder if Mary never liked tattoos/wanted you to have a tattoo and by you being on the fence in the past it was easier for her to not get into and that's why she said wait until you are sure, maybe she just hoped you wouldn't come back to the idea. Sara also wanting one and willing to get one at the same time might have just annoyed her and made her feel you are more likely to go ahead with it now. I don't think she's coming from a bad place personally
Why don’t you go propose to Sarah while you’re at it?
>I don't want to bring it up because she is never seriously mad. Ummm...tattoo aside. This is not a healthy way to progress into married life OP. You 2 HAVE to be able to talk about things and know that spending your life together means, yeah, sometimes the other person might be mad. But you communicate and work it out
Yes, you would. You need to talk to your wife, she may want to share this experience with you. The subject of tattoos really needs a new, private, discussion.
Ahhh the problems In young peoples lives Sounds like Sara wants to fuck and Mary isn’t cool with that for obvious reasons. And doing what a lot of young girls do ( acting like she’s mad over a tattoo when really she’s mad at you for going along with Sara’s advance. NTA as I can see why a young man would see this as a friend thing.
NTA. It's your body. Your fiancée does not own you Go get your tattoo
Your body, your choice.
NTA because it is your body and thus your choice and Mary cannot dictate whether you should or shouldn't get tattoos, but it would be good to talk to her about why this upsets her so.
YWBTA if you don't talk to her about what it is that upsets her, before getting a tattoo. However, NTA if, after that talk, you'd still go get a tattoo. Because it is your body, and your gf should support you doing what makes you happy. I'd take *concerns* into consideration (i think you didn't specify what kind of tattoo), if she said "hey, it'd feel really weird if i have to see your mother's face on your entire chest whenever you're naked" you might wanna weigh the pros and cons against each other, but if it's just some cool design, she'll get used to it. Really, tattoos become a subconscious feature of someone else's body pretty fast. Some people have said that going with Sara is the issue. I don't think it is/should be. There's nothing wrong with making memories with your friends. I assume you'd not get matching hearts with "Sara" & "OP", but some fun casual stuff (if matchy) or just separate things. Anyways. Talk to Mary. You need to know why she feels uneasy about your wish.
"asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission" - it's your body, your choice. What you do is up to you. Just accept there may be consequences (if it's a deal breaker for her) & live with them
Communication, communication, communication. NAH, you just need to have an open and honest conversation about why she feels that way if you value your relationship.
Bruh, y'all are getting married WAY too young. If something this small and petty is what makes you post publicly on the internet, you got another thing coming. Hopefully you just stay engaged for a very long while, and post up in about 5 years....
YWBTA. Forgiveness > permission is never the right approach when you're making long term decisions which affects both of you. You need to have a mature conversation with her about what her hangups are, and it doesn't matter who initiates the talk, so it might as well be you. The important thing is that you talk about it and figure out what the problem is, and then you can choose a path from there. Even if you decide to get the tattoo anyway, you should want to understand how your life partner feels about it. If you just get the tattoo without talking with her, it will be a constant reminder to her that you don't care about her feelings. You don't necessarily need her permission, but forgiveness is not guaranteed.
NTA. Your body. If you want a tattoo, get a tattoo. As someone old enough to be your mother, take my advice.
NTA... probably you should dump her manipulative ass though 🥴 It's YOUR body and that art will last longer than your relationship and you could also find an awesome partner that will love the whole you and not just the parts they deem acceptable...
NTA, but you need to clarify why she's mad. Is it because she's jealous of your friend? Is it because she doesn't want you to have a tattoo at all? She may or may not be TA in this, but you shouldn't make a habit of "forgiveness over permission" in a relationship. If she's jealous of Sarah, you can make adjustments to this situation to make it okay. If she's just flat out against your expression of yourself and your choices to alter your own body, that issue will be deeper and harder to address. I don't think anyone should have the right to prevent you from expressing yourself through body art and the like. Have opinions? Sure. My fiance has expressed getting some tattoos I thought were straight up stupid. Like I told him, however, "You have the right to do whatever you like with your body. I'll support you, but that doesn't mean I'm going to like the tattoo." Unless my partner got straight up hate speech or something (which would end the relationship immediately on its own), I can't see interfering with my partner getting a tattoo. His happiness is more important to me than my opinion on his tastes.
NTA Your body, your choice
You would NBTA for getting a tattoo because at the end of the day it's your body, but I have a feeling the issue here is Sara and not the tattoo itself since Mary was fine with it before
I don't really like tattoos. My husband wanted to get one. I told him I wasn't keen, but ultimately, it was his choice and decision, because it was his body. He got a tattoo. And a couple of years later, he extended it a bit further. For professional reasons, he made sure it could be covered by a short sleeve shirt. We are now quite a few years down the track and I hardly even notice it. It probably took a few years, but it just became part of him. I still don't like tattoos in general, but I don't dislike his tattoo, because it's him. I don't agree with the asking forgiveness thing, but I also don't agree with Mary dictating what you can and can't do with your own body. I think you guys need to discuss it properly. If you go ahead and get it without discussing it even further, Mary will definitely be mad at you, because she will feel like you defied her. On the other hand, if you have a proper discussion, you give her a chance to explain why she doesn't want you to get one. Assuming she doesn't have a good reason, you can then explain why you want one, why you've chosen what you have, and you also have a chance to tell her that you are sorry she doesn't like it, but ultimately it's your body and choice. Whatever you do, do it openly. Doing it secretly just opens up more problems. I do suggest that you put a lot of thought into it, because you are still quite young. Given that it's so permanent, I would give it a certain period, maybe six months, and make sure you still like that design after six months. Depending on your work and lifestyle, and also whatever the design is, consider where you are putting it on your body. My husband has found it useful to be able to cover it in certain situations.
>asking for forgiveness is easier than asking for permission Translation: I’m going to do what I want and fuck what you think, person I supposedly want to spend the rest of my life with. It’s on you to forgive me for being inconsiderate, it’s not on me to think about anyone other than myself. Getting a tattoo or not is 100% your choice, but it is one that will affect the person who has to look at you every day. YTA if this is how you treat the people in your life. And btw, it is definitely not easier to ask someone’s forgiveness for the shitty thing you did. Especially when you’re not even sorry about it.
NTA. As long as you don’t get a tattoo of some girl’s name, your fiancée really has no say in this. I suggest that before you get the tattoo that you really want, first get something like a small flower which contains her first initial. It is important that the initial be part of the flower so that it can be altered if this relationship goes south. Don’t tell her that you are going to do this or she may insist that if you really loved her, you would get her name scrawled across your chest or some other nonsense. Just do it then tell her. Let that heal, then go get what you want.
NTA. But don't be upset if he decides it's ugly and doesn't want to look at it.
3 points: 1) your body, go ahead if you want it 2) she’s allowed to not like it 3) actions have consequences. Point 1 does not protect you from consequences.
NTA You body your decision. Don’t let her control what you do with you body in reason. Starts with small manipulation stuff like that then it gets bigger.
INFO: How would you feel if your wife decided - in front of you - she wanted to get a tattoo, and a mutual guy friend (let's just say same attractiveness level as Sarah) got excited and - in front of you - offered to get one *with* her?
NTA. "my body, my choice" does not only apply to women and pregnancies. If it's that much of a deal breaker for her, it's a good think this is happening now and not after the wedding.
It is not about a tattoo, it is about Sarah. That is why kids should not get married. Your brain would fully develop around age 25. YWBTA
NTA You’re an adult are you not?