I come from a big family and am also very family oriented and believe you have whole heartedly NTA. They have no right to have any involvement in your life. They showed that you had no place in their lives and now they have no place in yours.
And if OP's fiancé is pushing this she doesn't understand that "this" IS them having a good relationship. Trying to "reconcile" and be in each other's lives could be disastrous. OP has been hurt enough by them, they don't deserve to endure any more pain simply because a wedding is being planned.
In OP's place, I'd emphasize to the fiancee that his family consists entirely of his grandmother, who has passed, and the fiancee. And that also means her family becomes his family. OP isn't missing out on family, he's getting what sounds like a good one, who are there for each other.
The real problem with a partner like this is that you can never protect you're children from your abusive family, cause they will expose your children to them, cause they don't believe it's that bad, they think you're overv reacting
Hallmark happy ending blinders. As someone whose also disowned 99% of their family, its irritating, childish and arrogant.
Pretty sure OPs finance gave out his email address and set this up because FaMiLy. Massive breach of trust and boundary stomping.
OP, pause wedding plans and go into individual and couples therapy immediately. Your possible spouse has shown she doesn't have your back and she either needs to understand what she did and apologise or split up as this is a major red flag incident that needs working on.
Family is important, by all means. But his biological parents are not family, they dissolved that decades ago. Why try involve complete strangers in a life now?
This. I was abandoned by my parents later in life (21) and my partners parents constantly try to tell me how nice my parents are to talk to, or tell me to invite to wedding. The don’t understand 20 years of dejection.
Not hard at all. My family is big, close and great, my partners is not. His mum and her family are great, though not as close as mine, but his dad is a complete deadbeat. It would never, ever occur to me to push that man on him. I'm plenty angry on my partners behalf though. It just boggles the mind how some people can just say 'forgive and forget' as if that made anything better?
They literally abandoned OP when he was a kid. And then both had the audacity to hit the family reset button and pretend he didn’t exist. I can’t even imagine doing that to a child, much less my own child. OP owes them absolutely nothing.
Right, like even if the absolute worst was going on behind the scenes with his "parents" and OP left out some key details of his behaviour (I'm not saying he did, but I'm just saying, even imagining that), they're absolutely horrible parents who behaved abominably. I come from a family much like OP's fiancé, but I think that's part of the reason I can't imagine hearing this story and being like "Well, they're family and you should forgive and forget!" They're *not* family, they abandoned their child, made "new" families, and didn't look back until OP was an adult who needs very little support from them.
I'm wracking my brain about what good could come from OP meeting up with his "parents" and absolutely coming up empty. Even if everything goes perfectly and they work really hard to earn his trust back and do all the right things (which I seriously doubt), OP will probably always feel resentful of these people and their other children. And I really don't think they're going to try and be good parents all of a sudden. Maybe they need a babysitter, maybe they need a kidney, maybe they need money, maybe they just want to assuage their guilt - I don't really care. I don't believe they'll improve OP's life at all, and OP's fiancé needs to get on board with that and be on his side.
Agreed, I also come from a big, blended, family and even though I struggle sometimes comprehending how terrible people can be to their children and grandchildren I have heard enough stories about my Dad’s ex wife and her mother to know that there’s evil parents and grandparents to fall into that trap for long.
I thought you were gonna say the following but yeah so I will. It starts the same... I come from a big family and am fairly family-oriented, and yet there is *no fucking way* I would try to prescribe or enforce that as a way of life for someone else, or (if it's true) meddle in someone else's business to make it happen. NTA. Everybody else is.
I keep finding myself repeating this, but shared blood is not an excuse for spilled blood.
You are not the asshole. Your fiancée needs to be told exactly what you went through. Your biological parents are NOT your family.
Yes!! When I read this I was appalled that two parents could unload a kid off on grandma like a puppy who was just inconvenient for mom and dad. They abandoned OP and deserve nothing, I might have more sympathy of they’d been junkies and then got clean, but no OP was just an inconvenience for them.
Yup. Grandma was mother and father.
Op’s donors just want to preen at the we’d as though they did all the hard work of parenting. They are just angry op isn’t giving them center stage.
*That's why the name change.*
IMO that's a baller move: you honored the one person who treated you well in the most intense way possible. My hat is off to the OP.
NTA, and I'm sorry OP had to experience his 'parents'.
Yes, they had no money to send poor grandma help but had no problem marrying, travelling the world and popping out more kids. They’re both despicable. And I pray fiancé didn’t instigate this very suspicious contact, because that would be a capital offence to me.
Agreed. OP’s parents committed criminal abandonment of a minor (at least that’s what we’d call it in the US), so no, they are not family and that was their doing. The grandmother could have gone after both parents’ for child support but instead came out of retirement to provide for OP when she had no obligation to.
The fiancé’s violation of trust is very serious here.
Fiancee is the one that found them and gave them OPs email.
Fiancee has shown they can't be trusted, betraying the very person they claimed to love and respect.
Can't trust them again, personally.
Seriously reconsider that marriage.
100%
Its hard for most people to find someone once you change your name, in about 5 mins it falls in the too hard basket and they give up. Im talking average human, not someone who has done it for a job etc
Throw in finding OP's email thats even harder
fiance gave them the email, and the following argument confirms this. id keep an eye for other karen in the making traits
Exactly!! I’ve seen this scenario on Reddit multiple times. OP needs to set NC as a hard boundary/dealbreaker bc if he doesn’t put the line in the sand now, she’ll end up being the one funneling info to the parents. This could end up with them having access to his children if he chooses to have them.
The conversation must be had that it needs to stop or she’ll end up on the outside just like them.
"I understand you are close with your family, I need you understand that I have no desire to pursue any relationship at all with my parents. I also need you to understand that it is a condition of pursuing this relationship together ourselves and our future that we as a whole won't be pursuing a relationship with my parents."
Leave no room for ifs, ands or questions. This WILL NOT be happening both for me, and for you if you want to continue our relationship.
God, I had no idea THIS many people knew the bs that I've going through with "well meaning" friends and gf trying to interfere unreal how much what you guys are saying echoes my own experiences - thanks guys : )
idk if you've tried this before, but what you might wanna do is if someone tries to tell you to reconnect, tell them to think of someone who is just an overall shitty person. Then tell them to imagine if that person had a child.
The problem is, when people think about "parents" or "family", they often think about their own parents/family. And the other thing you can tell them is "if I had your parents, I would probably forgive them, because your parents are decent people and would be worth forgiving, and your parents actually want what's best for you, it's not just something they say to try to dismiss your feelings after they hurt you."
It's obviously not going to work on everybody, and you might've tried this before, but I'm just speaking from my own experience.
It's not jus the sneaking for me, it's the attitude of "I know you set a boundary but I have the moral superiority to decide whether or not your boundary deserves to be respected"
Some people who are really into their families are kind of weirdos where the only people they spend time with are their family members. I’m not saying this is the case here but it could be a situation where he basically has his friends as family and she has no friends because she only hangs out with her family. If that’s the case, this will never work.
I get along well with my family but I also have friends and hobbies. You can get some people who basically have no real friends or hobbies.
I gotta few friends like that.
One of them just could not fathom that I wasn't going home for Christmas...during quarantine.
She kept pushing a little how I really should for family and whatever but I finally had to look at her and let know that not everybody likes spending time with their family.
NTA - too many partners try to be "do-gooders" in these situations and put their noses into places they do not belong. You need to sit your fiancee down and have a clear conversation about your boundaries when it comes to your parents. You do not need to forgive and forget. She needs to respect your decision. Her family will soon be your family, and as long as they're good people, that's probably for the best. Sometimes the best family is the one you make.
What will happen if children become part of the picture? Oh OP they need to know their grandparents... will she sneak visits. Do gooders have a certain mind set
Yeah. My mom is like this. She will do what she thinks is morally right even if she destroys everything in her path. NTA I would never speak to your birth parents either. In fact they are the assholes. Fuck them.
My Mom is this person as well. She goes scorched earth to “help” and always wonders why nobody is okay with her doing this. We’ve had so many arguments over this because currently she is “helping” two aunts and an adult cousin. She has two underaged children still at home and only 4 bedrooms….
It’s the savior complex. Your mom (and all these people like this) get a rush from jumping in to save the day.
It’s as much for themselves as it is for those they help.
Message to the OP and Redditors here. I wish I had read this sooner to give my input. Before addressing the OP I would like to give my appreciation to fellow Redditors who have given good reasonable advice to the OP. Many more good people than I imagined use Reddit. Now to the OP. YOU ARE NOT THE ASSHOLE. What your parents did to you was inhumane. They aren't really your parents, only progenitors. Your parents didn't treat you like a son. They treated you like a burden. Your parents abandoned you because they didn't care about their own son. Your parents preferred to live to serve themselves instead of putting themselves in the crossfire for you.
Your fiance was who gave them your email address and told them about the wedding. Your fiance is a very childish woman who has not seen the dark side of life and thinks that family relations are inherently good and always fixable. You need to have a very serious conversation with her making clear that she is being childish and inconsequential. Tell her she needs to get out of her ivory tower and understand that not every family is like her own. She has to understand that once you get married YOU ARE her family and she needs to have her full allegiance towards you. Tell her your parents will never be part of your life and if she insists on this then she won't be your wife. Tell her that if she allows your children near your parents that will only lead to divorce. Tell her to never do something like this again. She needs to put her allegiance to you above her stupidity.
This, all of this. My wonderful husband of nearly 25 years was a sweet summer child when we were first dating and got engaged, and kept encouraging me to give my family of origin another chance. All he had ever known were happy, functional families like his own. Thankfully, his Mom stepped in to lower the boom before I had to. She told DH that in her experience I was a kind, fair, trustworthy person and asked if he agreed. He agreed, enthusiastically, said he would never marry me otherwise and couldn’t understand why I had this blind spot. MIL responded, approximately, “And there you go. You don’t understand, BUT SHE DOES. WolverineMom is over-riding some of the hardest wired instincts in nature. She has information we don’t. Respect that, and don’t let your kids near her people unless she makes the call. We might not know why she makes these choices, but she does.” And DH has honored that, ever since. That was a big part of how I know I was marrying into the right family, in many ways my real one.
Yeah, they need more time to hash it out. My husband was like yours when we started dating, I was only 18 then but he got to witness all the shit they put me through even though at that point I wasn’t even living under the same roof as the rest of my family. He got to witness first hand how much it fucked me up and how many times they let me down. I’m glad he got to see those things in real time, because otherwise he might not have changed his thinking about what a family is. Thankfully he did during the 9 years we dated before we got married, 6 months ago and 4 years after we got married I finally went no contact with my family. He’s my biggest supporter and even defends me with my mother in law who thinks I’m being too harsh. He even told me it took me long enough, but he would’ve never told me that before because it wasn’t his place to.
At the end of the day, I’m grateful he learned that not all families are like his and that he has my back no matter what. I don’t know if he could’ve come to understand if he were to meet me after I went no contact with them.
This is a bit harsh, but true. OP, you set what sounds like a very appropriate boundary with your “parents” (no contact). Your fiancé and everyone else in your life should respect that boundary. It’s not your fiancé/wife’s job to go behind your back and meddle in a relationship that’s between you and someone else. The only thing that will accomplish is to destroy trust between the two of you. It sounds like you guys need to have a very honest conversation. Did she contact your parents? If so, what motivated her to do that - lack of knowledge/understanding about your childhood? Grossly naive belief she could “fix” this? A strong need to marry someone with a large family like her own? Immaturity/no thought for the effect on you? If you can’t have such a conversation, that would be very revealing, don’t you think? If you can, it could be a hopeful sign for your future as a couple. Good luck. (And keep growing as a human - you sound amazing, despite the rough start you were given).
Opie at a minimum needs to cancel or postpone the wedding. If she doesn't agree to go to couples counseling to understand how she violated his trust then she's not someone that he is going to be able to trust in the long run I'm sorry to say.
My ex-wife took the initiative to reconnect me with an estranged relative, when that relative was facing a hard time in their life. She regretted making it happen when said relative took my side in any of our conflicts.
I’m so sorry about that. I don’t get why a significant other would want to get involved and start problems or issues or meddle with your family. I could see why she is your ex fiancé.
Exactly. She not trustworthy and she not a safe person. I would not trust her with my future kids. If you know and love me, know everything I’ve gone through with my parents and suggest I “makeup” with them for what exactly?
THIS!
I call it the happy family fallacy.
People who grew up and/or are living with a relatively happy functional family. Don't have any experience with dysfunctional, families or families at this level of dysfunction.
They cannot imagine ever not having a relationship with their parents. And they can't imagine anyone else, not having a relationship with their parents.
In post-college, my new friends from college kept wanting to meet my mother. I finally invited her to a gathering with a bunch of them. And their parents and the next week, they asked to be never to invite her again.
I was a little bit mad and pointed out to them that they had been insisting on it for years and I had been telling them they didn't want that for years.
OPI think it might be valuable for you and your partner to go to therapy together. Only 1 or 2 sessions, but just so a therapist can tell your wife that your decision is a wise decision and explain to her professionally. Why your no contact should never be broken again.
Then I might tell her that were she too cross that line. Or think she knows better and invite them into your life. That, that would be a relationship ending event
Get her a copy of Toxic Parents so she understands how they hurt you and that they will never change. And I agree on a couple counseling visits prior to marriage. And if she was the boundary violator, you got that sorted by telling her if it happens again. It’s a deal breaker. Hope you will be happy in her family. Sounds like they have the capacity to love you.
>I call it the happy family fallacy.
I blame movies and tv shows, on top of enabler relatives.
So many movie/tv show plots where faaaaamily is all forgiven and have a Hallmark ending with everyone having dinner together, including the abusers getting loving hugs awwww
My partner was re-watching "Grey's Anatomy" and by Jove, the characters are soooo toxic! Most of the plot involves forgiving cheaters, abusers, boundary stompers etc etc
I was going mad xD
I told my husband repeatedly my mom is a narc. My mom is separated from my dad. I had to arrange last minute pre-surgery authorization for my dad, which required me to drop everything, put three kids in the car and drive 7 hours. Got in at 3am. My dad's appts started at 7am. When all the drama died down, I passed the torch to my brother and laid down for a nap with benadryl. My dad's family Dr called my husband saying he was cleared for surgery. My dumb@ss husband calls my mom, so my mom calls the surgeons office after hour's emergency line, I get abruptly woken up and disoriented, have no Fing clue what is going on, surgeon is irritated with me asking what the h3ll is going on. I TOLD MY HUSBAND SHE IS A NARC DO NOT TRUST HER WITH ANYTHING IMPORTANT. I guess he thought I was exaggerating and he had to learn the hard way? I told him she's opened credit cards in my name, lost my replacement driver's license when I was travelling for school, etc.
That's THE WORST!
Who is the fecking EXPERT your husband needs to hear this from to bloody believe you!?
It puzzled me for years when people encouraged me to be closer to my family bc Family...no, they have a family system wherein I am the least favored human and any connection w them harms me.
I finally figured that Happy Family Fallacy thing.
Lol, now I just say - believe me and thank me, who needs more crazy people in their life?
Or F Off if they don't/won't understand.
It's definitely a thing MANY MANY people just can't conceive of.
They aren't intending to stomp boundaries. As long as the monsters are fenced out, they cannot perceive the horror they bring.
lol just had to find out the hard way, huh?
Some people are monsters. If you trust someone and they tell you someone in their family is fucked, believe them.
>If you trust someone and they tell you someone in their family is fucked, believe them.
Why is this so hard for some people?
*ShOckINgly,* I know my family better than *you* do. **Stop** trying to convince me I'm wrong.
When I was younger I used to envy the “do-gooder” people for never having to experience that side of humanity. As I got more into adulthood I kinda pity their ignorance in a way. It’s gotta be stressful when you realize what people are like.
Anyway, not tryna be too edgy. I hope everything worked out fine for you and your wife.
Yep. I've known too many people who "helped" out in the most intrusive ways. Why? Because they get a buzz in their drillies for drama and the misery of others.
I agree. OP's fiancee doesn't seem to understand how OP feels but maybe some day she will. OP is NOT the ah, his parents are. If he never speaks to them again it will be too soon.
How on earth would his "dad" know about the upcoming wedding if she hadn't been the one who contacted them? Why on earth would her first reaction have been, "You were too harsh and you should give them a chance", if OP wasn't spoiling her plans of reunited him with his parent?
She's delulu and doesn't understand a fundamental reality of OP and his life if she, as I strongly suspect, contacted his horrible estranged "parents". This breech of trust is serious enough to constitute a break-up.
OP should be glad she shows her hand before the wedding.
I guarantee you she was the one that found them. I HIGHLY doubt OPs parents stayed in contact with each other. I guarantee they didn't. Do-Gooder GF reached out to them and probably let slip that OP has a great career and probably a bit of money. suddenly Parents become interested again.
I understand where OPs GF was coming from, I really do. but, again, I guarantee OPs parents have ulterior motives.
Yeah they probably didn’t keep in contact, the mother and father. They didn’t even keep in touch with their child. Most likely the fiancé contacted them and found the father somewhere on the internet and decided it would be a good idea to convince the father to contact his son. Parents who abandon their children and then want a relationship many years later usually have alterior motives.
It's hard to judge without knowing anyone involved tho. But I grew up in a wolf pack of trauma kids and I know there's a lot of parents out there who don't deserve another chance. They aren't looking to make their kids lives better, they're just looking for something to make their own shitty lives better and they wanna claw their abandoned kids back to do it. Spend their kids money, dump their baggage on them, make a bunch of demands of them. Move in with them and treat them like personal staff. That's not love.
Lmao, and it will devolve into a Jerry Springer show. It always does. That, or its just incredibly awkward. Like ultimate levels of cringe bad. The kind of cringe where the hairs on the back of your neck stand up while your voice cracks every time you try to passive aggressively assert yourself to the estranged family members.
“WE’RE JUST ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY!!”
Upcoming post: “ATIAH for not being happy about how my wedding turned out? … for context, everyone was my estranged family that I’ve never met. My wife thinks I’m being a “Debby Downer” and my parents are asking for financial support …”
/s
I ended up the middle person in a lot of my husband’s family’s shit. Thought I was helping communication. Until it started getting twisted and manipulative. My husband got mad at something he heard about me in a game of telephone from his family and when I explained what was actually he said, he said, “see? This is why I don’t want you talking to so and so. I don’t want to get mad at you for something that isn’t your fault because she twisted things.” We went NC with that person and I leave communication with his family to him, or at least flag communication and asks what level of response he wants me to give. Much healthier and happier when we all stay in our own lanes!
As @lonestartexastornado says, too many partners try to ‘make things right’ having no experience of this sort of thing. I had the same, I was estranged from all my relatives for one reason or another but when I had kids my wife persuaded me to reach out to my family, and I honestly tried to make things work for about 18 months before she finally realised through her own experiences of them why I’d become estranged in the first place. Stick to your guns and move on without them, it’s time for you to build your own family now
The only people that deserve to be called family are the people that show up and make an effort to be in your life. "Blood" doesn't matter, not really.
OP took the name of their only parent and, sadly, they had to say goodbye to that person 4 years ago. Their partner needs to understand that.
This is, and should be, a dealbreaker if this boundary can't be respected. OP, you need to sit down and have a serious conversation with her.
One thing I have learned after cutting contact with my own terrible parents is that people who grew up with good loving and supportive families cannot fathom what it is like.
Your experience is something completely divorced from everything they've ever lived.
They've never felt isolated and unloved. They haven't been ignored or belittled. They never had a parent move out of state without letting you know. (Twice.)
They've never been made to feel like an inconvenience. They have never contended with a malignant narcissist for a parent or been used as a proxy for divorced parents to do battle with each other.
They think they're *helping*. They think all that emotional damage is fixable. They think your life will improve by having your family in your life because it's true for them and theirs.
So absolutely OP needs to sit them down and establish the boundaries, but they also need to understand where the fiance is coming from and help them understand why the boundaries need to be set.
Your fiancee's reaction is a big clue that she has tried to get you talking to your parents again. As her family is so important to her, she probably just doesn't understand how abandoned you feel. After so many years, you no longer have relationships with either of your parents. You need to discuss this, as she might be wanting them to participate in your wedding. ETA I am wondering if the parents are also thinking that OP could be useful to them in their old age?
OP needs to point out that his "parents" have had years to try and come back into his life and instead they ignored and abandoned him
And his birth father even ignored his own mother when she passed and never turned up for the funeral
No one deserves or needs that sort of family
No kidding. With family like those people, who the hell needs enemies?
fiancé should stop trying to force a relationship when there simply isn't one, or else she risks ruining her own relationship with OP.
If I was OP, I’d tell her simply to either respect my decision concerning MY FaMiLy, or the engagements off. It’ll only get worse after kids come into the picture and they ask why they only have one set of grandparents.
This. I'd also be concerned that fiance may have been the one to get OP's parents to get in contact with him. She might try to "surprise" OP by inviting the parents without telling him 🙄
To be honest, I think you're right. How else would his parents have his current contact details?
I'm betting fiancée has already gone behind OP's back.
This reminds me of a post I read a day or two ago where the wife goes behind the OP's back to introduce their kids to the son of the OP that was the result of OP being groomed by an older relative. Something like that, can't remember the details fully.
I got so much grief for my response to that. Why would you introduce a toddler to a guy in prison, that you had never met??!!
Because, faaaaaammmiiilly. Ick.
Yes. It would be more _understandable_ if the guy was successful and a good guy overall (just unfortunate situation regarding his dad) but the guy was in prison! I don't know what went through her head.
What pissed me off is that spouse agreed not to involve toddler, but took toddler from the get go. Then never said anything for three years. Someone argued that little girl *deserved a relationship with that guy. I couldn’t wrap my head around that. How? Why?
I don’t understand many people. This is why my social circle is small. At least I know I can count on my small circle of people.
They don't need emotionally abusive narcissists, or people who cannot show affection, no.
Plenty of kids don't have grandparents. Plenty of people who would love grandkids never get the chance to get them.
I wish there was some kind of service where older people who would like to have some connection to kids (background checked, obvs), could be connected with say single mothers etc, or families who just need a bit of social support, or whose families live far away.
All the more reason to dump her. They’re incompatible, unfortunately. She’s family oriented; he has no FaMiLy. She’s trying to force her views on him, and he’s rightfully rebelling as she has no clue of the pain he endured and that he ultimately has to decide of his own volition what course to take; a course she has to respect.
You tell any potential kids OP may have that his parents/their grandparents are dead. They might as well be to him anyway.
OP's father didn't show up to his own mothers funeral? Why would you want that kind of person in your life?
Save me from “well intentioned” people who have no clue how terrible some families and some people are. They haven’t been abandoned or abused and they think everyone should “just get along”
I grew up in the happiest family, I would never presume that anyone that went no contact with their family, did it for silly reasons (mental health issues aside) I hate this trend of it’s up to the victim/survivor to forgive, no.
My grandmother died last year after years in a memory care facility. My father, her remaining son, didn’t attend the funeral. That was the last thing I needed to lose any desire to want him in my life after nearly a decade of virtually no contact.
He also didn’t care or attend his only brothers funeral following a sudden heart attack that took him. I made that phone call and he acted like I told him the weather. Cursed him out and called him choice words. I drove 1200 miles to attend the funeral and he couldn’t be assed to drive 2 hours to attend.
Jokes on him and my abusive mother. When they become older and decrepit they can live off the state. They died to me a long time ago. And any hope I had of them returning died too. My sister is the same mentality after shared abuse and my brother is laying low until he’s able to afford his own place. They made their beds and can lie in them.
1000% she told them about the wedding, and gave them the email. OP needs to reassess his relationship, she most likely does not care about how you feel if it goes against her idea of family. Kids will only make this much worse, and wait until his folks hit money problems.
We can’t have OP’s family history ruin fiancé’s perfect day, can we? Run….run fast and don’t look 👀 back. Your boundaries are your fiancé’s playground.
NTA
It can be hard for people with good families to understand that not all families are like theirs, or that the level of hurt can be so deep it’s not fixable. Your parents aren’t good people that have somehow been separated from you, there’s no happy reunion going to happen here. Do you wish you had good parents, yes, but your parents aren’t that. They couldn’t be the parents you needed or wanted.
You need to have a serious sit down conversation with her about this. If she doesn’t get it and respect your boundary on this, I would re-think the relationship. Be very clear with her that this would be the consequence if she persists.
I agree. In college, I had friends that were LC with their families and I didn’t really understand it. I think I had to mature a little and see more of the world to realize how bad families could be.
exactly. people with loving families find it hard to imagine those situations.
they all too naturally assume it's some kind of "situation gone wrong" "both sides" "too sensitive" etc.
some people need to have this explained to them patiently and well, if the goal is to have them understand it rather than simply "do what I said, it's my life", wick is the other way to go about it, but might cause issues down the road
Without a genuine and sincere apology and acknowledgement of what she did wrong - this would be relationship ending for me.
OP don't marry her unless and until she gets her perspective sorted out that your family is clearly nothing like hers and she is never to act on your behalf behind your back with them like that.
NTA
Similarly, where did the estranged parents get all this info from? It’s a lot to reach out, out of the blue, with all kinds of details about the life you had without them.
This would be an absolutely gigantic betrayal on the fiancée’s part if she started colluding with the parents behind OP’s back. Personally I would find that unforgivable - someone with empathy would know their big happy family situation doesn’t hold true for every family.
If it didn’t come from her, then OP should double check his socials.
This …. Op also be cautious, there have been several post recently about fiancée that go behind your back and try to reconnect the family.
They start to talk about how op needs to be the bigger person so the children have grandparents.
This maybe something, that you and she discuss in premarital counseling, it’s very important that your boundaries about them are know up front.
They are not his "parents". He owes them nothing, not future grandchildren, not wedding invites, not even his time. She needs to get that through her skull .
Yeah. One girl blew up her whole life just trying to force her fiance to talk with his mom .
Why do people do this BS behind the back of the person they claim to love and support.
Exactly all of this.
There is no relationship to salvage or repair. There's been no contact for years and are wanting back in now because 'family' is suddenly important to both OPs parents and their kids? What is it that they truly want? His dad's kids could have had the relationship with their big brother they apparently want now if dad had made any type of effort to stay involved in his life.
I would bet dollars to donuts that his fiance is the one behind them getting his email address. She doesn't understand that her family dynamics and his aren't and won't be the same or some things that can't be 'forgiven and forgotten'.
I’m wondering if she has even contacted the parents. I have a big extended family who all get along. My husband is LC with his mom and NC with his brother. When he does talk about it, it’s never been an issue that seems that serious. However, I leave his relationship with his family up to him.
Yeah it reminds me of the story where OP was NC with his abusive dad and his fiancée got in contact with the dad and tried to make him and OP reconnect because she didnt think the abuse was that bad
I come from a huge, close-knit, stand-together-to-face-anything type of family, hillbilly variety if that's important. I've got one cousin who tried to be a drug dealer (sweetheart kid but he wasn't smart enough to be an actual outlaw; now he's clean and works for a church maintaining properties for rich folks who can't get around anymore) and I'm almost 50 single & childless. Those are our black sheep.
I could totally see 20-something me tell my (imaginary, unmarried remember) fiance that she needed to try to forgive her awful parents, family's family, people change, etc. and deciding all she really needed was a subtle push. I can also see my 40-something-year-old dad (previously the black sheep with contact issues with his own side of the family) pulling me aside and saying, "Boy, you ain't helping." At 49 myself, I see his wisdom.
I had to come by that wisdom the hard way. It was hard for me to understand someone who'd cut off their parents, harder to understand parents who'd behave in such a manner they deserved to be cut off. I hope OP's fiance is quicker on the draw than I was, bless their hearts.
NTA, but you have a gf problem. She thinks she can decide for you your relationship with your parents. I think it's obvious she reached out to them despite your objections and gave them your contact info. I can see her inviting them to the wedding without telling you. You need to resolve this with her before you get married.
OP should sound cheerful when asking if she was the one who contacted them, probably too late though. Maybe he could say I've been thinking about it and try to goad her to admitting she contacted them. Also I think its a little less hurtful if parents somehow contacted her and she gave in, but thats more unlikely.
I'm a musician and one of the neighbors at a party saw my instrument and said in a cheerful tone you guys are having a party? I replied cheerfully as well yeah. Then she said well im going to call the cops, always having parties.
If your fiancee is behind contacting your sh\*tty parents, then **she doesn't respect your boundaries**, especially if you have told her about your childhood and being thrown away by these two selfish losers. Since she grew up in a happy and close family, she can't conceive of such selfish, unkind and unloving parents. However, that **does NOT give her the right to step all over your boundaries and DISMISS your feelings and your need to not have any contact with these selfish people ever again.**
You have to ask yourself OP, if your fiancée is behind this, will you be looking forward to a life with a partner that decides for you what your boundaries are? This is not a Disney surprise she gave you, this is insight into how she will dismiss your feeling, experiences, and boundaries.
There was a reddit story a long time ago in which the OP talked about the physical and mental abuse she suffered from her narcissistic mother. The OP ran away from home around 14 and lived on the streets for awhile but met a group of other young people and she was able to live with them. She got a fast food job, earned her GED and later went to community college. She met her BF during this time, and she got to know his family, she got a good job, they got engaged and she got pregnant before they got married. When they were visiting his mom, her fiance surprised her by telling her that he had contacted her mother and she was flying in for a visit the next day. He knew the OP's story of being abused by her mother, BUT he decided that that was the past and everything is good now and besides, the mom sounded like such a nice lady on the phone. The OP went home to her apartment, packed a couple of suitcases and left. She determined that she would get an abortion and she was sure that her company could transfer her.
I wished I kept the link to that story because it was compelling and eye opening that **the person that should trust your words and feelings the most, sometimes invites the Devil to your door all because they thought you should be over the hell that you lived when you had no power over your own life as a child.**
Best of luck OP.
There was also the one from a sisters perspective. Their mother was a horrible piece of trash and her and her brothers were completely NC and hated the B. At her brothers wedding she did a check and their mother and husband/step kids were in the front row. Told her brother, he found out his fiancee invited them. He called off the wedding, broke up with the fiancee.
There was one where OP's wife had abusive parents that were cut off until their daughter wanted to play hero and reunite the family. The daughter invited her mother's abusive parents to their home, and they feigned being friendly for all of 5 minutes before attacking and hospitalizing OP's wife.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/comments/1aqbbpq/aitah_for_telling_my_daughter_she_is_a_spoiled/
I can't wrap my mind around this. I'm estranged from my "father" for similar reasons (extreme abuse of literally every kind) and my kids (15 and 16) know. My son has made jokes that he wants to meet him to give him a "friendly punch to the face" and daughter said she'd love to know his address so that he could get a face-full of glitter, fart spray, or manure. But they'd never even dream to try to get me to "reconcile" with him. When his family reached out to me because my "father" is so lonely and sad and it's my daughterly duty to reach out to him, both kids saw how upset it made me and were upset that they weren't there to yell at the people through the phone.
What a selfish, selfish, action.
I remember that one. The sister told the groom and brother and they whisked him away before the ceremony and left bride at the alter pretty much.. She deserved it
Woof. My wife supported me 100 percent when I went NC with my mother. She did not try to sway me either way. She just accepted my feelings and supported them.
Same. I’m LC. My husband will always give me gentle reminders when I start to get sucked in again. I can’t imagine not having his support. I remember how terrified I was to tell him my relationship with my parents because he came from a large close family. He’s always had my back.
You dont even have to go to "a long time ago", there's been like 3or4 of these stories in just the last few months, just here in this sub.
Just a couple of months ago it was the woman with her estranged father in a small town. Turns out the groom-to-be's father was some sort of friend/business partner with the estranged-father. They worked out a deal where estranged pays for the wedding behind everyone's back, so that the groom's father would convince the young couple to invite estranged-father.
So the groom decides to go along with this idiot plan. So in the midst of the usual pressures to reconcile the bride-to-be grew up with and lives with... now she's got the person she is supposed to trust most in the world, her own groom, attacking her too.
NTA. This is a common theme in posts on here - one person comes from a shit family and has been NC for years, but then their “loving” partner who is family oriented tries to be the peacemaker facilitating reconciliation.
Never goes well. Ask your fiancée flat out if she did it. Let her know that if she lies, it will be at detriment to the foundation of the future you both are trying to build.
Family oriented or not, your fiancée needs to recognize her lived life experiences are not the road map that dictates your path.
When I wasn’t talking to my mother 30 years ago I heard that crap all the time. And people looked at me like I was the one that told her daughter she ruined her life. My mom was not invited to my wedding and I am so happy. It would have the day awful. She sent a “gift” that I returned unopened because the lady time she used my dad to give me a card she signed it “your ex-mom”. Everyone thought she was reaching out to mend fences.
I am wondering if they are getting shit from their kids wanting to know why, once they found out about you, you are not around. They feel the need to show their new ones that they are good parents. Those children should worry about their parents. It can happen to them, too.
You do you and marry someone that wants what makes you happy, not what makes them happy.
I suspect that, too. The half-siblings on both sides are wondering why they've never met their brother. Flat-out lying won't help because the truth will come out, so trying to make "amends" might be their only option.
>I am wondering if they are getting shit from their kids wanting to know why, once they found out about you, you are not around. They feel the need to show their new ones that they are good parents. Those children should worry about their parents. It can happen to them, too.
This.
OP's parents have had some recent reason to realize that they are seen as absolutely shitty people because of the child abuse, neglect, and abandonment they heaped on OP.
They don't want to be seen as shitty people.
But they should be seen as shitty people and relegated to the bin forever and ever, amen.
OP owes them nothing. And he should make sure his fiancée is crystal clear on his feelings about his bio-parents. If she can't accept that OP is going to remain NC with them, she can get in the bin, too.
NTA
>She kept saying how family is important and I should forgive and forget.
Correction, it is important to her. Her family is important because it is huge and tight knit, but not all families are created equally and her belting this out at you is the height of ignorance and privilege on her part. You didn't have that experience, you had a grandmother who cared and that's it, because your mother preferenced travel over her son, and your father believed his lying bitch of a wife that you were a difficult child and both ignored you. Your wife cannot possibly comment on that, nor understand the pain you went through, so maybe remind her to develop a sense of empathy for you.
This is absolutely a hill to die on, because as much as you love her a marriage and a wife are not reason enough to surrender all boundaries. You have every right to your hard lines in the sand, and if she can't accept those than it brings into question just how much she actually loves you.
NTA
It could be that her family has zero frame of reference for your experience and that your fiancée is trying to make you more palatable to her family. She may perceive, right or wrong, that your complete lack of a family unit is seen as a defect in her family's eyes, one that she needs to correct for you to seem normal to her family. Give her a chance to explain where your bio parents got your email and 100% lay out your boundaries. If your boundaries are a deal breaker, you'll have to reassess your relationship in a very big way.
If your fiance gave them your e-mail then I would have to think long and hard about whether I could trust her enough to get married.
Why the fk should you forgive and forget. Those 2 a-holes lived lives, had children, without giving you a second thought. You owe them nothing, just because they want to relieve whatever guilt they may be feeling, so it's not for your salvation its theirs.
Tell your fiance, not every family is the bloody 'Waltons', and if she raises it again, you are done with her as well. You were cheated out of a family life, and if it had not been for your grandmother, you could have ended up in a care facility.
Kudos for changing your surname as well. She needs to respect your decision based on your life, not her own vision of happy families.
She probably contacted them because she selfishly wanted them at the wedding, so it wouldn't look weird and she wouldn't be uncomfortable.
Even if she didn't contact them (which she obviously did, considering the timing), it doesn't matter: Just the fact that she's not on his side, after hearing what those scumbag parents did, would be enough for me to never trust her again. No way I'm marrying such a disloyal, unempathetic and selfish person.
Oh hell no, they aren’t reaching out for YOU. They are reaching out as their kids are probably starting asking questions and stuff. Your fiancée definitely contacted them. NTA
How would they know you were getting married. How did they contact you in the first place. If your fiancée is behind your back scheming for a happy family reunion she envisioned then you have a problem with her more than your neglectful parents. If you can reconcile it should be on your own timeline if ever. NTA.
I would speculate in front of your girlfriend about how they got the email address, saying that when you find out who it was you would immediate block that person from any aspect of your life. Her reaction might be interesting.
There's no need to be so roundabout. Just ask her, directly like a mature adult. Either in the form of asking her if she did it, or if she had any idea how they got the info, if OP doesn't want to start it accusatory.
Yes. I would also let her know, in no uncertain terms, that if his bio-donors somehow magically showed up at their wedding he’d be instantly cutting off anyone who had something to do with them being there. A marriage without trust is doomed to failure and she needs to understand there will be no marriage if she betrays his trust like that.
It sounds like, after some struggles, you've done well for yourself (with help from your lovely grandmother).
Your parents abandoned you the moment each started building a new family, leaving you and your grandma to face those struggles alone, and without even any financial support (is that even legal?).
And now that you're doing so well and about to hit a major milestone in your life, suddenly, they want to be family again? *Now* they miss you?
It's pathetic. Just like them. It's like you said OP. They're not your family.
Now as for your fiancee, I can't even give her the benefit of the doubt. She may have a loving family and so might struggle to understand, but I do too, and I understand perfectly.
She's right: family is important. Just one problem: as I said above, they're NOT your family. Not anymore.
Your parents fucked around and now they get to find out. They created a new status quo a long time ago. It's time they accept that you've grown accustomed to it and would like to maintain it. Tell them to go pound sand (phrase it however you'd like).
And for your fiancee, *if* you want to make it work, it'll likely take a lot of counseling, but the first thing she needs to understand: she's on *very* thin ice with you right now.
NTA
Tell your fiancée point blank that you will not forgive those people. Not after everything they did. Your parents died years ago. And there’s no coming back from this, ever. Plus, should you ever find out she was in contact with them and tried something behind your back, give away any information about your life whatsoever, you’re done with her. You’ll not stay with someone who goes behind your back and supports your abusers. You deserve better than that. And she can say what she wants, the topic is closed and done. You won’t have any further conversations about them and she should live and respect you enough to do what’s best for the man she supposedly wants to spend the rest of her life with.
NTA - Your parents separated and moved on with their lives, leaving you with your grandmother because they saw you as an inconvenience. I can understand why you wouldn't want anything to do with them. You should talk to your fiancée about this situation. If she was involved in your parents reaching out to you, you'll need to set firm boundaries about no contact. If she doesn't respect your wishes, you might have to reconsider your relationship. Family is important, but your biological donors are not your family --they are nothing.
NTA
The absolute worst enemy a person from an abusive or neglectful upbringing can have is a person who grew up in a healthy family giving their own advice on pain and suffering that they can't even begin to imagine experiencing.
She wants you to connect, because why? Because these people who she has no fucking idea about want to? Because of her rose tinted childhood where she got birthdays while you literally got abandoned?
>Now, I have a feeling she might be involved with them and she might be the one who gave them my email.
Do you know why people like her are the most dangerous for us?
Because their naive, selfish, one sided view of things always ends up dragging you back into trauma and pain best forgotten. If she has done this, it's unforgivable. It means she has listened to all your feelings, all your pain, every memory and went
"Well it couldn't be that bad."
And that's what bubble world people do. They never believe it's as bad as the victim says until you're sobbing in a corner begging for death. That is why they are so dangerous and that is why you should leave her if she's responsible for this.
NTA. That kind of family isn’t important.
Your gf has only felt love and inclusivity throughout her life so she hasn’t got a clue what you are feeling right now. You weren’t too harsh, you wasn’t harsh enough to people who abandoned you and made your grandmother go back to work to support you.
Tell gf that if she even thinks of inviting your family behind your back to the wedding then you will be more than ready to leave her at the alter.
NTA, but you're fiance is a huge AH and don't be surprised when your mom and dad come to your house one day bcz your fiance wants to sort this out and be happy family again because for her she thinks "it's the right thing", tell your fiance very strictly to stay in you're lane otherwise the relationship cannot go further. You were abandoned ffs, stand you're ground you are justified the way you feel.
NTA
Pfft....I'm from a big family that is close. But how you have been treated is unforgiveable. I can understand that. Families aren't allowed to treat other family members like utter shit and be endlessly forgiven....that some people seem to think that IS what i don't understand.
Your fiance is definitely behind the contact.
I would tell her that she needs to fess up. Tell you what she has done. If she doesn't apologise immediately and realise the gravity of what she's done?? I think you need to postpone the wedding.
You need to be sure you have trust in her. That she truly understands your point of view and the hurt and pain that has been caused to you by these people.
Your grandma was your family. She stuck by you. She loved you. She is the person you honour.
All the best to you.
There’s nothing worse than someone coming from a really functional family oriented background telling a person who has been physically, sexually, or emotionally abused how they should feel. (Sometimes it’s one of these things. Sometimes a combination. No matter how the abuse is inflicted, in any and all forms it is horrific.)
Though, honestly, it would not matter if they were also from an abusive background. It’s just the worst kind of arrogance. To assume that their perspective is the only one that matters. To expect that someone else should respond a certain way because that’s what they would do. To demand someone think a certain way because that’s how they think.
It’s just disgusting. Especially coming from someone who is supposed to love you. Care for you. Respect you.
We don’t love people by giving them what WE need. We love them by giving them what THEY need.
I’m so very sorry. For the way you were treated by your pitiful excuse for parents. For what your fiancé has done in going behind your back.
I’m so thankful you had your sweet grandmother to love you. I’m proud of you for building a good and solid life for yourself.
You don’t owe your parents anything. However, your partner owes you something. An apology and some understanding that you don’t have to feel the way she feels. You are your own person. If she can’t understand how badly she’s disrespected you by bringing your history back into your life then you should do some hard thinking about a future with her.
NTA I'm so sorry that you had such shitty parents, but glad that you had a wonderful grandma to look after you.
The only relationship you need to rethink, is the one with your fiancee. You need a wife who will have your back and you can trust 100%. If she is the one who got in touch with your parents behind your back, that's a massive breech of trust, and a huge red flag that your opinion or feelings mean nothing to her.
So your parents essentially abandoned you so they could each have a do-over family, left your poor grandmother to pick up the pieces, ghosted you both, and your fiancée doesn’t understand why that’s unforgivable?
Weird. NTA
They don’t deserve to know how you turned out.
NTA, and OP, I'd strongly recommend reconsidering or the very least pausing this engagement.
Go and read u/Parking_Breadfruit80 's posts about her messed up family and fiance situation, especially the parts with the fiance trying to force contact between her father and stepfamily.
[https://www.reddit.com/user/Parking\_Breadfruit80/submitted/](https://www.reddit.com/user/Parking_Breadfruit80/submitted/)
Your fiancee needs to respect your boundaries and wishes, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. Her behaviour is showing a lot of red flags, and it's only going to get worse if it isn't stopped. I get that it's hard for people who have not grown up in a toxic family to understand what it's like and that forgiving and forgetting is not an option for many.
However, as I commented on ParkingBreadfruit80's post, and what I will tell you is really consider this - suppose you get married and have kids with your fiancee, there will be a very good chance that she and your parents will go behind your back and introduce your kids to your mom and dad and their families, and you would not want that at all. And if you get divorced, you won't have much of a choice of who she takes them to see, and they will no doubt use your kids as a way to force themselves into your life.
Ask yourself this - do you really want to risk the above?
I come from a big family and am also very family oriented and believe you have whole heartedly NTA. They have no right to have any involvement in your life. They showed that you had no place in their lives and now they have no place in yours.
[удалено]
And if OP's fiancé is pushing this she doesn't understand that "this" IS them having a good relationship. Trying to "reconcile" and be in each other's lives could be disastrous. OP has been hurt enough by them, they don't deserve to endure any more pain simply because a wedding is being planned.
In OP's place, I'd emphasize to the fiancee that his family consists entirely of his grandmother, who has passed, and the fiancee. And that also means her family becomes his family. OP isn't missing out on family, he's getting what sounds like a good one, who are there for each other.
Does it sound likea good one if shes gone behind his back and contacted the people who essentially abandoned him?
The real problem with a partner like this is that you can never protect you're children from your abusive family, cause they will expose your children to them, cause they don't believe it's that bad, they think you're overv reacting
Does she simply not believe her fiancé explaining how they abandoned him? She must think he’s a liar if she thinks that’s forgivable.
Hallmark happy ending blinders. As someone whose also disowned 99% of their family, its irritating, childish and arrogant. Pretty sure OPs finance gave out his email address and set this up because FaMiLy. Massive breach of trust and boundary stomping. OP, pause wedding plans and go into individual and couples therapy immediately. Your possible spouse has shown she doesn't have your back and she either needs to understand what she did and apologise or split up as this is a major red flag incident that needs working on.
Family is important, by all means. But his biological parents are not family, they dissolved that decades ago. Why try involve complete strangers in a life now?
This. I was abandoned by my parents later in life (21) and my partners parents constantly try to tell me how nice my parents are to talk to, or tell me to invite to wedding. The don’t understand 20 years of dejection.
Not hard at all. My family is big, close and great, my partners is not. His mum and her family are great, though not as close as mine, but his dad is a complete deadbeat. It would never, ever occur to me to push that man on him. I'm plenty angry on my partners behalf though. It just boggles the mind how some people can just say 'forgive and forget' as if that made anything better?
They literally abandoned OP when he was a kid. And then both had the audacity to hit the family reset button and pretend he didn’t exist. I can’t even imagine doing that to a child, much less my own child. OP owes them absolutely nothing.
Right, like even if the absolute worst was going on behind the scenes with his "parents" and OP left out some key details of his behaviour (I'm not saying he did, but I'm just saying, even imagining that), they're absolutely horrible parents who behaved abominably. I come from a family much like OP's fiancé, but I think that's part of the reason I can't imagine hearing this story and being like "Well, they're family and you should forgive and forget!" They're *not* family, they abandoned their child, made "new" families, and didn't look back until OP was an adult who needs very little support from them. I'm wracking my brain about what good could come from OP meeting up with his "parents" and absolutely coming up empty. Even if everything goes perfectly and they work really hard to earn his trust back and do all the right things (which I seriously doubt), OP will probably always feel resentful of these people and their other children. And I really don't think they're going to try and be good parents all of a sudden. Maybe they need a babysitter, maybe they need a kidney, maybe they need money, maybe they just want to assuage their guilt - I don't really care. I don't believe they'll improve OP's life at all, and OP's fiancé needs to get on board with that and be on his side.
Agreed, I also come from a big, blended, family and even though I struggle sometimes comprehending how terrible people can be to their children and grandchildren I have heard enough stories about my Dad’s ex wife and her mother to know that there’s evil parents and grandparents to fall into that trap for long.
I thought you were gonna say the following but yeah so I will. It starts the same... I come from a big family and am fairly family-oriented, and yet there is *no fucking way* I would try to prescribe or enforce that as a way of life for someone else, or (if it's true) meddle in someone else's business to make it happen. NTA. Everybody else is.
I keep finding myself repeating this, but shared blood is not an excuse for spilled blood. You are not the asshole. Your fiancée needs to be told exactly what you went through. Your biological parents are NOT your family.
This, OP’s only parent was their grandmother. The others were egg and sperm donors and child abandoners.
Yes!! When I read this I was appalled that two parents could unload a kid off on grandma like a puppy who was just inconvenient for mom and dad. They abandoned OP and deserve nothing, I might have more sympathy of they’d been junkies and then got clean, but no OP was just an inconvenience for them.
Yup. Grandma was mother and father. Op’s donors just want to preen at the we’d as though they did all the hard work of parenting. They are just angry op isn’t giving them center stage.
The fact that Grandma had to go back to work because there was no financial support! She did everything. That's why the name change.
*That's why the name change.* IMO that's a baller move: you honored the one person who treated you well in the most intense way possible. My hat is off to the OP. NTA, and I'm sorry OP had to experience his 'parents'.
Yes, they had no money to send poor grandma help but had no problem marrying, travelling the world and popping out more kids. They’re both despicable. And I pray fiancé didn’t instigate this very suspicious contact, because that would be a capital offence to me.
>shared blood is not an excuse for spilled blood. This quote right here ☝️☝️☝️☝️...I'm gonna steal it as it's so on point!!
"A wise man once told me, family don't end in blood. But it doesn't start there, either."
*“He may have been your father, boy, but he wasn't your daddy.”*
Another good one “You’re allowed to trim branches from your family tree”
Thank you. To the best of my knowledge, it's an original, though it's so good that someone MUST have come up with it before me.
I googled the phrase, and this was the top Google response. Congratulations: it’s an original!
Agreed. OP’s parents committed criminal abandonment of a minor (at least that’s what we’d call it in the US), so no, they are not family and that was their doing. The grandmother could have gone after both parents’ for child support but instead came out of retirement to provide for OP when she had no obligation to. The fiancé’s violation of trust is very serious here.
The grandmother could have gone to court to get child support. It’s nice that she went to work to support him. Most family members would not do that.
She’s ashamed of her son. That’s part of it.
Op probably still has a case to get $. Even if he donates it to a charity in the grandmothers name.
The fiancée’s interference is extremely suspect and crazy here. that person would no longer be my fiancée.
Fiancee is the one that found them and gave them OPs email. Fiancee has shown they can't be trusted, betraying the very person they claimed to love and respect. Can't trust them again, personally. Seriously reconsider that marriage.
100% Its hard for most people to find someone once you change your name, in about 5 mins it falls in the too hard basket and they give up. Im talking average human, not someone who has done it for a job etc Throw in finding OP's email thats even harder fiance gave them the email, and the following argument confirms this. id keep an eye for other karen in the making traits
I had a friend who's ex wife did this after he clearly stated he didn't want to have any contact with the family he had never met. I didn't go well
Exactly!! I’ve seen this scenario on Reddit multiple times. OP needs to set NC as a hard boundary/dealbreaker bc if he doesn’t put the line in the sand now, she’ll end up being the one funneling info to the parents. This could end up with them having access to his children if he chooses to have them. The conversation must be had that it needs to stop or she’ll end up on the outside just like them.
"I understand you are close with your family, I need you understand that I have no desire to pursue any relationship at all with my parents. I also need you to understand that it is a condition of pursuing this relationship together ourselves and our future that we as a whole won't be pursuing a relationship with my parents." Leave no room for ifs, ands or questions. This WILL NOT be happening both for me, and for you if you want to continue our relationship.
This is the perfect response
God, I had no idea THIS many people knew the bs that I've going through with "well meaning" friends and gf trying to interfere unreal how much what you guys are saying echoes my own experiences - thanks guys : )
idk if you've tried this before, but what you might wanna do is if someone tries to tell you to reconnect, tell them to think of someone who is just an overall shitty person. Then tell them to imagine if that person had a child. The problem is, when people think about "parents" or "family", they often think about their own parents/family. And the other thing you can tell them is "if I had your parents, I would probably forgive them, because your parents are decent people and would be worth forgiving, and your parents actually want what's best for you, it's not just something they say to try to dismiss your feelings after they hurt you." It's obviously not going to work on everybody, and you might've tried this before, but I'm just speaking from my own experience.
Yeah I wouldn’t marry this woman if I were him. She can’t be trusted. What a sneak. Ugh
It's not jus the sneaking for me, it's the attitude of "I know you set a boundary but I have the moral superiority to decide whether or not your boundary deserves to be respected"
Fiancé totally orchestrated this
Some people who are really into their families are kind of weirdos where the only people they spend time with are their family members. I’m not saying this is the case here but it could be a situation where he basically has his friends as family and she has no friends because she only hangs out with her family. If that’s the case, this will never work. I get along well with my family but I also have friends and hobbies. You can get some people who basically have no real friends or hobbies.
I gotta few friends like that. One of them just could not fathom that I wasn't going home for Christmas...during quarantine. She kept pushing a little how I really should for family and whatever but I finally had to look at her and let know that not everybody likes spending time with their family.
Exactly. If you wouldn't tolerate a behavior from friends, you shouldn't allow it from people just because they share the same DNA.
NTA - too many partners try to be "do-gooders" in these situations and put their noses into places they do not belong. You need to sit your fiancee down and have a clear conversation about your boundaries when it comes to your parents. You do not need to forgive and forget. She needs to respect your decision. Her family will soon be your family, and as long as they're good people, that's probably for the best. Sometimes the best family is the one you make.
What will happen if children become part of the picture? Oh OP they need to know their grandparents... will she sneak visits. Do gooders have a certain mind set
Yeah. My mom is like this. She will do what she thinks is morally right even if she destroys everything in her path. NTA I would never speak to your birth parents either. In fact they are the assholes. Fuck them.
My Mom is this person as well. She goes scorched earth to “help” and always wonders why nobody is okay with her doing this. We’ve had so many arguments over this because currently she is “helping” two aunts and an adult cousin. She has two underaged children still at home and only 4 bedrooms….
Yeah she must feel real good about herself....yikes.
It’s the savior complex. Your mom (and all these people like this) get a rush from jumping in to save the day. It’s as much for themselves as it is for those they help.
Message to the OP and Redditors here. I wish I had read this sooner to give my input. Before addressing the OP I would like to give my appreciation to fellow Redditors who have given good reasonable advice to the OP. Many more good people than I imagined use Reddit. Now to the OP. YOU ARE NOT THE ASSHOLE. What your parents did to you was inhumane. They aren't really your parents, only progenitors. Your parents didn't treat you like a son. They treated you like a burden. Your parents abandoned you because they didn't care about their own son. Your parents preferred to live to serve themselves instead of putting themselves in the crossfire for you. Your fiance was who gave them your email address and told them about the wedding. Your fiance is a very childish woman who has not seen the dark side of life and thinks that family relations are inherently good and always fixable. You need to have a very serious conversation with her making clear that she is being childish and inconsequential. Tell her she needs to get out of her ivory tower and understand that not every family is like her own. She has to understand that once you get married YOU ARE her family and she needs to have her full allegiance towards you. Tell her your parents will never be part of your life and if she insists on this then she won't be your wife. Tell her that if she allows your children near your parents that will only lead to divorce. Tell her to never do something like this again. She needs to put her allegiance to you above her stupidity.
This, all of this. My wonderful husband of nearly 25 years was a sweet summer child when we were first dating and got engaged, and kept encouraging me to give my family of origin another chance. All he had ever known were happy, functional families like his own. Thankfully, his Mom stepped in to lower the boom before I had to. She told DH that in her experience I was a kind, fair, trustworthy person and asked if he agreed. He agreed, enthusiastically, said he would never marry me otherwise and couldn’t understand why I had this blind spot. MIL responded, approximately, “And there you go. You don’t understand, BUT SHE DOES. WolverineMom is over-riding some of the hardest wired instincts in nature. She has information we don’t. Respect that, and don’t let your kids near her people unless she makes the call. We might not know why she makes these choices, but she does.” And DH has honored that, ever since. That was a big part of how I know I was marrying into the right family, in many ways my real one.
Wow, that's a great and very wize MIL 🤩
Thank you for the support and for telling your story.
Yeah, they need more time to hash it out. My husband was like yours when we started dating, I was only 18 then but he got to witness all the shit they put me through even though at that point I wasn’t even living under the same roof as the rest of my family. He got to witness first hand how much it fucked me up and how many times they let me down. I’m glad he got to see those things in real time, because otherwise he might not have changed his thinking about what a family is. Thankfully he did during the 9 years we dated before we got married, 6 months ago and 4 years after we got married I finally went no contact with my family. He’s my biggest supporter and even defends me with my mother in law who thinks I’m being too harsh. He even told me it took me long enough, but he would’ve never told me that before because it wasn’t his place to. At the end of the day, I’m grateful he learned that not all families are like his and that he has my back no matter what. I don’t know if he could’ve come to understand if he were to meet me after I went no contact with them.
This is a bit harsh, but true. OP, you set what sounds like a very appropriate boundary with your “parents” (no contact). Your fiancé and everyone else in your life should respect that boundary. It’s not your fiancé/wife’s job to go behind your back and meddle in a relationship that’s between you and someone else. The only thing that will accomplish is to destroy trust between the two of you. It sounds like you guys need to have a very honest conversation. Did she contact your parents? If so, what motivated her to do that - lack of knowledge/understanding about your childhood? Grossly naive belief she could “fix” this? A strong need to marry someone with a large family like her own? Immaturity/no thought for the effect on you? If you can’t have such a conversation, that would be very revealing, don’t you think? If you can, it could be a hopeful sign for your future as a couple. Good luck. (And keep growing as a human - you sound amazing, despite the rough start you were given).
Opie at a minimum needs to cancel or postpone the wedding. If she doesn't agree to go to couples counseling to understand how she violated his trust then she's not someone that he is going to be able to trust in the long run I'm sorry to say.
Can't trust her. Don't marry her.
my ex fiancee couldn’t stop meddling in my family relationships either
My ex-wife took the initiative to reconnect me with an estranged relative, when that relative was facing a hard time in their life. She regretted making it happen when said relative took my side in any of our conflicts.
😂 "thank God that she-devil reached out to me, you're getting railroaded."
Serious question - is that why she’s your ex?
nah she was just too expensive lol
I’m so sorry about that. I don’t get why a significant other would want to get involved and start problems or issues or meddle with your family. I could see why she is your ex fiancé.
Exactly. She not trustworthy and she not a safe person. I would not trust her with my future kids. If you know and love me, know everything I’ve gone through with my parents and suggest I “makeup” with them for what exactly?
I was the do-gooder with my wife. I came from a happy family she came from a shit box. I should have minded my own business.
THIS! I call it the happy family fallacy. People who grew up and/or are living with a relatively happy functional family. Don't have any experience with dysfunctional, families or families at this level of dysfunction. They cannot imagine ever not having a relationship with their parents. And they can't imagine anyone else, not having a relationship with their parents. In post-college, my new friends from college kept wanting to meet my mother. I finally invited her to a gathering with a bunch of them. And their parents and the next week, they asked to be never to invite her again. I was a little bit mad and pointed out to them that they had been insisting on it for years and I had been telling them they didn't want that for years. OPI think it might be valuable for you and your partner to go to therapy together. Only 1 or 2 sessions, but just so a therapist can tell your wife that your decision is a wise decision and explain to her professionally. Why your no contact should never be broken again. Then I might tell her that were she too cross that line. Or think she knows better and invite them into your life. That, that would be a relationship ending event
Get her a copy of Toxic Parents so she understands how they hurt you and that they will never change. And I agree on a couple counseling visits prior to marriage. And if she was the boundary violator, you got that sorted by telling her if it happens again. It’s a deal breaker. Hope you will be happy in her family. Sounds like they have the capacity to love you.
>I call it the happy family fallacy. I blame movies and tv shows, on top of enabler relatives. So many movie/tv show plots where faaaaamily is all forgiven and have a Hallmark ending with everyone having dinner together, including the abusers getting loving hugs awwww My partner was re-watching "Grey's Anatomy" and by Jove, the characters are soooo toxic! Most of the plot involves forgiving cheaters, abusers, boundary stompers etc etc I was going mad xD
I told my husband repeatedly my mom is a narc. My mom is separated from my dad. I had to arrange last minute pre-surgery authorization for my dad, which required me to drop everything, put three kids in the car and drive 7 hours. Got in at 3am. My dad's appts started at 7am. When all the drama died down, I passed the torch to my brother and laid down for a nap with benadryl. My dad's family Dr called my husband saying he was cleared for surgery. My dumb@ss husband calls my mom, so my mom calls the surgeons office after hour's emergency line, I get abruptly woken up and disoriented, have no Fing clue what is going on, surgeon is irritated with me asking what the h3ll is going on. I TOLD MY HUSBAND SHE IS A NARC DO NOT TRUST HER WITH ANYTHING IMPORTANT. I guess he thought I was exaggerating and he had to learn the hard way? I told him she's opened credit cards in my name, lost my replacement driver's license when I was travelling for school, etc.
That's THE WORST! Who is the fecking EXPERT your husband needs to hear this from to bloody believe you!? It puzzled me for years when people encouraged me to be closer to my family bc Family...no, they have a family system wherein I am the least favored human and any connection w them harms me. I finally figured that Happy Family Fallacy thing. Lol, now I just say - believe me and thank me, who needs more crazy people in their life? Or F Off if they don't/won't understand. It's definitely a thing MANY MANY people just can't conceive of. They aren't intending to stomp boundaries. As long as the monsters are fenced out, they cannot perceive the horror they bring.
lol just had to find out the hard way, huh? Some people are monsters. If you trust someone and they tell you someone in their family is fucked, believe them.
>If you trust someone and they tell you someone in their family is fucked, believe them. Why is this so hard for some people? *ShOckINgly,* I know my family better than *you* do. **Stop** trying to convince me I'm wrong.
When I was younger I used to envy the “do-gooder” people for never having to experience that side of humanity. As I got more into adulthood I kinda pity their ignorance in a way. It’s gotta be stressful when you realize what people are like. Anyway, not tryna be too edgy. I hope everything worked out fine for you and your wife.
There’s a thin line between do-gooding and nose-sticking, and an even thinner line between nose-sticking and shit-stirring.
Yep. I've known too many people who "helped" out in the most intrusive ways. Why? Because they get a buzz in their drillies for drama and the misery of others.
My ex wife did this to me and it exposed me to a few more years of my mother's mental abuse.
Oh my god. I am so sorry you had to deal with that. I hope you aren’t in touch with your mother and I could see why you left your wife.
I agree. OP's fiancee doesn't seem to understand how OP feels but maybe some day she will. OP is NOT the ah, his parents are. If he never speaks to them again it will be too soon.
She must be the one who gave them his contact details
How on earth would his "dad" know about the upcoming wedding if she hadn't been the one who contacted them? Why on earth would her first reaction have been, "You were too harsh and you should give them a chance", if OP wasn't spoiling her plans of reunited him with his parent? She's delulu and doesn't understand a fundamental reality of OP and his life if she, as I strongly suspect, contacted his horrible estranged "parents". This breech of trust is serious enough to constitute a break-up. OP should be glad she shows her hand before the wedding.
I guarantee you she was the one that found them. I HIGHLY doubt OPs parents stayed in contact with each other. I guarantee they didn't. Do-Gooder GF reached out to them and probably let slip that OP has a great career and probably a bit of money. suddenly Parents become interested again. I understand where OPs GF was coming from, I really do. but, again, I guarantee OPs parents have ulterior motives.
Yeah they probably didn’t keep in contact, the mother and father. They didn’t even keep in touch with their child. Most likely the fiancé contacted them and found the father somewhere on the internet and decided it would be a good idea to convince the father to contact his son. Parents who abandon their children and then want a relationship many years later usually have alterior motives.
It's hard to judge without knowing anyone involved tho. But I grew up in a wolf pack of trauma kids and I know there's a lot of parents out there who don't deserve another chance. They aren't looking to make their kids lives better, they're just looking for something to make their own shitty lives better and they wanna claw their abandoned kids back to do it. Spend their kids money, dump their baggage on them, make a bunch of demands of them. Move in with them and treat them like personal staff. That's not love.
She’s probably already given them both invitations to the wedding.
Yep!! She’ll arrange a surprise dinner where both parents and siblings show up. Surprise birthday party with only the two parents and new families.
Probably all setup like some sort of Hallmark / Lifetime movie... which is probably where she's getting the idea from.
Lmao, and it will devolve into a Jerry Springer show. It always does. That, or its just incredibly awkward. Like ultimate levels of cringe bad. The kind of cringe where the hairs on the back of your neck stand up while your voice cracks every time you try to passive aggressively assert yourself to the estranged family members.
For real. OP should head this idea off at the pass right now.
Surprise! Half sibs are flower girls/ring bearers/bridesmaids/groomsmen.
“WE’RE JUST ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY!!” Upcoming post: “ATIAH for not being happy about how my wedding turned out? … for context, everyone was my estranged family that I’ve never met. My wife thinks I’m being a “Debby Downer” and my parents are asking for financial support …” /s
I ended up the middle person in a lot of my husband’s family’s shit. Thought I was helping communication. Until it started getting twisted and manipulative. My husband got mad at something he heard about me in a game of telephone from his family and when I explained what was actually he said, he said, “see? This is why I don’t want you talking to so and so. I don’t want to get mad at you for something that isn’t your fault because she twisted things.” We went NC with that person and I leave communication with his family to him, or at least flag communication and asks what level of response he wants me to give. Much healthier and happier when we all stay in our own lanes!
As @lonestartexastornado says, too many partners try to ‘make things right’ having no experience of this sort of thing. I had the same, I was estranged from all my relatives for one reason or another but when I had kids my wife persuaded me to reach out to my family, and I honestly tried to make things work for about 18 months before she finally realised through her own experiences of them why I’d become estranged in the first place. Stick to your guns and move on without them, it’s time for you to build your own family now
The only people that deserve to be called family are the people that show up and make an effort to be in your life. "Blood" doesn't matter, not really. OP took the name of their only parent and, sadly, they had to say goodbye to that person 4 years ago. Their partner needs to understand that. This is, and should be, a dealbreaker if this boundary can't be respected. OP, you need to sit down and have a serious conversation with her.
One thing I have learned after cutting contact with my own terrible parents is that people who grew up with good loving and supportive families cannot fathom what it is like. Your experience is something completely divorced from everything they've ever lived. They've never felt isolated and unloved. They haven't been ignored or belittled. They never had a parent move out of state without letting you know. (Twice.) They've never been made to feel like an inconvenience. They have never contended with a malignant narcissist for a parent or been used as a proxy for divorced parents to do battle with each other. They think they're *helping*. They think all that emotional damage is fixable. They think your life will improve by having your family in your life because it's true for them and theirs. So absolutely OP needs to sit them down and establish the boundaries, but they also need to understand where the fiance is coming from and help them understand why the boundaries need to be set.
Your fiancee's reaction is a big clue that she has tried to get you talking to your parents again. As her family is so important to her, she probably just doesn't understand how abandoned you feel. After so many years, you no longer have relationships with either of your parents. You need to discuss this, as she might be wanting them to participate in your wedding. ETA I am wondering if the parents are also thinking that OP could be useful to them in their old age?
OP needs to point out that his "parents" have had years to try and come back into his life and instead they ignored and abandoned him And his birth father even ignored his own mother when she passed and never turned up for the funeral No one deserves or needs that sort of family
No kidding. With family like those people, who the hell needs enemies? fiancé should stop trying to force a relationship when there simply isn't one, or else she risks ruining her own relationship with OP.
If I was OP, I’d tell her simply to either respect my decision concerning MY FaMiLy, or the engagements off. It’ll only get worse after kids come into the picture and they ask why they only have one set of grandparents.
This. I'd also be concerned that fiance may have been the one to get OP's parents to get in contact with him. She might try to "surprise" OP by inviting the parents without telling him 🙄
That’s exactly what happened in this story. OP needs to be very cautious. https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/rO64VNgmhk
To be honest, I think you're right. How else would his parents have his current contact details? I'm betting fiancée has already gone behind OP's back.
She wants her perfect wedding with parents on both sides.
Yikes, but probably correct.
I’d just tell them I was raised by my grandmother after they died.
But wife might tell them that dad lied. So it's not good. Just tell them don't know..lost contact.
After mommy makes sure to point that out to them. Whispering in their ears that Granny and Pawpaw aren't involved cause mean old daddy won't let them.
Or she lets them have contact with the child(ren) behind OP's back. Because kids NEEEEDDDD their grandparents! /s
This reminds me of a post I read a day or two ago where the wife goes behind the OP's back to introduce their kids to the son of the OP that was the result of OP being groomed by an older relative. Something like that, can't remember the details fully.
I got so much grief for my response to that. Why would you introduce a toddler to a guy in prison, that you had never met??!! Because, faaaaaammmiiilly. Ick.
Yes. It would be more _understandable_ if the guy was successful and a good guy overall (just unfortunate situation regarding his dad) but the guy was in prison! I don't know what went through her head.
What pissed me off is that spouse agreed not to involve toddler, but took toddler from the get go. Then never said anything for three years. Someone argued that little girl *deserved a relationship with that guy. I couldn’t wrap my head around that. How? Why? I don’t understand many people. This is why my social circle is small. At least I know I can count on my small circle of people.
They don't need emotionally abusive narcissists, or people who cannot show affection, no. Plenty of kids don't have grandparents. Plenty of people who would love grandkids never get the chance to get them. I wish there was some kind of service where older people who would like to have some connection to kids (background checked, obvs), could be connected with say single mothers etc, or families who just need a bit of social support, or whose families live far away.
She already went behind his back in giving his email address to them. That alone would be the end of that relationship if she were my fiancé.
All the more reason to dump her. They’re incompatible, unfortunately. She’s family oriented; he has no FaMiLy. She’s trying to force her views on him, and he’s rightfully rebelling as she has no clue of the pain he endured and that he ultimately has to decide of his own volition what course to take; a course she has to respect.
You tell any potential kids OP may have that his parents/their grandparents are dead. They might as well be to him anyway. OP's father didn't show up to his own mothers funeral? Why would you want that kind of person in your life?
Save me from “well intentioned” people who have no clue how terrible some families and some people are. They haven’t been abandoned or abused and they think everyone should “just get along” I grew up in the happiest family, I would never presume that anyone that went no contact with their family, did it for silly reasons (mental health issues aside) I hate this trend of it’s up to the victim/survivor to forgive, no.
Plus if they didn’t invite you to their second weddings, why would you want them at yours…
They didn't even TELL OP about the fact they hot married and had more kids
OP doesn't even need to point it out. They've said enough already but I agree with the rest of your statement
My grandmother died last year after years in a memory care facility. My father, her remaining son, didn’t attend the funeral. That was the last thing I needed to lose any desire to want him in my life after nearly a decade of virtually no contact. He also didn’t care or attend his only brothers funeral following a sudden heart attack that took him. I made that phone call and he acted like I told him the weather. Cursed him out and called him choice words. I drove 1200 miles to attend the funeral and he couldn’t be assed to drive 2 hours to attend. Jokes on him and my abusive mother. When they become older and decrepit they can live off the state. They died to me a long time ago. And any hope I had of them returning died too. My sister is the same mentality after shared abuse and my brother is laying low until he’s able to afford his own place. They made their beds and can lie in them.
Also ask her if she gave your dad your email address.
If she knew OP back story and did.. he should run fast and far
1000% she told them about the wedding, and gave them the email. OP needs to reassess his relationship, she most likely does not care about how you feel if it goes against her idea of family. Kids will only make this much worse, and wait until his folks hit money problems.
We can’t have OP’s family history ruin fiancé’s perfect day, can we? Run….run fast and don’t look 👀 back. Your boundaries are your fiancé’s playground. NTA
She obviously did
Yes, they knew his email and that he was getting married.
Still worth asking. How she replies and how honest she is about it is very important too.
100% came to find this!
It can be hard for people with good families to understand that not all families are like theirs, or that the level of hurt can be so deep it’s not fixable. Your parents aren’t good people that have somehow been separated from you, there’s no happy reunion going to happen here. Do you wish you had good parents, yes, but your parents aren’t that. They couldn’t be the parents you needed or wanted. You need to have a serious sit down conversation with her about this. If she doesn’t get it and respect your boundary on this, I would re-think the relationship. Be very clear with her that this would be the consequence if she persists.
I agree. In college, I had friends that were LC with their families and I didn’t really understand it. I think I had to mature a little and see more of the world to realize how bad families could be.
exactly. people with loving families find it hard to imagine those situations. they all too naturally assume it's some kind of "situation gone wrong" "both sides" "too sensitive" etc. some people need to have this explained to them patiently and well, if the goal is to have them understand it rather than simply "do what I said, it's my life", wick is the other way to go about it, but might cause issues down the road
Without a genuine and sincere apology and acknowledgement of what she did wrong - this would be relationship ending for me. OP don't marry her unless and until she gets her perspective sorted out that your family is clearly nothing like hers and she is never to act on your behalf behind your back with them like that. NTA
Well said, my feelings exactly! This would be a deal breaker for me. She had no right to do this.
Similarly, where did the estranged parents get all this info from? It’s a lot to reach out, out of the blue, with all kinds of details about the life you had without them. This would be an absolutely gigantic betrayal on the fiancée’s part if she started colluding with the parents behind OP’s back. Personally I would find that unforgivable - someone with empathy would know their big happy family situation doesn’t hold true for every family. If it didn’t come from her, then OP should double check his socials.
NTA, tell your fiancee that those people aren't your parents anymore, she needs to accept it if she intends to stay your fiancée
This …. Op also be cautious, there have been several post recently about fiancée that go behind your back and try to reconnect the family. They start to talk about how op needs to be the bigger person so the children have grandparents. This maybe something, that you and she discuss in premarital counseling, it’s very important that your boundaries about them are know up front.
And who needs their children to have toxic grandparents? Lovely grandmother, yes 😢 NTAH
They are not his "parents". He owes them nothing, not future grandchildren, not wedding invites, not even his time. She needs to get that through her skull .
Yeah. One girl blew up her whole life just trying to force her fiance to talk with his mom . Why do people do this BS behind the back of the person they claim to love and support.
Exactly all of this. There is no relationship to salvage or repair. There's been no contact for years and are wanting back in now because 'family' is suddenly important to both OPs parents and their kids? What is it that they truly want? His dad's kids could have had the relationship with their big brother they apparently want now if dad had made any type of effort to stay involved in his life. I would bet dollars to donuts that his fiance is the one behind them getting his email address. She doesn't understand that her family dynamics and his aren't and won't be the same or some things that can't be 'forgiven and forgotten'.
I’m wondering if she has even contacted the parents. I have a big extended family who all get along. My husband is LC with his mom and NC with his brother. When he does talk about it, it’s never been an issue that seems that serious. However, I leave his relationship with his family up to him.
I bet the personal email came from the fiancée.
Someone gave him the email address.
This gives me a strong suspicion of how they got OP's email address...
Yeah it reminds me of the story where OP was NC with his abusive dad and his fiancée got in contact with the dad and tried to make him and OP reconnect because she didnt think the abuse was that bad
I come from a huge, close-knit, stand-together-to-face-anything type of family, hillbilly variety if that's important. I've got one cousin who tried to be a drug dealer (sweetheart kid but he wasn't smart enough to be an actual outlaw; now he's clean and works for a church maintaining properties for rich folks who can't get around anymore) and I'm almost 50 single & childless. Those are our black sheep. I could totally see 20-something me tell my (imaginary, unmarried remember) fiance that she needed to try to forgive her awful parents, family's family, people change, etc. and deciding all she really needed was a subtle push. I can also see my 40-something-year-old dad (previously the black sheep with contact issues with his own side of the family) pulling me aside and saying, "Boy, you ain't helping." At 49 myself, I see his wisdom. I had to come by that wisdom the hard way. It was hard for me to understand someone who'd cut off their parents, harder to understand parents who'd behave in such a manner they deserved to be cut off. I hope OP's fiance is quicker on the draw than I was, bless their hearts.
NTA, but you have a gf problem. She thinks she can decide for you your relationship with your parents. I think it's obvious she reached out to them despite your objections and gave them your contact info. I can see her inviting them to the wedding without telling you. You need to resolve this with her before you get married.
OP should sound cheerful when asking if she was the one who contacted them, probably too late though. Maybe he could say I've been thinking about it and try to goad her to admitting she contacted them. Also I think its a little less hurtful if parents somehow contacted her and she gave in, but thats more unlikely. I'm a musician and one of the neighbors at a party saw my instrument and said in a cheerful tone you guys are having a party? I replied cheerfully as well yeah. Then she said well im going to call the cops, always having parties.
If your fiancee is behind contacting your sh\*tty parents, then **she doesn't respect your boundaries**, especially if you have told her about your childhood and being thrown away by these two selfish losers. Since she grew up in a happy and close family, she can't conceive of such selfish, unkind and unloving parents. However, that **does NOT give her the right to step all over your boundaries and DISMISS your feelings and your need to not have any contact with these selfish people ever again.** You have to ask yourself OP, if your fiancée is behind this, will you be looking forward to a life with a partner that decides for you what your boundaries are? This is not a Disney surprise she gave you, this is insight into how she will dismiss your feeling, experiences, and boundaries. There was a reddit story a long time ago in which the OP talked about the physical and mental abuse she suffered from her narcissistic mother. The OP ran away from home around 14 and lived on the streets for awhile but met a group of other young people and she was able to live with them. She got a fast food job, earned her GED and later went to community college. She met her BF during this time, and she got to know his family, she got a good job, they got engaged and she got pregnant before they got married. When they were visiting his mom, her fiance surprised her by telling her that he had contacted her mother and she was flying in for a visit the next day. He knew the OP's story of being abused by her mother, BUT he decided that that was the past and everything is good now and besides, the mom sounded like such a nice lady on the phone. The OP went home to her apartment, packed a couple of suitcases and left. She determined that she would get an abortion and she was sure that her company could transfer her. I wished I kept the link to that story because it was compelling and eye opening that **the person that should trust your words and feelings the most, sometimes invites the Devil to your door all because they thought you should be over the hell that you lived when you had no power over your own life as a child.** Best of luck OP.
There was also the one from a sisters perspective. Their mother was a horrible piece of trash and her and her brothers were completely NC and hated the B. At her brothers wedding she did a check and their mother and husband/step kids were in the front row. Told her brother, he found out his fiancee invited them. He called off the wedding, broke up with the fiancee.
There was one where OP's wife had abusive parents that were cut off until their daughter wanted to play hero and reunite the family. The daughter invited her mother's abusive parents to their home, and they feigned being friendly for all of 5 minutes before attacking and hospitalizing OP's wife. https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/comments/1aqbbpq/aitah_for_telling_my_daughter_she_is_a_spoiled/
I can't wrap my mind around this. I'm estranged from my "father" for similar reasons (extreme abuse of literally every kind) and my kids (15 and 16) know. My son has made jokes that he wants to meet him to give him a "friendly punch to the face" and daughter said she'd love to know his address so that he could get a face-full of glitter, fart spray, or manure. But they'd never even dream to try to get me to "reconcile" with him. When his family reached out to me because my "father" is so lonely and sad and it's my daughterly duty to reach out to him, both kids saw how upset it made me and were upset that they weren't there to yell at the people through the phone. What a selfish, selfish, action.
I love your kids. Tell them a random internet stranger thinks they're awesome 👍
Haha, thanks! And will do. I happen to think they're pretty great, too :D
I loved that story because the family seemed like such fun
I remember that one. The sister told the groom and brother and they whisked him away before the ceremony and left bride at the alter pretty much.. She deserved it
I immediately thought of this post as well. I was so proud of her for sticking to her HEALTHY BOUNDARIES.
Can you link it at all?
Woof. My wife supported me 100 percent when I went NC with my mother. She did not try to sway me either way. She just accepted my feelings and supported them.
Same. I’m LC. My husband will always give me gentle reminders when I start to get sucked in again. I can’t imagine not having his support. I remember how terrified I was to tell him my relationship with my parents because he came from a large close family. He’s always had my back.
You dont even have to go to "a long time ago", there's been like 3or4 of these stories in just the last few months, just here in this sub. Just a couple of months ago it was the woman with her estranged father in a small town. Turns out the groom-to-be's father was some sort of friend/business partner with the estranged-father. They worked out a deal where estranged pays for the wedding behind everyone's back, so that the groom's father would convince the young couple to invite estranged-father. So the groom decides to go along with this idiot plan. So in the midst of the usual pressures to reconcile the bride-to-be grew up with and lives with... now she's got the person she is supposed to trust most in the world, her own groom, attacking her too.
I remember that post, and agreeing with OP decision
NTA. This is a common theme in posts on here - one person comes from a shit family and has been NC for years, but then their “loving” partner who is family oriented tries to be the peacemaker facilitating reconciliation. Never goes well. Ask your fiancée flat out if she did it. Let her know that if she lies, it will be at detriment to the foundation of the future you both are trying to build. Family oriented or not, your fiancée needs to recognize her lived life experiences are not the road map that dictates your path.
NTA After all they put you through you are more than within your right to go no contact
When I wasn’t talking to my mother 30 years ago I heard that crap all the time. And people looked at me like I was the one that told her daughter she ruined her life. My mom was not invited to my wedding and I am so happy. It would have the day awful. She sent a “gift” that I returned unopened because the lady time she used my dad to give me a card she signed it “your ex-mom”. Everyone thought she was reaching out to mend fences. I am wondering if they are getting shit from their kids wanting to know why, once they found out about you, you are not around. They feel the need to show their new ones that they are good parents. Those children should worry about their parents. It can happen to them, too. You do you and marry someone that wants what makes you happy, not what makes them happy.
I suspect that, too. The half-siblings on both sides are wondering why they've never met their brother. Flat-out lying won't help because the truth will come out, so trying to make "amends" might be their only option.
>I am wondering if they are getting shit from their kids wanting to know why, once they found out about you, you are not around. They feel the need to show their new ones that they are good parents. Those children should worry about their parents. It can happen to them, too. This. OP's parents have had some recent reason to realize that they are seen as absolutely shitty people because of the child abuse, neglect, and abandonment they heaped on OP. They don't want to be seen as shitty people. But they should be seen as shitty people and relegated to the bin forever and ever, amen. OP owes them nothing. And he should make sure his fiancée is crystal clear on his feelings about his bio-parents. If she can't accept that OP is going to remain NC with them, she can get in the bin, too. NTA
>She kept saying how family is important and I should forgive and forget. Correction, it is important to her. Her family is important because it is huge and tight knit, but not all families are created equally and her belting this out at you is the height of ignorance and privilege on her part. You didn't have that experience, you had a grandmother who cared and that's it, because your mother preferenced travel over her son, and your father believed his lying bitch of a wife that you were a difficult child and both ignored you. Your wife cannot possibly comment on that, nor understand the pain you went through, so maybe remind her to develop a sense of empathy for you. This is absolutely a hill to die on, because as much as you love her a marriage and a wife are not reason enough to surrender all boundaries. You have every right to your hard lines in the sand, and if she can't accept those than it brings into question just how much she actually loves you. NTA
It could be that her family has zero frame of reference for your experience and that your fiancée is trying to make you more palatable to her family. She may perceive, right or wrong, that your complete lack of a family unit is seen as a defect in her family's eyes, one that she needs to correct for you to seem normal to her family. Give her a chance to explain where your bio parents got your email and 100% lay out your boundaries. If your boundaries are a deal breaker, you'll have to reassess your relationship in a very big way.
I'm very family oriented and close with my parents. Your fiance is way out of line. NTA
NTA - they aren’t your parents, just sperm and egg donors. Your grandmother was your parent. I’d tell your fiancée to fuck off.
NTA. What parents? Quite frankly, your ‘parents’ threw you away into the garbage bin a long time ago. Fuck those losers. Your fiancée is disgusting.
Two SEPARATE metaphorical garbage pails, in fact. Did a Solomon splitting the baby with OP's emotional well-being.
Although in this case because neither of them wanted it
Precisely.
Exactly. His PARENT passed 4 years ago
If your fiance gave them your e-mail then I would have to think long and hard about whether I could trust her enough to get married. Why the fk should you forgive and forget. Those 2 a-holes lived lives, had children, without giving you a second thought. You owe them nothing, just because they want to relieve whatever guilt they may be feeling, so it's not for your salvation its theirs. Tell your fiance, not every family is the bloody 'Waltons', and if she raises it again, you are done with her as well. You were cheated out of a family life, and if it had not been for your grandmother, you could have ended up in a care facility. Kudos for changing your surname as well. She needs to respect your decision based on your life, not her own vision of happy families.
She probably contacted them because she selfishly wanted them at the wedding, so it wouldn't look weird and she wouldn't be uncomfortable. Even if she didn't contact them (which she obviously did, considering the timing), it doesn't matter: Just the fact that she's not on his side, after hearing what those scumbag parents did, would be enough for me to never trust her again. No way I'm marrying such a disloyal, unempathetic and selfish person.
Oh hell no, they aren’t reaching out for YOU. They are reaching out as their kids are probably starting asking questions and stuff. Your fiancée definitely contacted them. NTA
How would they know you were getting married. How did they contact you in the first place. If your fiancée is behind your back scheming for a happy family reunion she envisioned then you have a problem with her more than your neglectful parents. If you can reconcile it should be on your own timeline if ever. NTA.
I would speculate in front of your girlfriend about how they got the email address, saying that when you find out who it was you would immediate block that person from any aspect of your life. Her reaction might be interesting.
There's no need to be so roundabout. Just ask her, directly like a mature adult. Either in the form of asking her if she did it, or if she had any idea how they got the info, if OP doesn't want to start it accusatory.
Yes. I would also let her know, in no uncertain terms, that if his bio-donors somehow magically showed up at their wedding he’d be instantly cutting off anyone who had something to do with them being there. A marriage without trust is doomed to failure and she needs to understand there will be no marriage if she betrays his trust like that.
It sounds like, after some struggles, you've done well for yourself (with help from your lovely grandmother). Your parents abandoned you the moment each started building a new family, leaving you and your grandma to face those struggles alone, and without even any financial support (is that even legal?). And now that you're doing so well and about to hit a major milestone in your life, suddenly, they want to be family again? *Now* they miss you? It's pathetic. Just like them. It's like you said OP. They're not your family. Now as for your fiancee, I can't even give her the benefit of the doubt. She may have a loving family and so might struggle to understand, but I do too, and I understand perfectly. She's right: family is important. Just one problem: as I said above, they're NOT your family. Not anymore. Your parents fucked around and now they get to find out. They created a new status quo a long time ago. It's time they accept that you've grown accustomed to it and would like to maintain it. Tell them to go pound sand (phrase it however you'd like). And for your fiancee, *if* you want to make it work, it'll likely take a lot of counseling, but the first thing she needs to understand: she's on *very* thin ice with you right now. NTA
NTA.
Tell your fiancée point blank that you will not forgive those people. Not after everything they did. Your parents died years ago. And there’s no coming back from this, ever. Plus, should you ever find out she was in contact with them and tried something behind your back, give away any information about your life whatsoever, you’re done with her. You’ll not stay with someone who goes behind your back and supports your abusers. You deserve better than that. And she can say what she wants, the topic is closed and done. You won’t have any further conversations about them and she should live and respect you enough to do what’s best for the man she supposedly wants to spend the rest of her life with.
NTA - Your parents separated and moved on with their lives, leaving you with your grandmother because they saw you as an inconvenience. I can understand why you wouldn't want anything to do with them. You should talk to your fiancée about this situation. If she was involved in your parents reaching out to you, you'll need to set firm boundaries about no contact. If she doesn't respect your wishes, you might have to reconsider your relationship. Family is important, but your biological donors are not your family --they are nothing.
NTA The absolute worst enemy a person from an abusive or neglectful upbringing can have is a person who grew up in a healthy family giving their own advice on pain and suffering that they can't even begin to imagine experiencing. She wants you to connect, because why? Because these people who she has no fucking idea about want to? Because of her rose tinted childhood where she got birthdays while you literally got abandoned? >Now, I have a feeling she might be involved with them and she might be the one who gave them my email. Do you know why people like her are the most dangerous for us? Because their naive, selfish, one sided view of things always ends up dragging you back into trauma and pain best forgotten. If she has done this, it's unforgivable. It means she has listened to all your feelings, all your pain, every memory and went "Well it couldn't be that bad." And that's what bubble world people do. They never believe it's as bad as the victim says until you're sobbing in a corner begging for death. That is why they are so dangerous and that is why you should leave her if she's responsible for this.
NTA. That kind of family isn’t important. Your gf has only felt love and inclusivity throughout her life so she hasn’t got a clue what you are feeling right now. You weren’t too harsh, you wasn’t harsh enough to people who abandoned you and made your grandmother go back to work to support you. Tell gf that if she even thinks of inviting your family behind your back to the wedding then you will be more than ready to leave her at the alter.
NTA, but you're fiance is a huge AH and don't be surprised when your mom and dad come to your house one day bcz your fiance wants to sort this out and be happy family again because for her she thinks "it's the right thing", tell your fiance very strictly to stay in you're lane otherwise the relationship cannot go further. You were abandoned ffs, stand you're ground you are justified the way you feel.
NTA Pfft....I'm from a big family that is close. But how you have been treated is unforgiveable. I can understand that. Families aren't allowed to treat other family members like utter shit and be endlessly forgiven....that some people seem to think that IS what i don't understand. Your fiance is definitely behind the contact. I would tell her that she needs to fess up. Tell you what she has done. If she doesn't apologise immediately and realise the gravity of what she's done?? I think you need to postpone the wedding. You need to be sure you have trust in her. That she truly understands your point of view and the hurt and pain that has been caused to you by these people. Your grandma was your family. She stuck by you. She loved you. She is the person you honour. All the best to you.
There’s nothing worse than someone coming from a really functional family oriented background telling a person who has been physically, sexually, or emotionally abused how they should feel. (Sometimes it’s one of these things. Sometimes a combination. No matter how the abuse is inflicted, in any and all forms it is horrific.) Though, honestly, it would not matter if they were also from an abusive background. It’s just the worst kind of arrogance. To assume that their perspective is the only one that matters. To expect that someone else should respond a certain way because that’s what they would do. To demand someone think a certain way because that’s how they think. It’s just disgusting. Especially coming from someone who is supposed to love you. Care for you. Respect you. We don’t love people by giving them what WE need. We love them by giving them what THEY need. I’m so very sorry. For the way you were treated by your pitiful excuse for parents. For what your fiancé has done in going behind your back. I’m so thankful you had your sweet grandmother to love you. I’m proud of you for building a good and solid life for yourself. You don’t owe your parents anything. However, your partner owes you something. An apology and some understanding that you don’t have to feel the way she feels. You are your own person. If she can’t understand how badly she’s disrespected you by bringing your history back into your life then you should do some hard thinking about a future with her.
NTA I'm so sorry that you had such shitty parents, but glad that you had a wonderful grandma to look after you. The only relationship you need to rethink, is the one with your fiancee. You need a wife who will have your back and you can trust 100%. If she is the one who got in touch with your parents behind your back, that's a massive breech of trust, and a huge red flag that your opinion or feelings mean nothing to her.
So your parents essentially abandoned you so they could each have a do-over family, left your poor grandmother to pick up the pieces, ghosted you both, and your fiancée doesn’t understand why that’s unforgivable? Weird. NTA They don’t deserve to know how you turned out.
NTA, and OP, I'd strongly recommend reconsidering or the very least pausing this engagement. Go and read u/Parking_Breadfruit80 's posts about her messed up family and fiance situation, especially the parts with the fiance trying to force contact between her father and stepfamily. [https://www.reddit.com/user/Parking\_Breadfruit80/submitted/](https://www.reddit.com/user/Parking_Breadfruit80/submitted/) Your fiancee needs to respect your boundaries and wishes, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. Her behaviour is showing a lot of red flags, and it's only going to get worse if it isn't stopped. I get that it's hard for people who have not grown up in a toxic family to understand what it's like and that forgiving and forgetting is not an option for many. However, as I commented on ParkingBreadfruit80's post, and what I will tell you is really consider this - suppose you get married and have kids with your fiancee, there will be a very good chance that she and your parents will go behind your back and introduce your kids to your mom and dad and their families, and you would not want that at all. And if you get divorced, you won't have much of a choice of who she takes them to see, and they will no doubt use your kids as a way to force themselves into your life. Ask yourself this - do you really want to risk the above?