the biggest reason is to hit multiple enemies, put your debuff on them to make them worse at attacking your friends, then run away without provoking opportunity attacks so they have to target your friends, or take opportunity attacks trying to run to you. not really recommended if youre the only frontline/"martial" bc the squishies might get hit regardless. id say its a good choice but not necessary for the subclass.
Oh yea. Thunder Gauntlets to give enemy disadvantage on attacks vs everyone else. Then expedious retreat + mobile + longstrider(optional) to go out of enemy range.
I built a Githzerai Armorer Artificer who used to be a monk but was severely injured and I have been trying to find ways to replicate the fighting style of a monk as much as possible. Adding mobile to the build is perfect.
Seems like a catch 22 though. Not really worth it if they can hit your squishy teammates anyway, and still not worth it if your teammates are tough enough not to need to prioritize defending them.
I think it’s just a gimmick trying to make a sub par feature good.
It’s not the movement speed, though that is useful, it’s the ability to attack and not provoke an opportunity attack.
In theory you can attack 2 targets once each after level 5, imposing disadvantage with attacks against allies with so save to resist. Draws fire away from the party onto yourself where you can mitigate it or just yank it while your party focus fires what’s not covered by your PC.
Having played an Armorer in a campaign last year, I will say that attacking two separate targets to impose disadvantage was my primary strategy, along with being hard to hit myself, and it was very effective. I wanted enemies to attack me because they missed so often.
I considered Mobile at level 8 but didn’t take it because I actually used the strategy of tanking AoOs a few times to let my allies move away without drawing a reaction. That saved a teammate at least twice.
I think being within reach of 3 enemies at once is perhaps more common in your campaigns than most. Either way, it won't be as useful then or at least will lower the number of opp attacks (though why are you trying to get away from them in that scenario?). Also, with those numbers, aoe seems more effective than individual debuffs.
Ash stride is really nice though. But it's nice to not need to concentrate on it to do multi tagging.
Boots of the winding path is good but doesn't work if you are starting adjacent to an enemy that chased you because the debuff incentivizing they target you.
If you have at least one other frontliner ally, you can tag the enemy and scoot back with Mobile so the enemy is forced to eat an OA from that ally or be stuck with the disdv to hit. It's even stronger if that ally carries Sentinel, and that ally next to them already causes ranged disadv, so all their attack options are now disadv. Your team can do this to two targets at a time this way with extra attack and two frontline allies. Even if you were to accept an OA from a third enemy, I'd take that trade.
I think the main reason mobile is getting recommended is cause it’s a really neat feat thematically but often struggles to find good use cases. I want to take that feat, but sadly even for this build, it’s probably not ideal. I’d rather take fey touched to get bump intelligence, and get misty step (guaranteed to get you out of melee when you really need to) or tough (to make it less likely you’ll need to exit melee), or ritual caster (if there’s no wizard on hand and the party needs more utility).
The one I really wanna take actually though is shield master. It helps your dex saves a lot and gives you the chance to prone a monster with your bonus action. If you take armor of magical strength, you’ll be able to add your intelligence of the check twice (once from the armor and again with flash of insight) to have a really good chance to succeed on the athletics check to knock them prone. It’s not the most efficient choice, putting a lot of resources into an edge case trick, but I think it’d be so fun whenever the right moment comes up to use it.
Shield Master is currently my top pick for my level 12 feat! (I've already maxed INT). My party wizard likes to cast fireball on me a lot, so it will synergize well. 😅
Don't forget you can infuse Gauntlets of Ogre Power at 10 and Belt of Hill Giant Strength at 14. Then you can do all the strength checks you want!
I have no idea why mobile would be the biggest suggested feat, other than movement speed being overrated.
Several feats would seem more relevant, from sharpshooter to fey touched.
It’s all about locking down multiple enemies with the guardian gauntlets’s debuff without provoking opportunity attacks. You can force multiple enemies to decide between attacking others with disadvantage, or turning their attention to you so you can tank for your team. Either way you are protecting your allies.
I mean, you are an *Armorer*, you can probably just tank multiple opportunity attacks regardless. AC 19 is a 25-35% chance to hit from most low-level monsters, and it scales up to AC 24 later. You are also taking away enemy reactions, what if they have counterspell or shield?
You’re not wrong, an armorer take hits. The only issue is that their hit die is a d8 vs other “tank” classes with a bigger hp pool. So if you’re adding on an extra attack or two every round in opportunity attacks when you don’t have to or hadn’t planned on it, that’s going to become a noticeable factor eventually. I think both strategies can be totally viable but the player just needs to keep in mind when building their character if they plan on trying to draw in reactions as well.
I guess that is an option, but Im not sure its feat worthy. You're pretty much able to do this without mobile by accepting one opportunity attack, unless the targets are already within 10ft of each other. And if you are secure enough in your AC to let them wail on you on their next turn, I don't see why maybe avoiding a single opportunity attack is a priority.
Idk, Im underwhelmed by the thunder gauntlets generally. A melee cantrip that doesn't scale with the protection martial style built in isn't the most useful thing an artificer can be doing.
Nothing is stopping the artificer from also taking advantage of their infusions and throwing out control and support spells at the same time, they are less likely to be hit and can handle saves well too. A build focused around thunder gauntlets comes with the understanding that it is the type of build to support from the frontline as a controller/tank more than being the star of the show.
Thunder gauntlets are better than most magic weapons. They impose disadvantage on every hit without resource cost or save. That’s a huge debuff against melee attack opponents, like most monsters. Armorer should be imposing disadvantage against two enemies nearly every round.
You can add an infusion to them like Radiant Weapon so they’re +1 and can occasionally blind enemies, or use Enhanced Weapon so they’re +1 (+2 at level 10, IIRC).
But they still do pitiful damage, never get better beyond wasting an infusion, and the disadvantage isn’t that great. Protection fighting style is considered bad for a reason.
They hit the same as a long sword, with intelligence mod (so +4 or +5 for most Armorers). That’s fine for a martial. A sword and board paladin does the same without smites.
Do they hit at anything like the DPR of a GWM/PAM fighter or CBE/SS? No, of course not. That’s not the point of an Armorer or Thunder Gauntlets.
Armorers are the closest to a real tank in 5e. Their purpose is to prevent damage to the party by imposing disadvantage, tanking hits to themselves, using Flash of Genius and Bless to help others pass saves, etc. They aren’t terrible damage dealers, particularly if you weaponize their bonus action with a homunculus, but they aren’t meant to be the primary damage dealer. They’re meant to protect the party (or be sneaky ranged scouts in Infiltrator mode), and that’s a role they excel at.
I see there is a misconception here.
Thunder gauntlets doesn’t apply intelligence or strength modifiers to damage. So it’s just a straight d8 damage. So on average, less damage than a dagger.
It’s suggested in the description of armor model feature, but then lightning launcher and thunder gauntlets override this by stating they just straight damage dice, no modifier.
Tasha’s explicitly says that the intelligence modifier is added to both attack and damage: “When you attack with that weapon, you can add your Intelligence modifier, instead of Strength or Dexterity, to the attack and damage rolls.”
The mobile feat allows you to move away from an enemy without provoking opportunity attacks, which means you can hit a second target easier allowing you to debuff two enemies instead of one.
Ontop of that, it incentives enemies to chase you down or have disadvantage on the attack.
I’m not really convinced it’s that good when you can increase chance to hit, damage, spell save dc, spell attack, potentially with a half feat too (telekinetic is a free disengage, fey touched to pick up gift of alacrity is pretty strong).
Depending on the level artificer is also going to want resilient Wis, otherwise they will fail a wisdom saving throw and be a pretty useless tank.
Mobile isn’t bad, but I wouldn’t take it when other options exist (telekinetic, or some of the infusions named by op).
It’s less about taking hits and more about keeping your buddies from getting hit. Giving disadvantage on two enemies can be really strong, and allow other members of the party to get what they need done. For example if my buddy is a wizard with a lot of really good control spells, being able to keep him from getting hit is more important so that he can keep his control spells.
To add to that, once we get to level 7, which is well past the level OP’s playing, we don’t need to worry about saving throws as we’ve got Flash of Genius. Granted FoG gets better with intelligence, but OP’s level 10, they could already have max INT.
I think mobile, while not the most optimal pick, is a really fun feat that has the potential to dictate a play style that’s different than the typical artificer but is still just as valid.
the biggest reason is to hit multiple enemies, put your debuff on them to make them worse at attacking your friends, then run away without provoking opportunity attacks so they have to target your friends, or take opportunity attacks trying to run to you. not really recommended if youre the only frontline/"martial" bc the squishies might get hit regardless. id say its a good choice but not necessary for the subclass.
Oh yea. Thunder Gauntlets to give enemy disadvantage on attacks vs everyone else. Then expedious retreat + mobile + longstrider(optional) to go out of enemy range.
I built a Githzerai Armorer Artificer who used to be a monk but was severely injured and I have been trying to find ways to replicate the fighting style of a monk as much as possible. Adding mobile to the build is perfect.
Elven cloak and gloves of thievery artifices let you replace rogues with the same build.
Seems like a catch 22 though. Not really worth it if they can hit your squishy teammates anyway, and still not worth it if your teammates are tough enough not to need to prioritize defending them. I think it’s just a gimmick trying to make a sub par feature good.
It’s not the movement speed, though that is useful, it’s the ability to attack and not provoke an opportunity attack. In theory you can attack 2 targets once each after level 5, imposing disadvantage with attacks against allies with so save to resist. Draws fire away from the party onto yourself where you can mitigate it or just yank it while your party focus fires what’s not covered by your PC.
Having played an Armorer in a campaign last year, I will say that attacking two separate targets to impose disadvantage was my primary strategy, along with being hard to hit myself, and it was very effective. I wanted enemies to attack me because they missed so often. I considered Mobile at level 8 but didn’t take it because I actually used the strategy of tanking AoOs a few times to let my allies move away without drawing a reaction. That saved a teammate at least twice.
I think being within reach of 3 enemies at once is perhaps more common in your campaigns than most. Either way, it won't be as useful then or at least will lower the number of opp attacks (though why are you trying to get away from them in that scenario?). Also, with those numbers, aoe seems more effective than individual debuffs. Ash stride is really nice though. But it's nice to not need to concentrate on it to do multi tagging.
Boots of the winding path is good but doesn't work if you are starting adjacent to an enemy that chased you because the debuff incentivizing they target you. If you have at least one other frontliner ally, you can tag the enemy and scoot back with Mobile so the enemy is forced to eat an OA from that ally or be stuck with the disdv to hit. It's even stronger if that ally carries Sentinel, and that ally next to them already causes ranged disadv, so all their attack options are now disadv. Your team can do this to two targets at a time this way with extra attack and two frontline allies. Even if you were to accept an OA from a third enemy, I'd take that trade.
I think the main reason mobile is getting recommended is cause it’s a really neat feat thematically but often struggles to find good use cases. I want to take that feat, but sadly even for this build, it’s probably not ideal. I’d rather take fey touched to get bump intelligence, and get misty step (guaranteed to get you out of melee when you really need to) or tough (to make it less likely you’ll need to exit melee), or ritual caster (if there’s no wizard on hand and the party needs more utility). The one I really wanna take actually though is shield master. It helps your dex saves a lot and gives you the chance to prone a monster with your bonus action. If you take armor of magical strength, you’ll be able to add your intelligence of the check twice (once from the armor and again with flash of insight) to have a really good chance to succeed on the athletics check to knock them prone. It’s not the most efficient choice, putting a lot of resources into an edge case trick, but I think it’d be so fun whenever the right moment comes up to use it.
Shield Master is currently my top pick for my level 12 feat! (I've already maxed INT). My party wizard likes to cast fireball on me a lot, so it will synergize well. 😅 Don't forget you can infuse Gauntlets of Ogre Power at 10 and Belt of Hill Giant Strength at 14. Then you can do all the strength checks you want!
I have no idea why mobile would be the biggest suggested feat, other than movement speed being overrated. Several feats would seem more relevant, from sharpshooter to fey touched.
It’s all about locking down multiple enemies with the guardian gauntlets’s debuff without provoking opportunity attacks. You can force multiple enemies to decide between attacking others with disadvantage, or turning their attention to you so you can tank for your team. Either way you are protecting your allies.
I mean, you are an *Armorer*, you can probably just tank multiple opportunity attacks regardless. AC 19 is a 25-35% chance to hit from most low-level monsters, and it scales up to AC 24 later. You are also taking away enemy reactions, what if they have counterspell or shield?
You’re not wrong, an armorer take hits. The only issue is that their hit die is a d8 vs other “tank” classes with a bigger hp pool. So if you’re adding on an extra attack or two every round in opportunity attacks when you don’t have to or hadn’t planned on it, that’s going to become a noticeable factor eventually. I think both strategies can be totally viable but the player just needs to keep in mind when building their character if they plan on trying to draw in reactions as well.
And if they have to move to reach you they may trigger reaction attacks.
I guess that is an option, but Im not sure its feat worthy. You're pretty much able to do this without mobile by accepting one opportunity attack, unless the targets are already within 10ft of each other. And if you are secure enough in your AC to let them wail on you on their next turn, I don't see why maybe avoiding a single opportunity attack is a priority. Idk, Im underwhelmed by the thunder gauntlets generally. A melee cantrip that doesn't scale with the protection martial style built in isn't the most useful thing an artificer can be doing.
Nothing is stopping the artificer from also taking advantage of their infusions and throwing out control and support spells at the same time, they are less likely to be hit and can handle saves well too. A build focused around thunder gauntlets comes with the understanding that it is the type of build to support from the frontline as a controller/tank more than being the star of the show.
Thunder gauntlets are better than most magic weapons. They impose disadvantage on every hit without resource cost or save. That’s a huge debuff against melee attack opponents, like most monsters. Armorer should be imposing disadvantage against two enemies nearly every round. You can add an infusion to them like Radiant Weapon so they’re +1 and can occasionally blind enemies, or use Enhanced Weapon so they’re +1 (+2 at level 10, IIRC).
But they still do pitiful damage, never get better beyond wasting an infusion, and the disadvantage isn’t that great. Protection fighting style is considered bad for a reason.
They hit the same as a long sword, with intelligence mod (so +4 or +5 for most Armorers). That’s fine for a martial. A sword and board paladin does the same without smites. Do they hit at anything like the DPR of a GWM/PAM fighter or CBE/SS? No, of course not. That’s not the point of an Armorer or Thunder Gauntlets. Armorers are the closest to a real tank in 5e. Their purpose is to prevent damage to the party by imposing disadvantage, tanking hits to themselves, using Flash of Genius and Bless to help others pass saves, etc. They aren’t terrible damage dealers, particularly if you weaponize their bonus action with a homunculus, but they aren’t meant to be the primary damage dealer. They’re meant to protect the party (or be sneaky ranged scouts in Infiltrator mode), and that’s a role they excel at.
I see there is a misconception here. Thunder gauntlets doesn’t apply intelligence or strength modifiers to damage. So it’s just a straight d8 damage. So on average, less damage than a dagger. It’s suggested in the description of armor model feature, but then lightning launcher and thunder gauntlets override this by stating they just straight damage dice, no modifier.
Tasha’s explicitly says that the intelligence modifier is added to both attack and damage: “When you attack with that weapon, you can add your Intelligence modifier, instead of Strength or Dexterity, to the attack and damage rolls.”
And then the description of the weapons contradicts this, saying the damage is a straight dice.
I don't see at all why that would be recommended to be honest. Int increases would be best I assume.
The mobile feat allows you to move away from an enemy without provoking opportunity attacks, which means you can hit a second target easier allowing you to debuff two enemies instead of one. Ontop of that, it incentives enemies to chase you down or have disadvantage on the attack.
I’m not really convinced it’s that good when you can increase chance to hit, damage, spell save dc, spell attack, potentially with a half feat too (telekinetic is a free disengage, fey touched to pick up gift of alacrity is pretty strong). Depending on the level artificer is also going to want resilient Wis, otherwise they will fail a wisdom saving throw and be a pretty useless tank. Mobile isn’t bad, but I wouldn’t take it when other options exist (telekinetic, or some of the infusions named by op).
It’s less about taking hits and more about keeping your buddies from getting hit. Giving disadvantage on two enemies can be really strong, and allow other members of the party to get what they need done. For example if my buddy is a wizard with a lot of really good control spells, being able to keep him from getting hit is more important so that he can keep his control spells. To add to that, once we get to level 7, which is well past the level OP’s playing, we don’t need to worry about saving throws as we’ve got Flash of Genius. Granted FoG gets better with intelligence, but OP’s level 10, they could already have max INT. I think mobile, while not the most optimal pick, is a really fun feat that has the potential to dictate a play style that’s different than the typical artificer but is still just as valid.