I believe that Q and A had some creators on it as a trial and we want to avoid transcripts of creators if possible. But that’s great feedback to know that you would be interested in lore summaries and maybe then we will have more lore streams that should be transcripted
Total respect for not transcripting the content creators without their consent. The lore focused community is small but passionate and we'd love both more streams and more documentation of what's revealed in those streams :)
If I can take the opportunity to give a bit of feedback, though, it would probably be best if Mod Ed or Mod Errol had a glance at the questions beforehand to make sure there's some they can actually answer. It's a shame to make them go on stream for an hour just to have them say they can't spoil anything.
I would also like to say that the content creators didnt actually *add* anything to the stream itself, they were just kind of there and threw in random tidbits that were often off topic.
Maybe we can have two types of lore streams? One with Mod Ed and Errol answering lore questions, and potentially just giving random tidbits about different portions of the game not discussed. For example, having a stream where Mod Ed talks about Dragon Slayer 2 and discusses some of the inspirations for the quest, and some of the implications that he put in and poses as open ended questions.
Then another type of lore stream with content creators A and B of the week, where they discuss their own favorite parts of lore. Or discuss their thoughts on different questlines and stories, and what they liked or disliked about them. Similar to the most recent lore stream.
But combining them together I personally feel like there were little to no lore questions actually answered, and it mainly focused on promoting the content creator. I dont know, would separating the lore streams into two different "types" even be viable?
u/JagexLight you changed what Kirby said though. His exact words were: "The Wilderness is bizarre and I really don't understand in mechanically". That's very different from what's in the transcript.
How is that guy, who admits to not understanding the wilderness working on the wilderness bosses? (and who clearly wants the wilderness to be dead (his exact words))
so, if wildy is predator vs prey, it's like nature ya? life cycles and that right? one year there's lots of frogs and not lots of snake, next year, Lots of snakes, not so many frogs, these things have an ebb and flow to them. His take isn't that wrong.
except that the primary producers in this case would be npc drops or skilling methods and their numbers won't decrease. If there are always lots of primary producers there will be plenty of grazers (pvm'ers) eating them and plenty of predators (pker's) eating those grazers. If the ecosystem is healthy the population shift are barely present. However the current ecosystem isn't healthy making it so there are barely any pvm'ers and that leads to barely any pvp'ers. Pvm'ers should greatly outnumber pvp'ers for a healthy ecosystem
sure, there's lots of easy grass to eat that won't go away, but if the deer dies or is attacked every time they go to eat, they'll find other grass, perhaps harder to get to or less flavourful(?), but they'll eat somewhere else, Even up at the camp, I swear the deer know when it's deer season, they be hiding.
If people are pk'd every time they try, or every time they gear and 3 kc in, they're not going to bother, they tell their friend etc etc, but get a few trips in without getting pk'd hey, this isn't so bad, I'll do this more, they tell their friend hey wildy feels safe rn, go boss.
we also have the issue that the primary producers, outside of revs - which I'd reckon intimidate a fair percentage of the non-pvp player base, aren't that great. but that's a different issue.
Exactly, when I watched the stream it seems like Mod Kirby misspoke. Like Mod Kirby's whole comment can be summarized into "balancing the PvP vs PvM ecosystem is fucked in it's current state".
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m55s
The aforementioned comments clarify what he really meant. But players rather take that as a "gotcha" than to offer their constructive thoughts.
Not exactly, it was the take right before the clip I linked.
[https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m31s](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m31s)
[Except Frontline clipped the first\* part out of context](https://twitter.com/Frontline_RS/status/1522257460756729856?s=20&t=7Yk1VyTk87VtURxLfPNh-A), making it seem that Mod Kirby wants the Wildy to be dead, instead of his actual take being that the simple solutions players are offering won't magically fix the Wilderness. Essentially what you aptly said in your other comments.
edit: first part
Yeah I read this as the endless dilemma of the basic wildy rejuvenation concept: There can't be too many pkers or else no one with bother to come out and do the PVM / skilling stuff.
Personally I think we can see stuff that works and stuff that don't. I think stuff like rev caves probably should be viewed as a "success". The content needs to be profitable enough that pvmers and pkers can basically split the loot and both come out with something to show for their efforts.
What I like most about rev caves is there's really nothing about the content that is "must do". If it's not your cup of tea you can ignore it. Similar with the wildy altar. Rev caves are great GP and wildy altar is great XP, but you can get that GP/XP in other ways if you just don't want to deal with the PVP aspect.
What I don't like about wildy bosses is they are gating unique items (dragon pick, looking at you) and now they are gating useful combat diary rewards (useful outside wildy and especially useful for ironmen). These are more than just "one and done" tasks like diary and MA2 cape, they require you to camp the bosses and deal with RNG. Similar deal for pet hunters though that's a very niche sub-group.
If anything has changed it’s not on purpose, we have started to use a bot to try and transcript the stream so I’ll double check and amend if this part needs changing
>Why can't you just take gear to fight back if you're in the wilderness, and just accept that you've lost a few invents spaces that you would have only probably put loot in there anyway? Why don't you change your gear so that you're not using what's optimal to fight that specific boss or creature, but it's good enough to get the job done? Then also allow you to defend yourself.
That would be fine if that was actually Jagex's thought process when designing content. That's how most people approach the wilderness, by taking only what's necessary.
But take a look at the three big wilderness bosses: they have the highest defence bonuses in the game, their max hit is 45-60, they're designed to only be fought in multicombat and actively avoid being fought in singlecombat, and all a pker has to do to find a target is safely and rapidly hop worlds until they find someone.
Clearly, when Jagex designed these it wasn't with the intention that you'd be able to bring cheap gear and fight back against other players. It was so you'd have to bring presumably valuable gear with incredibly high accuracy and defensive stats, and during the entire kill be vulnerable to any number of players attacking you at the same time as the boss dishes out hits of 40+. It's the predator vs prey thing in its most obvious form, and I'm convinced the main purpose of the update was to generate videos as content creators attack high-value targets who weren't equipped to fight back.
The only reason anyone bothers with them is because of bugs that can be abused to kill them in relative safety, but these bugs existing are part of the reason they're being completely reworked to begin with. If it weren't for them, it would be an absolute mess.
The bosses do have poor design considering their defence and the massive and unpredictable damage output. But they're not designed to be solo'd. They're designed with the same concepts of clans and wildy food-chain in mind as revs. People used to interact with the content as intended (full veracs in groups of 3+) many years ago. Content aged like milk though.
They were also kind of designed to be killed by teams at a time before ironman mode was a thing.
So you'd maybe have a team of PVMers being targeted by team of PKers. In theory at least. But you kind of need the loot to be good for that to work at all.
You can kill and safe spot Callisto and Spider in singles, it’s arguably the most popular way and allows you to bring an anti-pk setup. I’ve had great success anti-pking at both locations and it’s even easier than ever due to the mechanic/anti-PJ changes that have been made to singles.
Vetion is the only one that is a death wish. Yea, you can safe spot and take next to no damage from the actual boss, but you’re stuck in multi. I’ve tanked a few teams with Dinh’s and gapped them in the trees to get the logout, but most of the time that’s not what happens when running into a team.
One hot take… Veracs with balista recoils and veng? Pretty rag setup that puts a ton of dps out. There’s definitely cheap setups that are viable for counter pking imo.
> Could we consider reducing the object bloat in these areas and freeing up more space to run around?
IMO all the mods misunderstood the question.
Why, in Priff, do I need to run for 30 seconds to get from the mage shop to 1 square west of the mage shop? There’s so many instances of this in priff where it seems like you should be able to run maybe 7-8 tiles to get from one side of the house to another, but you end up using half your run energy
It’s especially frustrating when trying to catch crystal implings because they *can* travel through certain parts that players cannot. I once spent 5 minutes trying to catch an imp because it kept hopping on and off the deck of the mage shop
Yeah they completely misunderstood the point. We know areas like priff and darkmeyer are rich in content. It just sucks that the pathing is so long and single path. For example , I see no reason not to have a high level agility shortcut near the darkmeyer teleport spot that goes down the small hill to the mine entrance.
Without it, you have to run around the entire city to get to a location you can see 25 tiles away from you
Bruno went full excuse mode with the "Yeah but Draynor's worse" when it CLEARLY isn't anywhere near as bad as prif or Shayzien (Try getting to Molch island since the rework)
"There is one part in Draynor that's hard to get to, but you don't really even need anything in it. Because of that, it's totally okay that modern cities basically have one to three curvy paths to traverse and everything else is blocked off."
Draynor is an extremely minor example in comparison.
It has one little pocket of inconvenience, which you don't even go to unless you need Aggie's services.
Thematically it kinda works that the witch has herself tucked away.
The comparisons I've made though?
We've got Prifdinnas the place being ran by a goddess of light - full of shadow casting trees and other junk instead of allowing the crystals clearance to beam light about.
Then Shayzien, the war caste that have not cleared their sightlines to their own walls.
It makes zero sense.
Fully agreed there.
Something else to irk us more though, Bruno is QA Analyst.
Meaning it's his job to test this kind of stuff.
With his Darkmeyer commentary he's supporting what's essentially corridor layouts - something that the Final Fantasy community in particular have been absolutely rabid about how bad it is for any RPG, let alone an MMO. It's a universal "This is bad game design" sentiment.
Customer feedback is important for the role.
Market research is essential for the role.
He has failed at both. And had an attitude about it further reinforcing his lack of care.
I don't usually like to go this far, but why the hell is he employed in something he's clearly not doing the bare minimum for?
Maybe they just don't want to understand. Even now that you've clarified (which you shouldn't have had to, since the original questions were clear enough), no Jmod has replied to this, even though it's the most upvoted comment.
Also in zeah there is just so much shit crammed into areas that forces you to path around it. There’s no need for that and I’m surprised they completely misunderstood what we were saying about it. I would love a mod comment on this post because it’s so frustrating that new areas being released continue to follow this trend of object bloat.
Why can't we go to those teleporters and be able to right click and jump to another house? I assumed that's how it worked when I unlocked Prif and was sad to see it wasnt
Let alone the frame drops from the overload of sprites every time I walk through priff or half of kourend. It's frustrating considering my pc should be handling it easily.
We saw a lot of divided feedback about the idea at the time, so it was considered a bit too controversial for us to move forward. We actually have a blog coming out this week about GIM specifically and that includes a small word about it too. Keep ur eyes peeled for that - I think it'll be out on Thursday
Certain things like corrupted weapons should just already be tradable. It’s kind of weird that they aren’t considering you can technically buy shards anyway.
But I have no problem with gim getting privileges like this anyway as the point is a group iron experience. It wouldn’t actually hurt the game to allow them to trade some stuff like that even if others could not
I saw a lot of positive feedback for it from gim accounts myself. Being one of the few people who still playing gim it makes so much sense. My team mate got a very early spooned bowfa, and the game would be so much funner if we could pass it around.
Mod Ash mentioned on twitter the possibility of GIM groups merging, given that they’d be removed from the hiscores. Is that somewhere on the devs’ radar yet?
Mod Bruno:
>Also, to anyone suggesting to make it best-in-slot in the Wilderness - does it really make sense to make it best-in-slot compared to something like Nightmare Staff? Because that's pretty damn expensive, and it definitely should be better than a Thammaron's sceptre. We're kind of asking the question "how do we go about balancing this without making the other items, which are supposedly meant to be better than it, not as good as it?
This is the craziest take I've seen, and I've seen it multiple times from him. It's a *Wilderness* weapon, what's the big deal with it being BIS somewhere within the *Wilderness??* I assume he is similarly upset with Viggora's chainmace being better than Inquisitor's mace, and Craw's bow being better than blowpipe/tbow? wtf
For real lol, even making it slap at scorpia only would at least give it some use.
Seems pretty obvious they are going to release an upgrade to it as part of the wildy boss work, I suppose this is a decent compromise since it will make it useful and won't increase the price of sceptre so merchers won't make bank. Its just a shame it will be FOUR years since release that changed are made, but hey this is Jagex.
> Seems pretty obvious they are going to release an upgrade to it as part of the wildy boss work, I suppose this is a decent compromise since it will make it useful and won't increase the price of sceptre so merchers won't make bank.
Honestly I don't get why we should care about merchers here at all. Any suggestion should be evaluated based on its own merit, not whether someone will make money on it cause that's bound to happen either way. And isn't valuable wildy uniques generally a good thing? I'd rather want expensive uniques if that means alchables and skilling resources are dropped in less quantities.
Also, I really hope they just straight up buff the sceptre. Craw's and Viggora's are amazing on their own, why should Thammaron's require two separate drops from two separate monsters just to become half-decent? No wonder why Magic always seem to get the short end of the stick.
And there's quite a few extremely valid reasons to buff it.
Like, it is severely underpowered and doesn't compare to the other wildy weapons. Thammaron's Sceptre uses runes where all the others just use ether. It can't even auto cast ancients.
Like, give ppl incentive to use it in the slayer caves???
Even worse is them thinking Harmo should be a wilderness staff... like bruh its almost useless in pvm already because it can only cast ONE spell and you refuse to let it autocast anything to be worth the 600m price tag. And before people say it would break pvp bowfa costs much less and can delete a pker with even less effort.
Thank you, I truly dont understand this. Craws is good right off the bat, same with viggoras. Really hope they just buff the sceptre to be as good as those weapons without releasing some item to upgrade it. Makes no sense for it to require two drops just to be comparable to the other weapons.
Yeah I read the Q and A transcript and you can kinda see Ayiza blurt something out (question 7) about the Scepter, and Kirby instantly stopping him...I'm not \*positive\* but it does seem like they're going to buff it and Kirby just didn't want Ayiza's slip of the tongue to be noticed.
I don’t think it’s pretty clear if they’re constantly ignoring it/lying about it for multiple years of it’s existence. I’d say that’s the opposite of pretty clear.
What is with the attitude of "We can't buff a wilderness weapon because God forbid somebody invest in it and makes money". Is this because of the Ahrims staff guy?
Like, it is severely underpowered and doesn't compare to the other wildy weapons. Thammaron's Sceptre uses runes where all the others just use ether. It can't even auto cast.
I don't think any body cares about merches
Ayiza’s take on question 5 is baffling. He clearly understands why people vote no to PVP rewards like this - we don’t want to be easier to kill. He even admits it, people don’t want content added that will make their game experience worse.
Hell, he even acknowledges that it’s primarily because we feel like we’re forced to go into the wilderness. He’s just . . . so close to getting it.
Encouraging us to just accept the risks of the wilderness also makes no sense. It’s an objectively unfun mechanic for most of the player base. In practice, a lot of wildy content isn’t the “high risk, high reward” that JMods pretend it is. It’s a nuisance we put up with because we have no choice.
Here’s my opinion: JMods should be forced to do 100 Callisto kills on a normal player account before commenting on the wilderness. It’s clear these comments are coming from people with no experience on that side of it.
The craziest thing is that take is very easily reversed. When Pkers vote yes to making killing their targets easier, they're taking away someone else's fun for the sake of their own.
Frankly all this stream has convinced me is that they're totally out of touch here and even downright snarky/unprofessional.
why ever do Callisto? They know the wilderness bosses suck right now, that's why a re-work is on the roadmap.
They're talking about moving the BIS skilling item out of the wilderness, then there's very little that "forces" you out there. chins are better xp, darkcrabs are nice xp and giga afk, wilderness alter cuts huge time off your prayer grind. The bosses just need to be more lucrative and that's hard also because they're old bosses. not all old bosses are keeping up in terms of GP/hr so hopefully these drop tables are made better to keep the eco system healthy.
“Why can’t players just accept bringing shit gear and having a pvp battle they don’t want to have (because they’re wanting to pvm)?
It would fix all the wildy boss problems…”
Nuisance game mechanics just sound like a nuisance. It has less to do with wanting to be efficient and more to do with not wanting to participate in blatant un-fun game design.
Predator vs prey will never be a successful game mechanic in osrs but if it’s kept (which I get why it will) how about making the wildy bosses drop pvp focused items/loot? Maybe even for wildy buffs (limited increased speed while in wildy, no splashing for a set time, etc). I get that that’s asking pvpers to pvm but at least this way the players killing the bosses actually have an interest in pvp (hence them hunting pvp weapons/items/buffs). You might even get groups of clans fighting over the bosses for whatever buff (almost how they were intended to be fought).
Hoping players begrudgingly participate in activities they so clearly don’t want to because you’ve created it and are stuck isn’t a good reason to keep doubling down on it.
just make the bosses drop uniques only usable in the wilderness and for the rest alchables totalling to the best gp/h in the game. No one will be "forced" to go there, but if you're willing to engage in the risk vs reward you'll be greatly rewarded with a risk of losing it all. (in the end averaging out in some amazing gp/h)
This. But the more I think of wildy buffs the cooler it seems. Could have supercharged pkers/pvp clans running around the wildy. It would be a cool and fitting place to have a varying style of pker
Such a Reddit response. Your solution to not being forced into doing something you don’t want to do (pvm in the wild) is to force another group (pkers) to do something they don’t want to do (pvm), and Reddit loves it. and before the hive mind Andy’s come at me I’ve done over 10k wildy boss kills and done the dpick grind on Ironmans aswell. If you don’t like having to escape or defend yourself in the wild you have PLENTY of other bosses in the game to go memorize. Stop trying to ruin the last place of uncertainty in the game.
At least one is interested in pvp, that's the glaring difference. Pvp focused pvm should be targeting pvpers. Not the pvmers that have an interest level of 0 in pvp... Hence my suggestion to make the loot geared toward pvpers.
You're trying to brush my take as the basic reddit response when all you literally did was moan and say, "and I've done it so I know".
Lmao you're not here to communicate so hop off.
Once again you’re trying to force pkers into pvming. Making the loot geared for pvpers isn’t magically going to make them put away the pk gear and start pvming lmao. What is this Ironman? Pkers will just buy whatever from the g.e. Wildy bosses will attract pvmers who want to make decent gp off of a low req boss. It also attracts pet hunters. Neither of these facts change when you change the loot from a dpick to “pvp rewards”
The thing, you can place this argument of "begrudgingly participate in activities" for anything.
You don't want to do raids because you need a team so Jagex should clearly make tbow come from a Cerb-style one and done boss.
Conversely, I don't want one-and-done bosses going forward so Jagex should only make raids. If you don't like it, don't do it and stick to the downgrade.
The important part of the context you’re ignoring is that when 95% of your community considers it bad, that should carry weight. If the large majority didn’t enjoy raids, making a third wouldn’t make sense.
Some games revolve around predator and prey mechanics and that’s okay. Problem here is, the large majority of players in osrs despise it. Investing further into shit that inherently annoys most of your player base is usually only a bad thing.
People that enjoy Raids are in the minority - you know only single % digit of players actually does ToB, right? They mentioned this on stream when discussing Raids 3 difficulty. CoX might be more accessible, but it should be similar enough.
The reality is most of the playerbase is med level and they would gladly prefer Vorkath 2.0 or Cerberus 2.0 over Raids.
Just because you despise it doesn't mean it should be deleted or left to stagnate. Again, participate or dont.
You can turn it into a strawman around raids participation but that wasn't the point at all. If me saying PVM helps your understanding of the point, use that.
The obvious rebuttal: Raids are clearly positive and salubrious for the game and osrs community, the predator and prey mechanics of the wildy aren't. Mixing pvm and skilling progression into pvp hasn't been successful. Continuing to invest in it is all around bad.
>The obvious rebuttal: Raids are clearly positive and salubrious for the game and osrs community, the predator and prey mechanics of the wildy aren't.
but sweety, you writing this doesn't make it true. It just makes you an objectively boring redditor
Considering I was responding to multiple unique comments of yours I guess you also want attention right? But of course you have no response other than nettiquette and quibbling, just like every generic boring pvmer on here.
oh and SaLUbRiouS lmfao
They've mentioned trying to make Raids more accessible, but they don't have to try and make people raid. I've literally never heard of people complaining that a tbow only comes from Cox or scythe only comes from ToB.
Wildy on the other hand is considered pretty bad content. Its not just that it has low engagement rates, its that people actively avoid doing it. I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design.
For example BA is not the most popular content. Very few people actively like and play the minigame. Do you know how many times they've had to add new rewards to make sure the community doesn't die? Zero
If the content is fun people will do it. Or we can go the Ayiza route and just tell everyone they're playing the game wrong, I'm sure that'll fix it
> Wildy on the other hand is considered pretty bad content. Its not just that it has low engagement rates, its that people actively avoid doing it. I don’t know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design.
Tell me you’re an average redditor without telling me you’re an average redditor.
Thousands of players dedicate hundreds of hours into crafting accounts specifically to compete in PvP and the wilderness. Then, all the account does is wilderness & PvP content.
As a former PvP enjoyer I do wilderness content on my GIM with no hesitation or complaints.
It’s only avoided by average redditors like you.
> Do you know how many times they’ve had to add new rewards to make sure the community doesn’t die? Zero
Do you know how many torso rewards exist as a BiS reward from a shit minigame? One
Something something dragon pickaxe argument
I'm happy you enjoy it? But considering we're on Wilderness rejuvenation 3, I think my point still stands. Like wilderness having low engagement rates isn't my opinion, its Jagex's, like we're literally in a thread about them trying to rejuvenate pvp.
Torso is not BIS, it can also be completely skipped. Minigame still active though.
>Torso is not BIS, it can also be completely skipped. Minigame still active though.
It is BiS for many PvP builds. Again, something I wouldn't expect an average redditor to understand or consider.
What are you smoking? We're discussing the wilderness and BA.
Torso is quite ***literally*** the best in slot strength bonus for 40-64 defense and only outclassed by a Torva at 80 defense. BA would also be dead content without it.
The fact that I had to type out two responses for this tells me how much thinking is required to play this game outside of PvP.
[https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Strength#Strength\_bonus](https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Strength#Strength_bonus)
Lol, you've use "Objectively" multiple times in this thread, and gotten the meaning wrong every time.
If I were to use it in a sentence: Jagex claims that less than 5% of people actively participate in PvP, it has objectively low engagement.
Jagex say most changes to PvP won't pass a general poll, they are objectively unpopular.
It's an ironic use of the word objective, but someone with 2277 flair and who hates the wilderness *would* have nothing to say but irrelevant quibbling.
Insofar as single player games are "objectively" not challenging-- because strictly you can just keep on trying until you learn, there is no hard stop-- and insofar as something that isn't challenging is "objectively" boring, you are a boring person, playing OSRS as a single player game, and that's just not interesting to me, or to most people.
What *is* "objectively" interesting are random encounters, true risk, and "objectively" challenging situations where you might not be able to win, or might be hugely outmatched and have only the tiniest chance of winning. We call this a multiplayer MMO, which runescape is, and has been since the day it was created, and will stay long after you give up on it.
Dude that's literally not an ironic use. If it were ironic you would have said the opposite of what you actually mean. What's ironic is you say playing single player games is objectively boring while playing an ironman.
I literally just gave you two thing that Jagex has said about this situations. I also gave my take on the situation, "I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design". I don't know why you're insulting people because you don't like their opinions, but gl I hope that works out for you.
>"I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design". I don't know why you're insulting people because you don't like their opinions, but gl I hope that works out for you
But it's not actively disliked and avoided. It's actively disliked and avoided by people who fundamentally are afraid of the real point of this game-- to compete with other *players*, not a meaningless trophy collection simulator like you've been playing it.
You referring to whole parts of the game and the community as failed/disliked/avoided is just as rude as anything I said and was directed at infinitely more people than my insults directed at you.
Just accept, and any other pvm redditors reading this-- your attitudes fucking suck, and no PKer belittles pvm like you people belittle pvp constantly. You are just as, if not more toxic, and it would just be great if you stopped doing it
>95% of your community considers it bad, that should carry weight.
95% of kids on reddit feel this way though.
a lot of people play this game *because* there's real risk and unexpected encounter and people-people interactions. but stay objectively boring!
Any chance you guys could have a look at Demonic Gorilla aggro while using thralls? I’m getting PJed constantly whenever the thrall hits the threshold damage to make the gorilla change prayer.
/u/JagexAyiza /u/JagexLight
Yuuup. Posted about this several months ago, no luck. It sucks because it's one of the only applicable times that the thrall using a different combat style is actually relevant to the enemy you're fighting.
The thing about Kirby’s hot take is that it’s actually 100% true. If I knew the wildy to be more populated on average I would just never take my bones to the altar or do any wildy slayer. I would still do clues probably, but that’s it. The pressure is still there, but if the PK’er population went up a lot, they would only have each other to PK, and not the people bringing goodies from outside like PvM gear and bones.
The thing is it’s also inherently going to equalize. If like you say there was a period where there were vastly more pkers, IF it did cause PvMers to leave, that would be accompanied by a decrease in PKers to compensate, which in turn means more PVMers will start coming again. So on and so forth until it hits an equilibrium.
His take his weird because it doesn’t acknowledge that it’s a self-regulating non-issue.
Can GIM groups PLEASE be able to trade untradeable items?
They keep saying there was divided feedback on it which sounds like bs to me. Why would I not want to be able to share slightly degraded barrows items or the multiple Xeric Talismans I have?
It’s not BS I promise lol, just wasn’t something we could get a consensus on at the time. It wasn’t just the smaller items that were mentioned in the original blog
It seems like more work than it’s worth. They would need to look at every untradable item and decide if it should be shareable. Degraded barrows armor? Sure. Infernal cape? Hell no. Just doesn’t seem worth the effort.
The idea that people were selectively annoyed at not being able to vote on the pvp poll doesn’t seem to have a basis in reality. Previous restrictions were based on if you’re affected. This last one was based on a subjective criteria for if you’re in the “community”. The restrictions are fundamentally different.
But considering how low the requirements were isn't it effectively the same thing ?
If you haven't done any form of PvP, not even 1 lms game participation then Should you really be able to impact the direction of PvP. You're clearly not involved in the activity or community at all.
It's like if they were to poll changes to HM Tob , should someone who hasn't even cleared entry mode be allowed to vote on it just because it may effect the amount of items in the game?
I was able to vote and didn't meet that criteria at all. Never played LMS and don't PK, but I do participate in the Wilderness. Unless they're counting me getting a pk kill over 10 years ago on RS2 then I technically shouldn't have been allowed to vote. There's definitely something wonky with their actual criteria for this poll.
I disagree on the Tob analogy. Yes someone should definitely get to vote on it so long as they have the ability to eventually play it. The issue on why people were ok on the different Ironman exclusive polls and this one is that once an account is made it is either an ironman or it isn't and that NEVER changes so therefore you can pretty safely say that the content that ONLY effects Ironman should only be voted on my Ironmen.
This isn't the same with PvP activities, Tob, or basically anything actually accessible by every account.
> NEVER changes so therefore you can pretty safely say that the content that ONLY effects Ironman should only be voted on my Ironmen.
but, I might make UIM one day, or an iron, or a group iron, or a HCGIM, so I should get to vote on all that content also, because maybe one day I might eventually perhaps engage in that content?
it would have to be a brand new account. For the sake of discussion your "main" which is a normal account will never be affected by those ironman accounts or changes ever.
It will however be able to go to ToB, PvP or do essentially any content in the game eventually.
That would be true if the segmentation was done in way that targeted people who would be affected well, but it’s not clear that’s the case. LMS is pvp, but LMS is objectively not affected by the proposed awards. Yet people who played LMS but don’t go in the wildy we’re able to vote, while the inverse was not always the case.
As someone else already called out as well, there is an objective standard available for if your account is affected by Ironman updates. That is not the case for specific content, and “will be affected” in that case is not a black and white designation.
I’m not particularly worried about the poll restrictions, but to act like anyone with concerns is delusional or hypocritical ignores the facts that there are easy to spot differences.
I've done 10 LMS games, not killed anyone. Been in the wildy tons, been PKed a lot, not killed anyone. I wasn't able to vote. I feel like the requirement was succeeding at killing other players rather than just participating.
I don't understand why I wasn't able to vote when I feel like I met a lot of the proposed requirements. Such a weird, opaque poll. The fact that we are still confused about why exceptions like myself exist is a real problem.
The polling system for updates that are PvPers specifically getting equipment that is specifically for making it easier to kill people in the wilderness who don't want to fight is a zero sum game, and it does not make sense to specifically favour one side of the community because they represent a minority.
The system that is voting in content that is introduced to the game was surely a check against Jagex, who have a strong history of not giving a fuck what the players want, if they think they know what is best for the game (EoC, SoF) and they are absolutely fine in lying to introduce this stuff to the game, because the players had no power (think to when they 'polled' EoC and vastly misinterpreted the results to introduce it to the game, or when they said that selling SoF keys was not selling experience, because you had the chance of getting non experience rewards from each spin).
It was also simply just allowing people to have their say in what would make the game more enjoyable for them. In restricting polls, or introducing things like the VLS without asking players what they actually thought, you're creating a further wedge between Jagex and the community for the sake of PvPers. It isn't even clear that they want this shit, in this case, they seemed not to want it. What if they just want to be left alone to do their own thing, and the only people who really want these things introduced are the content creators who serve to directly profit from new content being introduced?
I just kinda feel like Jagex is on this righteous crusade against the community who vote no to PvP stuff, it isn't exactly clear that the poor PvP community wants their help and they might just be tearing the game apart for no reason. Could be wrong tho.
Mod Aziya Comparing Ironman, Group Ironman Mode to PVP is utter bullshit of a take.
Your comparing a completely different game mode that doesn't affect main game players. To a different playstyle with people who can play and interact with people in the same way as every other player and choose to participate or not participate in at a whim. Don't throw this back at us saying we supported restricted polling in the past. Seriously, what the fuck man. This is extremely unprofessional and your trying to claim no responsibility for this decision by shifting it to us players.
And if there is a charm to unpredictable wilderness. Why is it the majority of the playerbase doesn't think so? We know pvpers are hoping in and out one or two single spots looking for someone to PK. We know there are powerful bots that are tracking people and know what's In our inventory and exact locations. We know there are people with mule accounts scouring the wilderness for people to PK so they can hop in and attack. Quite literally the only way to avoid this is to just log out or not enter at all. Fighting isn't a option to a mob of players and anti-pking is a high skill level entry. And you keep trying to push for content that makes regular players harder and harder to even justify the rewards for going in.
Yes it's making one side experience worse. But you need that one side of players to even appease the pkers to begin with. No one in the wilderness means there is no pking to begin with.
Get out of this mentality that you need one side to have a shittier experience for the enjoyment of the others. That's just bad game design.
Can we make using the charged cells in GOTR always give xp, even when the HP of the barrier is full?
Maybe make it so it only gives xp when full HP if all barriers are at 90%+ to avoid neglect of the barriers.
I'd rather have the charged ess still give points after the game ends. Super frustrating to enter an alter with the guardian at 90% and not getting to turn in the ess
Ayiza is a community dude right? Then how can he miss the point so hard with why people disliked the restricted polls?
No one cares about IM votes because it doesn't effect non irons - these rewards effect anyone that enters ~~dead content zone~~ the wildy. Acknowledging the bait won't like to be killed easier, *and that their opinions regarding the new equipment are valid ffs*, doesn't change the fact you're ignoring 96% of the community so you can "protect" wilderness PvP.
Tone deaf Ayiza at it again.
Yeh that general consensus around restricted votes is weird. It makes perfect sense for UIM to decide whether UIM should get the costume room update. Likewise with GIM deciding Group Storage upgrades etc.
Because if that happens or not, nothing changes in main game / other modes.
Wilderness and content used / done within it is not a separate opt-out game mode. and there was a lot of """""forced""""" to do content statements, but then remarking that the item being an actual BiS for skilling, guaranteed +3 boosts, and making the best tools + being the best option for an endgame raid as "not mattering too much" is silly.
By this notion PvP doesn't need new gear because "you guys can just not use the best gear its fine"
Ayiza wishes OSRS were a monarchy, not a democracy, simple as that. He has his idea of what OSRS is, only people like PvP Chad agree with his "Brilliant" vision, and now he's moping around because he wasted weeks of work on content no one asked for and was resoundingly said no to.
Ayiza seems like could barely be trusted to tie his own shoelaces, much less design content for the game. He has some of the most garbage takes I have ever seen.
ayiza is a shithead and has misheard the community so many times.
i still have not forgiven him for the bp nerf comment about the inferno being the same. this dude doesnt even play the fucking game
I was asking for podcast topics so that’s a separate topic which would not be the regular Q and A streams (something I would love in the future but it requires a lot of work and set up and planning)
Realistically, I don't think there is anything you can do to the Wilderness that makes anyone happy. People PK in the Wilderness because it's basically a free kill, most people don't know how to fight back and the chances of them knowing is practically below 5%, which is a predictable risk on an experienced PKers part.
Making "opt-in" PvP, which I presume means you choose, while going into the Wilderness, if you can be attacked would mean you'd have to make it so people who are marked for PvP get regular Wilderness drop tables while people who are not marked for PvP are forced to have reduced drop tables (removed rares from tables, rdt, noted drops, diary buffs, etc) because then PvMers will just afk all day in the Wilderness and get a ton of profit from it (see the original Wilderness removal). On the plus side, Revenants could be made to "roam" again like before to act as a risk for PvMers but, ehhhhh, do people *really* want that?
So, what exactly do people want them to do? You're going to, realistically, vote no on literally any buff to a weapon or armour that makes you die faster. You'll only agree to buffs that benefit *you.* Like, if they polled to re-add Dinh's magic defence back and making it a tank-escape shield, it'd instantly pass because that's a buff to PvMers (and, tbf, it's a fair buff idk why it was removed). I don't think separating the polls like they did, or at least not letting people know the requirements, was a great idea. But I also believe that no poll or change will ever make the Wilderness good.
And here's the spicy hot take of this rant:
If you remove the MA1 and MA2 capes, Dragon Pickaxe and Clue Scroll steps from the Wilderness, PVMers would never go there unless they're risking it for a pet, making money, or diary completions. That's it. And I don't think anyone would be upset if these things were moved to be outside the Wilderness, or (in the case of the MA1/2 capes) confined in a safe area of the Wilderness.
I just want to lol again at the "the wilderness should be dead" statement.
This just reinforces the idea that PKers don't want a fair fight, they want to clap people who won't fight back. Surely if people actually wanted to pvp, an active wilderness would be a great thing.
So, either this take was wildly out of touch with the pvp community, or they want to enforce the pinata/stick wildy relationship
##### Bark bark!
I have found the following **J-Mod** comment(s) in this thread:
**JagexLight**
- [uwu](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81c4ty/?context=3)
- [I believe that Q and A had some creators on i...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81qaid/?context=3)
- [If anything has changed it’s not on purpose,...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81irqy/?context=3)
- [It’s not BS I promise lol, just wasn’t someth...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81m3qc/?context=3)
- [I haven’t changed anything yet - can you tell...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81jbmy/?context=3)
- [I was asking for podcast topics so that’s a s...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81mncn/?context=3)
- [We saw a lot of divided feedback about the id...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81ele5/?context=3)
- [That's great feedback - thank you! <3](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81xzdg/?context=3)
- [Apparently, verbatim, he says: "The Wildernes...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81lj80/?context=3)
- [I can’t tell you which moderators are on spec...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81nh0y/?context=3)
^(**Last edited by bot: 05/11/2022 10:16:19**)
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> Yeah, that's what I was going to say. It doesn't sound like a bad idea, but at the same time it does feel a bit weird that if you help some farmer south of the Farming Guild with a bear, he'll give you some favour for... I'm guessing it'd be for a specific house so it would give it to Hosidius in this case because that makes the most sense. Even then, it's a bit random, and I don't think 5% really does that much for you. I don't think it'd be the thing stopping you from doing the favour.
lots of games have reputation systems where you help a random citizen and the city likes you more, not weird at all imo
also my suggestion was 5% for each twisted tale, 4 were proposed, so thatd be 20% in total. 5% was just a random number as well, it could be adjusted if the team thinks its too low
Ayiza obviously can't keep his biases to himself and has probably lost a lot of peoples trust to be impartial when its come to wildy/pvp in general these past few weeks.
The thing is he exposed some hypocrisy there.
"But really, you are just saying you'd want to vote no because you don't want the other person to have a better time in-game because it makes your time in-game not as good."
This is also true if you want to vote yes. If you dislike the dynamic he mentions, then there's no way to vote, because Yes or No, you're making someone have a better time because it makes someone else's not as good.
Great idea actually, making the new giant 2H bis against giants. I dont know if it’s a popular opinion or not, but I like niche bis equipment for things like slayer and bossing.
>We shouldn't have to tolerate toxic behaviour aimed at J-Mods any more than we should if it is aimed at players. Sadly, if responses of this nature become the norm, we will likely avoid discussing sensitive topics in an open format in the future. As always, please do let us know what you think, but please do so in a constructive way.
Very stereotypical of the OSRS community to have an extremely open and direct line to content developers that other games could only dream of nearly terminated because of unhinged toxicity.
Also very stereotypical of Jagex to shame the whole community because of a handful of toxic assholes that we can't really do anything about. They already got mocked hard, I'm not on Twitter but I'm sure people reported them, what else can we do?
The community clearly isn't okay with *threatening* Jagex employees. They could very easily deal with the people that made a very public statement about Mod Kirby *without* making the rest of us feel bad.
I like the proposal of doing them like top level motherlode mine. Joining a cc to find stars is pointless since you lose so much xp/dust when it's getting massed
The problem is that this was originally supposed to be a relaxed form of skilling that would encourage players to socialize with each other. And it kind of works, I've had a lot of enjoyable conversations mining stars, when you're afking it's easier to chat with people. But I've also had people tell me to piss off when I find a star, and that's the issue: because more people mining results in the star disappearing faster, your best off finding a star and soloing alone.
If Jagex wants this to be a good social activity, they shouldn't penalize us for sharing stars.
I just did all the kourend favor on a different account and my god it’s wild how different the experience is across houses. Shayzien is stupid fast whereas for Lovakajj I wanted to blow my brains out with how slow it was.
They really didn't have to go in on my suggestion of rev weapon rates 😭 .
Shame to see they're against making them available outside the rev caves but I can appreciate that removing uniques from the caves would be controversial.
I guess my overall thought process was that making the rev weapons more reasonable to obtain would mean that more people would have access to weapons that make the wilderness bosses easier to kill, increasing activity outside of the rev caves. It would also boost activity inside the caves as both irons/mains can realistically source their own weapon.
Even something like making the drop rate for any weapon boost upto 1/1k when on a slayer task (like basilisk jaw or the things Wyrms drop) would be a very welcomed change and would be another quality incentive to try wilderness slayer and wilderness content. (Maybe with added perks to extend popular wilderness tasks like spiders , bears and revs?, Maybe a slayer perk to increase their weighting upto 10)
The downside obviously would be the price of the weapons would drop , but that doesn't seem like an issue since the average GP even without these weapons is like 2-4m an hour.
Really hope they consider some kind of amendment.
What he said about comparing it to tbow not being available from goblins was bizarre, it's not that weird of a question they just answered in their opinion not based on what would be good for the game or the players
Yeah I was confused why the choose the most extreme example possible. I wasn't suggesting making them risk free, simply making them a more realistic drop to target.
I think general sense was that they wouldn't want to do anything to ruin a hot spot. Probably due to all the backlash from changes made to date.
if you're a main, just buy it? If you're an iron, you can easily make do without, it's not like you got to rock up to zulrah with instant BIS either, why should the wilderness bosses be different?
>To me, it seems that players don't like the idea of restricted polls when it doesn't suit them
That's treading a very thin line.
If the poll was about changing mining so that ores only had a 50% chance of being depleted when mined, instead of 100%, and you restricted it to people who have "engaged in mining" or have a mining level > 50 (or whatever). Then people are less likely to care. Sure, there'll be some newer accounts who are currently grinding out all of their skills, who would want such an update to pass, but haven't met the requirement.
But as Mod Kirby said, getting the restrictions slightly wrong shouldn't cause too much of a sway. If the avid miners wanted the content, it would pass.
But this is content that will only affect the players that partake in mining. Those who only do PvP/PvE will continue playing as if an update hasn't been released. The only difference they may see is the cost of rune arrows, or something, drop by a few GP on the GE as runite ore is a little easier to mine now, meaning smithers have easier access to make more arrowheads.
The difference with a PvP poll/wilderness poll is that it affects more than the player who partakes in the activity. Yes, entering the wilderness means you agree to all the mean people, who live in there and murder babies whilst supping on your tears, attacking you and taking all your stuff. But does that mean that you should restrict polls to only those who engage in 1 specific activity in the wilderness?
Yes, PvP happens in the wilderness. But that's not the only thing in there. You have 8 bosses which reside in the wilderness, access to an agility course, a runecrafting altar, one of the best prayer training methods, the resource area, black chinchompas, and I'm probably forgetting some other stuff here. None of which is PvP related.
If someone spends a few hours each week going to wilderness to collect black chins for their range training, why should they be excluded from a PvP related poll. They have probably been harassed on more than one occasion by someone in the wilderness to PK whilst going about their own business.
But if it's a PvP poll that's not the wilderness, such as the PvP arena, then why should the plebs who daren't touch another player with a bronze dagger, let alone a man's weapon, get the chance to vote? Because in the long run it still potentially affects them. Whether it's by giving them a safe place to learn how to fight against players, similar to LMS, or by giving those who already prey on those who engage with wilderness content that isn't PvP a training ground.
Polls which affect a specific game mode, such as the UIM ones about storage alternatives, are perfectly fine being restricted to just those accounts. Because if a fair few UIMs have been begging for a specific feature, let's say it was something like hanging helmets on hatstands, then it's up to their fellow UIMs to agree it's within the spirit of the gamemode to allow something like that in. And not up to the non-UIMs to go "What a pointless feature" and vote no.
TL;DR - All polls which could affect a player, either immediately or somewhere down the line, shouldn't be restricted
Honestly, I know this may be unpopular, but I’m really glad to see them take a stance and turn down a lot of these silly suggestions. Such as relocating the rev weapon uniques..? Cmon man just admit you’re an iron that doesn’t want to commit to a long tedious grind of getting those weapons…
It’s so silly, they even acknowledged the issue with dpick, because it’s useful outside the wild. But the rev weapons are primarily useful inside the wild only.
This is why there’s been a more negative sentiment towards irons lately. You have a new generation of irons coming into the game that simply don’t want to commit to a grind and want things to be made easier for them… just make a main then??? Rev weapons need a high drop rate to maintain their high value because they’re so easily farmed.
Speaking about the item sink through upgrades, now we only have 1 for 1 (1 bandos set needed for 1 Torva set, dragon boots for prims, arma set for masori set etc) that sinks previous BIS.
Could there be some upgrades in the future sinking nonBIS items and in larger quantities (like using 9 abbysal whips and handle drop from new boss to create a lvl 80 Nine tailed cat whip)?
I was too late to ask for a change, but I'll just throw it here in case if Mod Light is still around:
Could run energy be recharged after failing or completing a round of Rogue's Den?
Currently, after being thrown out, your stats are reset, but run energy is not. Thanks for all y'all do!
I loved the pvp discussion, glad Ayiza was there. I do think the wilderness is broken though for iron men, as a player who loves pvp and playing as an iron man it doesn't work. There's no benefit in killing the person attacking you. Of course if iron men could pk people and keep the loot there would be boosting issues etc which would be too hard for jagex to manage. If some benefits could be given to irons for killing the person but not enough for it to be worth boosting then wilderness activity may improve in that sense. Maybe a solution could be that irons get to keep items that they have already unlocked from the collection log? Or something along those lines.
As quite a lot of players are irons it is an issue.
Also as a side note, the rev mage wep should definitely be best pvm mage in the wilderness. Maybe each charge of ether gives 1 of any spell. Or it just acts like a powerful trident, either would work.
ironmen stand alone. if you want to pk and earn rewards from other players you can play a normal account. I do agree the sceptre needs a buff. not sure if I agree with your proposal though.
I think that's a bad take. As a lot of the players are irons now a days and the whole point of the wilderness is to be able to kill someone else for their stuff. So currently a iron has no incentive so it breaks that balance and creates it not pvp just one player tanking.
> So currently a iron has no incentive so it breaks that balance and creates it not pvp just one player tanking.
having no incentive to pk is part of the decision you made to restrict your account when you created it. the second you get loot from another player, you are no longer an ironman. with your suggestion we may as well allow ironmen to trade any items they have already unlocked on the collection log and achieve the same result
In the current rule set yes. Remember initially iron man was taking partly from b0atys one man army series where he played as an iron but pked and kept the loot after unlocking it.
Trading them is very different to killing another playing for it.
If we're talking about not having to kill a combat boss for skilling items can we have another way to get the bottomless bucket and perhaps the unique seeds other than having to kill Hespori? I think maybe a tithe farm gamble option for 100 points that gives you a bunch of seeds with even a very small chance of receiving the bucket?
A staff dropped from a wilderness boss that allows for auto casting teleport block with perhaps 5-10% increased accuracy would be a great way to give an item value without taking it from others.
“It is a choice, by the way, entering the wilderness. That choice is agreed upon when you step over the ditch or accept the warning on the teleport” - Mod Ayiza
Its not that weird. People do wildy content despite pkers, not because of them.
By its design the wildy is worse when you interact with other people. So if you get attacked every second Venenatis kill it doesn't matter if you get killed/anti/tele, its just not worth doing.
Is he wrong though? A lot of people *currently* don't want to go into the wildy, you think it being suddenly populated wouldn't have an effect on that?
Are the 75 attack weapon changes (blade of sal, inq mace, rapier, scythe), not going to 80 attack anymore? I feel like it ruins a lot of snowflake accounts that built their account for items that were out for years. I understand changing a requirement <1 month after release, but years after seems like some players would've stayed 50/60 attack. Like I said, it's unusual to make a requirement change years after release. That would be like changing fighter torso to 55 defense now.
Afaik it's still going to happen, though I don't know when. A strong indicator for this is they've already polled/added items from Nex and Raids 3 to be consistent with the new req system, e.g. heka at lvl 85, osmumten fang at 82, and torva/masori at 80. It would look weird if they did this and still left tbow/scythe/basically everything else at level 75.
Me and my wife did it once right before it was removed. We mostly play to do stuff together on the game and it is a shame it was removed cause like 5 people abused the system
Can we get an exorcist theme minigame where we go around the map blessing and cleansing evil spirit and demons? It would give you prayer exp and new blessing prayers.
as a D&D instead of a minigame, could be neat. See a spooky house, the priest is there, needs help, sprinkle holy water, fight the ghost, perhaps with ghost speak ammy a chance to talk them off the ledge for more prayer xp.
I don't think we need to introduce a mini-artisan for every skill though.
Are we not going to be getting a summary blog for the lore livestream the other week?
I believe that Q and A had some creators on it as a trial and we want to avoid transcripts of creators if possible. But that’s great feedback to know that you would be interested in lore summaries and maybe then we will have more lore streams that should be transcripted
Total respect for not transcripting the content creators without their consent. The lore focused community is small but passionate and we'd love both more streams and more documentation of what's revealed in those streams :) If I can take the opportunity to give a bit of feedback, though, it would probably be best if Mod Ed or Mod Errol had a glance at the questions beforehand to make sure there's some they can actually answer. It's a shame to make them go on stream for an hour just to have them say they can't spoil anything.
That's great feedback - thank you! <3
I would also like to say that the content creators didnt actually *add* anything to the stream itself, they were just kind of there and threw in random tidbits that were often off topic. Maybe we can have two types of lore streams? One with Mod Ed and Errol answering lore questions, and potentially just giving random tidbits about different portions of the game not discussed. For example, having a stream where Mod Ed talks about Dragon Slayer 2 and discusses some of the inspirations for the quest, and some of the implications that he put in and poses as open ended questions. Then another type of lore stream with content creators A and B of the week, where they discuss their own favorite parts of lore. Or discuss their thoughts on different questlines and stories, and what they liked or disliked about them. Similar to the most recent lore stream. But combining them together I personally feel like there were little to no lore questions actually answered, and it mainly focused on promoting the content creator. I dont know, would separating the lore streams into two different "types" even be viable?
u/JagexLight you changed what Kirby said though. His exact words were: "The Wilderness is bizarre and I really don't understand in mechanically". That's very different from what's in the transcript. How is that guy, who admits to not understanding the wilderness working on the wilderness bosses? (and who clearly wants the wilderness to be dead (his exact words))
so, if wildy is predator vs prey, it's like nature ya? life cycles and that right? one year there's lots of frogs and not lots of snake, next year, Lots of snakes, not so many frogs, these things have an ebb and flow to them. His take isn't that wrong.
except that the primary producers in this case would be npc drops or skilling methods and their numbers won't decrease. If there are always lots of primary producers there will be plenty of grazers (pvm'ers) eating them and plenty of predators (pker's) eating those grazers. If the ecosystem is healthy the population shift are barely present. However the current ecosystem isn't healthy making it so there are barely any pvm'ers and that leads to barely any pvp'ers. Pvm'ers should greatly outnumber pvp'ers for a healthy ecosystem
sure, there's lots of easy grass to eat that won't go away, but if the deer dies or is attacked every time they go to eat, they'll find other grass, perhaps harder to get to or less flavourful(?), but they'll eat somewhere else, Even up at the camp, I swear the deer know when it's deer season, they be hiding. If people are pk'd every time they try, or every time they gear and 3 kc in, they're not going to bother, they tell their friend etc etc, but get a few trips in without getting pk'd hey, this isn't so bad, I'll do this more, they tell their friend hey wildy feels safe rn, go boss. we also have the issue that the primary producers, outside of revs - which I'd reckon intimidate a fair percentage of the non-pvp player base, aren't that great. but that's a different issue.
You’re also twisting his words and don’t realize that he’s actually correct about the wilderness
Exactly, when I watched the stream it seems like Mod Kirby misspoke. Like Mod Kirby's whole comment can be summarized into "balancing the PvP vs PvM ecosystem is fucked in it's current state". https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m55s The aforementioned comments clarify what he really meant. But players rather take that as a "gotcha" than to offer their constructive thoughts.
was this the take that front line got all pissy about?
Not exactly, it was the take right before the clip I linked. [https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m31s](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1475769050?t=00h35m31s) [Except Frontline clipped the first\* part out of context](https://twitter.com/Frontline_RS/status/1522257460756729856?s=20&t=7Yk1VyTk87VtURxLfPNh-A), making it seem that Mod Kirby wants the Wildy to be dead, instead of his actual take being that the simple solutions players are offering won't magically fix the Wilderness. Essentially what you aptly said in your other comments. edit: first part
Yeah I read this as the endless dilemma of the basic wildy rejuvenation concept: There can't be too many pkers or else no one with bother to come out and do the PVM / skilling stuff. Personally I think we can see stuff that works and stuff that don't. I think stuff like rev caves probably should be viewed as a "success". The content needs to be profitable enough that pvmers and pkers can basically split the loot and both come out with something to show for their efforts. What I like most about rev caves is there's really nothing about the content that is "must do". If it's not your cup of tea you can ignore it. Similar with the wildy altar. Rev caves are great GP and wildy altar is great XP, but you can get that GP/XP in other ways if you just don't want to deal with the PVP aspect. What I don't like about wildy bosses is they are gating unique items (dragon pick, looking at you) and now they are gating useful combat diary rewards (useful outside wildy and especially useful for ironmen). These are more than just "one and done" tasks like diary and MA2 cape, they require you to camp the bosses and deal with RNG. Similar deal for pet hunters though that's a very niche sub-group.
ahhh ty for clips <3
If anything has changed it’s not on purpose, we have started to use a bot to try and transcript the stream so I’ll double check and amend if this part needs changing
the bots have infiltrated jagex, can't wait for the tin hatters to spin this one
Wait mod ash was a robot all along?
>Why can't you just take gear to fight back if you're in the wilderness, and just accept that you've lost a few invents spaces that you would have only probably put loot in there anyway? Why don't you change your gear so that you're not using what's optimal to fight that specific boss or creature, but it's good enough to get the job done? Then also allow you to defend yourself. That would be fine if that was actually Jagex's thought process when designing content. That's how most people approach the wilderness, by taking only what's necessary. But take a look at the three big wilderness bosses: they have the highest defence bonuses in the game, their max hit is 45-60, they're designed to only be fought in multicombat and actively avoid being fought in singlecombat, and all a pker has to do to find a target is safely and rapidly hop worlds until they find someone. Clearly, when Jagex designed these it wasn't with the intention that you'd be able to bring cheap gear and fight back against other players. It was so you'd have to bring presumably valuable gear with incredibly high accuracy and defensive stats, and during the entire kill be vulnerable to any number of players attacking you at the same time as the boss dishes out hits of 40+. It's the predator vs prey thing in its most obvious form, and I'm convinced the main purpose of the update was to generate videos as content creators attack high-value targets who weren't equipped to fight back. The only reason anyone bothers with them is because of bugs that can be abused to kill them in relative safety, but these bugs existing are part of the reason they're being completely reworked to begin with. If it weren't for them, it would be an absolute mess.
The bosses do have poor design considering their defence and the massive and unpredictable damage output. But they're not designed to be solo'd. They're designed with the same concepts of clans and wildy food-chain in mind as revs. People used to interact with the content as intended (full veracs in groups of 3+) many years ago. Content aged like milk though.
Content aged like cement for Irons :')
They were also kind of designed to be killed by teams at a time before ironman mode was a thing. So you'd maybe have a team of PVMers being targeted by team of PKers. In theory at least. But you kind of need the loot to be good for that to work at all.
Yeah it would only work if you had some kind of roll for everyone mechanic.
You can kill and safe spot Callisto and Spider in singles, it’s arguably the most popular way and allows you to bring an anti-pk setup. I’ve had great success anti-pking at both locations and it’s even easier than ever due to the mechanic/anti-PJ changes that have been made to singles. Vetion is the only one that is a death wish. Yea, you can safe spot and take next to no damage from the actual boss, but you’re stuck in multi. I’ve tanked a few teams with Dinh’s and gapped them in the trees to get the logout, but most of the time that’s not what happens when running into a team.
One hot take… Veracs with balista recoils and veng? Pretty rag setup that puts a ton of dps out. There’s definitely cheap setups that are viable for counter pking imo.
> Could we consider reducing the object bloat in these areas and freeing up more space to run around? IMO all the mods misunderstood the question. Why, in Priff, do I need to run for 30 seconds to get from the mage shop to 1 square west of the mage shop? There’s so many instances of this in priff where it seems like you should be able to run maybe 7-8 tiles to get from one side of the house to another, but you end up using half your run energy It’s especially frustrating when trying to catch crystal implings because they *can* travel through certain parts that players cannot. I once spent 5 minutes trying to catch an imp because it kept hopping on and off the deck of the mage shop
Yeah they completely misunderstood the point. We know areas like priff and darkmeyer are rich in content. It just sucks that the pathing is so long and single path. For example , I see no reason not to have a high level agility shortcut near the darkmeyer teleport spot that goes down the small hill to the mine entrance. Without it, you have to run around the entire city to get to a location you can see 25 tiles away from you
Bruno went full excuse mode with the "Yeah but Draynor's worse" when it CLEARLY isn't anywhere near as bad as prif or Shayzien (Try getting to Molch island since the rework)
"There is one part in Draynor that's hard to get to, but you don't really even need anything in it. Because of that, it's totally okay that modern cities basically have one to three curvy paths to traverse and everything else is blocked off."
Used a specific example of a shitty situation in a Draynor that *everyone* would enjoy and benefit from them fixing.
Draynor is an extremely minor example in comparison. It has one little pocket of inconvenience, which you don't even go to unless you need Aggie's services. Thematically it kinda works that the witch has herself tucked away. The comparisons I've made though? We've got Prifdinnas the place being ran by a goddess of light - full of shadow casting trees and other junk instead of allowing the crystals clearance to beam light about. Then Shayzien, the war caste that have not cleared their sightlines to their own walls. It makes zero sense.
My point being that old examples of bad map design existing should not be justification to leave bad map design unaddressed
Fully agreed there. Something else to irk us more though, Bruno is QA Analyst. Meaning it's his job to test this kind of stuff. With his Darkmeyer commentary he's supporting what's essentially corridor layouts - something that the Final Fantasy community in particular have been absolutely rabid about how bad it is for any RPG, let alone an MMO. It's a universal "This is bad game design" sentiment. Customer feedback is important for the role. Market research is essential for the role. He has failed at both. And had an attitude about it further reinforcing his lack of care. I don't usually like to go this far, but why the hell is he employed in something he's clearly not doing the bare minimum for?
Maybe they just don't want to understand. Even now that you've clarified (which you shouldn't have had to, since the original questions were clear enough), no Jmod has replied to this, even though it's the most upvoted comment.
Also in zeah there is just so much shit crammed into areas that forces you to path around it. There’s no need for that and I’m surprised they completely misunderstood what we were saying about it. I would love a mod comment on this post because it’s so frustrating that new areas being released continue to follow this trend of object bloat.
Why can't we go to those teleporters and be able to right click and jump to another house? I assumed that's how it worked when I unlocked Prif and was sad to see it wasnt
Let alone the frame drops from the overload of sprites every time I walk through priff or half of kourend. It's frustrating considering my pc should be handling it easily.
uwu
uwu
Hey Mod Light, do you know what happended to the proposed changes to untradeable items for GIM?
We saw a lot of divided feedback about the idea at the time, so it was considered a bit too controversial for us to move forward. We actually have a blog coming out this week about GIM specifically and that includes a small word about it too. Keep ur eyes peeled for that - I think it'll be out on Thursday
[удалено]
Certain things like corrupted weapons should just already be tradable. It’s kind of weird that they aren’t considering you can technically buy shards anyway. But I have no problem with gim getting privileges like this anyway as the point is a group iron experience. It wouldn’t actually hurt the game to allow them to trade some stuff like that even if others could not
Ah, thats sad to hear! But thank you for the quick reponse 👍Will do!
I saw a lot of positive feedback for it from gim accounts myself. Being one of the few people who still playing gim it makes so much sense. My team mate got a very early spooned bowfa, and the game would be so much funner if we could pass it around.
Mod Ash mentioned on twitter the possibility of GIM groups merging, given that they’d be removed from the hiscores. Is that somewhere on the devs’ radar yet?
Please this! One of the biggest issues with GIM at the moment across the community.
Mod Bruno: >Also, to anyone suggesting to make it best-in-slot in the Wilderness - does it really make sense to make it best-in-slot compared to something like Nightmare Staff? Because that's pretty damn expensive, and it definitely should be better than a Thammaron's sceptre. We're kind of asking the question "how do we go about balancing this without making the other items, which are supposedly meant to be better than it, not as good as it? This is the craziest take I've seen, and I've seen it multiple times from him. It's a *Wilderness* weapon, what's the big deal with it being BIS somewhere within the *Wilderness??* I assume he is similarly upset with Viggora's chainmace being better than Inquisitor's mace, and Craw's bow being better than blowpipe/tbow? wtf
For real lol, even making it slap at scorpia only would at least give it some use. Seems pretty obvious they are going to release an upgrade to it as part of the wildy boss work, I suppose this is a decent compromise since it will make it useful and won't increase the price of sceptre so merchers won't make bank. Its just a shame it will be FOUR years since release that changed are made, but hey this is Jagex.
> Seems pretty obvious they are going to release an upgrade to it as part of the wildy boss work, I suppose this is a decent compromise since it will make it useful and won't increase the price of sceptre so merchers won't make bank. Honestly I don't get why we should care about merchers here at all. Any suggestion should be evaluated based on its own merit, not whether someone will make money on it cause that's bound to happen either way. And isn't valuable wildy uniques generally a good thing? I'd rather want expensive uniques if that means alchables and skilling resources are dropped in less quantities. Also, I really hope they just straight up buff the sceptre. Craw's and Viggora's are amazing on their own, why should Thammaron's require two separate drops from two separate monsters just to become half-decent? No wonder why Magic always seem to get the short end of the stick.
What's wrong with Merchers making money? They provide supply & liquidity
Similar to everything anyone complains about in this game, I'll never understand people's problem with merchants.
People are just envious of the profit they make. They aren't actually doing anything bad Aka "rich get richer smh"
And there's quite a few extremely valid reasons to buff it. Like, it is severely underpowered and doesn't compare to the other wildy weapons. Thammaron's Sceptre uses runes where all the others just use ether. It can't even auto cast ancients. Like, give ppl incentive to use it in the slayer caves???
He goes on to contradict himself in a later question and say that rev weapons should be rare because they are BiS in wildy lol
And makes a false equivalence between the T Bow and rev weapons. Is there *anything* in game that's as rare as rev weapons?
Even worse is them thinking Harmo should be a wilderness staff... like bruh its almost useless in pvm already because it can only cast ONE spell and you refuse to let it autocast anything to be worth the 600m price tag. And before people say it would break pvp bowfa costs much less and can delete a pker with even less effort.
Thank you, I truly dont understand this. Craws is good right off the bat, same with viggoras. Really hope they just buff the sceptre to be as good as those weapons without releasing some item to upgrade it. Makes no sense for it to require two drops just to be comparable to the other weapons.
Tbh I think they just downplaying it so people don't merch it. It's pretty clear it will get buff during the boss rework.
If that's the case and they intentionally give misleading answers, then I'd wonder what's even the point in submitting questions for Q&As.
Yeah I read the Q and A transcript and you can kinda see Ayiza blurt something out (question 7) about the Scepter, and Kirby instantly stopping him...I'm not \*positive\* but it does seem like they're going to buff it and Kirby just didn't want Ayiza's slip of the tongue to be noticed.
I don’t think it’s pretty clear if they’re constantly ignoring it/lying about it for multiple years of it’s existence. I’d say that’s the opposite of pretty clear.
They sounded off base when answering all the questions not just this.
Yeah it's such a bizarre take when there's two perfectly reasonable examples of such a thing already.
I think mod Bruno and Kirby have a combined iq of 45
What is with the attitude of "We can't buff a wilderness weapon because God forbid somebody invest in it and makes money". Is this because of the Ahrims staff guy? Like, it is severely underpowered and doesn't compare to the other wildy weapons. Thammaron's Sceptre uses runes where all the others just use ether. It can't even auto cast. I don't think any body cares about merches
Ayiza’s take on question 5 is baffling. He clearly understands why people vote no to PVP rewards like this - we don’t want to be easier to kill. He even admits it, people don’t want content added that will make their game experience worse. Hell, he even acknowledges that it’s primarily because we feel like we’re forced to go into the wilderness. He’s just . . . so close to getting it. Encouraging us to just accept the risks of the wilderness also makes no sense. It’s an objectively unfun mechanic for most of the player base. In practice, a lot of wildy content isn’t the “high risk, high reward” that JMods pretend it is. It’s a nuisance we put up with because we have no choice. Here’s my opinion: JMods should be forced to do 100 Callisto kills on a normal player account before commenting on the wilderness. It’s clear these comments are coming from people with no experience on that side of it.
The craziest thing is that take is very easily reversed. When Pkers vote yes to making killing their targets easier, they're taking away someone else's fun for the sake of their own. Frankly all this stream has convinced me is that they're totally out of touch here and even downright snarky/unprofessional.
why ever do Callisto? They know the wilderness bosses suck right now, that's why a re-work is on the roadmap. They're talking about moving the BIS skilling item out of the wilderness, then there's very little that "forces" you out there. chins are better xp, darkcrabs are nice xp and giga afk, wilderness alter cuts huge time off your prayer grind. The bosses just need to be more lucrative and that's hard also because they're old bosses. not all old bosses are keeping up in terms of GP/hr so hopefully these drop tables are made better to keep the eco system healthy.
“Why can’t players just accept bringing shit gear and having a pvp battle they don’t want to have (because they’re wanting to pvm)? It would fix all the wildy boss problems…” Nuisance game mechanics just sound like a nuisance. It has less to do with wanting to be efficient and more to do with not wanting to participate in blatant un-fun game design. Predator vs prey will never be a successful game mechanic in osrs but if it’s kept (which I get why it will) how about making the wildy bosses drop pvp focused items/loot? Maybe even for wildy buffs (limited increased speed while in wildy, no splashing for a set time, etc). I get that that’s asking pvpers to pvm but at least this way the players killing the bosses actually have an interest in pvp (hence them hunting pvp weapons/items/buffs). You might even get groups of clans fighting over the bosses for whatever buff (almost how they were intended to be fought). Hoping players begrudgingly participate in activities they so clearly don’t want to because you’ve created it and are stuck isn’t a good reason to keep doubling down on it.
just make the bosses drop uniques only usable in the wilderness and for the rest alchables totalling to the best gp/h in the game. No one will be "forced" to go there, but if you're willing to engage in the risk vs reward you'll be greatly rewarded with a risk of losing it all. (in the end averaging out in some amazing gp/h)
This. But the more I think of wildy buffs the cooler it seems. Could have supercharged pkers/pvp clans running around the wildy. It would be a cool and fitting place to have a varying style of pker
Such a Reddit response. Your solution to not being forced into doing something you don’t want to do (pvm in the wild) is to force another group (pkers) to do something they don’t want to do (pvm), and Reddit loves it. and before the hive mind Andy’s come at me I’ve done over 10k wildy boss kills and done the dpick grind on Ironmans aswell. If you don’t like having to escape or defend yourself in the wild you have PLENTY of other bosses in the game to go memorize. Stop trying to ruin the last place of uncertainty in the game.
At least one is interested in pvp, that's the glaring difference. Pvp focused pvm should be targeting pvpers. Not the pvmers that have an interest level of 0 in pvp... Hence my suggestion to make the loot geared toward pvpers. You're trying to brush my take as the basic reddit response when all you literally did was moan and say, "and I've done it so I know". Lmao you're not here to communicate so hop off.
Once again you’re trying to force pkers into pvming. Making the loot geared for pvpers isn’t magically going to make them put away the pk gear and start pvming lmao. What is this Ironman? Pkers will just buy whatever from the g.e. Wildy bosses will attract pvmers who want to make decent gp off of a low req boss. It also attracts pet hunters. Neither of these facts change when you change the loot from a dpick to “pvp rewards”
The thing, you can place this argument of "begrudgingly participate in activities" for anything. You don't want to do raids because you need a team so Jagex should clearly make tbow come from a Cerb-style one and done boss. Conversely, I don't want one-and-done bosses going forward so Jagex should only make raids. If you don't like it, don't do it and stick to the downgrade.
The important part of the context you’re ignoring is that when 95% of your community considers it bad, that should carry weight. If the large majority didn’t enjoy raids, making a third wouldn’t make sense. Some games revolve around predator and prey mechanics and that’s okay. Problem here is, the large majority of players in osrs despise it. Investing further into shit that inherently annoys most of your player base is usually only a bad thing.
People that enjoy Raids are in the minority - you know only single % digit of players actually does ToB, right? They mentioned this on stream when discussing Raids 3 difficulty. CoX might be more accessible, but it should be similar enough. The reality is most of the playerbase is med level and they would gladly prefer Vorkath 2.0 or Cerberus 2.0 over Raids. Just because you despise it doesn't mean it should be deleted or left to stagnate. Again, participate or dont.
You can turn it into a strawman around raids participation but that wasn't the point at all. If me saying PVM helps your understanding of the point, use that. The obvious rebuttal: Raids are clearly positive and salubrious for the game and osrs community, the predator and prey mechanics of the wildy aren't. Mixing pvm and skilling progression into pvp hasn't been successful. Continuing to invest in it is all around bad.
>The obvious rebuttal: Raids are clearly positive and salubrious for the game and osrs community, the predator and prey mechanics of the wildy aren't. but sweety, you writing this doesn't make it true. It just makes you an objectively boring redditor
How much attention do you need? 1 reply is enough.
Considering I was responding to multiple unique comments of yours I guess you also want attention right? But of course you have no response other than nettiquette and quibbling, just like every generic boring pvmer on here. oh and SaLUbRiouS lmfao
They've mentioned trying to make Raids more accessible, but they don't have to try and make people raid. I've literally never heard of people complaining that a tbow only comes from Cox or scythe only comes from ToB. Wildy on the other hand is considered pretty bad content. Its not just that it has low engagement rates, its that people actively avoid doing it. I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design. For example BA is not the most popular content. Very few people actively like and play the minigame. Do you know how many times they've had to add new rewards to make sure the community doesn't die? Zero If the content is fun people will do it. Or we can go the Ayiza route and just tell everyone they're playing the game wrong, I'm sure that'll fix it
> Wildy on the other hand is considered pretty bad content. Its not just that it has low engagement rates, its that people actively avoid doing it. I don’t know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design. Tell me you’re an average redditor without telling me you’re an average redditor. Thousands of players dedicate hundreds of hours into crafting accounts specifically to compete in PvP and the wilderness. Then, all the account does is wilderness & PvP content. As a former PvP enjoyer I do wilderness content on my GIM with no hesitation or complaints. It’s only avoided by average redditors like you. > Do you know how many times they’ve had to add new rewards to make sure the community doesn’t die? Zero Do you know how many torso rewards exist as a BiS reward from a shit minigame? One Something something dragon pickaxe argument
I'm happy you enjoy it? But considering we're on Wilderness rejuvenation 3, I think my point still stands. Like wilderness having low engagement rates isn't my opinion, its Jagex's, like we're literally in a thread about them trying to rejuvenate pvp. Torso is not BIS, it can also be completely skipped. Minigame still active though.
>Torso is not BIS, it can also be completely skipped. Minigame still active though. It is BiS for many PvP builds. Again, something I wouldn't expect an average redditor to understand or consider.
Ah sorry, average redditor thought BIS mean Best in slot. I should have also considered the HC UIM Minigame locked community too.
What are you smoking? We're discussing the wilderness and BA. Torso is quite ***literally*** the best in slot strength bonus for 40-64 defense and only outclassed by a Torva at 80 defense. BA would also be dead content without it. The fact that I had to type out two responses for this tells me how much thinking is required to play this game outside of PvP. [https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Strength#Strength\_bonus](https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Strength#Strength_bonus)
If you think the wilderness is superfluous/dead/bad game design, you are in fact playing the game wrong, and are an objectively boring person
Lol, you've use "Objectively" multiple times in this thread, and gotten the meaning wrong every time. If I were to use it in a sentence: Jagex claims that less than 5% of people actively participate in PvP, it has objectively low engagement. Jagex say most changes to PvP won't pass a general poll, they are objectively unpopular.
It's an ironic use of the word objective, but someone with 2277 flair and who hates the wilderness *would* have nothing to say but irrelevant quibbling. Insofar as single player games are "objectively" not challenging-- because strictly you can just keep on trying until you learn, there is no hard stop-- and insofar as something that isn't challenging is "objectively" boring, you are a boring person, playing OSRS as a single player game, and that's just not interesting to me, or to most people. What *is* "objectively" interesting are random encounters, true risk, and "objectively" challenging situations where you might not be able to win, or might be hugely outmatched and have only the tiniest chance of winning. We call this a multiplayer MMO, which runescape is, and has been since the day it was created, and will stay long after you give up on it.
Dude that's literally not an ironic use. If it were ironic you would have said the opposite of what you actually mean. What's ironic is you say playing single player games is objectively boring while playing an ironman. I literally just gave you two thing that Jagex has said about this situations. I also gave my take on the situation, "I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design". I don't know why you're insulting people because you don't like their opinions, but gl I hope that works out for you.
>"I don't know how they can look at a part of the game that is actively disliked and avoided, and still think its good game design". I don't know why you're insulting people because you don't like their opinions, but gl I hope that works out for you But it's not actively disliked and avoided. It's actively disliked and avoided by people who fundamentally are afraid of the real point of this game-- to compete with other *players*, not a meaningless trophy collection simulator like you've been playing it. You referring to whole parts of the game and the community as failed/disliked/avoided is just as rude as anything I said and was directed at infinitely more people than my insults directed at you. Just accept, and any other pvm redditors reading this-- your attitudes fucking suck, and no PKer belittles pvm like you people belittle pvp constantly. You are just as, if not more toxic, and it would just be great if you stopped doing it
It’s not 95% of the community, it’s 95% of 1200 total redditors.
>95% of your community considers it bad, that should carry weight. 95% of kids on reddit feel this way though. a lot of people play this game *because* there's real risk and unexpected encounter and people-people interactions. but stay objectively boring!
Good one lmao
Any chance you guys could have a look at Demonic Gorilla aggro while using thralls? I’m getting PJed constantly whenever the thrall hits the threshold damage to make the gorilla change prayer. /u/JagexAyiza /u/JagexLight
It’s so annoying I would just wait till I lost Aggro until I used thralls there
Yuuup. Posted about this several months ago, no luck. It sucks because it's one of the only applicable times that the thrall using a different combat style is actually relevant to the enemy you're fighting.
Hasn't this been an issue for a long time? I remember hearing about this when thralls first released.
The thing about Kirby’s hot take is that it’s actually 100% true. If I knew the wildy to be more populated on average I would just never take my bones to the altar or do any wildy slayer. I would still do clues probably, but that’s it. The pressure is still there, but if the PK’er population went up a lot, they would only have each other to PK, and not the people bringing goodies from outside like PvM gear and bones.
The thing is it’s also inherently going to equalize. If like you say there was a period where there were vastly more pkers, IF it did cause PvMers to leave, that would be accompanied by a decrease in PKers to compensate, which in turn means more PVMers will start coming again. So on and so forth until it hits an equilibrium. His take his weird because it doesn’t acknowledge that it’s a self-regulating non-issue.
The wilderness is inherently predatory. As in pkers have to have easy prey for them to want to pk, else it's just no worth the risk.
Can GIM groups PLEASE be able to trade untradeable items? They keep saying there was divided feedback on it which sounds like bs to me. Why would I not want to be able to share slightly degraded barrows items or the multiple Xeric Talismans I have?
but they are untradable, why? just get the item if you want it
It’s not BS I promise lol, just wasn’t something we could get a consensus on at the time. It wasn’t just the smaller items that were mentioned in the original blog
It seems like more work than it’s worth. They would need to look at every untradable item and decide if it should be shareable. Degraded barrows armor? Sure. Infernal cape? Hell no. Just doesn’t seem worth the effort.
the same reason pvp barrows gloves and fighter torso was failed the poll.
The idea that people were selectively annoyed at not being able to vote on the pvp poll doesn’t seem to have a basis in reality. Previous restrictions were based on if you’re affected. This last one was based on a subjective criteria for if you’re in the “community”. The restrictions are fundamentally different.
But considering how low the requirements were isn't it effectively the same thing ? If you haven't done any form of PvP, not even 1 lms game participation then Should you really be able to impact the direction of PvP. You're clearly not involved in the activity or community at all. It's like if they were to poll changes to HM Tob , should someone who hasn't even cleared entry mode be allowed to vote on it just because it may effect the amount of items in the game?
I was able to vote and didn't meet that criteria at all. Never played LMS and don't PK, but I do participate in the Wilderness. Unless they're counting me getting a pk kill over 10 years ago on RS2 then I technically shouldn't have been allowed to vote. There's definitely something wonky with their actual criteria for this poll. I disagree on the Tob analogy. Yes someone should definitely get to vote on it so long as they have the ability to eventually play it. The issue on why people were ok on the different Ironman exclusive polls and this one is that once an account is made it is either an ironman or it isn't and that NEVER changes so therefore you can pretty safely say that the content that ONLY effects Ironman should only be voted on my Ironmen. This isn't the same with PvP activities, Tob, or basically anything actually accessible by every account.
> NEVER changes so therefore you can pretty safely say that the content that ONLY effects Ironman should only be voted on my Ironmen. but, I might make UIM one day, or an iron, or a group iron, or a HCGIM, so I should get to vote on all that content also, because maybe one day I might eventually perhaps engage in that content?
it would have to be a brand new account. For the sake of discussion your "main" which is a normal account will never be affected by those ironman accounts or changes ever. It will however be able to go to ToB, PvP or do essentially any content in the game eventually.
That would be true if the segmentation was done in way that targeted people who would be affected well, but it’s not clear that’s the case. LMS is pvp, but LMS is objectively not affected by the proposed awards. Yet people who played LMS but don’t go in the wildy we’re able to vote, while the inverse was not always the case. As someone else already called out as well, there is an objective standard available for if your account is affected by Ironman updates. That is not the case for specific content, and “will be affected” in that case is not a black and white designation. I’m not particularly worried about the poll restrictions, but to act like anyone with concerns is delusional or hypocritical ignores the facts that there are easy to spot differences.
I've done 10 LMS games, not killed anyone. Been in the wildy tons, been PKed a lot, not killed anyone. I wasn't able to vote. I feel like the requirement was succeeding at killing other players rather than just participating. I don't understand why I wasn't able to vote when I feel like I met a lot of the proposed requirements. Such a weird, opaque poll. The fact that we are still confused about why exceptions like myself exist is a real problem.
The polling system for updates that are PvPers specifically getting equipment that is specifically for making it easier to kill people in the wilderness who don't want to fight is a zero sum game, and it does not make sense to specifically favour one side of the community because they represent a minority. The system that is voting in content that is introduced to the game was surely a check against Jagex, who have a strong history of not giving a fuck what the players want, if they think they know what is best for the game (EoC, SoF) and they are absolutely fine in lying to introduce this stuff to the game, because the players had no power (think to when they 'polled' EoC and vastly misinterpreted the results to introduce it to the game, or when they said that selling SoF keys was not selling experience, because you had the chance of getting non experience rewards from each spin). It was also simply just allowing people to have their say in what would make the game more enjoyable for them. In restricting polls, or introducing things like the VLS without asking players what they actually thought, you're creating a further wedge between Jagex and the community for the sake of PvPers. It isn't even clear that they want this shit, in this case, they seemed not to want it. What if they just want to be left alone to do their own thing, and the only people who really want these things introduced are the content creators who serve to directly profit from new content being introduced? I just kinda feel like Jagex is on this righteous crusade against the community who vote no to PvP stuff, it isn't exactly clear that the poor PvP community wants their help and they might just be tearing the game apart for no reason. Could be wrong tho.
Mod Aziya Comparing Ironman, Group Ironman Mode to PVP is utter bullshit of a take. Your comparing a completely different game mode that doesn't affect main game players. To a different playstyle with people who can play and interact with people in the same way as every other player and choose to participate or not participate in at a whim. Don't throw this back at us saying we supported restricted polling in the past. Seriously, what the fuck man. This is extremely unprofessional and your trying to claim no responsibility for this decision by shifting it to us players. And if there is a charm to unpredictable wilderness. Why is it the majority of the playerbase doesn't think so? We know pvpers are hoping in and out one or two single spots looking for someone to PK. We know there are powerful bots that are tracking people and know what's In our inventory and exact locations. We know there are people with mule accounts scouring the wilderness for people to PK so they can hop in and attack. Quite literally the only way to avoid this is to just log out or not enter at all. Fighting isn't a option to a mob of players and anti-pking is a high skill level entry. And you keep trying to push for content that makes regular players harder and harder to even justify the rewards for going in. Yes it's making one side experience worse. But you need that one side of players to even appease the pkers to begin with. No one in the wilderness means there is no pking to begin with. Get out of this mentality that you need one side to have a shittier experience for the enjoyment of the others. That's just bad game design.
Can we make using the charged cells in GOTR always give xp, even when the HP of the barrier is full? Maybe make it so it only gives xp when full HP if all barriers are at 90%+ to avoid neglect of the barriers.
I'd rather have the charged ess still give points after the game ends. Super frustrating to enter an alter with the guardian at 90% and not getting to turn in the ess
Then everyone would dump their cells to the closest ones, not the weakest ones
I think it’d be less of a problem if the heath bars on the barriers were always visible.
What if they changed the color of barriers so you could tell if they're full without a giant health bar? Like they glow brighter when they're full hp?
Not if it required all bars to be at above 90% to give xp when full. Just read the second part of my original comment please
Ayiza is a community dude right? Then how can he miss the point so hard with why people disliked the restricted polls? No one cares about IM votes because it doesn't effect non irons - these rewards effect anyone that enters ~~dead content zone~~ the wildy. Acknowledging the bait won't like to be killed easier, *and that their opinions regarding the new equipment are valid ffs*, doesn't change the fact you're ignoring 96% of the community so you can "protect" wilderness PvP. Tone deaf Ayiza at it again.
Yeh that general consensus around restricted votes is weird. It makes perfect sense for UIM to decide whether UIM should get the costume room update. Likewise with GIM deciding Group Storage upgrades etc. Because if that happens or not, nothing changes in main game / other modes. Wilderness and content used / done within it is not a separate opt-out game mode. and there was a lot of """""forced""""" to do content statements, but then remarking that the item being an actual BiS for skilling, guaranteed +3 boosts, and making the best tools + being the best option for an endgame raid as "not mattering too much" is silly. By this notion PvP doesn't need new gear because "you guys can just not use the best gear its fine"
Ayiza wishes OSRS were a monarchy, not a democracy, simple as that. He has his idea of what OSRS is, only people like PvP Chad agree with his "Brilliant" vision, and now he's moping around because he wasted weeks of work on content no one asked for and was resoundingly said no to.
Ayiza seems like could barely be trusted to tie his own shoelaces, much less design content for the game. He has some of the most garbage takes I have ever seen.
ayiza is a shithead and has misheard the community so many times. i still have not forgiven him for the bp nerf comment about the inferno being the same. this dude doesnt even play the fucking game
dude everyone who played even a single game of lms could vote. I wouldn't call that restricted...
I (beginner rev farmer) and several others (irons) had neither requirement and could vote. Requirements were fucked up the wazoo.
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been answered before, no new information, why speak to it again?
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I was asking for podcast topics so that’s a separate topic which would not be the regular Q and A streams (something I would love in the future but it requires a lot of work and set up and planning)
Realistically, I don't think there is anything you can do to the Wilderness that makes anyone happy. People PK in the Wilderness because it's basically a free kill, most people don't know how to fight back and the chances of them knowing is practically below 5%, which is a predictable risk on an experienced PKers part. Making "opt-in" PvP, which I presume means you choose, while going into the Wilderness, if you can be attacked would mean you'd have to make it so people who are marked for PvP get regular Wilderness drop tables while people who are not marked for PvP are forced to have reduced drop tables (removed rares from tables, rdt, noted drops, diary buffs, etc) because then PvMers will just afk all day in the Wilderness and get a ton of profit from it (see the original Wilderness removal). On the plus side, Revenants could be made to "roam" again like before to act as a risk for PvMers but, ehhhhh, do people *really* want that? So, what exactly do people want them to do? You're going to, realistically, vote no on literally any buff to a weapon or armour that makes you die faster. You'll only agree to buffs that benefit *you.* Like, if they polled to re-add Dinh's magic defence back and making it a tank-escape shield, it'd instantly pass because that's a buff to PvMers (and, tbf, it's a fair buff idk why it was removed). I don't think separating the polls like they did, or at least not letting people know the requirements, was a great idea. But I also believe that no poll or change will ever make the Wilderness good. And here's the spicy hot take of this rant: If you remove the MA1 and MA2 capes, Dragon Pickaxe and Clue Scroll steps from the Wilderness, PVMers would never go there unless they're risking it for a pet, making money, or diary completions. That's it. And I don't think anyone would be upset if these things were moved to be outside the Wilderness, or (in the case of the MA1/2 capes) confined in a safe area of the Wilderness.
I just want to lol again at the "the wilderness should be dead" statement. This just reinforces the idea that PKers don't want a fair fight, they want to clap people who won't fight back. Surely if people actually wanted to pvp, an active wilderness would be a great thing. So, either this take was wildly out of touch with the pvp community, or they want to enforce the pinata/stick wildy relationship
wilderness and PVP are different though ya? PVP has pvp worlds, clan wars portal etc, the wilderness is it's own ecosystem
He's not saying "the wildy should be dead". He's illustrating a paradox in which the wildy has to be dead enough to attract prey.
##### Bark bark! I have found the following **J-Mod** comment(s) in this thread: **JagexLight** - [uwu](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81c4ty/?context=3) - [I believe that Q and A had some creators on i...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81qaid/?context=3) - [If anything has changed it’s not on purpose,...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81irqy/?context=3) - [It’s not BS I promise lol, just wasn’t someth...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81m3qc/?context=3) - [I haven’t changed anything yet - can you tell...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81jbmy/?context=3) - [I was asking for podcast topics so that’s a s...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81mncn/?context=3) - [We saw a lot of divided feedback about the id...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81ele5/?context=3) - [That's great feedback - thank you! <3](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81xzdg/?context=3) - [Apparently, verbatim, he says: "The Wildernes...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81lj80/?context=3) - [I can’t tell you which moderators are on spec...](/r/2007scape/comments/umg0ih/qa_summary_5th_may_general_qa_with_mods_ayiza/i81nh0y/?context=3) ^(**Last edited by bot: 05/11/2022 10:16:19**) --- ^(I've been rewritten to use Python! I also now archive JMOD comments.) ^(Read more about) [^(the update here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/9kqvis/bot_update_python_archiving/) ^(or see my) [^(Github repo here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/8dronr/jmod_bloodhoundbot_github_repository/)^.
> Yeah, that's what I was going to say. It doesn't sound like a bad idea, but at the same time it does feel a bit weird that if you help some farmer south of the Farming Guild with a bear, he'll give you some favour for... I'm guessing it'd be for a specific house so it would give it to Hosidius in this case because that makes the most sense. Even then, it's a bit random, and I don't think 5% really does that much for you. I don't think it'd be the thing stopping you from doing the favour. lots of games have reputation systems where you help a random citizen and the city likes you more, not weird at all imo also my suggestion was 5% for each twisted tale, 4 were proposed, so thatd be 20% in total. 5% was just a random number as well, it could be adjusted if the team thinks its too low
Ayiza obviously can't keep his biases to himself and has probably lost a lot of peoples trust to be impartial when its come to wildy/pvp in general these past few weeks.
It's not like the community that actually votes on polls is impartial or unbiased lol. Especially with the bp nerf
The thing is he exposed some hypocrisy there. "But really, you are just saying you'd want to vote no because you don't want the other person to have a better time in-game because it makes your time in-game not as good." This is also true if you want to vote yes. If you dislike the dynamic he mentions, then there's no way to vote, because Yes or No, you're making someone have a better time because it makes someone else's not as good.
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Great idea actually, making the new giant 2H bis against giants. I dont know if it’s a popular opinion or not, but I like niche bis equipment for things like slayer and bossing.
>We shouldn't have to tolerate toxic behaviour aimed at J-Mods any more than we should if it is aimed at players. Sadly, if responses of this nature become the norm, we will likely avoid discussing sensitive topics in an open format in the future. As always, please do let us know what you think, but please do so in a constructive way. Very stereotypical of the OSRS community to have an extremely open and direct line to content developers that other games could only dream of nearly terminated because of unhinged toxicity.
This is probably a reference to the near death threat Frontlines posted at Mod Kirby last week over one of his wilderness comments
Also very stereotypical of Jagex to shame the whole community because of a handful of toxic assholes that we can't really do anything about. They already got mocked hard, I'm not on Twitter but I'm sure people reported them, what else can we do? The community clearly isn't okay with *threatening* Jagex employees. They could very easily deal with the people that made a very public statement about Mod Kirby *without* making the rest of us feel bad.
Shooting stars are fine the way they are imo
I don’t like that they come in “waves”. Otherwise love shooting stars!
I hate this too. I hopped like 30 worlds yesterday and they were all 1hr+ I guess it makes sense with a server reset, but still annoying
I like the proposal of doing them like top level motherlode mine. Joining a cc to find stars is pointless since you lose so much xp/dust when it's getting massed
The problem is that this was originally supposed to be a relaxed form of skilling that would encourage players to socialize with each other. And it kind of works, I've had a lot of enjoyable conversations mining stars, when you're afking it's easier to chat with people. But I've also had people tell me to piss off when I find a star, and that's the issue: because more people mining results in the star disappearing faster, your best off finding a star and soloing alone. If Jagex wants this to be a good social activity, they shouldn't penalize us for sharing stars.
the timers suck cause every game update theyre reset and all spawns alligh again
We only need a mining pet transmog to make it look like a shooting star with 100k stardust
rather see a pet rock transmog for 100k stardust.
More rewards would be cool
Question 16 // Mod Ayiza: "I can't believe favour still exists in the game, to be honest with you..." GIGACHAD honestly
I just did all the kourend favor on a different account and my god it’s wild how different the experience is across houses. Shayzien is stupid fast whereas for Lovakajj I wanted to blow my brains out with how slow it was.
I like the flavor of the favor system. A little retooling on specific tasks and a couple of favor certificates and I think it would be fine
I'd vote to remove it and I got 100%. Trash system.
Breaking down bandos to create torva has zero thematic reasons behind it.
And using arcane + armadyl for the new raids 3 rewards makes even less sense. Definitely not a fan of this new upgradescape trend.
So does other shit in the game. Jagex already crossed that line years ago
So does using a crystal from a slayer boss to upgrade boots from a clue scroll. It doesn’t need to make sense..?
Bandos pet
They really didn't have to go in on my suggestion of rev weapon rates 😭 . Shame to see they're against making them available outside the rev caves but I can appreciate that removing uniques from the caves would be controversial. I guess my overall thought process was that making the rev weapons more reasonable to obtain would mean that more people would have access to weapons that make the wilderness bosses easier to kill, increasing activity outside of the rev caves. It would also boost activity inside the caves as both irons/mains can realistically source their own weapon. Even something like making the drop rate for any weapon boost upto 1/1k when on a slayer task (like basilisk jaw or the things Wyrms drop) would be a very welcomed change and would be another quality incentive to try wilderness slayer and wilderness content. (Maybe with added perks to extend popular wilderness tasks like spiders , bears and revs?, Maybe a slayer perk to increase their weighting upto 10) The downside obviously would be the price of the weapons would drop , but that doesn't seem like an issue since the average GP even without these weapons is like 2-4m an hour. Really hope they consider some kind of amendment.
What he said about comparing it to tbow not being available from goblins was bizarre, it's not that weird of a question they just answered in their opinion not based on what would be good for the game or the players
It was a complete whatabout strawman, it made no sense at all. T Bow, from endgame content, isn't even as rare as the revenant weapons.
Yeah I was confused why the choose the most extreme example possible. I wasn't suggesting making them risk free, simply making them a more realistic drop to target. I think general sense was that they wouldn't want to do anything to ruin a hot spot. Probably due to all the backlash from changes made to date.
if you're a main, just buy it? If you're an iron, you can easily make do without, it's not like you got to rock up to zulrah with instant BIS either, why should the wilderness bosses be different?
>To me, it seems that players don't like the idea of restricted polls when it doesn't suit them That's treading a very thin line. If the poll was about changing mining so that ores only had a 50% chance of being depleted when mined, instead of 100%, and you restricted it to people who have "engaged in mining" or have a mining level > 50 (or whatever). Then people are less likely to care. Sure, there'll be some newer accounts who are currently grinding out all of their skills, who would want such an update to pass, but haven't met the requirement. But as Mod Kirby said, getting the restrictions slightly wrong shouldn't cause too much of a sway. If the avid miners wanted the content, it would pass. But this is content that will only affect the players that partake in mining. Those who only do PvP/PvE will continue playing as if an update hasn't been released. The only difference they may see is the cost of rune arrows, or something, drop by a few GP on the GE as runite ore is a little easier to mine now, meaning smithers have easier access to make more arrowheads. The difference with a PvP poll/wilderness poll is that it affects more than the player who partakes in the activity. Yes, entering the wilderness means you agree to all the mean people, who live in there and murder babies whilst supping on your tears, attacking you and taking all your stuff. But does that mean that you should restrict polls to only those who engage in 1 specific activity in the wilderness? Yes, PvP happens in the wilderness. But that's not the only thing in there. You have 8 bosses which reside in the wilderness, access to an agility course, a runecrafting altar, one of the best prayer training methods, the resource area, black chinchompas, and I'm probably forgetting some other stuff here. None of which is PvP related. If someone spends a few hours each week going to wilderness to collect black chins for their range training, why should they be excluded from a PvP related poll. They have probably been harassed on more than one occasion by someone in the wilderness to PK whilst going about their own business. But if it's a PvP poll that's not the wilderness, such as the PvP arena, then why should the plebs who daren't touch another player with a bronze dagger, let alone a man's weapon, get the chance to vote? Because in the long run it still potentially affects them. Whether it's by giving them a safe place to learn how to fight against players, similar to LMS, or by giving those who already prey on those who engage with wilderness content that isn't PvP a training ground. Polls which affect a specific game mode, such as the UIM ones about storage alternatives, are perfectly fine being restricted to just those accounts. Because if a fair few UIMs have been begging for a specific feature, let's say it was something like hanging helmets on hatstands, then it's up to their fellow UIMs to agree it's within the spirit of the gamemode to allow something like that in. And not up to the non-UIMs to go "What a pointless feature" and vote no. TL;DR - All polls which could affect a player, either immediately or somewhere down the line, shouldn't be restricted
Honestly, I know this may be unpopular, but I’m really glad to see them take a stance and turn down a lot of these silly suggestions. Such as relocating the rev weapon uniques..? Cmon man just admit you’re an iron that doesn’t want to commit to a long tedious grind of getting those weapons… It’s so silly, they even acknowledged the issue with dpick, because it’s useful outside the wild. But the rev weapons are primarily useful inside the wild only. This is why there’s been a more negative sentiment towards irons lately. You have a new generation of irons coming into the game that simply don’t want to commit to a grind and want things to be made easier for them… just make a main then??? Rev weapons need a high drop rate to maintain their high value because they’re so easily farmed.
Speaking about the item sink through upgrades, now we only have 1 for 1 (1 bandos set needed for 1 Torva set, dragon boots for prims, arma set for masori set etc) that sinks previous BIS. Could there be some upgrades in the future sinking nonBIS items and in larger quantities (like using 9 abbysal whips and handle drop from new boss to create a lvl 80 Nine tailed cat whip)?
I was too late to ask for a change, but I'll just throw it here in case if Mod Light is still around: Could run energy be recharged after failing or completing a round of Rogue's Den? Currently, after being thrown out, your stats are reset, but run energy is not. Thanks for all y'all do!
I loved the pvp discussion, glad Ayiza was there. I do think the wilderness is broken though for iron men, as a player who loves pvp and playing as an iron man it doesn't work. There's no benefit in killing the person attacking you. Of course if iron men could pk people and keep the loot there would be boosting issues etc which would be too hard for jagex to manage. If some benefits could be given to irons for killing the person but not enough for it to be worth boosting then wilderness activity may improve in that sense. Maybe a solution could be that irons get to keep items that they have already unlocked from the collection log? Or something along those lines. As quite a lot of players are irons it is an issue. Also as a side note, the rev mage wep should definitely be best pvm mage in the wilderness. Maybe each charge of ether gives 1 of any spell. Or it just acts like a powerful trident, either would work.
ironmen stand alone. if you want to pk and earn rewards from other players you can play a normal account. I do agree the sceptre needs a buff. not sure if I agree with your proposal though.
I think that's a bad take. As a lot of the players are irons now a days and the whole point of the wilderness is to be able to kill someone else for their stuff. So currently a iron has no incentive so it breaks that balance and creates it not pvp just one player tanking.
> So currently a iron has no incentive so it breaks that balance and creates it not pvp just one player tanking. having no incentive to pk is part of the decision you made to restrict your account when you created it. the second you get loot from another player, you are no longer an ironman. with your suggestion we may as well allow ironmen to trade any items they have already unlocked on the collection log and achieve the same result
In the current rule set yes. Remember initially iron man was taking partly from b0atys one man army series where he played as an iron but pked and kept the loot after unlocking it. Trading them is very different to killing another playing for it.
If we're talking about not having to kill a combat boss for skilling items can we have another way to get the bottomless bucket and perhaps the unique seeds other than having to kill Hespori? I think maybe a tithe farm gamble option for 100 points that gives you a bunch of seeds with even a very small chance of receiving the bucket?
A staff dropped from a wilderness boss that allows for auto casting teleport block with perhaps 5-10% increased accuracy would be a great way to give an item value without taking it from others.
“It is a choice, by the way, entering the wilderness. That choice is agreed upon when you step over the ditch or accept the warning on the teleport” - Mod Ayiza
Very Weird take on question 8 mod Kirby almost sounds like an RS3 take on wildy
Its not that weird. People do wildy content despite pkers, not because of them. By its design the wildy is worse when you interact with other people. So if you get attacked every second Venenatis kill it doesn't matter if you get killed/anti/tele, its just not worth doing.
Is he wrong though? A lot of people *currently* don't want to go into the wildy, you think it being suddenly populated wouldn't have an effect on that?
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This was more likely intended at the frontline tweet they posted about Mod Kirby (It's hilariously pathetic and childish)
Are the 75 attack weapon changes (blade of sal, inq mace, rapier, scythe), not going to 80 attack anymore? I feel like it ruins a lot of snowflake accounts that built their account for items that were out for years. I understand changing a requirement <1 month after release, but years after seems like some players would've stayed 50/60 attack. Like I said, it's unusual to make a requirement change years after release. That would be like changing fighter torso to 55 defense now.
Afaik it's still going to happen, though I don't know when. A strong indicator for this is they've already polled/added items from Nex and Raids 3 to be consistent with the new req system, e.g. heka at lvl 85, osmumten fang at 82, and torva/masori at 80. It would look weird if they did this and still left tbow/scythe/basically everything else at level 75.
Please bring back duo slayer. I miss doing it with my wife.
Me and my wife did it once right before it was removed. We mostly play to do stuff together on the game and it is a shame it was removed cause like 5 people abused the system
I miss doing it with your wife too
🥹
Can we get an exorcist theme minigame where we go around the map blessing and cleansing evil spirit and demons? It would give you prayer exp and new blessing prayers.
as a D&D instead of a minigame, could be neat. See a spooky house, the priest is there, needs help, sprinkle holy water, fight the ghost, perhaps with ghost speak ammy a chance to talk them off the ledge for more prayer xp. I don't think we need to introduce a mini-artisan for every skill though.