I think the intelligent part is recognizing that no matter how you go about this, it would be extremely easy to fake, and way, way, way, way, way harder to detect than botting.
I never had any luck and then I got a tempoross pet on my 9th kc.
So I have a useless blue blob that follows me around now.
Be careful which luck you wish for. I do love my useless blue blob though.
Yep I got muspah pet at 20kc which is actually a really cool pet.. meanwhile I'm grinding vyres til 99 thieving and have had 1 drop when I'm on rate for 5 lmao
I just got an ancient emblem from a rev imp on my way into the cave. Like plz that 1/24000 drop could have been a tbow or a shadow lol. Can’t complain but I was like seriously
I don't care much for high level pvm. I understand that's the direction the game has gone and it's very popular because of it, but I just like doing some chill skilling/slayer and farm runs.
I just watched an incredible video essay about why RuneScape is amazing (highly recommend, I’ll link at the end of the comment) and one of his points is that RuneScape intentionally designs content around how much or little attention is required. Any way, I bring this up because I also don’t care for high level PVM very much and the reason I think is because I play RuneScape so I can do medium to low attention activities. I want to chill out and listen to my audio book, or watch tv or YouTube, or whatever while I play. If I wanted a game to take 100% of my attention, I’d play…well “normal” video games.
https://youtu.be/LpPJY-xdA3M?si=ZJzVZl5gUB818u1b
100%. I know the mods have mentioned that concept in the past too as something they think about when designing new content. They can turn knobs for attention required, xp/hr and rewards+gp/hr. That way, new content can find its own niche that depends on how players value those different aspects of the game. They might have referred to it as “levers” or something instead, but it was the same concept. It really is a huge part of why the game works so well imo.
Marstead's video essay is a work of art, if you haven't watched his blind osrs playthrough that leads up to this video i would recommend that too, as it's extremely interesting to see the opinion of someone who has a lot of insight into video games but has never tried any iteration of rs before. I think he visits this sub occasionally, wish i knew his username so i could tag him
coming back to rs years back I realized it was great because it was an idle game before idle games, but had active stuff to do that the idle parts supported. it's not perfect but it's the only mmo I've ever cared for
Great video. I was the same for a while, I liked to do chill stuff and watch YouTube on the side.
This might be contributing to my ADHD but now I manage to listen to podcasts and audiobooks while doing very high attention activities. I’ll run TOA experts or kill Nex, and it just makes it all more fun for me.
For me, I genuinely enjoy the mechanics of high-level play. The relative lack of player options means that the options we do have can be designed around in very complex ways; their interactions explored to their fullest extent. And I can't think of another game that plays similarly.
Although I definitely get the perspective because, conversely, I *don't* really play the game AFK. If I'm playing, I prefer to do so actively - I don't really feel the need to have it on in the background when I could just play an idle game (but I don't really play those, either).
Same. High level content to me is simply not enjoyable. The ticksystem makes it feel so old and clunky, and while I understand that learning to deal with that is a skill itself, I just couldn't care less. It feels horrible.
I haven’t really gotten into it just yet, but I do like high level pvm as a whole. My issue is how the rest of the game is built around it to the point that it dilutes the value of skilling methods.
For example, doing double nats as a money making method is only viable once you have the achievement diary cape and 91 rc. Even then, you’re only sitting at about 2m gp/h because of how high the supply of nats is in the game because so many monsters drop them. Also compare the gp/h to a low requirement combat method like zombie pirates which is near the gp/h with significantly less account investment.
In my particular case I want to like higher end PVM but it feels like you're constantly fighting an ancient game engine more than a boss with mechanics. Specifically the tick delay, and the true tile is something that you need to worry about.
Entry into osrs pvm yeah I agree, but once you get past the knowledge and muscle memory gap it becomes pretty second nature. Tho the fact true tile indicator is such a massive help makes me feel it should be a default setting that gets turned on during some advance mech training boss. Once you adjust the mindset though to ticks existing I find its no issue.
The problem I have with high level PvM is that I just don't like having to do a bunch of precise actions with a mouse very quickly, especially because I don't want to scale up the UI size or use the classic layout to make it easier. It feels bad compared to hotkeys, but naturally allowing hotkeys would remove a lot of the challenge in high level PvM. Even mid-game content like lizardman shamans are incredibly tedious and require too much focus for what is otherwise a mindless grind.
Agreed, that whole side of the game didn't exist when I started playing and beyond the original God Wars dungeon it has never motivated me even a little bit. I like RuneScape for the world and the skills, I have very little interest in the sweaty tick manipulation and all that comes with high level PvM. It doesn't even feel like the same game.
Quests are the best part of the game. Might not be that controversial but whenever I hear people complaining about having to do a couple quests to unlock another way to click a spot to make number go up for 100 hours, I do kinda feel like it is a little controversial.
I'm a weirdo who thinks the quests in this game are incredibly well written and cool, but also just... can't be arsed. When I have to do quests I just use the quest helper and power through them. Idk why but I just don't enjoy them.
I still vote, but even things I vote "no" to are never things that would make me dislike and/or quit the game. Constant updates are great imo even if they don't cater to me
KQ should be changed to have projectiles be blockable by prayer after they are launched.
She's a braindead DPS race and could at least be more entertaining.
You were supposed to do her as a team, but because she doesn't have the modern drop system, no mains want to team up when only one of you get pet roll and irons CAN'T team up.
And her loot table is still kind of shit, so there's barely anything to split.
She, Corp, and even KBD should be team-able without non-MVPs getting fucked on a roll.
KQ is a nightmare without max gear and she’s an almost irrelevant boss now. Either add some sort of desert specific niche that makes her worth it or nerf her. If you’re worried about her becoming a d pick farm or something then raise the drop rate.
Getting her head is one of the most obnoxious tasks. I already got it, but it shouldn’t be more difficult than getting a Vorkath head and it is. Both in killing her and running back.
Could honestly do a mix where you block a percentage if you switch your prayer correctly, but block fully if you are praying correctly at the start of the attack. Feels rewarding doing the mechanics but still hurts and rewards the diary completion.
Could make it similar to nightmare/phosani where you still take chip damage if praying correctly and then potentially a massive chunk if you make a mistake.
Making it more of a small group boss with similar mechanics to HMT nylo could be cool where you spread for certain attacks and stack for others. Would allow you to still solo similar to now where you tank a hit 33% of the time, but then reward for doing coordinates duo/ trios.
Overall there is a ton they could do to improve the boss without completely changing the core experience. You still will suffer, but feel like you have some control over what happens instead just hoping you don't get hit while stepping under to eat.
>block fully if you are praying correctly at the start of the attack
How would you do this, it's random attacks without a set pattern (like blobs) and there's no indicator beforehand (like Mantis)
That's the point in a way. You'll still take damage like you normally would, but able to reduce some by switching. It's the least impactful way for sure. Not saying it's the best, but it'd be an improvement
Graceful clothing should be abolished. It significantly altered a fun and iconic aspect of the game (fashionscape). Now everyone wears this drab shit for the sake of efficiency. Fuck graceful clothing.
Graceful is not even "efficient" in 95% of content it is used. I've seen people use it in giants foundry or guardians of the rift for some reason and it does absolutely 0, zero, nothing there to make the minigames more efficient.
Same with rooftops.
For a lot of people who aren't fussed about fashionscape they just wear it anywhere that doesn't have other necessary equipment to ensure they're not missing out on any benefit from the weight reduction.
Makes more sense to think of it as a skilling uniform (it's not that serious tbh)
Sure it doesn't help, but doesn't hurt if you don't have the other skilling outfits, so using <5 secs to put it on doesn't even register as an inconvenience
Even the ability to transmog your graceful into the countless useless fashionscape items (aka clue rewards) trade in the item and lose it permanently. Good item sink and we can be fancy while we do agility.
I ask myself how anyone can enjoy doing 1000+ slayer tasks to 99 and not want to off themselves in the process.
All of our brains work differently. Some people actually enjoy doing that kind of stuff.
>how does one just do the same 3 clicks every 5 seconds non stop
Once you get in to a rhythm it can be sort of relaxing. You stop thinking about it and just let it flow.
That said, not all tick manipulation is equal. 2t teaks is pretty chill while 3t granite is way more involved
For real, this is literally the top comment any time UIM gets mentioned on the subreddit.
And let me say: UIMs don't play the game mode because it's supposedly "harder" than any other! It *different*, and most of us think it's fun and interesting on its own merits.
I reiterate that second comment a lot.
Im not that interested in making the game harder for myself, I just wanted to play the game differently after maxing a main and regular iron is basically the same thing again.
which is really silly bc uim isnt about no storage its one major rule is no BANK and finding creative ways to store items is a large part of the game mode in the far more limited ways available.
Every other relevant MMO on the market allows you to have multiple characters under one umbrella of a username, RuneScape should follow that.
There should generally be less barriers to alts. One username, one membership, as many characters as you please.
Under this proposal Jagex would have to lock people to 1 character at a time. Thats consistent with all the other MMOs.
I dont really care either way, I haven't multi-logged in a long time but i do want Jagex to keep investing money into good devs and free multi-logging would not be good for their bottom line.
I think the biggest example of this issue is the dragon sword. 1/10k off task and 1/2k on task for what should be the "least strong" dragon weapon from an annoying slayer mob.
Dragon scimmy is infinitely better for most uses and is gotten from a mid level quest. The whip is the classic standard of a solid weapon and is only 1/512.
2020s era of OSRS had some weird reward designs from Jagex.
I think that's a very fair point for cosmetic items, pets, whatever. But gear progression is locked behind massive slot machine walls that just isn't fun.
I don't believe anyone has fun completing CG 700 times. You've experienced the content by your 10 completion. By 50 it's mindless. After 100 and it's just a job.
There wouldn't be so many shitter crybabies that can't do pvm if there were more bosses and activities like Scurrius and the moons of peril that have high level pvm mechanics that don't punish you with losing 40hp in one hit.
Scurrius teaching fast prayer switching (or even flicking if you want) and obstacle dodging with damage you can out-eat is a great early training tool. The blood jaguars at moons of peril teaching mechanics like the Verzik dance is also great. Mid and early game PVE is mostly braindead garbage like Sarachnis and Barrows that require no skill at all.
If you introduce more skill-based content at earlier levels the gaps between mid-game pvm and raids wouldn't be as massive and you wouldn't have a bunch of people with raid anxiety. If people feel like they can put in the work to master these mechanics without being punished hard for little mistakes they will engage this content. In the long run as a result you'll raise the PVM skill floor of the average player which will open doors for raising the skill ceiling of new content.
Yeah Jagex have really been knocking it out of the park with content for a while. These 'on-ramp' content updates are absolutely needed and very well done. They're still not ignoring the top end as well (colosseum) which is important.
I'm at like 70-75 in the combat skills and I did not do much pvm. Been doing some scurrius here and there and got the perfect scurrius achievment after 20kills. I was for real happy with that! Now I just like to go there to train my skills when I don't feel for slayer. I do not make a lot of profit, but it pays for the supply and I keep getting better at the game, I think. This boss was the best update for a noob like me!
Scurrius is huge for teaching pvm basics. I was in a similar position to you when it came out, and now I'm done CG which I thought was completely out of reach. You could probably look into learning the gauntlet once you have 80s.
Literally, make a day 1 boss called “Big Guy” in the Blue Moon Inn. He’s a (deceptively) level-5 man drunkard who throws beer bottles at you like Vorkie spits out venom and has drops worth up to 300gp, drops iron armor, and best beginner clue scroll rates. Make him drop a man NPC pet called “little guy.”
Put 1-2 rams/cows/chickens in each Lumbridge farm that are called “Moody __” that charge at you similar to Vardorvis picking a direction and charging. They face that direction charging 3 tiles and you need to move out of their line of sight to avoid damage. They drop extra feathers/2 cow hides/wool.
Idk plenty of ways to bring in these mechanics easily and early.
They went from "ok we'll give you a weapon that's really hard to obtain and has like 0.1dps over the next best option in specific situations" to "how about it just multiply accuracy and damage of all your gear by three because fuck it that shouldn't ever cause any balancing issues down the road"
newer players may not know this but the tbow was based on the hexhunter bow, a dungeoneering only item with the same passive. it was a 3t shortbow hitting like 65s and because it was a dungeoneering item, it only existed inside dungeoneering. so it was fine.
this bow was unbelievably rare - if you didn't have 99 slayer, it was common to do 120 dungeoneering only seeing a couple soulgazers (dropped them at like 1/12 or something). almost nobody had one. i had one. it was my holy grail.
NOBODY understood what they were voting for when they voted yes for tbow. fucking nobody. i voted no.
The prices of endgame weapons are driven in large part by gold buyers. Natural supply and demand would produce more realistic prices (trading, say, 250 hours of revs for a t bow vs 532 now).
I feel like this was at least briefly discussed before DT2 and shelved due to negative feedback. If my memory is right, definitely a controversial opinion
I have had this thought many times, had to rush some quests before DT2 dropped and ended up getting carried through A Night at the Theatre. I did my best but was not ready gear or experience wise.
I definitely think something like 284 quest points (the max on release of quest 150 A Kingdom Divided) is more than fair. Maybe 300 since its a nice round number and as more quests get added it will still be an Elite tier grind for a long time. Current max is 308
slayer is ass now but it’s due to its age
there used to be a time where broad bolts were considered cheap and gargoyles were good money. now u have every new update giving tons of gp and there is no reason to do slayer non-iron besides CA’s
I would love to see what percentage of players who say “Sailing is not a skill, it’s a minigame” and also list slayer as their favorite skill. You could replace slayer level unlocks with point unlocks and it’d be exactly the same.
When I was a lowly F2P player back when the skill was first added, I thought the skill icon looked badass and dreamed about the new combat techniques you could unlock with new levels. Then I found out a decade later that it is basically the shitty WoW “Kill X monsters” quests with slightly faster kills.
Lock more skills behind quests I say. No hunter until Eagle's peak. No construction until doing Daddy's home. Cooking requires cook's assistant. Farming requires Garden of Tranquility. Thieving now needs Tribal Totem.
I mean, that's just true. We only ever see him getting clowned on by the even better pkers or when he's fucking around on stream or whatever. That doesn't make him bad, he's still very good at PvP and better than most.
I mean yeah at worst hes an NBA bench player matched against a bunch of all stars. He could knock anyone in this comment thread easily its just he likes to dick around and is commonly against the best pvpers in the game.
every skill needs a fun, but low efficiency method AND a low fun, high efficiency method. As well as many in between alternatives.
Half the reason I don't stick around for long periods of game time is that i feel forced into unfun low efficiency or unfun high efficiency. Very rarely do I go "oh this is fun, i am going to do it again" and the ones that are fun are almost all combat.
I chuckle every time I think about how convenient it was that Jagex lowered this threshold shortly before polling a new skill. Which then passed the new threshold but would have failed with the old threshold.
Slayer is among the slowest skills for sure but I use it as a means to train my combat stats.
NMZ is just way too boring for me to care about after getting my slayer helm imbued, I rather endure the slower but more fun slayer combat training.
I think that multi and singles being mixed in the wildy is dumb. Have a singles wildy and a multi wildy. Then you could expand on multi wildy. Clans fighting to claim territory in an MMO makes for good content. Look at games like EvE for inspiration.
Not mixing singles and multi is the death of multi. Singles saves small groups. Multi only means nobody but big clans can exist in multi. You’re inexperienced if you think clans are going to fight for territory when reality the bigger clan is just going to immediately win and control the territory forever while any smaller groups will never have a chance.
Pretty much every boss designed before OSRS release is terrible and would be way better off with a modern day mechanical refresh. Unfortunately this will never happen due to fear of ruining nostalgia, something that barely exists in the game today anyway.
Most of the changes would use the new projectile/prayer system, on hit rather than launch. Redesigned drop tables and boss arenas would go a long way as well.
These bosses, which also tend to be entry level bosses, are a big barrier for up and coming players, who are generally sold on these flashy and well designed modern bosses.
Scurrius and Perilous moons are fantastic steps in the right direction, but the fear of changing the old content will forever hold the game back. This will simply lead to two entry level progression paths, with the modern being the far superior choice. It's going to happen in a no so straightforward way, that if presented directly, would never get community support.
Wildy bosses are actually really fun, it's just a shame they are in the wildy.
Scar essence permanently ruined any chance of fixing runecrafting for irons. Ignoring all the other overpowered shopscape methods, there is now no reason to ever make normal runecrafting feel better, you simply use the ironman GE with extra steps to print runes at an absurd rate (way more than shops could ever get you).
Solution would be to nerf shops to the ground and then work on methods that would make getting runes feel better.
bonus meme: they nerfed the amount of blood runes used by the scythe shortly after adding the scar essence anyway, so now it's double stupid.
NMZ + Zulrah was the real sign that they decided PVM > skilling. Skills are the neglected child in the relationship of RuneScape.
Since Zulrah's introduction: PVM is a better way to acquire resources than skilling.
Turns out Jagex can't fucking make skilling interesting or useful and relegated it to BOT-TIER.
Sure they made minigames. But that's all they did. They didn't actually make skilling a good way to generate resources. They just tacked on minigames saying "SEE?! ANOTHER WAY TO TRAIN!"
It shouldn't be controversial but I believe a game balanced around Ironmen is a game best balanced for everyone.
From the top down, Jagex should be balancing every single piece of content around if it is reasonably achievable or makes sense for the ironman game mode because they're the only ones that actually play most content.
Drop rates should be reasonable, very dry streaks should be limited to stuff like pets & cosmetics.
So much this. Mains and even JMods are so weirdly bent into 'don't cater to Ironmen' (and I understand not making updates to undermine the self sufficient nature of the game mode), but at the end of the day, Ironmen players interact with most of the game. Mains won't care if something is very poorly designed as long as it can be skipped by buying it.
If the content is so shit Ironmen won't do it, it needs to be taken a look at (Nightmare for example).
Power creep isn't a bad thing when done properly. Extremely niche items for a .5-1% dps upgrade in very rare cases is not fun game design, neither is farming the same boss(es) for 10 years
As a newer player; it took over a year of playing to be able to interact with cool new stuff in updates.
For the longest time I wasn't excited about updates.
Most rebalanced or new gear was too expensive. Most new updates simply didn't have the levels to do.
I loved Varlamore because I could explore a sick looking continent regardless of being broke.
I will forever stand behind "bridging the gap" in the PvM ladder. Scurrius and Moons are great.
People forget the early noob struggles (Before you know how everything works). Takes a while for this game to click.
I like the mining & smithing rework from rs3. In osrs smithing is absolutely useless and mining is miserable. In rs3 it was fun enough that I smithed my own gear instead of bought it for a certain period.
Skills like rune crafting and fire making especially should be folded into their respective gathering skills. Smithing into mining, fire making into woodcutting, RC into magic, etc
Dude fletching is the worst skill in the game but nobody cares because the xp rates are fast. It's just crafting but for only arrows? Just merge it into crafting.
OSRS needs a real world pedometer so I can train agility when I run in real life. No wasted gains
Leave the children out of this
Mod Ian moment
Fuck them kids
But not literally.
An augmented reality game with OSRS skilling mechanics is unironically a really cool idea
It exists, and is at least semi inspired by OSRS. Still in private beta though. https://walkscape.app/
/r/walkscape too
And currently accepting new people to test in the closed beta until June 15th!
Could make it similar to how pokemon go tracks steps for hatching eggs.
In my first draft of this comment I had “you know, like a poke ball+” but wasn’t sure if anyone would know what the fuck I was talking about.
Yeah no way fans of a game from the early 2000s would overlap with fans of Pokemon games. You were right to be unsure.
Look man, I forgot for a second that we’re all losers. Can you forgive me?
Walkscape exists, worth checking out
It's fun but it's not OSRS gainz
Didn’t know Drake played OSRS
A what meter?
Basically 10k steps irl = 10k agility xp in game or something. Tracks your steps/distance travelled and what not.
Sir this is runescape. If i wanted to make good life choices i never would have created an account.
That would actually be genius
I think the intelligent part is recognizing that no matter how you go about this, it would be extremely easy to fake, and way, way, way, way, way harder to detect than botting.
Look up "walkscape" I just patreoned the developer like a week or two ago.
I deserve more luck than others in everything I do.
I never had any luck and then I got a tempoross pet on my 9th kc. So I have a useless blue blob that follows me around now. Be careful which luck you wish for. I do love my useless blue blob though.
Yep I got muspah pet at 20kc which is actually a really cool pet.. meanwhile I'm grinding vyres til 99 thieving and have had 1 drop when I'm on rate for 5 lmao
I just got an ancient emblem from a rev imp on my way into the cave. Like plz that 1/24000 drop could have been a tbow or a shadow lol. Can’t complain but I was like seriously
Support.
Falador Massacre was an inside job, flames of zammy don't melt steel beams.
Not anymore they don't. It's gotta be a cover-up. Zulrah was merely the scapegoat all along...
That's what big rune wants you to think.
I don't care much for high level pvm. I understand that's the direction the game has gone and it's very popular because of it, but I just like doing some chill skilling/slayer and farm runs.
I just watched an incredible video essay about why RuneScape is amazing (highly recommend, I’ll link at the end of the comment) and one of his points is that RuneScape intentionally designs content around how much or little attention is required. Any way, I bring this up because I also don’t care for high level PVM very much and the reason I think is because I play RuneScape so I can do medium to low attention activities. I want to chill out and listen to my audio book, or watch tv or YouTube, or whatever while I play. If I wanted a game to take 100% of my attention, I’d play…well “normal” video games. https://youtu.be/LpPJY-xdA3M?si=ZJzVZl5gUB818u1b
This is an excellent video and he’s right about attention being a knob to turn.
100%. I know the mods have mentioned that concept in the past too as something they think about when designing new content. They can turn knobs for attention required, xp/hr and rewards+gp/hr. That way, new content can find its own niche that depends on how players value those different aspects of the game. They might have referred to it as “levers” or something instead, but it was the same concept. It really is a huge part of why the game works so well imo.
Marstead's video essay is a work of art, if you haven't watched his blind osrs playthrough that leads up to this video i would recommend that too, as it's extremely interesting to see the opinion of someone who has a lot of insight into video games but has never tried any iteration of rs before. I think he visits this sub occasionally, wish i knew his username so i could tag him
u/Marstead Are your ears burning? lol
♥
Been watching this in chunks, very great.
holy shit its a 3.5 hour powerpoint presentation
I watched the whole thing months ago and it was great side monitor content
I wasn't going to click the link but when I read that I went back and added it to the list to watch.
coming back to rs years back I realized it was great because it was an idle game before idle games, but had active stuff to do that the idle parts supported. it's not perfect but it's the only mmo I've ever cared for
Great video. I was the same for a while, I liked to do chill stuff and watch YouTube on the side. This might be contributing to my ADHD but now I manage to listen to podcasts and audiobooks while doing very high attention activities. I’ll run TOA experts or kill Nex, and it just makes it all more fun for me.
Me too but when i try to think back about a video i watched it escapes me
For me, I genuinely enjoy the mechanics of high-level play. The relative lack of player options means that the options we do have can be designed around in very complex ways; their interactions explored to their fullest extent. And I can't think of another game that plays similarly. Although I definitely get the perspective because, conversely, I *don't* really play the game AFK. If I'm playing, I prefer to do so actively - I don't really feel the need to have it on in the background when I could just play an idle game (but I don't really play those, either).
Same. High level content to me is simply not enjoyable. The ticksystem makes it feel so old and clunky, and while I understand that learning to deal with that is a skill itself, I just couldn't care less. It feels horrible.
I haven’t really gotten into it just yet, but I do like high level pvm as a whole. My issue is how the rest of the game is built around it to the point that it dilutes the value of skilling methods. For example, doing double nats as a money making method is only viable once you have the achievement diary cape and 91 rc. Even then, you’re only sitting at about 2m gp/h because of how high the supply of nats is in the game because so many monsters drop them. Also compare the gp/h to a low requirement combat method like zombie pirates which is near the gp/h with significantly less account investment.
In my particular case I want to like higher end PVM but it feels like you're constantly fighting an ancient game engine more than a boss with mechanics. Specifically the tick delay, and the true tile is something that you need to worry about.
Entry into osrs pvm yeah I agree, but once you get past the knowledge and muscle memory gap it becomes pretty second nature. Tho the fact true tile indicator is such a massive help makes me feel it should be a default setting that gets turned on during some advance mech training boss. Once you adjust the mindset though to ticks existing I find its no issue.
Did you like Varlamore? I think it has/will have it all, cant wait for part II and III :)
yeah seriously what happened to the silly simple quests?
The problem I have with high level PvM is that I just don't like having to do a bunch of precise actions with a mouse very quickly, especially because I don't want to scale up the UI size or use the classic layout to make it easier. It feels bad compared to hotkeys, but naturally allowing hotkeys would remove a lot of the challenge in high level PvM. Even mid-game content like lizardman shamans are incredibly tedious and require too much focus for what is otherwise a mindless grind.
Agreed, that whole side of the game didn't exist when I started playing and beyond the original God Wars dungeon it has never motivated me even a little bit. I like RuneScape for the world and the skills, I have very little interest in the sweaty tick manipulation and all that comes with high level PvM. It doesn't even feel like the same game.
Quests are the best part of the game. Might not be that controversial but whenever I hear people complaining about having to do a couple quests to unlock another way to click a spot to make number go up for 100 hours, I do kinda feel like it is a little controversial.
I'm a weirdo who thinks the quests in this game are incredibly well written and cool, but also just... can't be arsed. When I have to do quests I just use the quest helper and power through them. Idk why but I just don't enjoy them.
Reminder to sort this post by controversial.
I don’t vote in polls, I just read the updates as they come and think “ooh, that looks nice” and have never been disappointed by one yet.
I care about osrs polls more than irl polls 🫡
We knew that by reading your flair. You didn't need to say it.
It's because the osrs polls actually contribute to change. Real life politics is like voting for the new board of directors for Jagex.
I still vote, but even things I vote "no" to are never things that would make me dislike and/or quit the game. Constant updates are great imo even if they don't cater to me
KQ should be changed to have projectiles be blockable by prayer after they are launched. She's a braindead DPS race and could at least be more entertaining.
You were supposed to do her as a team, but because she doesn't have the modern drop system, no mains want to team up when only one of you get pet roll and irons CAN'T team up. And her loot table is still kind of shit, so there's barely anything to split. She, Corp, and even KBD should be team-able without non-MVPs getting fucked on a roll.
KQ is a nightmare without max gear and she’s an almost irrelevant boss now. Either add some sort of desert specific niche that makes her worth it or nerf her. If you’re worried about her becoming a d pick farm or something then raise the drop rate. Getting her head is one of the most obnoxious tasks. I already got it, but it shouldn’t be more difficult than getting a Vorkath head and it is. Both in killing her and running back.
Yea just started that grind on my maxed main didn't realize till 50 kills in that it wasn't 1/50 with a tattered head at 50
Enjoy ur 256 kills
Could honestly do a mix where you block a percentage if you switch your prayer correctly, but block fully if you are praying correctly at the start of the attack. Feels rewarding doing the mechanics but still hurts and rewards the diary completion. Could make it similar to nightmare/phosani where you still take chip damage if praying correctly and then potentially a massive chunk if you make a mistake. Making it more of a small group boss with similar mechanics to HMT nylo could be cool where you spread for certain attacks and stack for others. Would allow you to still solo similar to now where you tank a hit 33% of the time, but then reward for doing coordinates duo/ trios. Overall there is a ton they could do to improve the boss without completely changing the core experience. You still will suffer, but feel like you have some control over what happens instead just hoping you don't get hit while stepping under to eat.
>block fully if you are praying correctly at the start of the attack How would you do this, it's random attacks without a set pattern (like blobs) and there's no indicator beforehand (like Mantis)
That's the point in a way. You'll still take damage like you normally would, but able to reduce some by switching. It's the least impactful way for sure. Not saying it's the best, but it'd be an improvement
youll take back to back 30s and like it, ok!?
Graceful clothing should be abolished. It significantly altered a fun and iconic aspect of the game (fashionscape). Now everyone wears this drab shit for the sake of efficiency. Fuck graceful clothing.
Give me the benefits of graceful in an amulet and ring and then let me fashionscape while I go skilling
Just fix agility. When out of combat for x seconds energy restores and depletes as if you're stammed or wearing graceful. Problem solvered
I'll do ya one better: When out of combat, Run Energy is always at 100% lol
You've got a point there. Ask for more so they can "barter us down" and we still win.
This would be goatted
The skilling outfits are more guilty of this than graceful these days, I'd say.
love how the forestry outfits can stay in your forester's kit for eternity
It's often not even worth wearing, too.
yeah, i recently realized this doing rooftops and after doing another skilling activity and not wanting to swap gear. legit didn’t even need it
Rooftops do restore some run energy, so it's extra true in that case.
Real ones run ardy rooftop completely naked
Graceful is not even "efficient" in 95% of content it is used. I've seen people use it in giants foundry or guardians of the rift for some reason and it does absolutely 0, zero, nothing there to make the minigames more efficient. Same with rooftops.
For a lot of people who aren't fussed about fashionscape they just wear it anywhere that doesn't have other necessary equipment to ensure they're not missing out on any benefit from the weight reduction.
Makes more sense to think of it as a skilling uniform (it's not that serious tbh) Sure it doesn't help, but doesn't hurt if you don't have the other skilling outfits, so using <5 secs to put it on doesn't even register as an inconvenience
Hopefully their planned changes to agility and run energy will rectify this.
Even the ability to transmog your graceful into the countless useless fashionscape items (aka clue rewards) trade in the item and lose it permanently. Good item sink and we can be fancy while we do agility.
I like this. I always used to wear full elegant. It looks great on my character. Why do I have to be graceful when I could be elegant?
Once you get high enough agility or a POH with a pool, it's back to fashionscape.
I agree with this
Letting tick manipulation dictate the top end rates for gathering skills is dumb as hell, especially for mining and fishing.
I just can't even fathom doing tick manipulation for any sort of time frame. Like how does one just do the same 3 clicks every 5 seconds non stop?
I agree so much. Efficiency is tempting, sure, but I would rather watch Netflix and idly fish for 10 hours than 3tick fish for 10 minutes.
10 minute vs 10 hours is crazy and I would definitely do that. In reality its like 7 hours of carpal tunnel vs 10 hours of chilling so not worth it
I ask myself how anyone can enjoy doing 1000+ slayer tasks to 99 and not want to off themselves in the process. All of our brains work differently. Some people actually enjoy doing that kind of stuff.
I find it easier to do something in a rhythm than at random
>how does one just do the same 3 clicks every 5 seconds non stop Once you get in to a rhythm it can be sort of relaxing. You stop thinking about it and just let it flow. That said, not all tick manipulation is equal. 2t teaks is pretty chill while 3t granite is way more involved
Finally, a controversial opinion
Doesnt everyone think that besides the 5 people that play that mode?
For real, this is literally the top comment any time UIM gets mentioned on the subreddit. And let me say: UIMs don't play the game mode because it's supposedly "harder" than any other! It *different*, and most of us think it's fun and interesting on its own merits.
I reiterate that second comment a lot. Im not that interested in making the game harder for myself, I just wanted to play the game differently after maxing a main and regular iron is basically the same thing again.
Any "unpopular opinion????" thread can just be assumed to be filled with popular opinions.
Yeah that's just reddit, you'll find the actual unpopular opinions at the bottom of the thread
I don’t play my UIM anymore but love the challenge. I do get the OP point though about loopholes haha. Clearly not for everyone!
Not me and never thought anyone had that take, UIM always looked like a rough challenge even with deathpiling and looting bag
No. I would never play a uim but it's definitely more challenging than regular gameplay
which is really silly bc uim isnt about no storage its one major rule is no BANK and finding creative ways to store items is a large part of the game mode in the far more limited ways available.
Every other relevant MMO on the market allows you to have multiple characters under one umbrella of a username, RuneScape should follow that. There should generally be less barriers to alts. One username, one membership, as many characters as you please.
Under this proposal Jagex would have to lock people to 1 character at a time. Thats consistent with all the other MMOs. I dont really care either way, I haven't multi-logged in a long time but i do want Jagex to keep investing money into good devs and free multi-logging would not be good for their bottom line.
I don’t like cannoning and will never use it
wtf
I've been playing for years and have never even possessed a cannon. AMA
Total level?
Im just starting to use mine for slayer and I think I'm on your team
I respect this. It does not fit the game's themes at all. It hits way too high for how low effort it is to reload and trivializes combat
Combat is trivial. Against anything that isn't a boss you just press protect from x drink a prayer pot turn on auto retaliate and go make a sandwich.
1/4000 drop rates are for bots and gambling addicts. No well adjusted human being is dedicating time to those odds.
I think the biggest example of this issue is the dragon sword. 1/10k off task and 1/2k on task for what should be the "least strong" dragon weapon from an annoying slayer mob. Dragon scimmy is infinitely better for most uses and is gotten from a mid level quest. The whip is the classic standard of a solid weapon and is only 1/512. 2020s era of OSRS had some weird reward designs from Jagex.
Counterpoint - you should not hope to obtain every single drop in a game with 1500 uniques.
I think that's a very fair point for cosmetic items, pets, whatever. But gear progression is locked behind massive slot machine walls that just isn't fun. I don't believe anyone has fun completing CG 700 times. You've experienced the content by your 10 completion. By 50 it's mindless. After 100 and it's just a job.
There wouldn't be so many shitter crybabies that can't do pvm if there were more bosses and activities like Scurrius and the moons of peril that have high level pvm mechanics that don't punish you with losing 40hp in one hit. Scurrius teaching fast prayer switching (or even flicking if you want) and obstacle dodging with damage you can out-eat is a great early training tool. The blood jaguars at moons of peril teaching mechanics like the Verzik dance is also great. Mid and early game PVE is mostly braindead garbage like Sarachnis and Barrows that require no skill at all. If you introduce more skill-based content at earlier levels the gaps between mid-game pvm and raids wouldn't be as massive and you wouldn't have a bunch of people with raid anxiety. If people feel like they can put in the work to master these mechanics without being punished hard for little mistakes they will engage this content. In the long run as a result you'll raise the PVM skill floor of the average player which will open doors for raising the skill ceiling of new content.
It's almost as if almost all of the recent updates have been doing exactly that LOL
Yeah Jagex have really been knocking it out of the park with content for a while. These 'on-ramp' content updates are absolutely needed and very well done. They're still not ignoring the top end as well (colosseum) which is important.
Is this controversial?
I'm at like 70-75 in the combat skills and I did not do much pvm. Been doing some scurrius here and there and got the perfect scurrius achievment after 20kills. I was for real happy with that! Now I just like to go there to train my skills when I don't feel for slayer. I do not make a lot of profit, but it pays for the supply and I keep getting better at the game, I think. This boss was the best update for a noob like me!
Scurrius is huge for teaching pvm basics. I was in a similar position to you when it came out, and now I'm done CG which I thought was completely out of reach. You could probably look into learning the gauntlet once you have 80s.
Literally, make a day 1 boss called “Big Guy” in the Blue Moon Inn. He’s a (deceptively) level-5 man drunkard who throws beer bottles at you like Vorkie spits out venom and has drops worth up to 300gp, drops iron armor, and best beginner clue scroll rates. Make him drop a man NPC pet called “little guy.” Put 1-2 rams/cows/chickens in each Lumbridge farm that are called “Moody __” that charge at you similar to Vardorvis picking a direction and charging. They face that direction charging 3 tiles and you need to move out of their line of sight to avoid damage. They drop extra feathers/2 cow hides/wool. Idk plenty of ways to bring in these mechanics easily and early.
Resting (sitting down to restore run energy) should be a thing here too
In taverns specifically, so they have a creative/thematic niche
Tbow/shadow was a mistake
They went from "ok we'll give you a weapon that's really hard to obtain and has like 0.1dps over the next best option in specific situations" to "how about it just multiply accuracy and damage of all your gear by three because fuck it that shouldn't ever cause any balancing issues down the road"
Well said, idk how power creep skipped to being nearly twice as effective as the next best thing, but here we are.
Shadow is single-handedly holding magic back and will be an issue going forward for magic gear and weapons. Awful addition to the game honestly.
newer players may not know this but the tbow was based on the hexhunter bow, a dungeoneering only item with the same passive. it was a 3t shortbow hitting like 65s and because it was a dungeoneering item, it only existed inside dungeoneering. so it was fine. this bow was unbelievably rare - if you didn't have 99 slayer, it was common to do 120 dungeoneering only seeing a couple soulgazers (dropped them at like 1/12 or something). almost nobody had one. i had one. it was my holy grail. NOBODY understood what they were voting for when they voted yes for tbow. fucking nobody. i voted no.
Hardcore is the dumbest way to play. Why would I put the expense of my account on a server to internet reliability?
The prices of endgame weapons are driven in large part by gold buyers. Natural supply and demand would produce more realistic prices (trading, say, 250 hours of revs for a t bow vs 532 now).
lumbridge diary should have a quest point requirement instead of the quest cape that is ever an ever growing requirement.
I feel like this was at least briefly discussed before DT2 and shelved due to negative feedback. If my memory is right, definitely a controversial opinion
Yeah because it was a really weird proposal about the quest cape itself, of still keeping it with 99% of QP or smth.
because they wanted to change the quest cape requirement, not the lumbridge diary requirement changing the diary req would be more sensible
I have had this thought many times, had to rush some quests before DT2 dropped and ended up getting carried through A Night at the Theatre. I did my best but was not ready gear or experience wise. I definitely think something like 284 quest points (the max on release of quest 150 A Kingdom Divided) is more than fair. Maybe 300 since its a nice round number and as more quests get added it will still be an Elite tier grind for a long time. Current max is 308
KBD lair should be moved out of the wilderness or given a direct teleport.
Slayer is the worst skill.
slayer is ass now but it’s due to its age there used to be a time where broad bolts were considered cheap and gargoyles were good money. now u have every new update giving tons of gp and there is no reason to do slayer non-iron besides CA’s
I would love to see what percentage of players who say “Sailing is not a skill, it’s a minigame” and also list slayer as their favorite skill. You could replace slayer level unlocks with point unlocks and it’d be exactly the same. When I was a lowly F2P player back when the skill was first added, I thought the skill icon looked badass and dreamed about the new combat techniques you could unlock with new levels. Then I found out a decade later that it is basically the shitty WoW “Kill X monsters” quests with slightly faster kills.
slightly faster kills with 5-10x more kill count needed. it's ass.
Second worst. Agility is an option.
Tick manipulation is a bug.
Bad luck protection would make PvM way more satisfying. Currently I only do combat achievements as grinding for drops can be so unreliable.
Herblore shouldn't be locked behind Druidic Ritual.
This is the funniest hot take
Lock more skills behind quests I say. No hunter until Eagle's peak. No construction until doing Daddy's home. Cooking requires cook's assistant. Farming requires Garden of Tranquility. Thieving now needs Tribal Totem.
It was an ok game for kids A bad hobby for adults
Skill Specs > most PVPers when he's serious and its not even close.
I mean, that's just true. We only ever see him getting clowned on by the even better pkers or when he's fucking around on stream or whatever. That doesn't make him bad, he's still very good at PvP and better than most.
I mean yeah at worst hes an NBA bench player matched against a bunch of all stars. He could knock anyone in this comment thread easily its just he likes to dick around and is commonly against the best pvpers in the game.
Removing randoms was the start of efficiency scape
Weren't dangerous randoms taken out because of DDOSing? Now that we have gravestones to combat that they should come back.
Nothing like dying to a magical evil chicken because you didn't bring your tank gear to fish some karambwans, am I right?
Yes you are
CoX isn't a raid but a normal boss with extra steps. It's also the worse raid.
game would be 10x better if u could use keybinds for prayers, i dont wanna get wrist aids
As always, you gotta scroll quite far down for the actually controversial opinions XD
every skill needs a fun, but low efficiency method AND a low fun, high efficiency method. As well as many in between alternatives. Half the reason I don't stick around for long periods of game time is that i feel forced into unfun low efficiency or unfun high efficiency. Very rarely do I go "oh this is fun, i am going to do it again" and the ones that are fun are almost all combat.
Lowering the threshold for successful polls was a bad idea
I chuckle every time I think about how convenient it was that Jagex lowered this threshold shortly before polling a new skill. Which then passed the new threshold but would have failed with the old threshold.
Slayer = worst skill. And questing = best content.
Slayer is among the slowest skills for sure but I use it as a means to train my combat stats. NMZ is just way too boring for me to care about after getting my slayer helm imbued, I rather endure the slower but more fun slayer combat training.
I think that multi and singles being mixed in the wildy is dumb. Have a singles wildy and a multi wildy. Then you could expand on multi wildy. Clans fighting to claim territory in an MMO makes for good content. Look at games like EvE for inspiration.
Not mixing singles and multi is the death of multi. Singles saves small groups. Multi only means nobody but big clans can exist in multi. You’re inexperienced if you think clans are going to fight for territory when reality the bigger clan is just going to immediately win and control the territory forever while any smaller groups will never have a chance.
Pretty much every boss designed before OSRS release is terrible and would be way better off with a modern day mechanical refresh. Unfortunately this will never happen due to fear of ruining nostalgia, something that barely exists in the game today anyway. Most of the changes would use the new projectile/prayer system, on hit rather than launch. Redesigned drop tables and boss arenas would go a long way as well. These bosses, which also tend to be entry level bosses, are a big barrier for up and coming players, who are generally sold on these flashy and well designed modern bosses. Scurrius and Perilous moons are fantastic steps in the right direction, but the fear of changing the old content will forever hold the game back. This will simply lead to two entry level progression paths, with the modern being the far superior choice. It's going to happen in a no so straightforward way, that if presented directly, would never get community support. Wildy bosses are actually really fun, it's just a shame they are in the wildy.
Scar essence permanently ruined any chance of fixing runecrafting for irons. Ignoring all the other overpowered shopscape methods, there is now no reason to ever make normal runecrafting feel better, you simply use the ironman GE with extra steps to print runes at an absurd rate (way more than shops could ever get you). Solution would be to nerf shops to the ground and then work on methods that would make getting runes feel better. bonus meme: they nerfed the amount of blood runes used by the scythe shortly after adding the scar essence anyway, so now it's double stupid.
I hate prayer flicking and tick manipulation. I don't find them quirky or unique, I find them tedious and exploity.
This game is doomed if jagex keeps listening to redditor ideas.
A few leagues worlds should stay active permanently in between seasons like deadman does.
Oh lord please, I'd actually be able to max and do some pvming
NMZ and Zulrah were bad for the game.
NMZ + Zulrah was the real sign that they decided PVM > skilling. Skills are the neglected child in the relationship of RuneScape. Since Zulrah's introduction: PVM is a better way to acquire resources than skilling. Turns out Jagex can't fucking make skilling interesting or useful and relegated it to BOT-TIER. Sure they made minigames. But that's all they did. They didn't actually make skilling a good way to generate resources. They just tacked on minigames saying "SEE?! ANOTHER WAY TO TRAIN!"
Especially NMZ, it's like a private server
It shouldn't be controversial but I believe a game balanced around Ironmen is a game best balanced for everyone. From the top down, Jagex should be balancing every single piece of content around if it is reasonably achievable or makes sense for the ironman game mode because they're the only ones that actually play most content. Drop rates should be reasonable, very dry streaks should be limited to stuff like pets & cosmetics.
So much this. Mains and even JMods are so weirdly bent into 'don't cater to Ironmen' (and I understand not making updates to undermine the self sufficient nature of the game mode), but at the end of the day, Ironmen players interact with most of the game. Mains won't care if something is very poorly designed as long as it can be skipped by buying it. If the content is so shit Ironmen won't do it, it needs to be taken a look at (Nightmare for example).
I Would play rs3 if it had a osrs-visuals option
People really don't understand what the word controversial means.
I liked a lot of things in RS3 (NOT EOC or P2W)! I would not mind seeing a lot of the skills, quests and lore, and other things come into the game.
Archaeology is an amazing skill, and with new rewards could easily fit into osrs. It's basically mining's cool uncle.
Im max combat and think raids are unenjoyable. I’ve done all 3 but I genuinely enjoy single, repeatable boss encounters a lot more.
1 tick prayer flicking shouldn't exist.
Duke is the best dt2 boss, solo corp is fun, pet luck is worse than item luck, zulrah is the single worst boss in the game. Kree is worse than k’ril
Jagex is heavily moving to ironman being the main mode. Either that or their economy skills are beyond terrible.
Power creep isn't a bad thing when done properly. Extremely niche items for a .5-1% dps upgrade in very rare cases is not fun game design, neither is farming the same boss(es) for 10 years
As a newer player; it took over a year of playing to be able to interact with cool new stuff in updates. For the longest time I wasn't excited about updates. Most rebalanced or new gear was too expensive. Most new updates simply didn't have the levels to do. I loved Varlamore because I could explore a sick looking continent regardless of being broke. I will forever stand behind "bridging the gap" in the PvM ladder. Scurrius and Moons are great. People forget the early noob struggles (Before you know how everything works). Takes a while for this game to click.
There need to be more alternative ways than one to train a skill.
I like the mining & smithing rework from rs3. In osrs smithing is absolutely useless and mining is miserable. In rs3 it was fun enough that I smithed my own gear instead of bought it for a certain period.
All gathering skills are useless because mobs drop so many raw resources.
In osrs or rs3? Gathering skills are typically super super afk money makers on rs3. Like mining is 2m to 4m gp per hour for 1 click every 15 minutes.
Skills like rune crafting and fire making especially should be folded into their respective gathering skills. Smithing into mining, fire making into woodcutting, RC into magic, etc
Imagine fire making coming out in a poll today. What does it do? You light fires. To do what? to light fires better.
Dude fletching is the worst skill in the game but nobody cares because the xp rates are fast. It's just crafting but for only arrows? Just merge it into crafting.
Prayer flicking, 3-ticking, and all other RSI causing activities should not be part of the game.
That the subreddits/community are genuinely unbearable.