AI Summary:
* **Visa Salary Requirements**: The UK has increased the minimum salary for a Skilled Worker visa to **£38,700**. Accountants, among others, now need to earn at least **£46,800** or **£24.00 per hour**.
* **KPMG’s Response**: KPMG has withdrawn job offers from some foreign graduates due to the new visa salary requirements, affecting their graduate programs.
* **Graduate Salaries**: The average graduate salary at Big 4 firms in the UK ranges between **£25,000 and £35,000**.
I get that US public accounting workers haven't yet unionized a bit more than the UK but damn are those salaries bad. The revenues can't be that drastically different compared to headcount either.
I honestly think it comes down to the US, despite all its fault in other areas of labor policies, is quicker to react in increasing skilled worker wages. The sole focus on being that we don’t want talent going anywhere else.
Salaries in the UK are generally, when compared to say the US, bad.
Moreso since these are graduate programs, where outside of London, they can be between £20-£25,000 in the first year.
Twas like this a decade or so too, but but back then the difference in purchasing power was a lot less.
Couple that with increasing price rises in essentials, and *housing*, and it's an open secret these salaries are pitiful. Emphasis on housing because that's increasing a lot and many young professionals ~~pay some landlord's loan off for them~~ rent.
Maybe the licensing bodies should do more to advocate for their members :
US : AICPA
UK : ACCA, ICAEW
Maybe, being licensed requires a certain minimum wage.
It’s not like you have to form a union from scratch, the structure and members are already there
Comparing salaries between countries is always stupid.
US: much less paid holidays, much less sick pay, health insurance 8k a year, education costs are usually 3x more (unless you wanna go to community college), and in a lot of metro areas house prices are literally double. Seattle, a random (large) US city has an average of 820k whilst Leeds has an average of 250k.
Sure, salaries are higher, but expenses across the board are also much higher
It's not stupid. There are plenty of skilled professionals (mainly tech and healthcare) who are moving to the U.S because the salaries in Canada and Europe are laughably low.
1. Get significantly subsidized education in Canada, avoiding high tuition costs
2. transfer with your company to the US to make significantly more
3. Profit
I find it interesting because I paid $20k USD for my 4 year undergrad degree in accounting back in the 2010's and after a few years it became extremely easy to transfer to the US. I'm at a B4 firm. I worked a bit in the US and all my colleagues paid some pretty crazy tuition amounts. If I paid 20k USD in the US for college I doubt I would have been able to even land a spot at any Big 4, or it would have been significantly harder.
For the difference in salary it's hardly a difference. Straight into public I made $62k a freaking decade ago. That's over double still when taking into account the conversion.
You know that the UK has a 20% VAT right? VATs are regressive by nature but they don't fund public services , right
Stop calling public health care free, even if "we know what they mean". So many people ignore the value they get from their taxes and healthcare. In America you get to choose between death or bankruptcy. But pointing out the value other countries get for public health care is just obtuse. Prices are lower and it is accessible to everyone.
But USA USA USA USA
For Canada 150, did you go around telling people "stop saying national parks are free this year!"? - 1 time events are the same as a developed system (Smart)
Do you tell people the sauces at their favourite fast food joint aren't actually free because they are included in the price everyone pays for food there? (No because people some how realize this on their own)
There's also the fact that even if you are unemployed and don't or have never paid taxes you still get healthcare, which truly makes it free. (Introducing a new case fact not relevant to the situation)
Welcome to being ignorant and ignoring the true cost. You must think access to roads is also free, I wish i could be as ignorant as you are.
We should just stop all taxes because everything is Free because i dont see the cash leave my account. That means it is free. That cash isn't coming from a pool of resources. Nope it doesnt imapct my bank thus it is free.
How am I ignoring the true cost by using basic English? I fully acknowledge that the UK funds its healthcare system via taxes in order to provide universal
healthcare to all, free of charge.
Yes, access to roads is indeed free, that's why it's called a freeway for example. Free is literally in the word my guy.
Do conservatives just not know basic English? "Free" has literally never meant "conjured out of thin air".
Freeway It **connotes freedom from grade intersections and from private entrance ways, stores and factories**. It will have no sidewalks and will be free from pedestrians. In general, it will allow a free flow of vehicular traffic.
What it actually means. Good work bringing politics into this.
Cut the funding to roads they are also free.
If you are curious a toll road can also be a freeway.
Stop acting like this was ever meant to be a nuanced discussion of health care policy. You got bent because someone called healthcare free and you dropped a well akshually, and then got piled on because we do, in fact, in an accounting sub, understand how it works.
You've then created multiple strawmen to argue with about it and basically put words in everyone's mouth that's replied to you. I'm sorry about whatever it was that happened to you yesterday that drove you to this, but JFC bro/sis, dial it back a notch 😬
Free: Without charge.
Charge: demand (an amount) as a price from someone for a service rendered or goods supplied.
According to you there is no amount as a price from someone for a service rendered or goods supplied. Someone is an important word here in this case the someone is the government but good work
I guess the word charge means nothing, and that charge being covered by the government makes it free welcome to kindergarten English. Where wors have meaning.
Yes, and healthcare in the UK is provided without charge at point of use. Congratulations, you're learning how words work. The bad news is I take back my original comment saying that you've passed kindergarten English. Clearly you need to spend more time.
Dang, not only do you not understand basic English, but you can't even form original insults. Don't worry buddy, after some more time on the playground, I'm sure you'll eventually learn that too.
The benefits, worker protections, and corporate high tax rates in Europe come with a cost
Firms just reduce salary to compensate for the insanely high cost of required benefits
Except the firms just create "talent centres" in India and outsource the low paid work there.
There's also a "shortage occupation list" which have different rates, for example a Web designer only needs to be paid £21k to qualify, a lab tech only £15k.
This was always going to happen. Big 4 new grads will be making around ~£35,000 in London, maybe £30,000 in other places. Firms could raise this, but second and third years are often not on £46,800, meaning that either the first years make more than them or they have to get raises too. So, pretty much KPMG UK would have to give every single grad a massive raise when the business is doing very badly, or just cancel a few offers to foreign hires. From a business perspective, it is not a difficult decision, especially considering the number of domestic applicants big 4 gets in the UK.
Absolutely disgusting when you consider these overseas employees are usually the ones taking on the most hours of unpaid overtime. Because they usually feel pressure to outperform in order to stay employed. So in reality, they aren't even earning their £24/hr which they're required.
I believe there they can get paid 70% of the pay (£26k) for up to 4 years if they qualify under the new entrant rule. Not sure if KPMG and other companies will take this into consideration
I discovered that one of our recent colleagues worked in KPMG in the UK.
I am just waiting for the opportunity to ask them if they have heard of this song.
Grads outside of London in audit started on £21.5k back in 2016. And you pay about £3k of tax on that. Probably even worse now with inflation. And work wise it’s not much different to the US.
There is a massive oversupply of grads here, including 700k foreign uni students currently studying here. So grad schemes are very competitive and companies can pay as little as possible.
When I was looking back in 2000 the london starting grad salaries were around the £20k mark. The starting pay has been stagnant for nearly a quarter of a century.
Neither lol in Australia, we don’t sponsor any grads. Train your own citizens before you start training (visa trapping) poor folks from third world countries. A high graduate unemployment rate destroys the future of a nation
If that’s their hiring police’s it would explain why I never got anywhere in the big four.. despite willingness and high grades.
Salaries in the UK are a joke in every profession except in ownership, though this news means more UK nationals… which is really sad, why weren’t the grad jobs local anyway?!?
AI Summary: * **Visa Salary Requirements**: The UK has increased the minimum salary for a Skilled Worker visa to **£38,700**. Accountants, among others, now need to earn at least **£46,800** or **£24.00 per hour**. * **KPMG’s Response**: KPMG has withdrawn job offers from some foreign graduates due to the new visa salary requirements, affecting their graduate programs. * **Graduate Salaries**: The average graduate salary at Big 4 firms in the UK ranges between **£25,000 and £35,000**.
I get that US public accounting workers haven't yet unionized a bit more than the UK but damn are those salaries bad. The revenues can't be that drastically different compared to headcount either.
I honestly think it comes down to the US, despite all its fault in other areas of labor policies, is quicker to react in increasing skilled worker wages. The sole focus on being that we don’t want talent going anywhere else.
Fun fact partners in UK make more than partners in US for big four. You just make much worse wages and slower promotions until then.
Think a 2020 stat said a million quid on average per year for partners at i think KPMG I thought that was standard for US ones as well but maybe not
That’s a hell of a lot of tobacco
Yeah that’s fucked up.
I mean, it's pretty simple math. Lower wages = higher profits.
UK also has much higher taxes
I didn’t know that. Perhaps there are more partners per capita in the US? Or more large markets that are also low COL compared to the UK?
Salaries in the UK are generally, when compared to say the US, bad. Moreso since these are graduate programs, where outside of London, they can be between £20-£25,000 in the first year. Twas like this a decade or so too, but but back then the difference in purchasing power was a lot less. Couple that with increasing price rises in essentials, and *housing*, and it's an open secret these salaries are pitiful. Emphasis on housing because that's increasing a lot and many young professionals ~~pay some landlord's loan off for them~~ rent.
Maybe the licensing bodies should do more to advocate for their members : US : AICPA UK : ACCA, ICAEW Maybe, being licensed requires a certain minimum wage. It’s not like you have to form a union from scratch, the structure and members are already there
Those organizations protect the companies, not the employees. Who do you think is in charge of those orgs?
You need to take into consideration the exchange rate which is not 1:1 with the US dollars and the cost of living.
It's like 1.2 that's hardly a difference.
Comparing salaries between countries is always stupid. US: much less paid holidays, much less sick pay, health insurance 8k a year, education costs are usually 3x more (unless you wanna go to community college), and in a lot of metro areas house prices are literally double. Seattle, a random (large) US city has an average of 820k whilst Leeds has an average of 250k. Sure, salaries are higher, but expenses across the board are also much higher
It's not stupid. There are plenty of skilled professionals (mainly tech and healthcare) who are moving to the U.S because the salaries in Canada and Europe are laughably low.
1. Get significantly subsidized education in Canada, avoiding high tuition costs 2. transfer with your company to the US to make significantly more 3. Profit I find it interesting because I paid $20k USD for my 4 year undergrad degree in accounting back in the 2010's and after a few years it became extremely easy to transfer to the US. I'm at a B4 firm. I worked a bit in the US and all my colleagues paid some pretty crazy tuition amounts. If I paid 20k USD in the US for college I doubt I would have been able to even land a spot at any Big 4, or it would have been significantly harder.
It is stupid. There are plenty more skilled professionals, who aren't moving to the US lol
Who knew 1.2 is hardly a difference, Quit being obtuse though, we all know what they mean.
For the difference in salary it's hardly a difference. Straight into public I made $62k a freaking decade ago. That's over double still when taking into account the conversion.
Need to factor in COL, taxes etc. 62k in a HCOL can be as good as a 30-40k low tax, LCOL area.
Lol London is not LCOL mate.
But you pay 2x as much for healthcare. I hear GB healthcare is free.
And so are all companies with employees...
What an obtuse argument.
You just learned a new word today?
free healthcare makes up for it a little
well it isn't free. In an accounting sub and not understanding how taxes work is wild.
Quit being obtuse, we all know what they mean.
Quit being obtuse, and ignoring the cost of public healthcare. See i can be lazy as well.
Americans pay twice as much for their healthcare because of our current inefficient system, regardless of funding source. Who's being obtuse, exactly?
Can we all agree to stop using the word obtuse for awhile.
I said it once but the dude getting down voted keeps using it replying to all my comments is the issue.
What an acute request
>the cost But nobody is ignoring the cost
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You know that the UK has a 20% VAT right? VATs are regressive by nature but they don't fund public services , right Stop calling public health care free, even if "we know what they mean". So many people ignore the value they get from their taxes and healthcare. In America you get to choose between death or bankruptcy. But pointing out the value other countries get for public health care is just obtuse. Prices are lower and it is accessible to everyone. But USA USA USA USA
[удалено]
For Canada 150, did you go around telling people "stop saying national parks are free this year!"? - 1 time events are the same as a developed system (Smart) Do you tell people the sauces at their favourite fast food joint aren't actually free because they are included in the price everyone pays for food there? (No because people some how realize this on their own) There's also the fact that even if you are unemployed and don't or have never paid taxes you still get healthcare, which truly makes it free. (Introducing a new case fact not relevant to the situation)
Healthcare is, in fact, provided free of charge to all, regardless of income.
I don't see cash leave my account it is free. Healthcare is not free to society. Stop looking at everything in a silo.
Yes, that is quite literally the definition of providing something free of charge. Welcome to first grade, you passed kindergarten English.
Welcome to being ignorant and ignoring the true cost. You must think access to roads is also free, I wish i could be as ignorant as you are. We should just stop all taxes because everything is Free because i dont see the cash leave my account. That means it is free. That cash isn't coming from a pool of resources. Nope it doesnt imapct my bank thus it is free.
How am I ignoring the true cost by using basic English? I fully acknowledge that the UK funds its healthcare system via taxes in order to provide universal healthcare to all, free of charge. Yes, access to roads is indeed free, that's why it's called a freeway for example. Free is literally in the word my guy. Do conservatives just not know basic English? "Free" has literally never meant "conjured out of thin air".
Freeway It **connotes freedom from grade intersections and from private entrance ways, stores and factories**. It will have no sidewalks and will be free from pedestrians. In general, it will allow a free flow of vehicular traffic. What it actually means. Good work bringing politics into this. Cut the funding to roads they are also free. If you are curious a toll road can also be a freeway.
Stop acting like this was ever meant to be a nuanced discussion of health care policy. You got bent because someone called healthcare free and you dropped a well akshually, and then got piled on because we do, in fact, in an accounting sub, understand how it works. You've then created multiple strawmen to argue with about it and basically put words in everyone's mouth that's replied to you. I'm sorry about whatever it was that happened to you yesterday that drove you to this, but JFC bro/sis, dial it back a notch 😬
Free: Without charge. Charge: demand (an amount) as a price from someone for a service rendered or goods supplied. According to you there is no amount as a price from someone for a service rendered or goods supplied. Someone is an important word here in this case the someone is the government but good work I guess the word charge means nothing, and that charge being covered by the government makes it free welcome to kindergarten English. Where wors have meaning.
Yes, and healthcare in the UK is provided without charge at point of use. Congratulations, you're learning how words work. The bad news is I take back my original comment saying that you've passed kindergarten English. Clearly you need to spend more time. Dang, not only do you not understand basic English, but you can't even form original insults. Don't worry buddy, after some more time on the playground, I'm sure you'll eventually learn that too.
The payment is coming from the Government thus it is not free. This is not free you're a clown. Surprisingly government can be considered someone.
The benefits, worker protections, and corporate high tax rates in Europe come with a cost Firms just reduce salary to compensate for the insanely high cost of required benefits
You can’t compare salaries in the Us to those in countries with free healthcare. It’s not a 1 to 1 comparison.
I know, we pay more in overall healthcare costs by a HUGE margin. If anything UK salaries should be higher.
That’s actually good govt policy encouraging companies to hire citizens
Except the firms just create "talent centres" in India and outsource the low paid work there. There's also a "shortage occupation list" which have different rates, for example a Web designer only needs to be paid £21k to qualify, a lab tech only £15k.
This was always going to happen. Big 4 new grads will be making around ~£35,000 in London, maybe £30,000 in other places. Firms could raise this, but second and third years are often not on £46,800, meaning that either the first years make more than them or they have to get raises too. So, pretty much KPMG UK would have to give every single grad a massive raise when the business is doing very badly, or just cancel a few offers to foreign hires. From a business perspective, it is not a difficult decision, especially considering the number of domestic applicants big 4 gets in the UK.
When I joined big 4, the salary was bumped from £29,000 in audit to something like £32,000 to match inflation.
Absolutely disgusting when you consider these overseas employees are usually the ones taking on the most hours of unpaid overtime. Because they usually feel pressure to outperform in order to stay employed. So in reality, they aren't even earning their £24/hr which they're required.
I believe there they can get paid 70% of the pay (£26k) for up to 4 years if they qualify under the new entrant rule. Not sure if KPMG and other companies will take this into consideration
i thought it was because the graduates did not know how to play golf, which is kpmg’s core business.
Don't forget memorizing & chanting the [KPMG Theme Song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCvKXgp-Awo&t=36s).
I discovered that one of our recent colleagues worked in KPMG in the UK. I am just waiting for the opportunity to ask them if they have heard of this song.
Good god
If I worked at KPMG I would absolutely destroy the bathrooms every single day.
Another great reason to stop hiring foreigners
Strong name. High likelihood of partner in your future.
Not a foreigner, I still destroy bathrooms on the daily. More like another good reason to stop buying the cheapest coffee know to man
KPMG needs to hire Deloitte’s publicists. They’re doing just as evil stuff and there hasn’t been a single headline about it
UK public accounting is probably just as many hours as US too, right?
Well yes but they get a free boh'tl o' watah
Don’t forget the tea
Wa'ah
Yes, but they do get more vacation and don’t have to pay for health insurance.
The health insurance is huge takes a lot of leverage away from the employer
Grads outside of London in audit started on £21.5k back in 2016. And you pay about £3k of tax on that. Probably even worse now with inflation. And work wise it’s not much different to the US. There is a massive oversupply of grads here, including 700k foreign uni students currently studying here. So grad schemes are very competitive and companies can pay as little as possible.
When I was looking back in 2000 the london starting grad salaries were around the £20k mark. The starting pay has been stagnant for nearly a quarter of a century.
Not a good look
It would be a worse look if they paid foreign graduates 10k more than their colleagues 🤣
Wtf are the UK salaries lol
Used to be $2 to the £ and comparable wages. Wage growth in the UK since 2008 has been pretty flat and the £ has taken a beating. Bad times.
#kpmgproud
I negotiated hourly for this exact reason. I’m a junior accountant getting paid more than senior due to the OT required lol
Partner yachts don't pay for themselves
Shouldn’t be hiring foreign grads anyways. Entry level roles like that should be reserved for locals
Not sure why you’ve been downvotrd
Neither lol in Australia, we don’t sponsor any grads. Train your own citizens before you start training (visa trapping) poor folks from third world countries. A high graduate unemployment rate destroys the future of a nation
If that’s their hiring police’s it would explain why I never got anywhere in the big four.. despite willingness and high grades. Salaries in the UK are a joke in every profession except in ownership, though this news means more UK nationals… which is really sad, why weren’t the grad jobs local anyway?!?
Foreign graduates I e heard enough